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  1. #401
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    Koozer hubs, 72 POE @ under $60

    Yeah already spoke to rev. 5 bucks for the spacer. However it was 18 bucks for the whole free hub with pawls etc. so I just paid the 18. My old one is all chewed up from my cassette anyways. So I though 18 was a pretty good deal shipped. I also noticed some wear on some of the pawls.

  2. #402
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    Quote Originally Posted by Breitness24 View Post
    Yeah already spoke to rev. 5 bucks for the spacer. However it was 18 bucks for the whole free hub with pawls etc. so I just paid the 18. My old one is all chewed up from my cassette anyways. So I though 18 was a pretty good deal shipped. I also noticed some wear on some of the pawls.
    Do you have a link to where you can buy the freehub body?

  3. #403
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    $18 shipped is incredible. With bearings and pawls?!

    I've noticed a few ebay sellers posting the hubs with what look to be ano black freehub body. Same alloy? Possibly lighter?
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  4. #404
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    Koozer hubs, 72 POE @ under $60

    I contacted revmega directly through eBay. He said it was the whole free hub. Whether he understood me clearly is another story. So we will see. He sent me an invoice I paid.

  5. #405
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    I finally got my Koozer hub , it took 5 weeks to arrive. I got the 142mm with extra QR caps. Unfortunately one of the QR caps was missing so I have another long wait till I'm able to use the hub. The hub will be used QR, and as a backup for a 142 wheel on another bike.

    I tried fitting endcaps from a Hope Pro 2 evo hub, but they were too large. The outer diameter of the Koozer 12mm axle is noticably smaller than the Evo axle. The pawls are quite a bit smaller also.

    I wonder the thinner axle is contributing to the Koozer freehub bearing failures. Hope had a problem with 12mm axle flex on their Pro2 hubs and made the Evo axle thicker to fix the problem.

  6. #406
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    It took my hubs 2 days to show up. The build has started with Stans rims and Bikesmith spokes.

  7. #407
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    Quote Originally Posted by abelfonseca View Post
    I would replace the bearing on the pawls right off the bat. The rest I would use them till they failed.
    Hey all,

    After reading through the thread it seems many feel the freewheel bearings are suspect? Have others experienced freewheel skipping when under load? Do bearing upgrades help?

    Thanks!

  8. #408
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    Koozer hubs, 72 POE @ under $60

    Upon further inspection of my free hub I found that the metal on the hub seems to be worn right around the individual pawl. And that's what lead to my failure. I am a big guy so I'm sure I put a lot of torque on the climbs. Here's a macro pic to see.

  9. #409
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    i think that can still be repaired or bring it to a machine shop

  10. #410
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    Ok guys I need some serious help. After swapping out my free hub with my buddies who has the same but hasn't installed yet it still skipped. So I figured my hub was worn and the teeth were rounded. So stupid me I bought a whole new set and an extra rear. I just finished installing it and the damn thing brand new still skips under load. def not as much as my old hub but i can't safely ride. So then I swapped out the free hub with my second rear hub and it still skips and I'm about to lose my mind. If there are 6 pawls how come they all skip and not maybe one skip but the other 5 grab. Please someone chime in I'm dying here.

  11. #411
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    Quote Originally Posted by Breitness24 View Post
    Ok guys I need some serious help. After swapping out my free hub with my buddies who has the same but hasn't installed yet it still skipped. So I figured my hub was worn and the teeth were rounded. So stupid me I bought a whole new set and an extra rear. I just finished installing it and the damn thing brand new still skips under load. def not as much as my old hub but i can't safely ride. So then I swapped out the free hub with my second rear hub and it still skips and I'm about to lose my mind. If there are 6 pawls how come they all skip and not maybe one skip but the other 5 grab. Please someone chime in I'm dying here.
    Breitness24,

    So I have been experiencing some free hub skipping under load as well. For me it seems to occur if I am pedaling and leaning the bike. Such as coming out of a corner. Based on the thread it appears that some folks attribute this to a flexy axle and poor quality bearings.

    If anyone has specific bearings that they have used please respond. I was considering REAL WORLD Cycling ceramic hybrid angular contact bearings but at around $70 I wanted to be sure these remedy the problem.

  12. #412
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    Koozer hubs, 72 POE @ under $60

    My new hubs are from rev and these are supposed to be the new models. The free hub is black. These are the thru axle model and he gave me qr adapters. The new models are supposed to be better with harder materials. My old hub was just a regular qr hub. And I weigh 270 maybe I can swap out my old bearing onto the new hub.

    Update: Matt (rev) responded pretty damn fast like 20 min. He asked me to take pics and vids of my hub and advised he will solve it or refund me. Hopefully they can solve it.

    After reading the thread I check the bearings from my old hub that lasted over a year under my 260 lb frame and the new hub. The bearings are different brands.

  13. #413
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    Koozer hubs, 72 POE @ under $60

    Try SKF bearings as mentioned earlier in thread. Problem seems to be wimpy bearings unable to keep axle centered under load thus unable to keep freehub spinning on proper axis thus creating misalignment of pawl engagement. Not necessarily axle flex but rather axle movement. I think the deformation of the alloy around pawl in above macro pics is a direct result of this. This issue was also common with Stans 3.30 hub. Bearings were toast - replaced with SKF and never again had problem.
    Hope this solves it.

    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  14. #414
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    Koozer hubs, 72 POE @ under $60

    Ok I figured my issue it and it def deals with flex. I had my original koozer since april of '14. I've been swapping the rear wheel from a steel SS and my full squish. Recently I've Ben neglecting the squish for the SS. So I decided to go ss on my squish.

    I'm using a cheap aluminum eBay spacer kit on my SS gear. Since the SS is steel it didn't flex. And whenever I swapped the rim to my squish the 10spd cassette kept it all stiff. But the SS gear and aluminum spacers in the squish alum. Frame was a no go too much flex. I just rode both bikes as normal and no popping.

    So do you guys think if I find steel spacers for the SS kit I could run it on my squish ?

  15. #415
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    Decided to rebuild my much abused, one season old, set of Koozers. Originally purchased Jan 2015. They were still running fine with no problems as of the end of September, ~120 rides on them so well over 1000 km in all weather conditions.

    Freehub internals looked like they saw a bit of water, which isn't surprising considering what I put them through. Bit of corrosion on parts, no grease left. Guess I should have done some mid season maintenance. Cleaned them up and added a bit of grease before the photo below, though I'm going to replace the freehub assembly anyway.

    Blue washer was toast; broken into multiple pieces, can be seen to the left. Little bit of deformation on the freehub body, not sure if this would affect operation. I'm 185 lb before gear and not exactly a masher, I can imagine a heavier rider could destroy this thing pretty rapidly. Haven't experienced any skipping.



    Bearings were mostly fine (i.e. felt smooth, with no notchiness or gritty feeling). Only bad ones were rear NDS hub shell 6902, which was very notchy, and one on the front hub, which wasn't as bad. I guess this could easily account for the wear visible on the freehub. Going to replace the whole lot.

    Mine are QR F/R but same as below apart from the two in the front hub, which were NBK 6902-2RS (i.e. same as the rear):

    Quote Originally Posted by GuitsBoy View Post
    Also, my bearing sizes for the were as follows:

    Front 15x100 Thru Axle
    NBK 6804-2RS
    NBK 6804-2RS

    Rear 12x142 Thru Axle
    NBK 6902-2RS
    NBK 6902-2RS

    6 Pawl Freehub:
    Tekino 15267RS
    Appears to be same size Tekino 15267RS (Unverified due to rubber seal)

  16. #416
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    So, finally got some time to take the wheel apart, but i can`t get the freehub off. Any suggestions? It`s the 12x142 version.Koozer hubs, 72 POE @ under -c239c6c7-6ae9-4bce-a961-d69948a5f863_zpsikjz7sse.jpg

  17. #417
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    Grasp it and should pull straight out. Even with the cassette still on it can pull right out as one unit


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  18. #418
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    It doesn't move at all. Will try and contact Revmega and see what they say. 20 hours use and the freehub stops working... :/

  19. #419
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    Hmm perhaps try putting cassette back on and tap from opposite side to try dislodging.


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  20. #420
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    Quote Originally Posted by Parapax View Post
    It doesn't move at all. Will try and contact Revmega and see what they say. 20 hours use and the freehub stops working... :/
    Has it actually stopped working, or do you mean it just won't pull off easily? As they are two pretty different things.

  21. #421
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    There's nothing holding it on the hub. Just pull. If it's stuck, put the cassette on and pull on the cassette with both hands.

    I bought the new black fhb model. I have pretty low expectations! Built it on a kom i23. We'll see.

  22. #422
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    Quote Originally Posted by funnyjr View Post
    Grasp it and should pull straight out. Even with the cassette still on it can pull right out as one unit


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    This ^ plus I found taking the axle end cap off helps too.

  23. #423
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    Freehub is broken, turns both ways with no engagement. Taken both end caps off, put the cassette back on and tried to pull it off, doesn't want to move at all. Tried to pull it off with water pump pliers, didn't work. What`s next? Taking the disc off and hitting the backside of the cassette with a hammer?

  24. #424
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    Quote Originally Posted by Parapax View Post
    Freehub is broken, turns both ways with no engagement. Taken both end caps off, put the cassette back on and tried to pull it off, doesn't want to move at all. Tried to pull it off with water pump pliers, didn't work. What`s next? Taking the disc off and hitting the backside of the cassette with a hammer?
    If you're out of other options you could try knocking the axle (and attached freehub) out from the other side. Place the hub over something with a circular hole that the flange can sit on, freehub down through the hole, and knock the axle through from the top. There is a lip that retains the axle behind the hub bearing, so you will pop the DS bearing out too, but at least you can see what's going on.

  25. #425
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    Quote Originally Posted by Forcemajeure View Post
    Attachment 1005059ayt here are some pics, took me several hours to complete the task as i wanna take my time and be careful with the bearings and hubs.. will test ride the bike next time

    i forgot to take a picture of the retainer ring, like a washer on the axle ratchet side, you have you use thin metal to pry it out

    1. remove the end caps by using 2 pcs 5mm allen key ( i think it was 5mm )
    2. pull out the free hub body by doing counter clockwise motion
    3, remove the bearings on the freehub body, just, toggle the spacer and gently tap the bearing and it will fall off
    4. remove the retainer or washer like metal ring on the axle you can check both sides to be sure, but i removed the one on the ratchet side
    5. use rubber mallet gently tap the axle, i chose to hit the rotor side first, once out use the axle to remove the 4th bearing

    now i used different kinds of sockets from my socket wrench set, and a threaded rod to act as a press tool, cost me $1 USD

    havn't tried riding my bike, since i also removed BB, cranks, pulley, rotors, rollers, general check up and clean up after a grueling ride on the mountain, trails, mud, heavy rain..

    Attachment 1005047Attachment 1005048Attachment 1005049Attachment 1005050Attachment 1005051Attachment 1005052Attachment 1005053Attachment 1005054
    Just replaced the rear bearings (freehub and shell) with SKF bearings purchased on eBay. After a quick run around the block I didn't detect any freehub skipping. I was really cranking hard corners on the asphalt and wasn't able to detect problems as I usually found the freehub skipping when coming out of a corner and pedaling hard.

    Also...as an FYI. Keep your old bearings as they come in handy to press in new ones if your using a threaded rod.

    Thanks everyone for the tips.

  26. #426
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    So finally got it off, what`s your thoughts? Koozer hubs, 72 POE @ under -2016-03-072022.41.51_zpsymrqmcga.jpgName:  2016-03-072022.42.04_zpsbp8l8njs.JPG
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Size:  128.4 KBKoozer hubs, 72 POE @ under -2016-03-072022.42.15_zpsmtjasqcv.jpgName:  2016-03-072022.43.37_zpsn66uvpdw.JPG
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Size:  139.5 KB

  27. #427
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    That should buff right out...

    Holy hell, you did some job on destroying that thing. But why is it only 3 pawls? Was this an earlier koozer? Though I thought the black freehub was supposedly the new stronger design? Any chance it was a mismatched freehub from a different hub?

  28. #428
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    According to PayPal it`s a KOOZER HA02N/HA04N 72HD Hub. What is it supposed to look like? I have never had a freehub fail before, and this was after 20 hours of light riding :/

  29. #429
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    If you look on the last page, youll see a picture of a freehub with 6 pawls (the flippers that skip over the teeth in one direction, and grab in the opposite direction). Yours appears to be only 3 pawls. Do you have a picture of the ratchet ring? I believe that the ring should have 36 teeth. If you only have 3 pawls, you probably only had 36 POE and not 72, so you didnt really get what you paid for. And if it was a different brand freehub, that may have lead to your problems. But just as easily, this might be an earlier style, and was indeed the genuine article, but a design thats different from what most of us have. I cant confirm one way or another.

    Who did you buy it from?

  30. #430
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    Horrible light, but here you go. Bought it from Revmega.Name:  2016-03-082000.41.03_zpsdegtjhrt.JPG
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Size:  137.3 KB

  31. #431
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    Quote Originally Posted by Parapax View Post
    According to PayPal it`s a KOOZER HA02N/HA04N 72HD Hub. What is it supposed to look like? I have never had a freehub fail before, and this was after 20 hours of light riding :/
    +1 on what GuitsBoy said. I see that all your pawls are stuck behind the springs instead of infront of them, hence no engagement. A few of mine were like that when I pulled mine out, not sure what causes it. I assumed it was deformation of the freehub body around where the pawls attach, but yours looks fine.

    If you pull the pawls out and push the springs back behind them your hub should work again (for the moment).

    Edit: That's 36 POE. They used to sell both 3 pawl and 6 pawl versions, either you picked the 36 POE one or they sent you the wrong one.

  32. #432
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    Quote Originally Posted by Parapax View Post
    Bought it from Revmega.
    Did you buy it recently? Shoot him a message stating that it failed in 20 hours of light riding, and show him these pics. Ask him why its not a 6 pawl freehub? My guess is it's either old stock, or some kind of factory mixup. Hopefully he can do something for you. Please keep us updated.

  33. #433
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    Quote Originally Posted by cerebroside View Post
    +1 on what GuitsBoy said. I see that all your pawls are stuck behind the springs instead of infront of them, hence no engagement. A few of mine were like that when I pulled mine out, not sure what causes it. I assumed it was deformation of the freehub body around where the pawls attach, but yours looks fine.

    If you pull the pawls out and push the springs back behind them your hub should work again (for the moment).
    Took me a minute to see them, but I think youre right. I thought the pawls had simply fallen out, but you can just see them peeking out behind the springs. Still, that freehub looks toasted. Look at the gouges from the ratchet ring. Hopefully the seller will help him out, and if not, free hubs are cheap, although Mine was $26 shipped, not $18 like posted above.

  34. #434
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    Quote Originally Posted by GuitsBoy View Post
    Took me a minute to see them, but I think youre right. I thought the pawls had simply fallen out, but you can just see them peeking out behind the springs. Still, that freehub looks toasted. Look at the gouges from the ratchet ring. Hopefully the seller will help him out, and if not, free hubs are cheap, although Mine was $26 shipped, not $18 like posted above.
    I don't think the gouges affect the operation of the freehub, though another poster in this thread said they indicated the bearings were poor which leads to the freehub body contacting the ratchet, and probably all the other problems people are having. Perhaps if the freehub moves far enough away from center the springs can slip out from under the pawls.

    My freehub was $18 USD and $5 shipping, though I haven't received it yet. Replaced my hub body bearings with SKF and put my old freehub back on for the moment.

  35. #435
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    Sent them a message with the pics. I bought this hub after searching the web for a affordable 12x142 hub without center lock disc mount (not easy to come by) I would not have bought it if i knew it was a 36 POE.

  36. #436
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    My concern would be that the gouges that deep would stand a bit proud on the edges as the metal is deformed and displaced, possibly contacting the ratchet and wearing sooner. Also, something caused it to seize and lock up to the point where it needed to be hammered out. I do agree that the bearings are the most likely contributor to the freehub getting skewed, and what you say makes sense about the springs coming out while under load.

    I guess no harm in trying, but Id certainly want a new freehub on its way just the same.

  37. #437
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    Result! Sent pics and asked them why the hub body reads 6 pawls and freehub only has 3 pawls. Here`s their response: "I see, it's our mistake. sorry for that, I will send you a new rear hub soon. It's a 3 pawls hub, a mistake by production line, some hubs mix together, it happens when our 12x142 hub first released last year. So please confirm your shipping address again. thank you"

    Happy camper

  38. #438
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    Quote Originally Posted by Parapax View Post
    Result! Sent pics and asked them why the hub body reads 6 pawls and freehub only has 3 pawls. Here`s their response: "I see, it's our mistake. sorry for that, I will send you a new rear hub soon. It's a 3 pawls hub, a mistake by production line, some hubs mix together, it happens when our 12x142 hub first released last year. So please confirm your shipping address again. thank you"

    Happy camper
    Bummer to read your story. Glad you are making progress. From the response it seems that they are shipping you a 3 pawl hub? Shouldn't it be a 6 pawl since that is the newer version.

    Good luck getting everything sorted.

  39. #439
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    Great news Parapax. Glad to hear theyre taking care of you.

    Sounds to me like they're sending you a whole new rear hub, not just the freehub. I guess you'll have to relace your rear wheel, but at least you'll have a better hub in there now.

    Are you planning on changing out the bearings as soon as you get the new hub?

  40. #440
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    Quote Originally Posted by GuitsBoy View Post

    Are you planning on changing out the bearings as soon as you get the new hub?
    Yeah might as well do that. Don't know how to build my own wheels so need to spend about 80usd to have my lbs build it up for me. Not exactly what I would call a cheap hub, total cost with two rebuilds and hardwear: 210usd. Could have bought a complete wheel for that price. Well, that's life.

  41. #441
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    You can just stick the freehub from your replacement hub in your old hub shell (for free). Might want to change the hub shell bearings first, though I don't think anyone has established whether that solves the problem yet.

  42. #442
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    Quote Originally Posted by cerebroside View Post
    You can just stick the freehub from your replacement hub in your old hub shell (for free). Might want to change the hub shell bearings first, though I don't think anyone has established whether that solves the problem yet.
    I recently took a look at the hub from a guy whose previous koozer freehub body failed totally (pawls broken, pawl bearing broken, FHB deformed and marred from making contact with the ratched ring). I posted the pictures earlier on this thread.

    So we got a new freehub body a couple of months ago, changed the pawl bearing with an "enduro" bearing right off the bat and installed it on his old hub shell. I told him I wanted to inspect it to see how it was holding up. The freehub body looked as good as new, it slid off the axle easily and smoothly when removing it, there were absolutely no marks from contacting the ratchet ring and all 6 pawls were working fine and dandy.
    I cant say for sure that that this is proof that the lousy stock pawl bearing is the culprit for these problems and that this is a definite fix, but it looks promising so far. This is a pretty hefty and strong dude btw. 250 pounds of fat and fit muscle. He can push some nice peak watts I am sure. Never underestimate the power of a fat fit man.

  43. #443
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    So do you think swapping out the freehub bearings only is enough preventative maintenance or do I really need to swap the hub shell bearings as well to see any benefit?

  44. #444
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    Quote Originally Posted by abelfonseca View Post
    I recently took a look at the hub from a guy whose previous koozer freehub body failed totally (pawls broken, pawl bearing broken, FHB deformed and marred from making contact with the ratched ring). I posted the pictures earlier on this thread.

    So we got a new freehub body a couple of months ago, changed the pawl bearing with an "enduro" bearing right off the bat and installed it on his old hub shell. I told him I wanted to inspect it to see how it was holding up. The freehub body looked as good as new, it slid off the axle easily and smoothly when removing it, there were absolutely no marks from contacting the ratchet ring and all 6 pawls were working fine and dandy.
    I cant say for sure that that this is proof that the lousy stock pawl bearing is the culprit for these problems and that this is a definite fix, but it looks promising so far. This is a pretty hefty and strong dude btw. 250 pounds of fat and fit muscle. He can push some nice peak watts I am sure. Never underestimate the power of a fat fit man.
    Good to hear. Mine will be fully changed to SKF when I get it, I'll try to pull it occasionally and update here.

  45. #445
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    Quote Originally Posted by GuitsBoy View Post
    So do you think swapping out the freehub bearings only is enough preventative maintenance or do I really need to swap the hub shell bearings as well to see any benefit?
    We decided on only replacing tha pawl side freehub body bearing because it was the only one that failed, the others were still rolling smoothly. I think it wouldnt hurt to have them all replaced, but if you want to skimp, at least go for the pawl side freehub body bearing.

  46. #446
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    I'll probably just replace them all at some point. Its a low priority since they haven't given me any issues yet. Though I just rebuilt my wheelset with i35 rims for my B+ build, so they're about to get some heavy mileage pretty quickly.

  47. #447
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    Im going to do both of the fhb bearings. Just paid $17 shipped for 2 of them, from SKF.

    I pulled apart the hub and removed the seals. The bearings are properly greased, they're just bad quality. On the plus side, these really are pretty big bearings. A decent quality bearing in the hub should really help it out.

    Im still a little weary of the axle thickness, but it does seem like more than a few people are having good luck after replacing the bearings.

    If you wait until something fails, its going to cause you more problems than if you just replaced the bearing right off the bat.

  48. #448
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    I contacted Jeroen at "The Hub Doctor" ebay store and asked if he had any packages for Koozer hubs, and he was kind enough to create two listings for us, one SKF and one Hybrid Ceramic. He said he prefers the hybrid ceramic ones since they roll faster. Both are rated ABEC 5. Not sure if there's anything else that would sway you towards SKF over the hybrid ceramic at the same price.

    Hybrid Ceramic for 15/12 thru axle:
    Koozer Hybrid Ceramic Ball Bearing Front Rear Wheels Freehub Bearings | eBay

    SKF for 15/12 thru axle:
    Koozer Hybrid SKF Ball Bearing Front Rear Wheels Freehub Bearings | eBay

    Anyway, these seem to be a bit cheaper than piecing together the bearings in 2 packs.

  49. #449
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    Quote Originally Posted by GuitsBoy View Post
    I contacted Jeroen at "The Hub Doctor" ebay store and asked if he had any packages for Koozer hubs, and he was kind enough to create two listings for us, one SKF and one Hybrid Ceramic. He said he prefers the hybrid ceramic ones since they roll faster. Both are rated ABEC 5. Not sure if there's anything else that would sway you towards SKF over the hybrid ceramic at the same price.

    Hybrid Ceramic:
    Koozer Hybrid Ceramic Ball Bearing Front Rear Wheels Freehub Bearings | eBay

    SKF:
    Koozer Hybrid SKF Ball Bearing Front Rear Wheels Freehub Bearings | eBay

    Anyway, these seem to be a bit cheaper than piecing together the bearings in 2 packs.
    Nice, that's who I just got mine from. They do say in the listing, but note that the QR front uses different bearings as stated on the last page.

  50. #450
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    Quote Originally Posted by cerebroside View Post
    Nice, that's who I just got mine from. They do say in the listing, but note that the QR front uses different bearings as stated on the last page.
    Sorry, yes, I meant to mention that. 15mm/12mm thru axles.

  51. #451
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    Quote Originally Posted by GuitsBoy View Post
    Sorry, yes, I meant to mention that. 15mm/12mm thru axles.
    Rear is the same, so it should work for 15-F/QR-R combos too. Not many people running QR front anymore, but 135 drops on the rear are still pretty popular on hardtails. Thanks for organizing that package with the seller.

  52. #452
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    I bought SKF abec 5's for the freehub. I think (hope?) they're stainless.

    I used enduro LLB's for the hub shell. They're big bearings with big seals, the llb's are supposed to have less seal drag than 2RS bearings.

    Total was $23 shipped. I dont necessarily want ceramics in my hubs. I think you get a better quality bearing using comparably priced stainless. Real high quality ceramics are insanely priced.

  53. #453
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    I finally got the QR endcaps for my 142 Koozer rear hub and finished building the wheel today. RevMega shipped out the correct parts right away. but it took 2 months by the time everything arrived.

    I used a Mavic F219 rim and Sapim Race spokes. I'll be ordering a spare freehub soon, just in case, and enduro bearings for the freehub.

  54. #454
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    Quote Originally Posted by One Pivot View Post
    I bought SKF abec 5's for the freehub. I think (hope?) they're stainless.

    I used enduro LLB's for the hub shell. They're big bearings with big seals, the llb's are supposed to have less seal drag than 2RS bearings.

    Total was $23 shipped. I dont necessarily want ceramics in my hubs. I think you get a better quality bearing using comparably priced stainless. Real high quality ceramics are insanely priced.
    I agree w you in regards to the ceramic bearings. I ordered some few yrs back to rebuild my wheels and they literally disintegrated after a short period of time. SKF work awesome from hub doc.


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  55. #455
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    Quote Originally Posted by funnyjr View Post
    I agree w you in regards to the ceramic bearings. I ordered some few yrs back to rebuild my wheels and they literally disintegrated after a short period of time. SKF work awesome from hub doc.
    Only reason I rolled the dice was because they ceramics were priced the same, and of the two, the hub doctor suggested the ceramic over skf. Ill have to defer to his expertise on the matter. If they do disintegrate in short order, it will be a rather inexpensive lesson in marketing.

  56. #456
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    I would like to try a 157mm OR a 150mm spacing for DH, not tons of pedaling in my world like you guys so I think the 6 pawls sound would just be a nice HOPE knock off that would be good enough for me?

    BTW The SKOOTER 24h hub with ratchet style engagement is a Chris King knock off, I think the truth is in the material they use to clone it.

  57. #457
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    This is absolutely not a DH hub.

  58. #458
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    Most roadies will put down much more torque than a DH rider. I'd have no issue running these on my DH bike. That said, they are not offered in a 12x150/157mm or a 20x110mm.
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  59. #459
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    People are destroying these things on normal bikes. ONE bearing goes out and the hub eats itself. While we can replace the bearing and keep going, its really not just that one bearing causing the issues. I have DT 240 hubs that had trashed bearings and the hub was fine. Its not about torque, its the axle bending. These dont have beefy axle. DH bikes need beefy axles.

  60. #460
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    i installed HCH bearing made in china, please dont use them, use japan made bearings

  61. #461
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    I have replaced the inner freehub body bearings on 2 different hubs and still cracked the freehub body and I used enduro bearings that are visibly thicker than the stock tekino bearings. I am now trying the new rear hub with the black hub body and hoping for better results.

  62. #462
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    My rear Koozer fell apart. Started to hear popping sounds from the hub. Took off the wheel first thing i noticed was the lock nut was loose. Pulled off the freehub and the bearing of the freehub was stuck on the axle. Pawls came out all over the place. Bearings are toast in the hub. Not going to bother fixing this hub. Going with a Hope. Something a lot more reliable.

  63. #463
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    Quote Originally Posted by One Pivot View Post
    People are destroying these things on normal bikes. ONE bearing goes out and the hub eats itself. While we can replace the bearing and keep going, its really not just that one bearing causing the issues. I have DT 240 hubs that had trashed bearings and the hub was fine. Its not about torque, its the axle bending. These dont have beefy axle. DH bikes need beefy axles.
    The forces applied through the pedals similarly reaches the axle. Yes, the bearings are appearing to be the short fall on these hubs but the flanges/body seem to be holding strong. There are a lot of sh!t hubs out there, I'll take these over 90% off the hubs on the market. Still no issues with my set that's ridden on my 130mm bike, but I'll take a look at the bearings next time the wheel is out. I'd have no issues putting them on my DH bike if 12x150mm and 20x110mm were offered.
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  64. #464
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    These black FHB's are really new. The old ones certainly werent holding up at all, so hopefully this new design really is significantly better... but we'll see. Its been raining enough that I cant get a ride in, but come summer I think a lot of us will be piling on miles. We'll see.

    As it sits now, these are one of those shit hubs on the market. The freehub shouldnt smash into the ratchet ring and destroy itself. I understand the few odd failures with any product, but we're seeing a pattern failure. I really hope they did fix it with the black freehub models.

    If you can build your own wheels... hey, 60 bucks for 72pt! If its going to be your only wheel and you're paying to build it up, id really wait a few months to see what happens.

  65. #465
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    Quote Originally Posted by One Pivot View Post
    These black FHB's are really new. The old ones certainly werent holding up at all, so hopefully this new design really is significantly better... but we'll see. Its been raining enough that I cant get a ride in, but come summer I think a lot of us will be piling on miles. We'll see.

    As it sits now, these are one of those shit hubs on the market. The freehub shouldnt smash into the ratchet ring and destroy itself. I understand the few odd failures with any product, but we're seeing a pattern failure. I really hope they did fix it with the black freehub models.

    If you can build your own wheels... hey, 60 bucks for 72pt! If its going to be your only wheel and you're paying to build it up, id really wait a few months to see what happens.
    Hard for me to complain since I've put a lot of kilometers on mine with no functional issues (just the freehub marring). Since people seem to be destroying newer ones in a matter of hours perhaps there is some quality fade going on? That has been a big problem with cheaper lights. Or perhaps they are just more popular now so the issues are more obvious.

    Either way, the next best deal (IMHO) for a high engagement hub is the Bitex/BHS MTB270, which is almost double the price ($110 USD) for slightly less engagement (54 POE). No reported issues with that one, and mine has been stellar.
    If you want 72 POE then there is the Superstar Tesla EVO, which is triple the price (and has its own freehub problems.)

  66. #466
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    It's a kinda tough call. In my case, I stick to used DT350 hubs, usually in complete wheelsets. You can find DT Swiss Spline wheels, usually take offs from people who are upgrading to carbon or what have you, for under $300, and if you're lucky you'll get one of the wider versions. I scored a set of X1700 for $250 in like-new condition. Koozer complete wheels would have cost $180 or so, and I've never built wheels so paying an extra $70 for a quality wheelset was worth it. Granted someday I'll need to upgrade to wider rims, but I also trust that the 54t rachet that's installed will still work completely fine, I'll still be able to get quality bearings, and even better, I'll be able to get 148 conversion end caps.

    I am totally that dude who has no problems sourcing cheap Chinese or Taiwanese parts, but in some cases going the used route and getting lightly used quality parts from big name manufacturers has its advantages.
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  67. #467
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    so, the new koozer hub (2016) is not recommended?

  68. #468
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cronoscr View Post
    so, the new koozer hub (2016) is not recommended?
    Hard to say. One person has broken theirs, but the specific circumstances are not known, apart from it probably being due to poor bearing quality (?). For the other failures it was not stated whether it was an old or new model.
    Obviously not the most reliable hub in the world, but if you are comfortable working on your own wheels and want to take a bit of a gamble for high POE, then I would still recommend it. Personally it has paid off for me, since I have not had any failures. If you are worried about reliability and are willing to pay a bit more then perhaps choose something else (i.e. BHS MTB270).

  69. #469
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    I have destroyed 2 of the earlier ones despite replacing the inner and outer freehub bearings with enduro bearings (gold color fhb's). I received one of the new 2016 black ones and have already put around 75 miles on it (others failed within 1 or 2 rides) and hard uphill miles and I weigh close to 240lbs. No scoring, no crushed bearings (kept the stock ones which are upgraded skf bearings) no noise, no issues whatsoever. The new ones have upgraded aluminum supposed to be the same hardness as DT Swiss fhb's. I think the problems have been fixed with the 2016 hubs, wouldn't hesitate to now buy them again. Rvmega on ebay has been the most helpful seller I have ever dealt with.

  70. #470
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    I am heavy , what is BHS MTB270?? i dont found any on ebay, actually i have a novatec but is something battered

  71. #471
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    I just want to put this out there. I'm running the original 72 poe hubs and have replaced the bearings (pro-actively) this past winter. However, these hubs have been solid for me. I'm 210+ geared up and I power over technical things. I've recently blown through an XT 10-speed cassette however the hub is still holding up strong. I do service the hub at the end of every season by cleaning and re-lubing the pawls. I've been running these hubs since May 2015 and I ride at least 3 times a week (aside from the last 2-3 winter months). I'm confused as to how many versions of these there are so maybe the first round were built stronger???


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  72. #472
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    Quote Originally Posted by One Pivot View Post
    ...Its not about torque, its the axle bending...
    There is a common theme running through all of these chinese rear hub failures - a thin wall alu 15mm axle is just not strong enough. There is a huge amount of bending force where the inner bearing of the freehub and the inner bearing in the hubshell meet. This is where the axle bends and results in contact with the drive ring, pawl failure, freehub failure and premature bearing failure. The bending of the axle is actually causing the bearings to fail because of the loads caused by the axle bending.

  73. #473
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    Quote Originally Posted by TigWorld View Post
    There is a common theme running through all of these chinese rear hub failures - a thin wall alu 15mm axle is just not strong enough.
    I just drilled out my endcaps and converted to a 10x135 thru axle. Would adding a short length of 10mm ID 12mm OD tube between the thru axle and the hub axle do anything to stiffen it? Does this problem only affect QR rear hubs and not thru axles for just this reason?

  74. #474
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    Chronoscr - BHS website, great customer service, nice basic hubs w/ a good reputation.
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  75. #475
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    Quote Originally Posted by GuitsBoy View Post
    I just drilled out my endcaps and converted to a 10x135 thru axle. Would adding a short length of 10mm ID 12mm OD tube between the thru axle and the hub axle do anything to stiffen it? Does this problem only affect QR rear hubs and not thru axles for just this reason?
    This would solve the problem IMHO.

  76. #476
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    Quote Originally Posted by TigWorld View Post
    This would solve the problem IMHO.
    Yeah, I figured it would be worth a try. I ordered a 50 cm length of 12mm OD 10mm ID titanium tubing from china for $16. Assuming the diameters are accurate, I should be able to cut it down with an angle grinder and reinforce the existing aluminum axle. It should work for QR skewers too, at least for the T/A hubs with QR endcaps.

  77. #477
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    Koozer hubs, 72 POE @ under $60

    Quote Originally Posted by TigWorld View Post
    The bending of the axle is actually causing the bearings to fail because of the loads caused by the axle bending.
    Or is it the other way around.. bearing failure causing axle to move?

    Since some have seemed to have remedied using higher quality bearings.

    I had same problems with Stans 3.30 hub and fixed using SKF bearings.

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  78. #478
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    SRAM XD Driver freehubs are out, it seems. Unfortunately 2016 model year only right now. Sent Revmega an email asking if the 2015 would be coming out soon. Ill let you guys know.

    Koozer HA02N HA04N Hub Parts Freehub SRAM XD Driver 2016 2015 Model | eBay

    Does anyone know if the 2015 and 2016 freehub pawls and ratchet rings are the same? Ive seen both hubs and endcaps, and it looks like if they did fit, you might be able to grind down the endcap a bit to get it to work on the 2015.

  79. #479
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    so far so good with my hubs. replaced the 2 bearings in the freehub as well. but did multiple rides with stock bearings

  80. #480
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    SRAM XD Driver info:

    As per Revmega, only the 2016 hub can be converted to XD driver. The 2015 hub is standard freehub only. Do not be confused by the ebay listing, if you select 2015, your only choice will be the standard freehub.

    Not sure its worth buying both a new rear hub AND freehub just to get an XD driver on there. Guess Ill stick with an 11t.

  81. #481
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    How do you distinguish between 2015 and 2016. Not sure which I have honestly

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  82. #482
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    I think you can tell by the freehub. The 2015 freehub has two 15267 bearings. The 2016 freehub has one 15267 and one 6902 I think. Not 100% sure exactly of the bearing number, but I do know the 2016 has two different bearings in the freehub.

  83. #483
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    I bought what was listed as a 2016. It has two 15267 bearings in the freehub, and a 6902 bearing shield stuffed in the end as a dust shield.

  84. #484
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    For what it's worth, a buddy of mine just brought his new xd driver over and it seems to swap fine with my older freehub. Mine is definitely two 15267 bearings. The endcaps were slightly different but it looked like it would work.

  85. #485
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    anyone has a link of a video for new koozer hubs XR1600 with clutch mech?

  86. #486
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    Revmega strongly cautioned me against using the XD freehub on the 2015 12mm rear hub. He said the waterproofing seal as well as the endcaps are different.

    Visually, yes they are different, but in measuring with a vernier caliper, the endcap is pretty close. Only .035" difference, which I could easily grind down. The waterproofing seal doesn't seem like it would physically interfere much either, but it my well become ineffective at keeping water out. It shoudl still offer some dust protection, but it wont be a perfect seal since the seals are different. I dont ride in a lot of adverse conditions, so I think Ill be ok.

    I think I'm going to throw caution to the wind and order up the XD freehub despite his warnings. Ill let you guys know how it goes.

  87. #487
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    So finally decided that I am going to try my hand at wheelbuilding this year and build up a new set of "wider" rims. I know that there was some talk of the bearings in these not being all that great and that some were changing them out.

    For those that changed them out, what did you change them too?
    Also, It looks like there may be an updated version that has newer bearings? When purchasing how do I tell which are the newer and which are the older?

  88. #488
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    Quote Originally Posted by gregnash View Post
    So finally decided that I am going to try my hand at wheelbuilding this year and build up a new set of "wider" rims. I know that there was some talk of the bearings in these not being all that great and that some were changing them out.

    For those that changed them out, what did you change them too?
    Also, It looks like there may be an updated version that has newer bearings? When purchasing how do I tell which are the newer and which are the older?
    reason why i changed the bearings was i just want to have a peace of mind, knowing that i can install japanese made bearings, instead of waiting for the chinese bearings to pop out...

    yup and i replaced them with hch chinese made bearings, after few months, i replaced them with japan made bearings.. so far so good

  89. #489
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    I use 2016 XD freehub on koozer 2015 hub. But I must use new 2016 freehub dust shield (orange) . With old 2015 (black) did not work properly.
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  90. #490
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    Quote Originally Posted by cipo23 View Post
    I use 2016 XD freehub on koozer 2015 hub. But I must use new 2016 freehub dust shield (orange) . With old 2015 (black) did not work properly.
    Great to hear. Where did you get the dust shield from? I was just going to try and turn down the xd freehub lip on a lathe, but Id rather swap out for the proper dust shield if possible.

  91. #491
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    Quote Originally Posted by GuitsBoy View Post
    Great to hear. Where did you get the dust shield from? I was just going to try and turn down the xd freehub lip on a lathe, but Id rather swap out for the proper dust shield if possible.

    I order new hub, so I try change it. I wrote REVMEGA about new dust shield. He sent them to me for free.

  92. #492
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    Can you just get the freehub body or bearings for the rear koozer hub.

  93. #493
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    Quote Originally Posted by caRpetbomBer View Post
    Can you just get the freehub body or bearings for the rear koozer hub.
    You can order new freehubs from Revmega on ebay. They have standard freehubs for both 2015 and 2016 hubs. The XD freehub is 2016 only, but a few of us are trying to retrofit to 2015 hubs.

    As for bearings, you can source the bearings from whereve you like. Most people seem to like SKF or enduro bearings. There are bearing pacakges available on ebay from "the hub doctor", but these are for the 2015 model. If you have the 2016 hubs, you can contact him with the bearing part numbers and see if he will customize a set for you. Or you can buy each bearing individually (or in pairs) for a couple bucks more.

  94. #494
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    Forgot to mention this, but I successfully reinforced my rear axle. I ordered a length of 12mm titanium tubing from ebay, and it just arrived yesterday. I measured the existing axle length and cut the tubing down with an angle grinder. Sadly, it was a little too tight to fit through the stock axle, so I put it in my drill press chuck, and spent 20-30 minutes sanding it down with emory cloth. Finally, I removed enough material to tap it through the stock axle. The 10mm thru axle I have was still a bit loose, so I shimmed with with some metal tape I had laying around. Now everything is a snug fit, and the rear axle should me considerably stiffer than it was. Good thing too, since I already have ratchet ring teeth marks on the freehub body due to axle flex, even with upgraded bearings.

  95. #495
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    Man this thread is scaring me. I built 2 sets of wheels with the 2015 hubs for my kids. I figured their weight would be ok, but you guys are making me wonder if I'm going to be walking bikes back to the car this summer.

    Can someone give me the numbers for the bearings I need to order? Is the front as susceptible as the rear?

  96. #496
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    Quote Originally Posted by GuitsBoy View Post
    I think you can tell by the freehub. The 2015 freehub has two 15267 bearings. The 2016 freehub has one 15267 and one 6902 I think. Not 100% sure exactly of the bearing number, but I do know the 2016 has two different bearings in the freehub.
    @Erock503 The 15267 is the bearings that I believe you are wanting to go with for everything. If nothing else you can pull the hubs apart and see the bearing numbers on the bearings themselves or talk with RevMega on ebay. There is nothing really "wrong" with the supplied bearings, I mean this thread has been going on for a while with 20pgs of responses and I think 1 person has had bearing issues. Ultimately, most people will NOT like things that are Chinese made due to the QA/QC processes being fairly inaccurate (or at least that is the perception) and so they just replace. But again, if you do not have issues then you should be fine. and really if you are having kids ride these then you are definitely fine. I believe that once you get into adults that ride hard and are a bit heavier (clydes even) that is where the Chinese bearings start having issues.

  97. #497
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    Quote Originally Posted by Erock503 View Post
    Man this thread is scaring me. I built 2 sets of wheels with the 2015 hubs for my kids. I figured their weight would be ok, but you guys are making me wonder if I'm going to be walking bikes back to the car this summer.

    Can someone give me the numbers for the bearings I need to order? Is the front as susceptible as the rear?
    I'm >180 lbs before gear and haven't had a failure in over a year of riding. Still on the original freehub since my replacement hasn't arrived yet, and the bearings needed doing anyway. I think a lot of other people are replacing the bearings more as a precaution than anything. If you're worried about it pull the freehub and check for marring or pawls stuck behind springs.

    Edit: The bearing replacement advice only relates to the freehub marring and pawls moving out of place, you only need to do the front if your bearings get gritty, etc.

  98. #498
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    I have to agree with what gregnash has to say. No cause for concern, especially at child weights.

    I am proactively replacing and reinforcing my rear hub because I am at 240 Lb ride weight with a 425 pound squat. That's not to say I'm a good rider, but I certainly put more force on my drivetrain than the average joe. The fact that my stock hubs survived my first trip out should give you confidence they'll hold up for your kids.

  99. #499
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    Thanks guys, really appreciate the perspective and numbers.

  100. #500
    Short-Change-Hero
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    I am with @Guitsboy in that when I get mine I will probably look at replacing the bearings with high quality Japanese bearings. This is mainly because I will be taking my time to build these new rims, not in any particular hurry.

    I am a research analyst by profession and nature, so this will give me adequate time to do some learning and make determinations on some good bearing companies. I know that NSK and SKF are good brands and have heard mixed reviews about Enduro. Ultimately, everyone has a main mfg somewhere and they are not dedicated to producing the exact same bearing for just one company, so many times you can find off-brand bearings that are made to the same quality standards as the higher end bearings but at half the cost (this was my findings about 10yrs ago when Vizio first started coming on to the LED/LCD TV market).

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