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  1. #51
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    Hadley Racing Hubs !!

  2. #52
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    I've had my Chris Kings since July 2004, still going strong.

  3. #53
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    I9's are just way too loud for me. You can't even carry on a conversation with someone on I9's when pedaling to the trailhead. And when riding a trail you always know where the I9 rider is. Way too loud.
    I have CK on Derby's 40mm wheels for all-mountain setup. Gonna build a XC setup with Light bike hoops and DT Swiss 240 hubs now. The all-mountains setup climbs a bit slower than I want.

  4. #54
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    Sounds like the I9 hubs have so much less drag that they have to coast more so the kings can keep up.
    Otherwise they wouldn't be such a nuisance.

  5. #55
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    Chris King or Industry 9 hubs ?????

    DT. Amazingly, people with DT hubs are also able to ride tech stuff.😜 I would like faster engagement, but my wheels are light and my hubs are strong. They're getting kind of loud though.


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  6. #56
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    CK or i9 both are near perfect. You wont regret either. Buy either.

  7. #57
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    Rode both and nearly identical. Buy either. I9 is louder by small margin but also has slightly faster engagement. Yes it can be felt but not a deal breaker.

  8. #58
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    I've been running my true precision stealth hubs now for about a year and they kick ass. they are 100 trillion poe. Really smart mechanism in those, makes the rest look like tech from the dark ages, comparatively.
    Rule #9 // If you are out riding in bad weather, it means you are a badass. Period.

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    Specialized sucks ass.

  9. #59
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    Profile Elites!

  10. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trail_Blazer View Post
    Rode both and nearly identical. Buy either. I9 is louder by small margin but also has slightly faster engagement. Yes it can be felt but not a deal breaker.
    Agreed. Although I would say my I9s are MUCH louder than my Kings. Granted the Kings are relatively new and the I9s are about a year old.

  11. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by Simplemind View Post
    I never read anyone arguing with CK quality. However since their current design doesn't lend itself to XX1, a solution will not come soon enough for me.
    I like the Torch design on paper and if the quality is up to par with my current I9's, then that's probably one of the best current options.
    Thanks for all the great info everyone. I wanted to add a tag to this old thread that Chris King XD freehub upgrade kits our now available.

  12. #62
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    Should check out new Project 321 hubs, they improve upon the Torch shortcomings.

  13. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by pointerDixie214 View Post
    Agreed. Although I would say my I9s are MUCH louder than my Kings. Granted the Kings are relatively new and the I9s are about a year old.
    I live in Asheville, so I9's are everywhere, I went with CK to be different (actually, they came with the bike....)

    I think i9's are much louder than my CK's, but it could be the pitch difference and my ears going from years around large machinery.... The i9's are in the same pitch as a std hub, but a louder growl, the CK's are a higher pitch, more of a buzz:

    ANGRY BEE RINGTONE | Chris King Precision Components

    I scared one hiker as I (very politely) passed her, and coasted for a second. She jumped, looking for a rattler.
    My bike MCA kinda climbs like a billy-goat. WOO WOO!

  14. #64
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    That's what I went with. Still waiting for them to arrive.

  15. #65
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    My I9's have been great!
    I like to fart when I'm in front of you on a climb

  16. #66
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    Chris King or Industry 9 hubs ?????

    Love my i9s!

  17. #67
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    What's the difference between ISO & " cross lock? " hubs

  18. #68
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    Chris King or Industry 9 hubs ?????

    Quote Originally Posted by velo99 View Post
    What's the difference between ISO & " cross lock? " hubs
    WTF is a "cross lock" hub?
    Quote Originally Posted by pvd
    Time to stop believing the hype and start doing some science.
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  19. #69
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    Was looking earlier today @ hubs. One type was cross or center something. Hence the question mark.

  20. #70
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    Do you mean center lock? That's a style of brake rotor.

  21. #71
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    Chris King or Industry 9 hubs ?????

    Quote Originally Posted by velo99 View Post
    Was looking earlier today @ hubs. One type was cross or center something. Hence the question mark.
    Then you weren't looking at Chris King or I9.
    Chris King ISO hubs are their standard disc hub. Standard as in 6-bolt rotor mount.
    Shimano has a proprietary rotor mount system that is called "centerlock," and a couple of manufacturers have licensed it (e.g., DT Swiss), but not Industry 9 or Chris King.
    You can adapt a CL hub to fit a standard 6-bolt rotor, but not the other way around.
    Quote Originally Posted by pvd
    Time to stop believing the hype and start doing some science.
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  22. #72
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    What shortcomings of the I9 Torch hubs did Project 321 address?
    Quote Originally Posted by dgw7000 View Post
    Should check out new Project 321 hubs, they improve upon the Torch shortcomings.

  23. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andy13 View Post
    What shortcomings of the I9 Torch hubs did Project 321 address?
    Don't know about Torch shortcomings, but the 321s come with Enduro angular contact bearings, a significant improvement over the typical cartridge balls that Torches come with.
    Quote Originally Posted by pvd
    Time to stop believing the hype and start doing some science.
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  24. #74
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    My trail Torch hubs now have had 3 revisions to correct the problems and they still have bearing problems, I think some of the problems could have been avoided.
    Project 321 new G2 rear hub has 2 angular contact bearings with longer life and better lateral load capacity. Better end caps to accurately load to adjust bearing preload for no play as bearings start to wear. I think being able to adjust preload is critical !! I also feel the Ano on Projsct 321 is the best out there no sun fade. Weight 274 grams not bad!! Hub in pict 23 months old still had nice rich color.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Chris King or Industry 9 hubs ?????-p1040624.jpg  


  25. #75
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    Thanks for the info. I agree the bearing issue w/ my torch hubs has been frustrating. I've said it before, I9 has great customer service, I just wish I didn't need to use it. The last design change w/ the new cassette body using a double row of bearings seems to have fixed my issues. Good to know that the 321 hubs have better bearings. Would the angular bearings fit in the I9 hubs/cassette bodies? TIA

  26. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andy13 View Post
    Thanks for the info. I agree the bearing issue w/ my torch hubs has been frustrating. I've said it before, I9 has great customer service, I just wish I didn't need to use it. The last design change w/ the new cassette body using a double row of bearings seems to have fixed my issues. Good to know that the 321 hubs have better bearings. Would the angular bearings fit in the I9 hubs/cassette bodies? TIA
    This reassures me that my choice to eliminate I9 from contention. I ended up with 36 hole Chris Kings. I anticipate ZERO issues as long as I winterize the hubs at the appropriate time of year. It seems to me that I9 is a good choice for lightweight riders and super spinners.

    ... but I do wonder who has the ultimately stronger freehub body ... Chris King or DT Swiss.

  27. #77
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    Chris King or Industry 9 hubs ?????

    Quote Originally Posted by willtsmith_nwi View Post
    ... but I do wonder who has the ultimately stronger freehub body ... Chris King or DT Swiss.
    Ultimate strength goes to Chris King without question and by a LARGE margin. The torque ratings on the ring drive are astronomical, which is due to the design feature that increases the engagement force as force is applied to the drive. The harder you push, the harder the splines are pushed against each other, making slipping or failure much less likely. Once the DT Swiss star ratchet is engaged the only force on the drive mechanism is the driving torque.
    Quote Originally Posted by pvd
    Time to stop believing the hype and start doing some science.
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  28. #78
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    The more I use DT Swiss 240 hubs the more I like them, a go to hub for people that want light weight and butter long lasting bearings. Also so easy to service.

  29. #79
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    This thread is a must read to avoid mistakes, for anyone in the process of buying expensive wheels.
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  30. #80
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    Great thread! I've had CK's for about 8 years. They almost get better with age and I can't imagine a better hub. With that said, I'm selling them anyway to go with I9's for my current build. I need the fastest, lightest and highest POE I can get as this build is intended for racing (ie speed). With all of these high end wheels you really can't go wrong. So how do you pick? Here's another perspective - consider the bike and it's intended useage. Here's my opinion on the best for each type:

    CK - For the ultimate steel road, cross or mountain bike. CK to hubs is like steel to frames. They will last a life time and both are proven high end choices. CK on high end steel frames is a match made in heaven.

    I9 - For the ultimate carbon mountain bike. The bling of a carbon mountain bike deserves the bling of I9. They've got high # of engagement points needed for rough trails, low weight and low drag for speed. And with the straight pull AL spokes (idea is stiffness) it just matches well with the design of a good carbon mountain frame.

    DS - For the ultimate carbon road bike. They are light and affordable enough to allow an upgrade to carbon rims! Yes, the POE isn't as high, but this isn't as neccessary for road bikes. Easily serviceable, will last forever and sound awesome on the road.

    There are lots of other great wheels out there, but with the 3 choices above you can't go wrong. Oh, the one type of bike I left out was aluminum frames. For those I'd just go with Mavic

  31. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by eck cyclist View Post
    Great thread! I've had CK's for about 8 years. They almost get better with age and I can't imagine a better hub. With that said, I'm selling them anyway to go with I9's for my current build. I need the fastest, lightest and highest POE I can get as this build is intended for racing (ie speed). With all of these high end wheels you really can't go wrong. So how do you pick? Here's another perspective - consider the bike and it's intended useage. Here's my opinion on the best for each type:

    CK - For the ultimate steel road, cross or mountain bike. CK to hubs is like steel to frames. They will last a life time and both are proven high end choices. CK on high end steel frames is a match made in heaven.

    I9 - For the ultimate carbon mountain bike. The bling of a carbon mountain bike deserves the bling of I9. They've got high # of engagement points needed for rough trails, low weight and low drag for speed. And with the straight pull AL spokes (idea is stiffness) it just matches well with the design of a good carbon mountain frame.

    DS - For the ultimate carbon road bike. They are light and affordable enough to allow an upgrade to carbon rims! Yes, the POE isn't as high, but this isn't as neccessary for road bikes. Easily serviceable, will last forever and sound awesome on the road.

    There are lots of other great wheels out there, but with the 3 choices above you can't go wrong. Oh, the one type of bike I left out was aluminum frames. For those I'd just go with Mavic
    You won't have any issues with the I9 ring gear Both CK and I9 have very close ring gear test ratings. One is not significantly stronger than the other when it comes to that. I'm still on my first set on my enduro's and they are stiff and still perfectly true. I ran a set of enve's this summer with CK hubs and they were great as well. The AM enve's were maybe slightly stiffer (maybe) hard to tell, but both hubs worked great. I would change bearings in the I9 every few years as they seem to collect a bit more dirt, at least that's what I am told. I did have to change some after 2 years. Either way have fun, you will love the I9's.

  32. #82
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    Myself would go with Project 321 hubs over the I9, better bearings and end caps. Same weight, Project 321 has better anodizing. Just my 2 cent and I do have I9 Torch hubs and Project 321.

  33. #83
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    Chris King or Industry 9 hubs ?????

    Quote Originally Posted by dgw7000 View Post
    The more I use DT Swiss 240 hubs the more I like them, a go to hub for people that want light weight and butter long lasting bearings. Also so easy to service.
    Agree. I am considering a I9 but my 240s is so reliable.


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  34. #84
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    I wanna try the I9's because of the higher engagement. I run Hadley's now and love the Ti free hub. I had CK's and wore out the free hub just like you described.
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  35. #85
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    This review is a bit dated but still an interesting read:

    Hub Showdown - Chris King, Hadley, Industry Nine, DT, Stealth, and Hope | RIDING FEELS GOOD

    Cheers..
    -S

    FWIW, I have three sets of Hadleys.

  36. #86
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    Does Hadley make anything but 32 and 36 hole? All the info I can conjure up indicates no 28H hubs. I would love to give them a try for a soon-to-be build, but need 28H.

  37. #87
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    Hadley don't have a website but all their products are shown and available here:
    Balle Racing Mountain Bike Parts & Tools

    And you're right, only 32 or 36 spoke holes. And no Boost (yet).


    -S

  38. #88
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    Quote Originally Posted by shif View Post
    This review is a bit dated but still an interesting read:

    Hub Showdown - Chris King, Hadley, Industry Nine, DT, Stealth, and Hope | RIDING FEELS GOOD

    Cheers..
    -S

    FWIW, I have three sets of Hadleys.
    FWIW, I have three sets of DT Swiss 240s.

    I can't even comprehend why people buy King hubs when DT 240s exist, aside from the color aspect. Lighter, more durable, easier to operate on if and when you want to change something. When I converted my ~2010ish model year rear to accept a 142x12mm TA, I did it with with nothing other than my hands and two pieces of 2x4, one of which had a hole drilled in it.

    I9? If you're considering them, you might as well buy Kings instead. No experience with Hadleys or Stealth, but I'd never ride a hub that weighed twice as much as what I'm riding now (DT 240: 265g, Stealth: 550g), with more drag. Sorry, not going to happen.
    Last edited by Le Duke; 09-03-2015 at 03:02 PM.
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  39. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by Le Duke View Post
    FWIW, I have three sets of DT Swiss 240s.

    I can't even comprehend why people buy King hubs when DT 240s exist, aside from the color aspect. Lighter, more durable, easier to operate on if and when you want to change something. When I converted my ~2010ish model year rear to accept a 142x12mm TA, I did it with with nothing other than my hands and two pieces of 2x4, one of which had a hole drilled in it.

    I9? If you're considering them, you might as well buy Kings instead. No experience with Hadleys or Stealth, but I'd never ride a hub that weighed twice as much as what I'm riding now (Stealth), with more drag. Sorry, not going to happen.
    How about the onyx hubs?

  40. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by Le Duke View Post
    FWIW, I have three sets of DT Swiss 240s.

    I can't even comprehend why people buy King hubs when DT 240s exist, aside from the color aspect. Lighter, more durable, easier to operate on if and when you want to change something. When I converted my ~2010ish model year rear to accept a 142x12mm TA, I did it with with nothing other than my hands and two pieces of 2x4, one of which had a hole drilled in it.

    I9? If you're considering them, you might as well buy Kings instead. No experience with Hadleys or Stealth, but I'd never ride a hub that weighed twice as much as what I'm riding now (DT 240: 265g, Stealth: 550g), with more drag. Sorry, not going to happen.
    I agree with most of the DT upside, except durability compared to CK. I've cracked a 240 rear hubshell and stripped a set of ratchets - I still consider them awesome hubs. I rode a set of Kings for almost a decade with zero issues - a friend is still riding them today.

    That said, I'm on a new set of I9s because the price was right and I was curious. So far they are great, but long term remains to be seen.

    Will also add, the DT350s are the absolute best budget hubs out there right now IMO (especially if you have some spare 36t ratchets laying about).

  41. #91
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    Chris King or Industry 9 hubs ?????

    Quote Originally Posted by Le Duke View Post
    FWIW, I have three sets of DT Swiss 240s.

    I can't even comprehend why people buy King hubs when DT 240s exist, aside from the color aspect. Lighter, more durable, easier to operate on if and when you want to change something. When I converted my ~2010ish model year rear to accept a 142x12mm TA, I did it with with nothing other than my hands and two pieces of 2x4, one of which had a hole drilled in it.

    I9? If you're considering them, you might as well buy Kings instead. No experience with Hadleys or Stealth, but I'd never ride a hub that weighed twice as much as what I'm riding now (DT 240: 265g, Stealth: 550g), with more drag. Sorry, not going to happen.
    People make different choices than you because different things are important to them. Weight and conversion ability are two upsides to DT Swiss (depending on who you are comparing to), but those aren't the only two things that drive hub selection. Aesthetics, engagement & cost are three typically big factors that people look at where DT doesn't compare as favorably as you paint it.
    Quote Originally Posted by pvd
    Time to stop believing the hype and start doing some science.
    29er Tire Weight Database

  42. #92
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    DT 240 freehub bearings are not the most durable either, and they are not serviceable, you have to buy a new freehub with bearings preinstalled.

  43. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by syl3 View Post
    DT 240 freehub bearings are not the most durable either, and they are not serviceable, you have to buy a new freehub with bearings preinstalled.
    Whoever told you that is a fool.

    They take standard 6XXX series bearings ($4-$5).

    Which, of course, you can also pry open and repack with grease.
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  44. #94
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    I love my I9 hubs. Still have an old set and the new Torch series and the 120 points of engagement is addictive. Anything less is inferior for me. Super easy to rebuild and lots of online stores carry parts now. Never had issues regarding reliability in the five years I've owned the original ones. The Torch series hub went on a diet and is very light, had those for over a year. Owned Hadleys in the past and like them but still prefer my I9's.

  45. #95
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    Quote Originally Posted by Le Duke View Post
    Whoever told you that is a fool.

    They take standard 6XXX series bearings ($4-$5).

    Which, of course, you can also pry open and repack with grease.
    You can repack shot bearings all you want, i would rather replace them with SKF. unfortunately it's impossible to do this on 240 freehubs and this is clearly by design. the outside bearing facing the ring drive is exposed but the inside bearing must pass a very tight raised lip and fall behind it before you can start pressing it in its place, which makes replacing this bearing almost impossible without dedicated tools. it is also the bearing which fails most often as it is not an angular contact bearing and it's prone to excessive side load when overtightening x12 axles (which doesn't take much).

  46. #96
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    I've done it multiple times with a hammer and flat punch. Those are not specialized tools.
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  47. #97
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    When you send in a cracked freehub body for warranty make sure to mention that your idea of service is hammering in new bearings.

    I will stick with Hope and King thank you very much.

  48. #98
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    Quote Originally Posted by syl3 View Post
    When you send in a cracked freehub body for warranty make sure to mention that your idea of service is hammering in new bearings.

    I will stick with Hope and King thank you very much.
    I hammer them out, as recommended by their tech reps, as well as their technical manual.

    Do you know what DT Swiss uses to press them in? A vice (or a block of wood), the tool (which is nothing more than a metal cylinder equal in diameter to the outside diameter of the bearing) and a...plastic mallet. Which is a type of hammer.

    See page 4, item 12. Yeah. Kunststoffhammer.

    https://www.dtswiss.com/Resources/Su...chnical-Manual

    I'm sorry you have such troubles with an incredibly easy task.
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  49. #99
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    Not once in the exploded diagrams does it show the freehub bearings. They are not meant to be extracted by hand.

    I doubt that you can do that with a plastic mallet. Once the bearing is in the space behind the raised lip it has a lot of wiggle room but your "metal cylinder" does not. A hammer is guaranteed to press it in crooked and deform the soft alloy shell. Even with a threaded rod press it takes quite a bit of work and some luck. If the bearing gets stuck sideways you will never remove it unless you cut it apart with a dremel.

    But next time please make a video and post it on youtube for all of us to learn from your experience.

  50. #100
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    Guaranteed? This is like saying that no one could possibly install BB30 bearings without them being crooked.

    I've done it 4 times on three different XD freehubs. No problems, ever.

    Again, please continue to make baseless claims based upon your personal inability to accomplish a relatively simple physical task.
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