View Poll Results: Return the fat bastard?

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  • Ride it

    4 12.50%
  • Return it

    28 87.50%
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  1. #1
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    Would you return this tire or ride it?

    So I special ordered a Schwallbe Rocket Ron 29x 2.25 tire. The claimed weight is 605 grams but the tire weighs in at 710 g out of the box!

    Now I'm a weight weenie where it counts. If two parts are comparible in performance and price but one is lighter I lean towards saving weight. I like Schwalbe because they are light and grip well and I am willing to pay for it.

    I've seen small variances in weight but a quarter of a pound? That's 13% overweight! So maybe it will last 13% longer right?

    Would you return it, or ride it?

  2. #2
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    Schwalbe state that...

    Weight
    Approx. weight in grams (Weights given are within +/- 8%)

    So that would be 556gms - 653gms for the Snakeskin 29x2.25 Rocket Ron. Contact Schwalbe and ask them.
    I'm a member of NSMBA and IMBA Canada

  3. #3
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    Well, if there is one place that weight matters the most, I would say it is the wheels and tires. That being said, there is a lot more importance to a good tire than just weight (traction, rolling resistance, durability, etc).

    I suppose the best way to answer your question though is by asking a question.
    Would you have still bought the tire if the stated weight was 710g?

    If "yes", keep it and ride it.
    If "no", return it.

    Problem solved.
    Just stick it in granny and start grinding.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by kjlued View Post
    ...

    I suppose the best way to answer your question though is by asking a question.
    Would you have still bought the tire if the stated weight was 710g?

    If "yes", keep it and ride it.
    If "no", return it.

    Problem solved.
    Yeeaaah...NO. I would not have ordered it if I knew it would be over 700g. There's plenty of tires in the realm of $50 cheaper that I can get around 730g. For a $100 tire I want to save weight. IMHO it's the most important kind of weight to save (rotational)


  5. #5
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    I agree fully rotational mass is the most important weight saving.

    That being said, you answered your question to what is best for your and what you expect.
    Therefore, you should return the tire and look for something else.
    Just stick it in granny and start grinding.

  6. #6
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    If you special ordered a tire from a local store they won't be happy to take it back.
    I'd write Schwalbe and ask "what the ..." maybe they'll send you a free tire or store credit or something.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by limba View Post
    If you special ordered a tire from a local store they won't be happy to take it back.
    Yes, because as a customer you should worry about keeping the business happy.

    If he didn't use it, who cares, they will sell it. That is part of them earning his business.
    If they don't want to return special ordered items, they will have it in their policy that all sales are final on special ordered items.
    Just stick it in granny and start grinding.

  8. #8
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    I voted for "return it". But return it to Schwalbe, not the store you ordered it from.
    ...and proud member of the anti-sock puppet desolation

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hawg View Post
    I voted for "return it". But return it to Schwalbe, not the store you ordered it from.
    Will Schwalbe give him a refund?

    I am guessing probably not since they would be eating the profit that the shop made too.
    Even if they did, who pays the shipping?

    I say take it back up the store and see if they can order you something that meets your liking. One of reasons you buy from a shop is so you have somebody to deal with if you are not satisfied. Sometimes it sucks for the shop, but that is part of being a business.
    If returning it to the shop was the wrong thing to do than why spend the extra money it costs to buy it local and not just save money and order it online.

    For instance, I can order 2 tires at a local shop for $50ea +tax or buy the same tires online for $40ea no tax and free shipping to my door which saves me over $25, my time and my gas. So why should I spend the extra money locally if I am not going to accept their customer service if I am not pleased with the product?

    Not arguing, I am just curious where this train of thought comes from about returning an unused product to the shop you brought it from is such a bad thing?
    Just stick it in granny and start grinding.

  10. #10
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    Kjlued,

    A reputable company would be willing to send out a replacement tire (free of charge) or at least exchange it. He pays to ship it back (if they want it back), they pay to ship the replacement. That is standard business return practices for something that is not broken in the first place. So the question is (assuming they do not offer to simply send out another tire free of charge), how much hassle is SJDude willing to go through? No reason to include the LBS in this, it's not their problem. Deal with the manufacturer directly. If he grumbles and complains enough (in a professional/courteous manor), they will send him another tire just to keep him happy.

    If you do not think Schwalbe would be willing to work with SJDude in this manor, then I suggest you all find a different tire brand to use, from a company who appreciates it's customers/patrons.
    ...and proud member of the anti-sock puppet desolation

  11. #11
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    I see what you are getting at, but I am under the assumption that the tire is not defective, just that it weighs more than advertised which means he does not want it at all. So therefore he has no other option but to return it or keep it.

    That being said, even if he did want an exchange, my theory still holds true.
    If I have to deal directly with manufacturer after buying, I am going to buy everything online.
    I am all for supporting local businesses and will glad pay a reasonable additional amount in order to keep my dollars local. However part of the benefit to that is the customer service you receive from the shop.

    This is good for the business. If he takes it back there and they handle it cheerfully, he will see a value in why he spends the extra money there. If he handles it personally with the manufacturer, then why does he need a local business when ordering stuff?

    Just a difference in opinion I guess.
    Just stick it in granny and start grinding.

  12. #12
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    Great point. But technically (IMO) the tire is indeed "defective", it's waaaaay overweight compared to the advertised weight listing. That should raise a red flag for Schwalbe where product control/consistency is concerned.

    So, for the weight weenie's sake, handle it how you will. But if weight wasn't an issue, it may indeed last longer since it weighs more than advertised.
    ...and proud member of the anti-sock puppet desolation

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by SJDude View Post
    Yeeaaah...NO. I would not have ordered it if I knew it would be over 700g. There's plenty of tires in the realm of $50 cheaper that I can get around 730g. For a $100 tire I want to save weight.
    On a semi-related note, you might be able to save some money on those tires going forward. Not sure if you were exaggerating on the "$100" bit, but you can find that tire from German etailers in EVO form for 39.90 EUR, which equates to ~44 USD at the moment. Yep, you'll add shipping and maybe duties/taxes, but you should still come out well ahead of $100 each especially if ordering multiples in the shipment.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by phlegm View Post
    On a semi-related note, you might be able to save some money on those tires going forward. Not sure if you were exaggerating on the "$100" bit, but you can find that tire from German etailers in EVO form for 39.90 EUR, which equates to ~44 USD at the moment. Yep, you'll add shipping and maybe duties/taxes, but you should still come out well ahead of $100 each especially if ordering multiples in the shipment.
    In Canada they are $99 plus tax in LBS unless offered a discount.

    I would always be willing to have a friendly conversation about swapping first, I bought my tires, weighed them, then asked for them to be installed at the same shop I bought them at. But, they had more on the shelf to swap which helps.
    Mine came in at well less than 600g without snakeskin protection, can't recall exact numbers.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by roobydoo View Post
    In Canada they are $99 plus tax in LBS unless offered a discount.
    Right, I'm in Canada, and I order from Germany.

  16. #16
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    Well, might be a little over the top for a single tire but I've ordered lots of things from Canada too so what's the deal? As long as shipping doesn't cost an arm and a leg I don't see the problem.

    I voted for "return it" as weights are a typical problem with current tires. They should either be honest (all manufacturers have this problem) or take it back. As soon as it's out of the +/- 5% range I'll bring it back.

  17. #17
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    Is that claimed weight is listed on the box or somewhere else? Weights on a "soft good" like tires is hard to control, but that's really excessive. You sound like you wouldn't be totally happy/satisfied if you rode it. I'd return it if it's not anywhere near the claimed weight on the box, for that exact tire model... there are a lot of variations of the "Rocket Ron 29x 2.25". Tubeless, snakeskin, etc. can add a lot of weight. Make sure you picked the right one. Sounds like a return either way, since you wanted a lighter version.

  18. #18
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    It normally says "roughly xx g" but then that estimate should still be more-or-less correct. It's not like you could leave something off, like a frame that has its weight claimed without paint and the rear axle, or forks without a steerer.
    +/- 3% off is great, 5% would be normal but anything above 8-10% definitely qualifies for a return.

  19. #19
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    I found this link on an old mtbr post

    "MC Kramppi Scientific Bike Research Center: The differences between the real and the claimed weights of the mountain bike components"

    When we analyzed the distribution of the weight differences the following results were found:

    On 39.1% of the components the real weight was 0-5% higher than claimed. The real weight was 0-5% lower than the claimed weight on 23.1% of components. The real and the claimed weights were exactly the same on 9,3% of the cases. There was a weight difference of more than 5% (either way) in 28% of the cases.

    MC Kramppi - The differences between the real and the claimed weights of the mountain bike components

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Radical_53 View Post

    ...I voted for "return it" as weights are a typical problem with current tires. They should either be honest (all manufacturers have this problem) or take it back. As soon as it's out of the +/- 5% range I'll bring it back.
    Is this a chinese problem?

    I really have a hard time believing a $100 Continental would be this far overweight.

    But I could be wrong, I'm going to do some research.

    In the meantime, return that tire to the store you bought it from.


    Tom

  21. #21
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    Re: Would you return this tire or ride it?

    700g!
    They're was one guy that claimed he got two knard tires around 700 grams each.
    Page 4 post 32-- on tapatalk at least.
    Anyone get their hands on a Surly Knard 29x3"?

  22. #22
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    I don't mind a few grams between claimed and actual weight, but a quarter of a pound is F'n rediculous IMHO. Schwallbe needs to take better care of their QA/QC or they will lose customers fast. Luckily the manager at the parts counter agreed with me fully.

    So the tire is a Rocket Ron 29x2.25 snakeskin tubeless. The claimed weight from the box it came in as well as the catalogue (OGC? Norco maybe?) is 605g. The actual weight on the scale at the LBS was 718g!

    I need the extra sidewall to accommodate my clydesdale-ness. I've had a regular Knobby nick tear on the first ride, and killed S-works quickly too. The Spesh Control line is better and way less expensive but comes in around 730g in a 29x2.25 captain. Conversely I've had "UST" tires last 300 hours of hard off road riding problem free, so a little bit of extra weight is well worth it to me.

    I offered to pay for shipping back to the manufacturer but in reality someone who doesn't care about weight will buy it an love it. It is a great tire. I just have way too much money and time into this bike to stop caring about grams now.

    The parts manager has ordered me another tire exactly the same just to see its weight. For now I am riding some 630g crossmarks I got out of the discount bin for $30. FWIW the full pop retail on schwallbe is around $100. Sure you can order it on line cheaper but then you are on the hook for shipping a warranty etc...

    I haven't had much luck with on line parts. I used to have steep and cheap bookmarked and checked it daily but often the cost of shipping to Canada was more than the cost of the item. I tried to buy a Fluke voltage tester once and they wanted $80 to ship from Quebec to Alberta.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by THE ARS View Post
    Is this a chinese problem?

    I really have a hard time believing a $100 Continental would be this far overweight.

    Tom
    I don't know the Chinese tires from Continental but their "handmade" tires have the same problems as these Schwalbe tires.
    Quite often I do think it's not a problem of manufacturing but rather marketing. They rather put a "50g less" sticker on the box and sell heavier tires than being honest with their customers.
    I've seen this with all kinds of components but it seems to be rather prominent with tires.

    Schwalbe Rocket Ron has been very exact, some were a little lighter even, Fat Albert has been fine mostly (a tad heavier than supposed to be).
    The latest Nobby Nics were much heavier than they were supposed to be, 8-10% average, just like the Mountain King 2 tires from Continental.
    It's like searching a needle in a haystick trying to find a tire that matches the claimed weight.

    PS: Tire prices seem extreme (to us Europeans) but on the other hand that's how much we have to pay for frames, components and other gear when we shop stuff from the other side of the pond.
    A Fox fork retails for roughly 2000$ (US) over here.

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