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  1. #26
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    Next time there is a conflict, shank 'em with a mini pump...

  2. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by freakybro View Post
    I came up behind a female trail runner on Grand Ridge last summer. I announced myself. She continued to run down the middle of the trail without acknowledging me in any way. I followed along for maybe 100 yards, then told her I would like to pass at her convenience. She continued ignoring me. I asked her to just move over a little and I'd handle the rest. She ignored me. Finally, I told her that at the next opportunity, I was going to pass her on the left. I would announce I was passing, then I would pass, and I hoped we didn't collide, but if we did, I was not going to apologize for it. Shortly thereafter, I passed. I looked back, and it was as if I was invisible. No reaction whatsoever. Besides that one negative encounter, I've had nothing but good greetings and words with every other hiker, runner or horseman I've met along the trail. Totally strange.

    You ARE invisible.
    Today I will gladly share my experience and advice, for there are no sweeter words than "I told you so."

  3. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by nasai View Post
    You ARE invisible.
    Who are you talking to?
    Quote Originally Posted by ridelikeafatkid
    "MOMMY, I WANT TO RIDE LIKE THAT FAT KID!" true story.

  4. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by trboxman View Post
    Who are you talking to?
    The guy I quoted. I guess I need to put smiley faces while I'm at it?
    Today I will gladly share my experience and advice, for there are no sweeter words than "I told you so."

  5. #30
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    Re: Watch out for this guy

    I don't love this thread. Yeah he's a bad guy but I want his side of the story. I'm talking about the dog walker if anyone is wondering.

    At least it points out there is strong "interest" in getting along on this closest great trail to 2 million souls.

    I suggest Evergreen have a plan for when the official complaint salvos begin to trickle into county parks to respond with an outreach tent at grand ridge drive (so it does not impact the cars) perhaps with county staff and even WTA to educate all users to get along especially us vs them. I hope it doesn't become a lodge.

    Look inside yourselves. Strava hero or courteous interaction? Groups especially teams in colors really set a tone to walkers. Put yourself in their position. How many bikes just went by as I lost track?

    I'm the sarcastic guy when you tell me "1 back" I reply "I know, 200 back". There is always someone around every corner. Yes I ring a bell on all of them. But my ancient bell will remain silent hereafter regarding GR conflict. Its your turn to change a disgruntled walker's opinion...

    You will surely not change anyone's opinion here :-)

    Or drive another 20 minutes to tiger or beyond and Go Rural ye fast and furious young men and women. There is nobody there to care, but please never forget your manners.

  6. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by nasai View Post
    The guy I quoted. I guess I need to put smiley faces while I'm at it?
    No, it's not that... It was an invisible joke.
    So it's OK that you didn't see it right away.

  7. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by trboxman View Post
    Who are you talking to?
    I think he was talking to that older dude

  8. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by paleo View Post
    I don't love this thread. Yeah he's a bad guy but I want his side of the story. I'm talking about the dog walker if anyone is wondering.

    At least it points out there is strong "interest" in getting along on this closest great trail to 2 million souls.

    I suggest Evergreen have a plan for when the official complaint salvos begin to trickle into county parks to respond with an outreach tent at grand ridge drive (so it does not impact the cars) perhaps with county staff and even WTA to educate all users to get along especially us vs them. I hope it doesn't become a lodge.

    Look inside yourselves. Strava hero or courteous interaction? Groups especially teams in colors really set a tone to walkers. Put yourself in their position. How many bikes just went by as I lost track?

    I'm the sarcastic guy when you tell me "1 back" I reply "I know, 200 back". There is always someone around every corner. Yes I ring a bell on all of them. But my ancient bell will remain silent hereafter regarding GR conflict. Its your turn to change a disgruntled walker's opinion...

    You will surely not change anyone's opinion here :-)

    Or drive another 20 minutes to tiger or beyond and Go Rural ye fast and furious young men and women. There is nobody there to care, but please never forget your manners.
    The onus always will be on us. Not casting aspersions on the OP's story I'm just sayin' - I agree fully with what the Legend is trying to communicate. It's true for every trail, but GR and the like are a bubble inside of an egg - fragile.

    I had a guy screaming at me and trying to poke me with his walking poles* (I had to push them out of the way) and then as I walked by he belly bumped me and of course I had all sorts of post-incident thoughts, but of every single scenario I considered, none of them had a positive outcome except "remove myself from this situation with as much dispatch as possible". Which it sounds like the OP did, except for the push.

    *this was in another time and place several years ago

  9. #34
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    Buddy system.
    Helmet camera.
    Jail cell.
    Victory.

  10. #35
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    Thr horse crowd can go jump in the coldest lake in the Cascades, and as for the hiking thugs, well there are some good ones out there. Don't expect to find any near Brinnon or Quilcene, that are could use some help in civility, trail-wise.
    Good friction shifting is getting hard to find nowadays....

  11. #36
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    OP here folks. I don't want to get in to a big discussion about this but I have to defend pushing the guy off after he assaulted me and was standing over me yelling. I'd like to hear the other side of the story too because we weren't even on singletrack yet and there was plenty of room. I stopped behind him, politely asked to pass and when I did decide to pass I was going about 3 mph and he had plenty of room. I don't wear bright colors, use Strava and I don't rip around Grand Ridge like it's my personal enduro course.

    That being said, I've been surprised by the amount of dickish riding I see on Grand Ridge. I'm from a place where you yield and you might even (god forbid) stop to chat for a bit with the other rider. Grand Ridge was a culture shock coming from Eugene/Oakridge but it's still a nice place to cruise around after work. I understand how some hikers get pissed at the mtn bikers on GR but it ain't no excuse to assault people. That dude was a dangerous dick but regardless of that we should all strive to be a little more polite and cautious on busy trails. Problem is, the people who need to hear that probably ain't reading this forum. Happy trails y'all.

  12. #37
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    Re: Watch out for this guy

    You are a breath of fresh air OP.

    Welcome!

    Will watch out.

  13. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by nasai View Post
    The guy I quoted. I guess I need to put smiley faces while I'm at it?
    No, I got yours, but it looks like you didn't get my funny
    Quote Originally Posted by ridelikeafatkid
    "MOMMY, I WANT TO RIDE LIKE THAT FAT KID!" true story.

  14. #39
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    So, the saga continues. I was out walking my dog and ran into our friendly neighborhood bike-shover. This time I got my camera out and started filming him which made him pretty upset. He reads our forums and started calling me "WestwardHo". So, hello sir if you're reading this. I gave him my real name and asked for his which was met with a "f**k you buddy". At that point he called the cops and said that my dog and I were threatening him and going to attack. I just kept filming, letting him get more worked up while I got some shots of his face for the police. At that point he was starting to get pretty upset and one of his off-leash dogs had run off so I decided to head down the trail and call the police myself.

    That made him even more mad for some reason and I got some more video of him telling me to come back to fight I guess? He just kept saying I was a p**sy in different uncreative ways. I met with the Issaquah police down at the bottom of the trail and showed them the video that torpedoed his story. The cops were laughing at the ridiculousness of the guy and I was too honestly. They now have a report on file for this as well. I'm not going to post the video since I'm not a lawyer and not sure if I should but here's a pic that gives you some idea of who to look out for. I don't want to put a pic of his face up because I'm figuring he'll murder the next mountain biker he sees if I do that. At least now you have some idea of what he and his dogs look like. Hopefully the chat with the police will keep him under control for the time being.

    Watch out for this guy-20140619_164104.jpg

  15. #40
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    I'm about 50 years old and also have a border collie, so please make sure its the right guy before you flip him any s**t.

  16. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kliemann53 View Post
    I'm about 50 years old and also have a border collie, so please make sure its the right guy before you flip him any s**t.
    Do you also wear your short up to your belly button with your shirt tucked in and on your way to a safari of trail conflict?
    Epic trails get built in the Northwest by epic people!

    Sustainable quality trails please.

  17. #42
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    Re: Watch out for this guy

    Mr. Corgiman hope you appreciate Pink Floyd's The Wall:

    "The evidence before the court is incontrovertible. There is no need for the jury to retire...."

    (Leads to "Tear down The Wall!" )

    We all want to figure out how get along. Like Ross Perot I am all ears.

    You bought that nice house up there and I've feared for the local stakeholders vs. Our clan of the unwashed with our $1000 cars and $5000 bikes trying to share this precious open space.

    I'm the guy who puts up the "Let's Fix This" signs here and there over the last couple of winters and dozens of my friends, you know: we the unwashed, fill and shape the trail to give the water an escape route to avoid divots.

    Let's fix this...

    I'll meet you anywhere you want alone no shenanigans lets just talk about your very special neighborhood.

    If you want I can have someone from county parks to hear your story. I can ask the parks Manager Gary Brown to join us or Google him and arrange your own meeting. Again no shenanigans am just trying to gain perspective and mutually determine if we have options to reach out to this readership to help remind them of best practices..
    Last edited by paleo; 06-22-2014 at 01:12 AM.

  18. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by WestwardHo View Post
    So, the saga continues. I was out walking my dog and ran into our friendly neighborhood bike-shover. This time I got my camera out and started filming him which made him pretty upset. He reads our forums and started calling me "WestwardHo". So, hello sir if you're reading this. I gave him my real name and asked for his which was met with a "f**k you buddy". At that point he called the cops and said that my dog and I were threatening him and going to attack. I just kept filming, letting him get more worked up while I got some shots of his face for the police. At that point he was starting to get pretty upset and one of his off-leash dogs had run off so I decided to head down the trail and call the police myself.

    That made him even more mad for some reason and I got some more video of him telling me to come back to fight I guess? He just kept saying I was a p**sy in different uncreative ways. I met with the Issaquah police down at the bottom of the trail and showed them the video that torpedoed his story. The cops were laughing at the ridiculousness of the guy and I was too honestly. They now have a report on file for this as well. I'm not going to post the video since I'm not a lawyer and not sure if I should but here's a pic that gives you some idea of who to look out for. I don't want to put a pic of his face up because I'm figuring he'll murder the next mountain biker he sees if I do that. At least now you have some idea of what he and his dogs look like. Hopefully the chat with the police will keep him under control for the time being.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Good job.

  19. #44
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    I'm still laughing at "safari of trail conflict" .

    Thanks for the update and another huge thanks to Len... for not only fixing up the trails we love to ride, but now offering to be an ambassador! I doubt corgiman will contact you, but if he does, there's no better person than you to have a conversation with.

    For the last 5 months, Julie and I have been hiking the trails at GR way more than we ride them. I'd like to summarize our experience and make a point...

    *All* of the bikers we've met while hiking have been cool and willing to give us the right of way. We just get out of the way because its the easiest thing to do. And when we're riding, that's what most of the hikers we meet do as well. So our experience at GR has been pretty damn positive.

    As you can expect, a small percentage of the riders we've met were going pretty fast and had to brake pretty hard to stop in time. Being bikers, Julie and I are fine with it and the riders are cool about it... even apologetic. However, I can easily see how that could freak out some hikers. Especially those who don't understand mt biking. They could see those encounters as a near devastating crash. Especially parents with younger kids and older folks.

    My point... we need to slow down at places like GR. It's not the place for strava or practicing your high speed cornering skills. And the closer you get to Central Park, the heavier the casual walk-in-the-woods traffic will be. I imagine it's the same at St Eds.

    BTW, not saying there aren't Vandemans out there on both sides, I think they are rare and I have yet to meet one at GR.

  20. #45
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    I want to second the thanks to Len. I hope he does call and this gets worked out in a productive manner. During our last "conversation" he seemed to think that mountain bikers break the law all the time and this gives him the right to do as he pleases. That said, he's old enough that he should be receptive to some measured conversation once he's calmed down from all this.

    On another note, please don't accost this gentleman if you run into him on the trail. The police know who he is now so just give him a wide berth and document anything he does with the proper authorities. I can provide you with a case number if you pm me after you run into him.

    And like people have been saying, slow down in the populated areas of grand ridge and try to be syrupy sweet in your encounters with the general public. Most people are wonderful but there are those out there who've painted a target on our backs so remember that we are all ambassadors for the sport and trail access. Anyway, thanks for all the support everyone. I'm hoping this is the last I have to deal with this and I can pedal around stupid and happy for the rest of my days.

  21. #46
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    I would say vigilante, but that's taking law enforcement into one's own hands...he is not enforcing any laws, rather, breaking them.

    I would say selfish or egocentric but that means concerned "chiefly" with one's own personal profit or pleasure. His focus seems to be concerned solely (not chiefly) with his own pleasure.

    There really is not one word to describe a person who transgresses moral, ethical, or civil law in such a blatant manner. This is not situational, this a personality disorder. Take away the bike, the hike, the park, the dogs...I would be willing to bet that this person's life is steeped in empty and pointless conflict. It's too bad (and quite amazing) that people like this exist in settings such as open spaces and parks where the focus is supposed to be recreation (or re-creation meaning to re create one self outside of the daily routine).

  22. #47
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    One good tip for people who ride GR. Stop trying to count all the knobs on your tires while riding. Trust your skills, your bike, the trail and look ahead for other trail users. 3/4ers of people on bikes that I encounter on that trail are looking right at there tire and that makes it hard to see anything else. If you can get comfortable looking ahead and not having to gazing into the knobs of your tire like it's a camp fire then you will become a more skilled rider.

    Hint- If you can't look ahead while riding your bike you might be riding a little out of control of your skills set.
    Epic trails get built in the Northwest by epic people!

    Sustainable quality trails please.

  23. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by walangkatapat View Post
    Good job.
    Sick hat. This thread is pretty entertaining, but on a serious note, I'm really impressed how you're handling it. I would have reacted far more aggressively if some guy shoved me off my bike like that... but after reading this thread, I wouldn't. So, thanks for the perspective. Hope it works out and that the toughest part of the safari is over.

  24. #49
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    The restraint shown in this thread is refreshing.

    Field Lieutenant Corgiman is worthy of our pity, not our fists. What a sad little man. Seven billion people on this planet--good luck with your doggies and your trail and your helmet, bud. See you on the other side...

  25. #50
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    that's one of those safari pith helmet things, yes?

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