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  1. #1
    "El Whatever"
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    Stan Flows or DT EX 500??? Wheel build recommendations?

    Hi all!!

    I'm thinking new wheels and I know that I want CK hubs laced to a 21mm inside rim in the order of 500grs give or take. I run tubes.

    I am 140-150 pounds ready to ride. My riding is aggressive XC or light AM (whatever it's called this days), average trailriding, with small drops up to 2' maybe. Terrain is rather rough, that can go from rocky to rooty.

    Despite my light weight and rather tame riding, I've managed to fed up a few rims, mainly on a basis of poor skills. I'm constantly bashing the rims against rocks or curbs as I like to use low tyre pressures.

    I have narrowed my choices for rims to Stan's Flows and DT's EX 500.
    Which one is less prone to dents? Which one builds a more sturdy wheel?

    On the spoke side, I'd like to keep the weight contained. I'm thinking Supercompetitions
    How do Sapim's Laser stack up against Supercomps? Would you use it for a durable wheel?

    I'm thinking brass nipples as opposed to alloy. I don't mind the extra weight if they are more durable or hold better over time.

    BTW... My current wheels are Hope Bulb R/Hope Pro II F, laced to Alex FD28's (28mm wide outside, 21mm inside, 490grs claimed, sleeved joint) and Competition Spokes, haven run them since early 2008 and so far so good. I've banged the crap out of them and I haven't got any dings or bends despite some rim to metal contact. The wheels have been trued twice and they need one more truing now.

    Thanks in advance for your help!!
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  2. #2
    eBiker
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    Hi Warp, sounds like you might not gain much going to new rims.

    That said I've run 5.1s for the last 3 years without issue and have had some Flows on my SS for the last year. Because I've had no issues with either it's hard to state durability differences. Both have gone down to rim.

    I prefer the 22.6 inner width of the Flows, it ups the traction. I also prefer the Flows tubeless conversion method over the DT kit (a few burps with DT, none with Flows). Flows are lighter - I feel no stiffness difference... see where I am going...

    I do some jumps and drops on both bikes.

    Also, I think aluminum nipples are reliable enough now that they should be fine, especially if you run super comps. I have WheelSmith DB (2.0-1.7-2.0) at a close enough weight of the super comps but it gains in a 2.0 (vs 1.8) nipple interface.

    P

  3. #3
    "El Whatever"
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    Gracias, Seņor P!

    I'm also inclined to Flows for the same reasons you state, but I will discuss it also with the wheelbuilder when the time comes.
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  4. #4
    usually cranky
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    not to thread jack but how do you like your alex rims? thinking of getting the xed44's.

  5. #5
    "El Whatever"
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    Quote Originally Posted by b-kul View Post
    not to thread jack but how do you like your alex rims? thinking of getting the xed44's.
    No worries... They have been great in all honesty.

    They have held really good to the use of these three and plus years. Barely any scratches and no dings or dents. I'm light and not very aggressive, but sure I've hit them even to curbs and even against an iron sewer that didn't had a cover (didn't see it ).

    Even the finish has held nicely.

    This hit gave the tyre a nice rash... but the rim didn't even noticed.




    Three caveats...

    1.- I never checked the weight. I'm taking claimed weights from Alex at 490grs. I think Syncros DS28 are the same rims (or at least made by Alex, someone correct me if I'm wrong) and they are claiming 520grs. So the claimed weight could be way off.

    Check mtb-news.de I think I've read somewhere those are close to claimed weight at 478grs or so. I'm not sure, so I won't make the claimed that they're close to claimed weight.

    2.- At least on my rims, all tyres seem to get less volume than claimed. Tubeless tyres are really hard to mount and most commonly, I needed to inflate tubed tyres to a nice pressure (40-50psi) for the bead to pop in place properly. In a nutshell, they're a beyotch to mount the tyre properly, and you get a smaller, rounder tyre than expected.

    3.- I didn't build them myself, so I can't comment on how do they build. Finish is ok, nothing fancy. Gets the job done like it should.

    I'm also interested in XED44's... especially after owning my rims. They seem to get good reviews in mtb-news.de.
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  6. #6
    usually cranky
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    thanks! sounds like we are pretty similar, im a tiny bit bigger. i was sold on the wtb tcs trail rims but then i read your post and found the xed44 rims with a 20mm internal width and a light weight. for $50 its a great deal. not super concerned with the tire volume issue, i have 317s right now.

  7. #7
    Nouveau Retrogrouch SuperModerator
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    Quote Originally Posted by Warp View Post
    Hi all!!

    I'm thinking new wheels and I know that I want CK hubs laced to a 21mm inside rim in the order of 500grs give or take. I run tubes.

    I am 140-150 pounds ready to ride. My riding is aggressive XC or light AM (whatever it's called this days), average trailriding, with small drops up to 2' maybe. Terrain is rather rough, that can go from rocky to rooty.

    Despite my light weight and rather tame riding, I've managed to fed up a few rims, mainly on a basis of poor skills. I'm constantly bashing the rims against rocks or curbs as I like to use low tyre pressures.

    I have narrowed my choices for rims to Stan's Flows and DT's EX 500.
    Which one is less prone to dents? Which one builds a more sturdy wheel?

    On the spoke side, I'd like to keep the weight contained. I'm thinking Supercompetitions
    How do Sapim's Laser stack up against Supercomps? Would you use it for a durable wheel?

    I'm thinking brass nipples as opposed to alloy. I don't mind the extra weight if they are more durable or hold better over time.

    BTW... My current wheels are Hope Bulb R/Hope Pro II F, laced to Alex FD28's (28mm wide outside, 21mm inside, 490grs claimed, sleeved joint) and Competition Spokes, haven run them since early 2008 and so far so good. I've banged the crap out of them and I haven't got any dings or bends despite some rim to metal contact. The wheels have been trued twice and they need one more truing now.

    Thanks in advance for your help!!
    Velocity Blunt. 409g claimed weight, 28mm outside (21-22 inside)

    The Laser is the same dimensions as the Revolution. Thinner/lighter than the Supercomp.

    I have no durability issues with alloy nipples.
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  8. #8
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    I did measure my blunts once. In the back of my mind I thought they were closer to 24mm inside? P35's are supposedly 28mm inside?
    Either way it's nice to have an option of color other than black.

  9. #9
    "El Whatever"
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    Quote Originally Posted by shiggy View Post
    Velocity Blunt. 409g claimed weight, 28mm outside (21-22 inside)

    The Laser is the same dimensions as the Revolution. Thinner/lighter than the Supercomp.

    I have no durability issues with alloy nipples.

    Thanks, Shiggy... how do Blunts they build up? Are they soft or are resilient?
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  10. #10
    Nouveau Retrogrouch SuperModerator
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    Quote Originally Posted by Warp View Post
    Thanks, Shiggy... how do Blunts they build up? Are they soft or are resilient?
    Easy build. Have yet to ding my 650B versions.
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  11. #11
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    I run the EX500's laced to hope pro 2's and LOVE them! I'm 6ft 215 and huck my bike every which way possible, and honestly I havent been able to pop a tire (tubes) for over a season and I run low 20's all day!

  12. #12
    "El Whatever"
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    Given that someone asked for the Alex XDE44 and it got my interest, I found these pics of real weight on them... not too bad for a cheap, wide, welded rim!

    Claimed weight is 430grs, so they come very close. Inside 3%.

    Pics come from mtb-news.de (I hope they don't get mad as I did not asked for permission of use).
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Stan Flows or DT EX 500??? Wheel build recommendations?-img_3107_1299704640.jpg  

    Stan Flows or DT EX 500??? Wheel build recommendations?-img_3109.jpg  

    Stan Flows or DT EX 500??? Wheel build recommendations?-dscn0712.jpg  

    Stan Flows or DT EX 500??? Wheel build recommendations?-dscn0710.jpg  

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  13. #13
    Spring! Spring! Spring!
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    fwiw, i've run dt 5.1d for a couple years (a while ago) and have been running Flows since about 2007.

    I think the Flow hold up better over time to the point that I use them on both my FS 26er (2.3" tires and larger) and my rigid 29er (2.2" tires and larger). If I was a serious DH racer I'd have race-wheels built with Flows too (I run tubeless all around) but as I'm a "hack" DH guy I went for a burlier rim (sun mtx-39) for that application.

    I was originally very skeptical of longevity of the Flows, particularly since they don't have eyelets, but they have been great. I think their (slightly) lower sidewall works well tubed also (I've had periods when a tire has had enough damage that it could not hold air by itself and was running tubes).

    i'm > 200 lbs and under normal conditions get plenty of regular mileage. The 26er FS and 29er get used on almost all the same trail, the 29er is just taken a bit slower on big-chunk (so my body holds up ... the bike and wheels don't seem to care).

  14. #14
    Five is right out
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    Quote Originally Posted by shiggy View Post
    Velocity Blunt. 409g claimed weight, 28mm outside (21-22 inside)

    The Laser is the same dimensions as the Revolution. Thinner/lighter than the Supercomp.

    I have no durability issues with alloy nipples.
    I've been running a Blunt for a front for just over a year. I weigh 150 in gear, run 25psi, rocky terrain. No dings yet. No idea how easily they build up as I had a shop do it (and they did a pretty terrible job, but I'm pretty sure that's not a reflection on the rims as they completely muffed the rear Arch build too).

  15. #15
    Nouveau Retrogrouch SuperModerator
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    Quote Originally Posted by gvs_nz View Post
    I did measure my blunts once. In the back of my mind I thought they were closer to 24mm inside? P35's are supposedly 28mm inside?
    Either way it's nice to have an option of color other than black.
    Just measured my Blunts at 23.6mm inside. More than most for the outside width.
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  16. #16
    1:18
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    I've used 5.1d and now ZTR Flows. No big perceptible difference in stiffness, but Flows offer wider profile (more grip) and are very simple for tubeless setup. Probably the only big downside is the price...

    Both are prone to denting for a hard riding style or too many encounters with low pressure

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