Page 2 of 10 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 5 6 ... LastLast
Results 26 to 50 of 239

Thread: NOX Composites?

  1. #26
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Posts
    40
    Ya, I don't want this thread to turn into a spoke debate. In the end, we make rims, not spokes so that's where we focus most of our attention. Who knows why people latch on to these small details with religious zeal, but I'll give the poor little cx-ray a bit of defense.

    First, we are spoke agnostic. If you read our website and came away thinking we will ONLY build with cx-rays or other bladed spokes then you are taking it the wrong way. We frequently recommend other spokes based on the unique requirements of the rider/terrain. For racers, or riders wanting to save weight, we frequently do recommend the cx-ray for 2 reasons:

    1. Sapim claims ~3x improved fatigue life for the CX-Ray versus the laser. Based on our own anecdotal evidence when compared to a laser (same weight butted spoke), we see less cx-rays break than lasers. Now before you all attack your keyboards with "but spokes don't break because they reach the end of their fatigue life!!!" ya ya, we know that, but the fact remains we've seen more lasers break than cx-ray. Not really sure why.. well, we do have some theories but let's save that for a different thread.
    2. The additional cost is small compared to the overall cost of the wheelset, so we recommend the cx-ray over the laser if you are looking for a lightweight spoke (which almost all our customers are) because we feel it's more durable. Simple as that.

    One more point is that it's much easier to build with a light bladed spoke versus a 1.5mm round spoke because you can hold the bladed spoke as you tighten the nipple. You don't have to deal with windup. Making the wheel builder's life easier usually results in a happy wheel builder, which results is a better build.

    I know I dodged the claim of torsional stiffness... that claim is based on discussions with a DT swiss engineer. While we do respect this engineer, we also agree the math predicts the stiffness should be unchanged if a cx-ray is just a reshaped laser. So ya, we need to shake this out - we have an inquiry in now with DT and we'll reference the claim or at least substantiate it if DT has data to back this up. Keep in mind that a small change in torsional stiffness is not something you can "feel" on the bike. This is why we normally build 2X on 29ers - because while it sacrifices torsional stiffness it improves lateral stiffness.

    Thanks guys,
    Brad

  2. #27
    transmitter~receiver
    Reputation: meltingfeather's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    7,794

    NOX Composites?

    Quote Originally Posted by NoxComposites View Post
    Who knows why people latch on to these small details with religious zeal, but I'll give the poor little cx-ray a bit of defense.
    The zealotry seems always to be on the side of people who lack facts and/or knowledge. It's all pretty simple stuff from a structural and materials standpoint, though I recognize that materials and structural analysis are understood by a small percentage of the general population.
    The allusion to religion is funny, because religion is based on faith, which is what you need to believe in something you don't understand or can't explain.
    I assume these comments are aimed at me, since I'm the one that challenged your incorrect claims about bladed spokes.
    Rather than offer any kind of explanation or justification, you've come back by suggesting fanatical obsession with details. Weak ass sauce, but whatevs. It seemed for a minute like you might know what you're talking about and I was hoping to maybe learn something... another day.

    Quote Originally Posted by NoxComposites View Post
    First, we are spoke agnostic. If you read our website and came away thinking we will ONLY build with cx-rays or other bladed spokes then you are taking it the wrong way.
    Bladed spokes are all you mention, and you sort of carry on a out the merits of them, so it doesn't seem like a crazy conclusion to arrive at, even though I hadn't read your website until just now and didn't mention it.
    You also in this thread have touted bladed spokes as the best of the best.
    "Spoke agnostic" vs. the "religious zealots" is funny, even if you got the roles reversed.
    Quote Originally Posted by NoxComposites View Post
    The additional cost is small compared to the overall cost of the wheelset, so we recommend the cx-ray over the laser if you are looking for a lightweight spoke (which almost all our customers are) because we feel it's more durable. Simple as that.
    Lasers are $1 a piece. CX Rays are typically $3.50, which is $160 difference for 64 spokes. Small is subjective, but if you're doing it for the new reason of "easier to build" that seems like a hard sell on a wheel customer.
    "Hey, spend 3x on spokes so I can have an easier time building with them."
    I don't find Lasers/Revos to be that difficult to build with.
    Quote Originally Posted by NoxComposites View Post
    I know I dodged the claim of torsional stiffness... that claim is based on discussions with a DT swiss engineer. While we do respect this engineer, we also agree the math predicts the stiffness should be unchanged if a cx-ray is just a reshaped laser. So ya, we need to shake this out - we have an inquiry in now with DT and we'll reference the claim or at least substantiate it if DT has data to back this up. Keep in mind that a small change in torsional stiffness is not something you can "feel" on the bike. This is why we normally build 2X on 29ers - because while it sacrifices torsional stiffness it improves lateral stiffness.

    I've heard the same thing from a DT rep and agree that it is bogus.
    If you don't agree and you do other things that compromise it (the 2x vs. 3x thing is correct), then it's kind of hard to understand why you would throw it out there, unless you're in the habit of blowing smoke, in which case it would also be difficult to take the anecdotal evidence of CX Rays lasting longer seriously.
    Both Sapim and DT have the challenge of selling bladed products for the mountain bike market at a HUGE premium. They have to come up with some justification, and this is where this misinformation originates. I'd be skeptical of what they have to say unless it is backed up by something unbiased.

    I still like your rims.
    Good luck with it.
    Quote Originally Posted by pvd
    Time to stop believing the hype and start doing some science.
    29er Tire Weight Database

  3. #28
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Posts
    20
    Man melting feather you should release some of that anger by going for a bike ride

  4. #29
    transmitter~receiver
    Reputation: meltingfeather's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    7,794

    NOX Composites?

    Quote Originally Posted by JIMSLICK View Post
    Man melting feather you should release some of that anger by going for a bike ride
    lol
    What a tired ass comment... and as comments like that so often are, way off the mark.
    Why even waste the time?
    Quote Originally Posted by pvd
    Time to stop believing the hype and start doing some science.
    29er Tire Weight Database

  5. #30
    Nuts
    Reputation: bdundee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    4,361
    Well this thread went south! Might as well go over to the cheap Chinese rim thread at least I get to see a bunch of broken rims.
    And I love beer!!

  6. #31
    1izalluneed
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Posts
    62

    Received my wheels

    I received my wheels on Friday. I had them built by Nox Composites with Chris King hubs. The quality of the rim and the build is very nice. I have 2 rides on them consisting of 1 longish climb and a bunch of short punchy climbs with a lot of rocks and roots. Also some fast smooth single track with some good cornering. My observations thus far:

    1. The wheels are very, very stiff. In corners, monster trucking down rocky steeps, and climbing.

    2. They make my full squishy climb more like a hard tail.

    3. They seem lighter than their advertised weight of ~1594g. I don't know if that is from the stiffness or what but they just seem light.

    4. The wheels spin up to speed really quickly and hold speed well.

    I am going on a 3 day mtb trip later this week and will put many more miles on this wheel set. I expect to be even more impressed with the quality, ride and price with this wheel set.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails NOX Composites?-nox_1.jpg  


  7. #32
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    1,121
    Greg, what is your opinion on linear-pull hubs/spokes?

    TIA

  8. #33
    1izalluneed
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Posts
    62
    Quote Originally Posted by DennisF View Post
    Greg, what is your opinion on linear-pull hubs/spokes?

    TIA
    I am certainly not a wheel expert but will provide my opinion as you asked. J-bend spokes are easier to repair or adjust on the trail or at home and typically do not require proprietary tools and proprietary parts. From an engineering perspective (I am not an engineer) linear pull spokes seem to be a great option and seemingly would be under less stress at the hub. I have actually never broken a spoke at the J-bend, it has always been somewhere along the length of the spoke or at the nipple. I have had wheels with both linear pull spokes and J-bend spokes. All the hand built wheels with J-bend spokes have held up very well in comparison to some other wheels I have had in the last 15 years.

  9. #34
    Nuts
    Reputation: bdundee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    4,361

    Well Done!!

    Received my Nox wheelset today and oh my these turned out sweet!! Very excited to get them out and pound the crap out of em!!
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails NOX Composites?-544552_722276941131161_566095461_n.jpg  

    NOX Composites?-1240548_722276907797831_1313462213_n.jpg  

    Last edited by bdundee; 09-18-2013 at 08:19 PM.
    And I love beer!!

  10. #35
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Posts
    48
    This is why OEMs mostly refrain from posting on MTBR. Nice job.

  11. #36
    1izalluneed
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Posts
    62
    Great looking wheels bdundee! I have put ~90 miles mile on my Nox Composites wheels since receiving a couple weeks ago. I have ridden just about every type of terrain, smooth, fast and flowy, slow, rocky, rooty and technical and everything in between. I am really pleased with the overall performance. They are the stiffest xc wheels I have ridden to date, including 26ers. Tubeless setup with Ardent (f) and Ikon (r) was a breeze. Have fun putting them to the test!

  12. #37
    mtbr member
    Reputation: ColinL's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Posts
    1,277
    Quote Originally Posted by YogiKudo View Post
    This is why OEMs mostly refrain from posting on MTBR. Nice job.
    Heh. Yes, sometimes it can be tempting to get into technical minutia that has little relevance.

  13. #38
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Posts
    538
    Shipping this set out to a customer today. Polished silver White Industries hubs, silver Revolution spokes, black alloy nipples. Looks way better in person than my iPhone camera can capture. Going on a titanium Form Prevail, should look sweeeeet!






  14. #39
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Posts
    40
    Those will look great on a Ti bike! You don't see those hubs very often but they are quite nice.
    Nox Composites
    Carbon Fiber Mountain Rims and Wheels

  15. #40
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Posts
    335
    I would love to see some 26 all mountain love from you guy's!

  16. #41
    Nuts
    Reputation: bdundee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    4,361
    These things are friggen fast
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails NOX Composites?-1235194_727037400655115_1626107085_n.jpg  

    NOX Composites?-img_20130926_140406715-edited.jpg  

    And I love beer!!

  17. #42
    mtbr member
    Reputation: mnyquist's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Posts
    282
    bdundee: what are your initial thoughts on the hubs? Also, thoughts on the Panaracers set up tubeless?

    Bike and wheels look great!

  18. #43
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Posts
    126
    The bike now feels like a 26 inch in the fast twisty stuff
    NOX Composites?-p9260174-001.jpg

    Quote Originally Posted by dgaddis1 View Post
    Shipping this set out to a customer today. Polished silver White Industries hubs, silver Revolution spokes, black alloy nipples. Looks way better in person than my iPhone camera can capture. Going on a titanium Form Prevail, should look sweeeeet!






  19. #44
    Nuts
    Reputation: bdundee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    4,361
    Quote Originally Posted by mnyquist View Post
    bdundee: what are your initial thoughts on the hubs? Also, thoughts on the Panaracers set up tubeless?

    Bike and wheels look great!
    Thanks! The Panaracers set up beautiful tubeless, very very tight fit and have been holding air great almost got them to seat with a floor pump but I didn't feel like working that hard. I know they are actually going to switch the line to tubeless ready soon but these had no sidewall leaks and really with some rims going hookless what does the bead really have to do with anything anyways. Maybe someone could explain that knows more.

    As far as the hubs, I have been on I9's for a few years and love em. I know the Torch hubs have been giving a few fits but so was the last model when they first came out but I never had a problem plus they are very easy to take apart and service.
    And I love beer!!

  20. #45
    Nuts
    Reputation: bdundee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    4,361
    Quote Originally Posted by slowandlow View Post
    The bike now feels like a 26 inch in the fast twisty stuff
    Sweet ride!!
    And I love beer!!

  21. #46
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Posts
    126
    Thanx!

  22. #47
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Posts
    3
    Have a set of 29er rims coming to Belgium, can't wait !!!

  23. #48
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    4
    Wheels look very interesting. Trying to decide between these the Enve xc or the Easton ec 90. Any thoughts on those wheels? how the compare on ride and stiffness?

  24. #49
    mtbr member
    Reputation: mnyquist's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Posts
    282
    I just sold a set of Enve XC 29er wheels. I am building a new bike with the Nox rims and I9 hubs. I will report back as soon as the build is done. The Enve rims are great, no question, but I am interested to see how the Nox compare.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - now Free

  25. #50
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    1,121
    Nox, what is your opinion on linear-pull spokes?

    TIA.

Page 2 of 10 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 5 6 ... LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 14
    Last Post: 12-15-2011, 03:55 PM
  2. Replies: 0
    Last Post: 09-06-2011, 09:15 AM
  3. Replies: 0
    Last Post: 09-06-2011, 09:13 AM
  4. Ahead Composites Wheels
    By Stevob in forum 29er Bikes
    Replies: 40
    Last Post: 08-23-2011, 08:56 AM
  5. A joint venture between Turner and Edge Composites
    By juan_speeder in forum Turner
    Replies: 241
    Last Post: 12-10-2009, 06:47 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •