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  1. #1
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    Best light weight rotor? Alligator (Wind-Cutter, Starlite, Cirrus) or Ashima

    First let me start off by saying that I love my Avid Elixir's but I have been bitten by the weight weenie bug again and it seems that I can save 50g or more by changing out the rotors. So my question is what is the best light weight rotor? Alligator (Wind-Cutter, Starlite, Cirrus) or Ashima or another? Which one has the best performance and doesn't chew up pads. And is not crazy expensive... example: Scrub.

    Thanks in advance!

  2. #2
    Masher
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    Sorry, Scrub is the answer. Start saving.

  3. #3
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    With elixirs, they give you enough power to run smaller/less powerful rotors for XC no problem. If you aren't already running 160F and 140R then do that first. You can use Hope floating rotors which are light and easy to get, and the alligator seem better than the cirrus by all accounts. Both of these options will save 15g per rotor approx. For full WW effort dropping about 80g then the scrubs are the way to go.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by MisterC
    Sorry, Scrub is the answer. Start saving.
    I guess my question should of been best reasonably priced light weight rotor? lol

    I get it scrub makes great light weight rotors, but I don't want to drop $300 on them. $300 can go further towards other lighter bike parts than just rotors. So I guess I am a WW on a budget and hence the question...

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by AlexRandall
    the alligator seem better than the cirrus by all accounts. Both of these options will save 15g per rotor approx.
    The Cirrus rotor is made by alligator... I am just wondering which one has the best performance and is not crazy expensive. And yes I am looking into getting a 140R, I think that I already have an adapter.

  6. #6
    Lover, not a fighter...
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    Let me suggest another option

    The Formula R1 rotor. You can get the 160mm pictured here for only about $40 from Pricepoint:



    Pic was originally posted by Eliflap in the R1 thread.

  7. #7
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    I run Ashima AiRotor's on my Juicy Ultimates. No problems, lightweight, and look the business.
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  8. #8
    Seeeriously easy Livin
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    Not sure at all, but is that ashima rotor mounted backward? Every other disc rotor I've seen has the "spokes" curving into the direction of rotation. The spokes on that ashima do have a bit of an s curve on them, so who knows.

    BTW I have used a alligator windcutter, and I think it performs better then old stock avid.

  9. #9
    "They Call Me Bone'z"
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    i think the formula looks better
    RAH!

  10. #10
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    GiantMartin & Flystagg how are the brake pads holding up? Standard wear or increased wear and tear on the pads?

  11. #11
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    Anyone have any reviews on the starlite?

  12. #12
    Seeeriously easy Livin
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    I didn't notice any increased wear, I was using sintered pads though.

  13. #13
    LuizSalles
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    i bought the cirrus and it´s not so good, i return to the original marta sl rotors....
    LuizSalles
    São Paulo, São Paulo
    Brazil

  14. #14
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    thanks Flystagg & LuizSalles that's the review I have been looking for... still curious about the starlite too. Maybe wind-cutters are the way to go.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flystagg
    [FONT=Verdana]Not sure at all, but is that ashima rotor mounted backward? Every other disc rotor I've seen has the "spokes" curving into the direction of rotation. The spokes on that ashima do have a bit of an s curve on them, so who knows.
    I think it is. Supposedly what happened is the logos were printed on the wrong side. I have flipped my Ashima over. Couple of mates have warped their rotors and they had them mounted same as picture above.

    For original OP I mostly use Hope floating rotors. If you can get your hands on some (CRC occasionally have stock) get the "lightweight" Hope Mono Mini Pro rotors. They are a bit thinner than Hopes standard floating rotors and hence a bit lighter too. I've run them for almost 4,000 kms on my hardtail and they are still going strong.

  16. #16
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    My Ashimas have been great. No problems whatsoever. My Alligators need frequent 'truing'.
    Ashimas all the way.

  17. #17
    bike rider
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    I use 6" Windcutters on my XC and 8" on my DH. They perform just like stock rotors.
    I HIGHLY recommend against using 140mm on the rear if you live in mountains. They get really hot on short descents and are useless on long descents.
    Keep the Country country.

  18. #18
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    Re: Scrubs - I have not been able to keep them from howling on long descents, whereas I have no problem with stailess steel rotors. I'm giving up on them, 50 grams is not enough to justify howling brakes. I am going to Windcutters.

  19. #19
    Live Free or Ride!
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    Padlife has been fine so far, I am still running the pads that I got at the beginning of this season.

    As far as the rotor being on backwards I thought the same thing but I just followed the little arrows on the rotor and they have been fine. But I think I might do some more investigation into this.
    2007 Giant Anthem 1
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  20. #20
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    Just to get back to the reverse rotor question, I quickly scrolled thru ppl's bike pic's on this forum and they are all mounted this way, but I have not yet received an answer from ashima.
    2007 Giant Anthem 1
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  21. #21
    Weight Weenie Addict!
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    We distribute Alligator and Scrub and so far the Wind Cutter is the clear winner in terms of price, weight and braking performance. The Scrubs are light and we had good success with them...but the price is probably way out there for most. The Alligator Starlite are pretty good IMO....slightly lighter than the Wind Cutters and look good. The Alligator Aries (Cirrus) is the lightest from them but the pad contact area is the smaller of all the models.

  22. #22
    LuizSalles
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmartpr
    We distribute Alligator and Scrub and so far the Wind Cutter is the clear winner in terms of price, weight and braking performance. The Scrubs are light and we had good success with them...but the price is probably way out there for most. The Alligator Starlite are pretty good IMO....slightly lighter than the Wind Cutters and look good. The Alligator Aries (Cirrus) is the lightest from them but the pad contact area is the smaller of all the models.
    Great... and about the pads ? the sintered is the way to go ? something like EBC gold ? do you have another brand sugestion ?
    LuizSalles
    São Paulo, São Paulo
    Brazil

  23. #23
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    We sell a lot of Alligator Semi-Metallic as an affordable replacement with good performance...those that want a premium pad go for the Swiss Stop which we also distribute. Send me an e-mail or PM if you need more info on the pads and prices.

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by radiation vibe
    Anyone have any reviews on the starlite?
    I have 160mm starlites with Elixir R's and they are definitely not as powerful as the stock Avid rotors. Same goes for windcutters too. They are woefully lacking in power for DH or FR. Might be okay for trail or XC but I'm not a fan. The weight savings isn't worth the performance degradation.

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scimitar
    Same goes for windcutters too. They are woefully lacking in power for DH or FR. The weight savings isn't worth the performance degradation.
    I have to disagree. I use 8" XTs on my DH bike with XT rotors on my practice wheels and Windcutters on my race wheels. I have the stock pads in front and Jagwire sintered pads in the rear. I can't tell any difference in brake power or feel swapping between wheels.

    My XC bike uses 6" Windcutters with XTR brakes and stock pads. They have as much power as I'd expect from such a brake, which is plenty when using 2.35" Small Block 8 tires on a 6" travel bike in the Rockies.
    Keep the Country country.

  26. #26
    The MTB Lab
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    I have tested them all and by far the Ashima AiRotors are the winner. Just don't expect to have your pads to last very long!

  27. #27
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    FYI: all Ashima AiRotors should be run with the spokes curving into the direction of rotation (the opposite of most), it keeps the arms in tension when they are under braking force.

  28. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by gixer7
    I think it is. Supposedly what happened is the logos were printed on the wrong side. I have flipped my Ashima over. Couple of mates have warped their rotors and they had them mounted same as picture above.
    .
    That is the proper direction to run the rotors, the opposite of most any rotor that I am aware of.

    What size had the warping issues? Please explain further. They have sold over 70,000 discs since releasing them in 2008, some downhillers had some issues with the 203's, but that is all I am aware of.

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by pastajet
    FYI: all Ashima AiRotors should be run with the spokes curving into the direction of rotation (the opposite of most), it keeps the arms in tension when they are under braking force.
    So the above rotors are on backwards?

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scimitar
    I have 160mm starlites with Elixir R's and they are definitely not as powerful as the stock Avid rotors. Same goes for windcutters too. They are woefully lacking in power for DH or FR. Might be okay for trail or XC but I'm not a fan. The weight savings isn't worth the performance degradation.
    Thanks that is what I didn't want to hear but Nino said the same thing in another post. Eh maybe I should just be happy with a 140R? or try the hope mini pros as mentioned above.

  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by pastajet
    I have tested them all and by far the Ashima AiRotors are the winner. Just don't expect to have your pads to last very long!
    That's enough reason for me not to get them. EBC warns about using these rotors and the wind-cutters. Saying there is no warranty if you use these rotors.

  32. #32
    LuizSalles
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    OK radiation vibe... I understand this too, but about the Hope mini pros ? I think they are more thin tham original rotors this is not a problem ?
    LuizSalles
    São Paulo, São Paulo
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  33. #33
    cougarbait
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    what about alligator serrations??
    09AS-Rsl/09Six

  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by LuizSalles
    OK radiation vibe... I understand this too, but about the Hope mini pros ? I think they are more thin tham original rotors this is not a problem ?
    From what I have read on other threads they are the same thickness as other rotors. But they have some compatibility issues...

    http://weightweenies.starbike.com/fo...ic.php?t=44979

    Hope Mini Pro's and rotor thickness

    Hope floating rotor compatibility

    I am now thinking about doing the 140R and Ti bolts... I can shave weight easier on other places on my bike than rotors.

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lambdamaster
    what about alligator serrations??
    serrations are now called wind-cutters so its the same thing. The only things that scares me about wind-cutters is that EBC does not recommend them just like the Ashima. So pad wear in other words... But at the same time they are only $13 right now and about 13 grams lighter than a G3 rotor. I'm looking into the formula's again as I type this.

  36. #36
    cougarbait
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    Quote Originally Posted by radiation vibe
    serrations are now called wind-cutters so its the same thing. The only things that scares me about wind-cutters is that EBC does not recommend them just like the Ashima. So pad wear in other words... But at the same time they are only $13 right now and about 13 grams lighter than a G3 rotor. I'm looking into the formula's again as I type this.
    ah i see
    I got a set of Ti-Nitride coated 160mm rotors for $20 a piece because I am on a dieting spree for my hardtail, and they look great =]

    oh yeah, they preform pretty well too
    09AS-Rsl/09Six

  37. #37
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    Here are some pics of a couple of various rotors in the proper position. I also attached some info why the Ashima are run they way they are.

    The Ashima lightweight rotor struts work better under tension, when they under compression they are more susceptible to bending forces.
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  38. #38
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    I've always wondered why other rotors are mounted the way they are. Being under tension while braking makes more sense.
    Keep the Country country.

  39. #39
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    i had major problems with my front clean sweep, it would flex and hit the fork under braking. my rear doesn't do it but i got a different front (looks like a roundagon but has alot more holes. And yeah, it's an avid rotor)

  40. #40
    cougarbait
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    Quote Originally Posted by AlexJK
    i had major problems with my front clean sweep, it would flex and hit the fork under braking. my rear doesn't do it but i got a different front (looks like a roundagon but has alot more holes. And yeah, it's an avid rotor)
    your rotor hit your fork??
    I think this is the most fantastic claim you have made yet, alex... and still, we have no evidence.
    09AS-Rsl/09Six

  41. #41
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    His hub/fork interface was flexing and allowing the rotor to hit the pads.
    I'm sure you already knew that Lambdamaster.
    Keep the Country country.

  42. #42
    cougarbait
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lelandjt
    His hub/fork interface was flexing and allowing the rotor to hit the pads.
    I'm sure you already knew that Lambdamaster.
    he is claiming his rotor hit the fork, not the pads
    you should take a look at his threads/posts in the specialized forum...then maybe you'll understand my skepticism of his claims.
    09AS-Rsl/09Six

  43. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lambdamaster
    your rotor hit your fork??
    I think this is the most fantastic claim you have made yet, alex... and still, we have no evidence.
    you want proof? i'll get you proof!

    i'll get ya a picture!

    Hold me to it

  44. #44
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    is there a way to upload a picture directly from my mobile? my computer is gay and won't run photobucket and the file size is too big

  45. #45
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    here ya go asswhipe

    JK! i understand that you want proof, here ya go

    the spot where it hit is the big spot of bare metal to the left of the break...

    the previous fork had a much bigger spot worn into it
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  46. #46
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    I don't think your rotor was flexing. The fork/hub interface or hub itself was flexing and allowing the rotor to hit. There is no lateral force on the rotor so nothing could cause it to flex. If changing rotors solved the problem I'm not sure why. Maybe a slightly smaller outer diameter so while the new rotor is still flexing it doesn't quite reach the fork?

    Sorry for the thread derail but this sort of speculation and problem diagnosis is fun.
    Keep the Country country.

  47. #47
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    oh it was deffinatly the rotor, you could look down and hit the brakes and the rotor would easily be seen hitting the fork, the wheel wouldn't move like if the QR wasn't tight, but the rotor would, the mounting bolts were tight.

    and there must be lateral forces, it looks like the diagram above shows it. and if there weren't then why the heck would my rotor be hitting the fork?

    it did this everytime i hit the brakes and it quickly forced it into an out-of-dish condition.

  48. #48
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    Do you mean an out-of-true condition? Like the rotor would develop a wobble? This is puzzling but I assure you there are no lateral forces applied to the rotor. Look at it. When you apply brake to a spinning wheel the caliper applies equal pressure to both sides of the rotor. This does create very strong torque force between the rotor, which is attached to the hub and the caliper, which is attached to the fork. Look at the various connections between the caliper and rotor. Caliper mounts are pretty stiff (looks like you have post mounts on your fork which are very stiff), rotor mounts on hub are pretty stiff (I've never noticed flex from a 6 bolt hub).
    This leaves the fork/hub interface and the hub axle and bearings. Is your hub of high quality with properly adjusted bearings? If so it probably isn't flexing much but its axle will flex some. The thinner the axle the more flex. What axle/fork interface do you have? If it's a standard hollow axle with a QR skewer that is a known flexy system. A solid 9mm QR like Specialized's Skraxle (sp?) is stiffer and of course QR15 and 20mm thru axles are much stiffer.
    This is all meaningless speculation because you've managed to solve the problem with a different rotor but I can't see how this made any difference besides possibly a slightly smaller outer diameter that doesn't reach the fork, despite the other components flexing just like before.
    Keep the Country country.

  49. #49
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    ebc warns about using them with resin pads(green & red compound). i'm using windcutters(160/140) with shimano stock resin pads. on the front there's no premature wear, but on the back one pad was destroyed after about 500 miles. that was my mistake, caliper was badly aligned.

    so, i order ebc gold pads from ebay few days ago, we'll see how that works. i presume it will be louder, but pad wear and breaking power should be better.
    ~ Too weird to live, too rare to die ~

  50. #50
    cougarbait
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    do you have a picture that is less zoomed-in?? I can't really tell what I am looking at.
    09AS-Rsl/09Six

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