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  1. #1
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    Which are the Lightest FS 27.5/650b Make/Model bikes for 2017 designed for Trail/AM?

    ???

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    +1 on this request. I wish a site existed where you could look up any bike/build kit option and see the overall weight. Or even just an excel file with every bike listed along with the weight. But I guess since most companies don't list bike weights this would be hard.

    One of the lightest for 2017 has to be the Scott Spark, but its very expensive.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by JD_OC View Post
    But I guess since most companies don't list bike weights this would be hard.
    Not only that, some of them are outright liars. Make your own excel. I have.
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  4. #4
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    Most bike components can be looked up with a simple Google image search.

    Many times, you can find a picture of the item in question on a gram scale.
    Death from Below.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jayem View Post
    Not only that, some of them are outright liars. Make your own excel. I have.
    Are you willing to share that Excel file?

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    Quote Originally Posted by JD_OC View Post
    +1 on this request. I wish a site existed where you could look up any bike/build kit option and see the overall weight. Or even just an excel file with every bike listed along with the weight. But I guess since most companies don't list bike weights this would be hard.

    One of the lightest for 2017 has to be the Scott Spark, but its very expensive.
    Thanks, The prices are comical on the new models. I'll check out the Spark as a future candidate for my next bike.

  7. #7
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    The 2017 Scott Spark would be on the light side of Trail/AM at 120mm of travel, that would typically be a Scott Genius to get into the Trail/AM category.

    So the starting point of the conversation would be asking the question: what do you consider as the specifications for a Trail/AM bike for your riding area? In my part of the world that would be at least 140-150mm of travel and the ability to mount 2.4" tires at the least, and 27.5+ would be a serious consideration. That won't be a universal definition, maybe 120-130mm of travel is enough for the trails in your riding location.

    The other question will be whether you're after frame only comparisons, or are you after complete bikes only? Carbon frames will be the lightest, but pricey. But complete bikes will only be the lightest with a light frame and a lightweight build kit, so those will be really pricey. It seems that most of the 2017 uber-light Trail/Am bikes are in the $7000+ USD range to get in the 26 pound range.
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    [QUOTE=rockyuphill;12989103]The 2017 Scott Spark would be on the light side of Trail/AM at 120mm of travel, that would typically be a Scott Genius to get into the Trail/AM category.

    So the starting point of the conversation would be asking the question: what do you consider as the specifications for a Trail/AM bike for your riding area? In my part of the world that would be at least 140-150mm of travel and the ability to mount 2.4" tires at the least, and 27.5+ would be a serious consideration. That won't be a universal definition, maybe 120-130mm of travel is enough for the trails in your riding location.

    The other question will be whether you're after frame only comparisons, or are you after complete bikes only? Carbon frames will be the lightest, but pricey. But complete bikes will only be the lightest with a light frame and a lightweight build kit, so those will be really pricey. It seems that most of the 2017 uber-light Trail/Am bikes are in the $7000+ USD range to get in the 26 pound range.[/QUOTE

    I am not landing jumps from way up in the air, I currently have 150mm but don't use all of it's travel. I'd have to test ride a Spark to be sure, but think I'd be OK with 120mm travel on my local trails.
    I would want a Mountain King 2.4 front and 2.2 rear tire combination.

    I am not looking to build my own. The spark looks good to me for my next bike to ride most of the time, and I think I will buy a downhill bike just to take to bike parks.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by JD_OC View Post
    +1 on this request. I wish a site existed where you could look up any bike/build kit option and see the overall weight. Or even just an excel file with every bike listed along with the weight. But I guess since most companies don't list bike weights this would be hard.

    One of the lightest for 2017 has to be the Scott Spark, but its very expensive.
    Comparing frames is a bit hard if you want absolute precision. Companies reported weights (often quite accurate) and especially weights reported by "us" include (or not): bolts, seat collar, rear axle, chain stay guard, down tube guard, often but not always shock (that however come in different kinds and weight even for the same bike) sometimes head set, sometimes seat post, unfrequently bottom bracket.

    Add to the complication that you cannot really compare a 650b with a 29 (or 26), and that if you are, for example, in between a medium and large size you need weights for both for different manufactures.

    Personally I would avoid going nuts about frame weights, and just follow rough rules of thumb more or less along these lines:

    • Carbon: XC sub 100-110 travel 4.0-4.5 pounds
    • Carbon: XC/Trail sub 125 travel 4.5 to 5.5
    • Carbon: Trail/All-Mountain sub 160 - 5.5-6.5
    • Aluminum rear: add 0.5 pounds
    • All Aluminum: add 1.0-1.5 pounds


    There are plenty exceptions (Liteville comes to mind as a light aluminum) but for ballpark is ok, and in my opinion departures are not that important because one should not really choose a frame based on a couple of hundreds grams more or less ...
    Last edited by Davide; 01-09-2017 at 08:07 PM.

  10. #10
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    It seems very expensive to be a Weight Weenie! I think I'll add a few inexpensive stuff to my current bike and buy used Spark or equivalent bike in a few years. My seat,seat post and seat clamp are not carbon fiber, also I can drop my pretty heavy bash guard and also the big ring on my 3x.

    Can anyone recommend a seat and seat post that will last not to expensive, it does not have to be the lightest as my current stuff is pretty heavy.



    Quote Originally Posted by Davide View Post
    Comparing frames is a bit hard if you want absolute precision. Companies reported weights (often quite accurate) and especially weights reported by "us" include (or not): bolts, seat collar, rear axle, chain stay guard, down tube guard, often but not always shock (that however come in different kinds and weight even for the same bike) sometimes head set, sometimes seat post, unfrequently bottom bracket.

    Add to the complication that you cannot really compare a 650b with a 29 (or 26), and that if you are, for example, in between a medium and large size you need weights for both for different manufactures.

    Personally I would avoid going nuts about frame weights, and just follow rough rules of thumb more or less along these lines:

    • Carbon: XC sub 100-110 travel 4.0-4.5 pounds
    • Carbon: XC/Trail sub 125 travel 4.5 to 5.5
    • Carbon: Trail/All-Mountain sub 160 - 5.5-6.5
    • Aluminum rear: add 0.5 pounds
    • All Aluminum: add 1.0-1.5 pounds


    There are plenty exceptions (Liteville comes to mind as a light aluminum) but for ballpark is ok, and in my opinion departures are not that important because one should not really choose a frame based on a couple of hundreds grams more or less ...

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cottam View Post
    It seems very expensive to be a Weight Weenie!
    Yes, if you are trying to hit a weight target and not sacrifice performance (like you want brakes that actually work, not carbon rotors that'll blow up in 5 minutes), it's expensive because you have to plan it out and then follow through to buy the stuff that will meet the weight target, even if something a little heavier goes on sale, because once you start making compromises, you won't meet the goal. Good to approach it from a practical side, go with what you can afford and what brings the best combination of performance, longevity and weight that you are looking for. Some people loved crank brother's pedals, despite the fact that they are essentially disposable and had poor durability. Some people don't want to replace stuff every couple rides. Some can get away with lighter stuff, some can get away with heavier stuff. Some choose components that hold them back, some ride stuff heavier than they need.
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  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cottam View Post
    It seems very expensive to be a Weight Weenie! I think I'll add a few inexpensive stuff to my current bike and buy used Spark or equivalent bike in a few years. My seat,seat post and seat clamp are not carbon fiber, also I can drop my pretty heavy bash guard and also the big ring on my 3x.

    Can anyone recommend a seat and seat post that will last not to expensive, it does not have to be the lightest as my current stuff is pretty heavy.
    If you can get away with 1X, you'll be able to save quite a bit of weight (shifter, derailleur, rings).

    As for the saddle, several of us have tried a cheap eBay carbon saddle, like this one:
    Full Carbon Fiber Mountain Road Bike Cycling Cushion Saddle Bicycle Seat Q1R9 | eBay

    ...however I can't tell you what shape would fit you best. However they are very inexpensive, and should be pretty light.

  13. #13
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    Canyon Spectral is the lightest frame I've seen for a 140mm trail bike. 2850g for the aluminum frame (XL) including axle and seatpost clamp. My complete build is 28.5ish pounds with pedals and dropper.

    Edit: shock not included.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cottam View Post
    It seems very expensive to be a Weight Weenie! I think I'll add a few inexpensive stuff to my current bike and buy used Spark or equivalent bike in a few years. My seat,seat post and seat clamp are not carbon fiber, also I can drop my pretty heavy bash guard and also the big ring on my 3x.

    Can anyone recommend a seat and seat post that will last not to expensive, it does not have to be the lightest as my current stuff is pretty heavy.
    Well ... YES it is expensive. I do it just because I consider my bikes my FERRARI! And they are way less expensive then a 19 year old ballerina!!!! MTB and windsurf are pretty much the only indulgences I have ... and so I do indulge. But in general I never compromise for weight sake. That means I never buy thingies like carbon fiber discs, 50345 milligrams stems, 39312 milligrams saddles , or go around with a zeppelin lifting me from the ground I am happy with XTR level, and solid enduro/trail ready carbon everywhere else.

    But to come to your question. It depends on the current weights, but I would not really bother changing seat post, the savings (unless you spend a fortune) is probably around 50 grams. The saddle, depending on what you have, can be a different story. If your current one is around 300, buying a 150 gram range one starts to make a dent ... and you can try a China-made for not much money.

    1x used to give you a good 200-250 grams saving, but now it is a bit less because the cassettes and derailleur got bigger ... and it is a big investment. If you are on ten speed you could get away with just removing granny, bashguard, front der and get a XT 1142 cassette. That will save you a chunk.

  15. #15
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    Thanks for the help, I think I can shave off a good amount of weight for not to much money. My next bike will be my light weight indulgence for sure.


    Quote Originally Posted by Davide View Post
    Well ... YES it is expensive. I do it just because I consider my bikes my FERRARI! And they are way less expensive then a 19 year old ballerina!!!! MTB and windsurf are pretty much the only indulgences I have ... and so I do indulge. But in general I never compromise for weight sake. That means I never buy thingies like carbon fiber discs, 50345 milligrams stems, 39312 milligrams saddles , or go around with a zeppelin lifting me from the ground I am happy with XTR level, and solid enduro/trail ready carbon everywhere else.

    But to come to your question. It depends on the current weights, but I would not really bother changing seat post, the savings (unless you spend a fortune) is probably around 50 grams. The saddle, depending on what you have, can be a different story. If your current one is around 300, buying a 150 gram range one starts to make a dent ... and you can try a China-made for not much money.

    1x used to give you a good 200-250 grams saving, but now it is a bit less because the cassettes and derailleur got bigger ... and it is a big investment. If you are on ten speed you could get away with just removing granny, bashguard, front der and get a XT 1142 cassette. That will save you a chunk.

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