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  1. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by scapin
    Dirt boy: B sample positive.
    Where did you get the info? Got a link?
    Nevermind, here you go:

    PARIS - Tour de France champion Floyd Landis’ backup urine sample confirmed high levels of testosterone, cycling’s governing body said Saturday, raising the prospect that he could lose his title.

    Following the results of the “B” sample, Landis was fired by his Swiss team, Phonak. He also faces a two-year ban from USA Cycling, which is responsible for sanctions against the American rider.

    “The analysis of the sample B of Floyd Landis’s urine has confirmed the result of an adverse analytical finding notified by the anti-doping laboratory of Paris on 26th July, following the analysis of the sample A,” the International Cycling Union said, referring to the Chatenay-Malabry lab outside Paris.
    “Landis will be dismissed without notice for violating the teams internal Code of Ethics,” Phonak said in a statement. “Landis will continue to have legal options to contest the findings. However, this will be his personal affair, and the Phonak team will no longer be involved in that.”

    The confirmed test sets off what could now be months of appeals and arguments by Landis, who claims the positive finding was due to naturally high testosterone levels. He has repeatedly declared his innocence and vowed to fight the allegations — and did so again Saturday.

    “I have never taken any banned substance, including testosterone,” Landis said in a statement. “I was the strongest man at the Tour de France, and that is why I am the champion.

    “I will fight these charges with the same determination and intensity that I bring to my training and racing. It is now my goal to clear my name and restore what I worked so hard to achieve.”

    If found guilty, Landis would become the first winner in the 103-year history of cycling’s premier race to lose his Tour crown over doping allegations. The title would go to Spain’s Oscar Pereiro, the runner-up.

    Landis’ lawyer is preparing to take the case to arbitration, said a statement issued by his spokesman, Michael Henson.

    The two-tiered analysis at the Chatenay-Malabry lab, which is accredited by the World Anti-Doping Agency, is designed to eliminate the chance for mistakes in the first test.

    Henson said this week that the rider had tested positive for an testosterone-epitestosterone ratio of 11:1 — well above the 4:1 limit.

    On Friday, Henson said Landis was in the San Diego area, but no further details of his whereabouts were given.

    The tests were conducted on urine samples drawn July 20 after Landis’ stage victory in a grueling Alpine leg of the Tour, when he clawed back nearly eight minutes against then-leader Pereiro — and back into contention to win the three-week race.

    The UCI is expected to refer the case to the U.S. Anti-Doping Agency for handling. The process could take months, possibly with appeals to the Court of Arbitration for Sport.

    Landis’ Spanish lawyer, Jose Maria Buxeda, has said he still believes Landis will prove his innocence,

    “He’s pretty sure we will be able to prove ... that it is due to natural causes,” Buxeda said.

    Landis, a 30-year-old former mountain biker, says he was tested eight other times during the three-week tour and those results came back negative.

    “I’m going to do my best to defend my dignity and my innocence,” he said on CNN’s “Larry King Live” last week.

    Landis has hired high-profile American lawyer Howard Jacobs, who has represented several athletes in doping cases.

    Jacobs plans to go after the UCI for allegedly leaking information regarding the sample testing.

    Earlier this week, a New York Times report cited a source from the UCI saying that a second analysis of Landis’ “A” sample by carbon isotope ratio testing had detected synthetic testosterone — meaning it was ingested.

    “I call on the UCI to start following its own rules and to allow this process to proceed without the further taint of public comment by UCI officials,” Jacobs said in a statement Saturday.

    Since the Phonak team was informed of the positive test on July 27, Landis and his defense team have offered varying explanations as to the high testosterone reading — including cortisone shots taken for pain in Landis’ degenerating hip; drinking beer and whiskey the night before; thyroid medication; and his natural metabolism.

    Another theory — dehydration — was rebuffed by anti-doping experts and contrasted with events during stage 17 itself when Landis rode alone for hours.



    So, his defense so far seems pretty weak. Beer and wisky the light before his big race? WTF!!! That's just crazy talk.
    Last edited by Axis II; 08-05-2006 at 03:51 AM.
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  2. #77
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  3. #78
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    Ofcourse....

    did you think it might be differnt?

    Now the FACTS are out:
    1. His testosterone was NOT elevated. His epitestosterone was lower than normal.
    2. The more relaible and positve carbon isotope(?) was not done yet. If it's done and comes back positive, he is DONE!
    3. This lab is the same lab that screwed up sprinter's Butch Johnson career with false and in accurate testing.
    4. They are very close to le Euipe who leaked possible fasle info on EPO testing on Lance.
    Now if the crabon testing comes back and proves the testosterone in Landis' system is synthetic, he is guilty! I don't care how it got in him. he should NOT allow it to happen, unless it was tainted by te lab.

    One of the top professors in the US on Steriods in Sports Charles Yersalis(?) thinks something is fishy/wrong with the test/findings.

    But it does not look good for him and it's sad to see it happen. I am just glad that the UCI system does not run the justice system in the US .
    Doping testing is so flawed so somethimes it hard to get the truth out. The lab is always procalimed right and the athlete is always lying.....
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  4. #79
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    Is it a conspiracy? That's ridicolus...

  5. #80
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    Your never know...

    Let's see, Lance and 3 of his top teamates have now been busted:
    Roberto Heras, Tyler Hamilton and Floyd Landis. Only Levi Leipenhimer has not.

    Or these guys are all dopers and stupid enough to get caught.

    My thing is this. If Landis did dope on that stage, why win that stage? You KNOW the winner will be tested. Or he never pallned on winning. He thought others riders would go chase him and they did not.
    Then he screwed up!

    I am honestly not sure what to think. But have you noticed one thing? most Euros think he is guilty and most of the US thinks he is clean.....

    Conspiracy? I guess we will never know!

    If Landis is trully guilt, good rittnes to him and I hope never to see him ride again!

    What do you have to say about that lab we scrwed up an American's carreer??
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  6. #81
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    please!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by DIRT BOY
    Your never know...

    Let's see, Lance and 3 of his top teamates have now been busted:
    Roberto Heras, Tyler Hamilton and Floyd Landis. Only Levi Leipenhimer has not.

    Or these guys are all dopers and stupid enough to get caught.

    My thing is this. If Landis did dope on that stage, why win that stage? You KNOW the winner will be tested. Or he never pallned on winning. He thought others riders would go chase him and they did not.
    Then he screwed up!

    I am honestly not sure what to think. But have you noticed one thing? most Euros think he is guilty and most of the US thinks he is clean.....

    Conspiracy? I guess we will never know!

    If Landis is trully guilt, good rittnes to him and I hope never to see him ride again!

    What do you have to say about that lab we scrwed up an American's carreer??
    Gio and others,
    please stop that america vs. the rest of the world thing! this has nothing to do with a rider beeing american or not. he was tested positive which is the reason he got disqualified. that's it. as simple as that. "we" non americans treat Ullrich and Basso and all the others the same way as we do with Floyd or other caught riders. it's a shame and hurts cycling in general. but we all know they dope and still we are shocked when they get punished...strange, really strange.

    if you hear what the normal, non cycling people think about all this then you will understand cycling is going in a wrong direction. i think big sponsors will most likely withdraw sooner or later. this whole dope thing hurts cycling in general. sad, really sad.

  7. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by nino
    Gio and others,
    please stop that america vs. the rest of the world thing! this has nothing to do with a rider beeing american or not. he was tested positive which is the reason he got disqualified. that's it. as simple as that. "we" non americans treat Ullrich and Basso and all the others the same way as we do with Floyd or other caught riders. it's a shame and hurts cycling in general. but we all know they dope and still we are shocked when they get punished...strange, really strange.

    if you hear what the normal, non cycling people think about all this then you will understand cycling is going in a wrong direction. i think big sponsors will most likely withdraw sooner or later. this whole dope thing hurts cycling in general. sad, really sad.
    It's true.

  8. #83
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    Nino,

    I am not sayng that with everyone. BUT yes, Ullrich and Basso are being treated the same and I will agree. But it it seems like the American riders get more of a guilty wrap from Euros. Maybe it's it's not as bad as I sometimes see, but it can be there. I have not heard one non-american even think that Landis is not guilty.

    What about the things I posted? comments?

    I am personally start to wonder about it myself. Look being an American and Italian I thnk Basso is guilty, but think maybe, just maybe Floyd is not. Ullrich, guilty and money paid to Fuentes proves that!

    Cycling is going down a very bad road. the other day riding my bike, someone in a car yellped "doper" at me...yah right.....
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  9. #84
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    US press...

    Quote Originally Posted by DIRT BOY
    Nino,

    I am not sayng that with everyone. BUT yes, Ullrich and Basso are being treated the same and I will agree. But it it seems like the American riders get more of a guilty wrap from Euros. Maybe it's it's not as bad as I sometimes see, but it can be there. I have not heard one non-american even think that Landis is not guilty.

    What about the things I posted? comments?

    I am personally start to wonder about it myself. Look being an American and Italian I thnk Basso is guilty, but think maybe, just maybe Floyd is not. Ullrich, guilty and money paid to Fuentes proves that!

    Cycling is going down a very bad road. the other day riding my bike, someone in a car yellped "doper" at me...yah right.....
    might it be the US journalism? i know you get informed quite different than "the rest of the world". i have family in the US and they tell me how different the view of you guys sometimes is because all the media is kind of one view only. this is the case with wars all over the world and terrorism and might also be the reason you see things different now when a US athlete gets accused. i know you guys are quite a bit patriotic, more so than most other countries i know of (sorry for speaking in this general manner, i might be wrong as well by putting all americans in the same group). but you might understand what i mean. my english isn't good enough to express me really precise here.

    i and 99% of the rest of the world don't care what the french press writes. we get the facts as they are and right now it really doesn't look too good for Floyd, Basso, Ullrich and all the others.

    by the way - what happened to Tyler Hamilton? didn't he promise to show the world his positive results were false as well....no comment.

  10. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by DIRT BOY
    Cycling is going down a very bad road. the other day riding my bike, someone in a car yellped "doper" at me...yah right.....
    What evidences do you want? For me you never believe that ALL the riders are doped.
    You too...

  11. #86
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    US press and as many Euro papers that I can find or read. I aslo get info from Eurosport.

    The major problem is Euro and US sources that throwing crap out to get the scoop on the story without checking facts and using stupid aynomous sources.

    Look the US media is not perfect and NEITHER is the Euro press.

    If you look at the facts, you will see somethingis not right!

    His testosterones levels were NOT higher than normal that the US and euro press both said. Epitesterone is low. NO ONE has confrimed that Sythetic testerone has been found. Until then, there coul dbe other medical reason that the RATIO was off or the lab is wrong.

    Why don't they use another independant lab chosen by Landis' team the the UCI/TDF?

    If synthetic hormones are found, Landis has NO excuses.

    Tyler Hamliton is guilty as hell in my eyes. And yes, what happend to him proven he is not guilty? Kinda like OJ.....
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  12. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by DIRT BOY
    Tyler Hamliton is guilty as hell in my eyes. And yes, what happend to him proven he is not guilty? Kinda like OJ.....
    Exactly. You tell about justice from a country that execute only who doesn't afford excellent lawyers...
    Last edited by scapin; 08-05-2006 at 08:15 AM.

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    And you think Italy's justice system is perfect? UK? France? Germany?

    Come on...The US justice sytem is well respected. yes I good layer can get most people off. Why, because stupid jury get mesmorzed by these sweet talker and don't always listen and understand the facts!

    NO Justice sytem is perfect, but I will take my chances in a US Court any day.
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    Quote Originally Posted by DIRT BOY
    And you think Italy's justice system is perfect? UK? France? Germany?

    Come on...The US justice sytem is well respected. yes I good layer can get most people off. Why, because stupid jury get mesmorzed by these sweet talker and don't always listen and understand the facts!

    NO Justice sytem is perfect, but I will take my chances in a US Court any day.
    NOW, the facts tell Landis is positive, LATER Landis can prove it isn't true.

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    No, the test shows his epitesosterone to tesosterone levels are off. Yes in the UCI terms this is a positive test. BUT if and they admit his testerones leveels are in FACT his noraml levels and just his epistersterone levels are off, we need to find out if anhting he did/took threw his levels off on his ratio.
    BTW, the EURO press was the first to say they found Sythetic testesterone which is FALSE. that has not been tested for yet.

    The facts are:
    1. His testosterone levls are normal.
    2. His Epitesosterone are not causing his RATIO to be off.
    3. This is an infraction UCI rules.
    4. No synthetic testosterone has been found.
    Until the test and confrim for Sythetic testosterone, we his not truly guilt of doping. he he took synthetic test, his overall test levels would ride.

    Now did some other legit medicine cause his levels up epi to go down, or a masking drug or another dope source?

    This is what we truly need to find out. Regardless, this man was tired in a Jury of the Press (US & Euro) even before his A test even came back!

    Until the CAS says he is guilty he is not done yet or stripped of his title.
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    ahem...

    Quote Originally Posted by DIRT BOY
    No, the test shows his epitesosterone to tesosterone levels are off. Yes in the UCI terms this is a positive test. BUT if and they admit his testerones leveels are in FACT his noraml levels and just his epistersterone levels are off, we need to find out if anhting he did/took threw his levels off on his ratio.
    BTW, the EURO press was the first to say they found Sythetic testesterone which is FALSE. that has not been tested for yet.

    The facts are:
    1. His testosterone levls are normal.
    2. His Epitesosterone are not causing his RATIO to be off.
    3. This is an infraction UCI rules.
    4. No synthetic testosterone has been found.
    Until the test and confrim for Sythetic testosterone, we his not truly guilt of doping. he he took synthetic test, his overall test levels would ride.

    Now did some other legit medicine cause his levels up epi to go down, or a masking drug or another dope source?

    This is what we truly need to find out. Regardless, this man was tired in a Jury of the Press (US & Euro) even before his A test even came back!

    Until the CAS says he is guilty he is not done yet or stripped of his title.
    he got tested before and after that as well and there his levels were normal. strange thing, don't you think? he now tries to say it was either the beer or other medicines that caused the test to show this result. ahem...sorry, that's very fishy indeed

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    No, beer or other medicine lowered his epitest! There are many medical legitimate reasons why that his epistest went lower. We just need to see if they apply to him

    Let me ask you a question. If you were found GUILTY for anything, whould YOU not try to fine EVERY reason why you possibily are not?

    Yes and all those tests show his test levels have remained the same. Just his Epitest is off, causing the ratio to go off one one stage.

    Again, until the carbon test and CAS say he is guilty I will whithold judgement! Eevn though in my heart I am starting to sway towards guilty. Why? Because pro cycling is a dirty sport!
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    Quote Originally Posted by nino
    he got tested before and after that as well and there his levels were normal. strange thing, don't you think? he now tries to say it was either the beer or other medicines that caused the test to show this result. ahem...sorry, that's very fishy indeed
    100 beers?

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    AP reports are saying synthetic testosterone was indeed found. Landis has been fired from Phonak, and will most likely be stripped of his TDF title. He had so many supporters who wanted to believe. What a sad day for cycling.

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    It sure is a sad day for cycling...............I so dont knwo what to believe anymore. We know so many dope etc..........................You want to believe they dont etc etc ...............

    So feel I am dammed if I do believe and dammed if I dont...

    Living in Spain now from New Zealand, there is no ill feeling towards US riders at all, form those in cycling that I speak with. They hold all TDF riders and pros in high esteem.........Not dopers though, and understandably......................
    The_Lecht_Rocks: whafe - cheeers - may i offer an official apology for the wagon wheeler "dis-belief"

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    AP reports and others are worth as much as the

    crap I took this morning. UNTIL the UCI and the [SIZE=2][SIZE=-1]USADA release an offical report, I won't believe it,

    Funny but he is not accused of taking abanned substance, just have abnormal readings.

    And you know what i think too? If Floyd is guilty by the UCI and he is honstley clean or he doped due to Phonaks request or mandate, she should come clean and tell the truth! BUST Phonalk and any other team that is putting pressure or forccing these guys to dope.

    This is Phonaks' what third or fourth bust? Two high profile riders in Landis and Hamiltion! Why not? His pro carer is over after this!
    [/SIZE]
    [/SIZE]
    Last edited by DIRT BOY; 08-05-2006 at 11:22 AM.
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    Alrighty then...

    News ->Latest news

    05/08/2006: Press release : The adverse analytical finding from Floyd Landis is confirmed


    The UCI communicates that the analysis of the sample B of Floyd Landis’s urine has confirmed the result of an adverse analytical finding notified by the Anti-doping laboratory of Paris on 26th July, following the analysis of the sample A.

    In accordance to the Anti-doping rules, the Anti-doping Commission of the UCI will request that the USA Cycling Federation open a disciplinary procedure against the rider.


    UCI Press Service


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    Copyright © 1997-2006 Union Cycliste Internationale. All rights reserved.

    Français Printable version

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    Quote Originally Posted by nino
    might it be the US journalism? i know you get informed quite different than "the rest of the world". i have family in the US and they tell me how different the view of you guys sometimes is because all the media is kind of one view only. this is the case with wars all over the world and terrorism and might also be the reason you see things different now when a US athlete gets accused. i know you guys are quite a bit patriotic, more so than most other countries i know of (sorry for speaking in this general manner, i might be wrong as well by putting all americans in the same group). but you might understand what i mean. my english isn't good enough to express me really precise here.

    i and 99% of the rest of the world don't care what the french press writes. we get the facts as they are and right now it really doesn't look too good for Floyd, Basso, Ullrich and all the others.

    by the way - what happened to Tyler Hamilton? didn't he promise to show the world his positive results were false as well....no comment.
    Very good post.

    Moreover, DirtBoy, are you able to read another language than english ? May be italian ? I think most of english and american press share a pretty close point of view. (see on the irak war or economics for a good example).

    I think you should let go the French conspiracy stuff. There is no French nowhere near the podium. L'equipe sells a lot of paper from the TDF, wich they invented. They do not want to brake it. Landis was pretty popular here, and was welcome as a more charismatic guy than Armstrong. Is particular childhood (who sees so strange to us) was very intertaining !

    So what, this year TDF winner was on dope ? What's new ?
    It has been for that for years. Do you remember the Anquetil years ? He confessed taking stuff.
    And next year ? It will be the same. All people in pro sport are going to use stuff. Thats needed to brake records and keep the entairtainement. Next year tdf winner will use stuff too.

    Sport as never been good to your body. Physical activity is ! Next year, look at the tour to see the beautiful French countryside, look at the new bikes, may be the chicks on the podium, and use the rest or the time to go riding enjoying yourself rather than supporting drug enhanced human rats !
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    Still, it does not say SYNTHETIC HORMONES FOUND!
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    I amily use translators, but I can uderstand some Spanish and a little Italian.
    Funny, but I find the BBC to best one of the best!

    You know I don't think it's has anything to do with the French people. Just a lab that might just suck and is possibly dirty and L'Equipe being behind things.

    Then agin, the TDF does NOT need bad press like this and out of 103 TDFs NO WINNER has ever been stripped.

    Before someones' career and livelyhodd is stripped form them, let's be REALLY, REALLY sure he is in the wrong. Why not have another lab or two test the results? let's run a real test on Landis himself. If he is clean, submit a blood sample! If you are clean, this will let tell the truth!!!

    This is really hard to say what is truly going on.....
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