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  1. #1
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    m972 xtr shadow rear mech tuned

    Is there any point tuning the pivot bolts and pully bolts on this mech or are they pretty light already. Has anyone done so?

  2. #2
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    i've tuned mine

    I have the short cage shadow and saved 3g over stock bolts - came to 177g. Replaced the two pulley bolts and the cable clamp bolt. I just used the old bolts that tuned my M952 rear derailleur except for the cable clamp bolt - the shadow one is M6 and not M5. You could probably save more by going to alloy bolts, but probably only a gram or two.
    Hey, I didn't see that rock there."

  3. #3
    Hack Racer
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    Quote Originally Posted by millsm
    I have the short cage shadow and saved 3g over stock bolts - came to 177g. Replaced the two pulley bolts and the cable clamp bolt. I just used the old bolts that tuned my M952 rear derailleur except for the cable clamp bolt - the shadow one is M6 and not M5. You could probably save more by going to alloy bolts, but probably only a gram or two.
    were you able to re-use the cir-clips on the back side of the rear cage to prevent the pulley bolts from coming undone?

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cheers!
    were you able to re-use the cir-clips on the back side of the rear cage to prevent the pulley bolts from coming undone?
    I never reused them and nevver had problem

  5. #5
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    After i removed the 3g? tacky XTR alloy badge on my new Shadow XTR972 RD, i switched the pulleys to FSA ceramic. instead of the plastic FSA universal fit spacer kit, i used a spare/modified SRAM Blackbox alloy pulley covers.

    since the pics i replaced the pulley bolts for raw aluminium.

    in standard spec, the lower circlip was a pain to find when it pinged accross the room, i used a plastic tire lever to finally get it back in place with some extra locite on the bolt.

    3 years ago i re-used my XTR960 circlip, never had any problems
    Last edited by culturesponge; 04-13-2009 at 09:40 PM.

  6. #6
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    I never re-used the circlips with no problems. This is the first derailleur Shimano has produced with the circlips - I guess 'cause of the carbon cage. Never used loctite on the pulley bolts before with no problems, either - just a little grease for the ti-to-aluminum interface (carbon with the shadow).
    Hey, I didn't see that rock there."

  7. #7
    gone for a bike ride
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    see below.

    (comment was out of sequence)
    Last edited by culturesponge; 12-31-2008 at 02:47 PM.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by millsm
    I never re-used the circlips with no problems. This is the first derailleur Shimano has produced with the circlips - I guess 'cause of the carbon cage.
    Actually, the M960 series also had circlips.

    On my M972, I removed the steel adjusting screw that's used to change the parallelogram angle (analogous to the B-tension screw on conventional derailleurs that have a spring-loaded upper pivot). It wasn't necessary for my bike.

  9. #9
    More carbon fiber please!
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    Quote Originally Posted by mechBgon
    Actually, the M960 series also had circlips.

    On my M972, I removed the steel adjusting screw that's used to change the parallelogram angle (analogous to the B-tension screw on conventional derailleurs that have a spring-loaded upper pivot). It wasn't necessary for my bike.
    I may do the same once I have some ride time on the new DA cassette in the spring. I had to grind the derailleur hanger to even get the Shadow to swing forwards enough to get closer to the cogs and stop the ghost shifting issue with the XTR cogs. If the DA works fine then the screw will probably be gone.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by IAmtnbikr
    I may do the same once I have some ride time on the new DA cassette in the spring. I had to grind the derailleur hanger to even get the Shadow to swing forwards enough to get closer to the cogs and stop the ghost shifting issue with the XTR cogs. If the DA works fine then the screw will probably be gone.
    Had the same problem.

    Shadow simply don't work well with road cassette.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by IAmtnbikr
    I may do the same once I have some ride time on the new DA cassette in the spring. I had to grind the derailleur hanger to even get the Shadow to swing forwards enough to get closer to the cogs and stop the ghost shifting issue with the XTR cogs. If the DA works fine then the screw will probably be gone.
    If I could do it again, I'd get non-Shadow XTR, or we have a mid-cage Dura-Ace 9sp at work as another option. With both the upper and lower pivot bolts replaced with aluminum, that could be rather light and very functional. I should see if we still have any SRP lower-pivot bolts rattling around, I used to use those on my first-gen XTR RD-M900s.

  12. #12
    More carbon fiber please!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Megaclocker
    Had the same problem.

    Shadow simply don't work well with road cassette.
    It seemed to shift fine on the stand and on a quick couple spins I had before snowfall hit us. The problem even with the 11-34 XTR was that it seemed have some erratic shift issues. When I took a better look it was obvious the upper pulley was nowhere near close enough to the cassette teeth. Even with the adjustment screw backed clear out. I had to take the hanger off and grind it to allow the derailleur to swing up closer. I think it will work just fine with the DA though.

  13. #13
    rad to the power of sick
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    Quote Originally Posted by mechBgon
    If I could do it again, I'd get non-Shadow XTR, or we have a mid-cage Dura-Ace 9sp at work as another option. With both the upper and lower pivot bolts replaced with aluminum, that could be rather light and very functional. I should see if we still have any SRP lower-pivot bolts rattling around, I used to use those on my first-gen XTR RD-M900s.
    Do it.

    In my experience, the non shadow XTR is far superior. Too much material is removed from the main pivot on the shadow to allow for adequate shifting accuracy. 972's quickly develop play at said pivot that causes some mild ghost shifting. The XT shadow seems to be more resilient at this pivot.

    You can use a 10sp dura-ace 7800 without problems. However, the minimalist design above the limit screws may not be able to handle the stress an MTB drivetrain is subject to. At least in my experience.


    I haven't tried the 7900 rear d. but at 177g. and complete redesign, it may be worth a shot as well.

    At the end of the day. If you build your bike to race/ ride hard. The regular XTR is the way to go.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by superlightracer
    Do it.

    In my experience, the non shadow XTR is far superior. Too much material is removed from the main pivot on the shadow to allow for adequate shifting accuracy. 972's quickly develop play at said pivot that causes some mild ghost shifting. The XT shadow seems to be more resilient at this pivot.

    You can use a 10sp dura-ace 7800 without problems. However, the minimalist design above the limit screws may not be able to handle the stress an MTB drivetrain is subject to. At least in my experience.


    I haven't tried the 7900 rear d. but at 177g. and complete redesign, it may be worth a shot as well.

    At the end of the day. If you build your bike to race/ ride hard. The regular XTR is the way to go.
    Yowzers

    So what actually happened? The stress of quick-shifting pulled the thing off the hinge?

    I was thinking about running a da in the back too, however seeing this freaks me out? So what are you running now?
    3po armorless, the first weight weenie.

  15. #15
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    please delete this post.

  16. #16
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    The early XTR Shadows also had a bad habit of having the return spring on the cage snap loose out of the carbon cage and have the tension unwind. Not sure if Shimano got that sorted out or not, but it sounded like the cage was flexing enough to allow the shallow pin on the spring to pop out. I have the XT Shadow on my one bike that would benefit from the better protection from rock and root hits for that reason.
    I'm a member of NSMBA and IMBA Canada

  17. #17
    rad to the power of sick
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    Quote Originally Posted by protocol_droid
    Yowzers

    So what actually happened? The stress of quick-shifting pulled the thing off the hinge?
    Essentially.

    It snapped cleanly right below the main pivot. (see pic) I wish i took some close up pics of the break. If you want to know where the weight savings are on the da der, its the bored out material in that junction. Its hollow and the material is maybe 2 mm thick . It's easy to see where the structural integrity is different on the da vs XTR.



    Im running a med cage 970 right now, and havent had any problems.

  18. #18
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    I'd like to have input about deciding between the 971 and the 972. I have now a 960 with the inverted spring, which is quite ackward, but it works. I bought a 971, not installed yet, but it shows no play. A friend has a 972 for sale, but with quite some play in the connection between the pulleys cage and the rear der main paralelogram.

    Should I buy this 972 or should I stick to the 971? Im asking cause he would seel it really cheap.

    Thanks.

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