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  1. #1
    mainly roadie
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    Best square taper bb?

    I recently bought a tune Bigfoot crankset, and I need a square taper bb.
    The guys I've asked who use Bigfoot/AC38 love it. (Thanks! )

    My question is:
    should I buy the tune AC38 because of compatibility with the Bigfoot, or
    the Phil Wood Premium ti (or ActionTec ti) because I am in the US, and I can get them for a bit (but not much) less and they can be very easily serviced, etc. here?
    The weight for the AC38 (with crankbolts) is 187g.
    The weight for the Phil Wood (with crankbolts) is...187g.

    Any opinions re: durability/stiffness/etc.?

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by cadence90
    I recently bought a tune Bigfoot crankset, and I need a square taper bb.
    The guys I've asked who use Bigfoot/AC38 love it. (Thanks! )

    My question is:
    should I buy the tune AC38 because of compatibility with the Bigfoot, or
    the Phil Wood Premium ti (or ActionTec ti) because I am in the US, and I can get them for a bit (but not much) less and they can be very easily serviced, etc. here?
    The weight for the AC38 (with crankbolts) is 187g.
    The weight for the Phil Wood (with crankbolts) is...187g.

    Any opinions re: durability/stiffness/etc.?
    I have never used nay of the two mentioned... but i have had Race Face taper lock BB and its bomb proof.. IT has a cromo spindle/shaft.... but wieght wise, i dont think its too light but hey i lked it.

  3. #3
    mainly roadie
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    Thanks.
    But I was hoping to hear from folks who have used one or both of these bb's.
    Pipe up, please!

  4. #4
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    I love my AC38

    I am riding AC 38 and AC37 since years on all my bikes with a couple of cranks such as Middleburn, DuraAce and the like and love them. You can easily adjust the chainline and it runs for decades. However make sure you get the tool for them, otherwise it will be difficult to mount them without having noise afterwards. That noise is what some people criticise , as well as being to flexy for others (I cant see or feel that). Guys at tune told me that stiffness is one thing, flexibility better to avoid breaking and for longer lasting. There are downhillers riding that bb). I just buy the next one next week, so if you like I might organise a second one. By the way, my 107mm 68mm (red ones, black ones are 73mm)) AC38 is just 150gr w/o bolts.

    Actually I also wanted to raise the phil wood question here, since phil´s is my second choice but for me it is the same with you just vice-versa, a bit more expensive than tunes.

  5. #5
    mainly roadie
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    Thank you! Another positive review of AC38...I wonder if I should just get that, to make sure the fit is perfect with the Bigfoot.

    On the other hand, since you ask about Phil Wood, I think they are maybe the Chris King of bottom brackets (and I mean that as a true compliment). There are numerous reports of Phil Wood bottom brackets lasting 20,000-30,000 MILES!!!...and then you simply replace the bearings for US $30.

  6. #6
    Kam
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    i am also running a race face taperlock with a steel spindle. it's been flawless after a mess of single speed miles and plenty of heavy torquing under my 175 pounds.

    i am thinking of getting another *lighter* square taper bb....the only one i'll look at are the phil wood. these things are amazing in reliabilty and are pretty light. bearings run as smooth as glass right from the get go and quite possible for thousands after...buy it, install it, forget about it for a long time.

    i am gonna get the ti spindle (of course).

    you specifically asked for "the best", and phil wood bb's are it, without a doubt. read the reviews.

  7. #7
    mainly roadie
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    I wonder if there is any major difference between the "Premium" ti and the "Proprietary" ti (with "magnium" housing). The price is much more! I think the "Premium" is the best deal....

  8. #8
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    FRM CU2 QUADRO TI 107


    no soucy and 148gr

  9. #9
    mainly roadie
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    What is "soucy"?
    I need 113mm.
    Is FRM making those anymore? They only list integrsal and ISIS on their web now....

  10. #10
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    http://www.light-bikes.com/bikegalle...ing.asp?id=332

    look crank in my bike it's race face next lp for a square taper

  11. #11
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    phil wood is like the chris king of the bbs. expensive and not ultralight but will last your lifetime. i have not used one but i work on two bikes that have it for about seven or eight years each and they never give me any kind of problem. the bearings are still smooth as butter. besides the price i dont think theres any downside about it, but when we want the best we have to pay for it
    hey
    ho
    lets go!

  12. #12
    Single Speed Junkie
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    Quote Originally Posted by cadence90
    I wonder if there is any major difference between the "Premium" ti and the "Proprietary" ti (with "magnium" housing). The price is much more! I think the "Premium" is the best deal....
    From my understanding the Premium ti has a weight guideline for riders preferred under 185#s, Proprietary has no such guideline. I may be mistaken or just not had my morning coffee yet so please don't quote me on this.

    Regardless I'm running two proprietary BB and one steel version and very upset at high end crank manufactures for moving away from the square taper design. Got to love the Phil BB, customer service is top notch as well. Ordered to short of a spindle once on a proprietary bb and Brent swapped it out for one a few mm longer with out any questions.

    Phil hubs are of similar high quality and standards even with the weight penalty over kings.

  13. #13
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    If someones interested I have a World Class Titanium BB for sale, they're very nice and only 155g.

    http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...e=STRK:MESE:IT

  14. #14
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    Race Face Titanium

    Quote Originally Posted by wickerman1
    I have never used nay of the two mentioned... but i have had Race Face taper lock BB and its bomb proof.. IT has a cromo spindle/shaft.... but wieght wise, i dont think its too light but hey i lked it.
    I have a Race face with titanium spindle (160+) that has been working great for years. Only problem are the cups with the thread that turned out to be very delicate (blew one off while swapping BBs but I could buy replacement cups).

  15. #15
    Doesntplaywellwithmorons!
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    I sell Ti bbs of my own branding...

    and use them, as well as using syncros ti bb's, world class ti bbs, and I have a real ti BB I'm waiting for a bike build to try out. Its hard to cock up a square taper Ti BB... Most all of them rely on a Ti 6Al/4V spindle (or an alloy that is stronger), a couple cartridge bearings (usually the 6903 size), a pair of cups (could be old style double adjustable with lockrings and pin tools, or newer style fixed cubs with cartridge tool) that are usually made from aluminium, and some sort of seal setup to protect the bearings (anything from cartridge bearings with rubber seals built in, or additional o-ring seals in the BB cups.

    Weight wise they'll vary from the ultra light range like the raceface (which is about 152g for a 107mm spindle, including ti crank bolts) to the porky stuff like the phil's (around 190g with ti bolts). Higher end CrMo spindle square-taper BB's (like raceface, real, and the UN91 shimano ones) range from 220 to 245g without crank bolts. For a comparison on the same brand/design, the real crankcase Ti BB and CrMo BB, in 107mm spindle length are 165g and 220g respectively, without crank bolts.

    The BB's I sell run from around 170g (with ti bolts) to 195g complete depending on spindle length and that's something else you need to consider, what spindle length are they weighing? Presently I'm all out of Ti spindles in any sizes other than 103mm, 107mm and 127mm and given how little demand there is now for square-taper Ti BBs, I have zero plans to order in anymore spindles in the other sizes for the time being. I don't even sell mine with cartridge bearings anymore. I've just taken to selling the cups, lockrings, spindles, and crank bolts as a bargain package and the buyer can source their own 6903 bearings in whatever price/quality level they so choose.



    Its an old photo from when I had a wider range of spindle lengths in stock, as well as different crank bolt head styles, but that's basically what I sell. A pair of cups (english or italian), a spindle, and a set of ti crank bolts (currently only the 14mm box style with seperate ti spacers). Oh and there's a pair of o-rings also that fit into the grooves in the cups where the spindles pass thru to the outside to keep dirt/debris from getting in around the spindles. I forgot to have them sitting there when I took the photo.
    Last edited by DeeEight; 01-22-2005 at 12:04 PM.
    I don't post to generate business for myself or make like I'm better than sliced bread

  16. #16
    mainly roadie
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    Well, I need a 113mm spindle.
    I'll call Phil wood on Monday and see what they say re: the Premium vs. Proprietary.
    The other candidate besides the tune AC38, might be ActionTec.
    Has anybody used those? Comparison to Phil/tune/RaceFace/etc.?

  17. #17
    Doesntplaywellwithmorons!
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    I have 113mm in Crmo spindle real crankcase BBs, they're $40US and 230 grams without bolts, or $55US and 246g including Ti crank bolts.

    http://classifieds.mtbr.com/cgi-bin/...exact_match=on
    I don't post to generate business for myself or make like I'm better than sliced bread

  18. #18
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    Action Tec / Phil Wood

    Quote Originally Posted by cadence90
    I recently bought a tune Bigfoot crankset, and I need a square taper bb.
    The guys I've asked who use Bigfoot/AC38 love it. (Thanks! )

    My question is:
    should I buy the tune AC38 because of compatibility with the Bigfoot, or
    the Phil Wood Premium ti (or ActionTec ti) because I am in the US, and I can get them for a bit (but not much) less and they can be very easily serviced, etc. here?
    The weight for the AC38 (with crankbolts) is 187g.
    The weight for the Phil Wood (with crankbolts) is...187g.

    Any opinions re: durability/stiffness/etc.?
    Have both and swear by them

    Action Tec Ti
    One each on my hardtail (96 Merlin) and full suspension (01 SC Superlite) mated to RF Next cranks - also had one on my original road bike (90 Litespeed Classic) mated to Super Record cranks

    Phil Wood Ti
    Have this in 102mm on my current road bike (02 Seven Odonata) mated to a '03 Record Carbon crank

    Both are as light as they get in terms of sqare taper Ti BB's

    No manufacturing shortcuts either - precise threads and spindle tapers. Bearings are great as well (I think AT uses SFK)

    Raced on all four and have never once had a problem with reliability or concerns with stiffness. Only problem I've ever had was removing the aluminum cups from my road frame after 12 years of use - they had fused to the BB shell!

    Never once changed the bearings - they way they spun, felt like I never had to - smooth

    One note on stiffness, the material used in your frame combined wth the taper of the tubes at the BB junction will probably have a greater impact on the squish factor than the material or shape of your spindle - but I'm no scientist

    Keep reading on this and other boards about the lousy workmanship, set up difficulty, and short lifespan (in some cases one ride/race) of those ISIS BB's - what a joke!!

    In terms of buyside decision, no wrong move here if choosing between the two. AT is a little less expensive than the Phil Wood - however, I think Phil Wood has more spindle options

    Good luck with your purchase

    Cheers!

  19. #19
    I love Pisgah
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    My .02 cents.

    Been on an ActionTec ti for 3 seasons now. 1.5 bearing swaps and 2 frames later, I plan on running it for a long time to come. Race Sport and weigh 168lbs.

    fwiw. Also ride an identical bike but with an FRM alum ISIS drive setup(both use RF 5bolt compact setups). Its(isis) somewhat stiffer when up outa the saddle and crank'n, but the diff small at best. I've swapped the FRM bearings 1.5 times as well, but thats over 2 seasons.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by cadence90
    I recently bought a tune Bigfoot crankset, and I need a square taper bb.
    The guys I've asked who use Bigfoot/AC38 love it. (Thanks! )

    My question is:
    should I buy the tune AC38 because of compatibility with the Bigfoot, or
    the Phil Wood Premium ti (or ActionTec ti) because I am in the US, and I can get them for a bit (but not much) less and they can be very easily serviced, etc. here?
    The weight for the AC38 (with crankbolts) is 187g.
    The weight for the Phil Wood (with crankbolts) is...187g.

    Any opinions re: durability/stiffness/etc.?
    I have the AC38........if I were you I'd go with the Phil unit. It is the BEST!

  21. #21
    Boj
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    I'm running Action Tec with Tune Bigfoot cranks as of December last year. I had the crank bolts loosen when I just started running them but so far no problems. It's simple, easy to service and runs great though I'm not riding much lately.
    If in doubt - pedal harder!!!

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