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  1. #1
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    Tolt trail names.. seeking old timers!

    We were riding around Tolt yesterday trying to relearn how some of the trails fit together in the messier parts like the SW corner with Dancin', O.D., I-90, etc.

    I'd like to produce a new map, but from the 3 or 4 existing old maps I have, it's sometimes even hard to figure out which segments properly belong to what original trail, and some people making maps seem to have invented names that don't match other maps.

    So on one map it seems like Dancin' was built first and originally included what's later called O.D.? (Now known as Oinking Donkey..)

    The handdrawn map shows something below O.D. whose name I can't read. ("lowin"??)

    Does Sideshow continue all the way to where The Beast meets South Hill? Or is that called something else?

    When you're at the spot where The Beast roughly meets 76... it seems there's a N-S doubletrack there (West Road extension) and and E-W double track which 76 comes off of. I thought that that E-W double track was called Grant's Pass, but looking again, I think maybe instead the trail that starts across from 76 with a steep downhill and then turns eastwards may actually be Grant's Pass? (I thought that was Sideshow, but maybe not...)

    So many questions... Any old timers have opinions? Anyone want to email their old timer friends who don't hang out on forums anymore but who would know? :-)

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  2. #2
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    Is there a name for the trail that runs parallel to the East Road on its west side? (Newer than Mystery and Oxbow...)

  3. #3
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    I can dial all that in for you offline though Mike built most of it... "O.D" is Outer Dancin'.

    The one map I had called it "East side road". Or, at least I seem to remember making a name tag as that for it. It would be green and wired on a tree head height about 15-30 feet in.

    Grant's Pass is/was indeed the old road bed at the top of the hill and Sideshow does parallel below it. There is a short steep down into that gully going south to north called "Endo" though.

  4. #4
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    I have a map that puts "Endo" as coming off Buckhorn, i.e. on the east side of the N-S road that I think of as the "South Center Rd." (Har har.)

    I'm actually playing with the mapped trails on OpenStreetMap.org, which is like Wikipedia for mapping. You can see the current state of the trails at Tolt here:

    OpenStreetMap

    Sometimes you have to zoom in farther to see trail names. It's not at all complete, a bunch of stuff is missing.

    I'm having trouble seeing how to correct the naming in the Oxbow/Mystery area. From the hand-drawn map I had, originally there was one long meandering trail called Oxbow in that area, with both ends coming off Cross Quadrant. Then Mystery branched off it towards the 5-way at top of IAB. Now there seem to be more intersections... not sure what's what.

  5. #5
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    Awesome to see somebody take this on! It's been needed badly for a while! Presumably you've already pulled from both the sources here:

    Trail:Tolt MacDonald - Evergreen Trail Guide

    including the GPS-based one that is accurate to scale (though probably not to name, nor up-to-date).

    When you make some more headway on this, let's be sure to get it onto the Evergreen wiki! I can help you with that if you want.

    Thanks again.
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  6. #6
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    There are also a couple trails on the north side of the water tower that none of these maps seems to show. I have no clue what they are called but they are actually quite a bit of fun. No one ever seems to know they exist

  7. #7
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    These maps I posted above are really old ones... maybe older than some of those trails. :-)

    OpenStreetMap does have some trails up there (Fern World, ...). I'll go ride around some more when it's a bit warmer...

  8. #8
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    I finally opened the open street map and there are a bunch of things that are wrong with it... Lots.

    Frankly, I'm surprised there is some interest. You do know RnR that no one rides there any more. Right? (You have been a away a while...)

    You may want to talk to "the other Mike" who has been spearheading the legal and authorized recent Tolt work in the Fernworld area in particular.

  9. #9
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    Oh yeah, plenty of issues with the map, that's why I started fixing and adding stuff. To make a good map, you have to first make a bad map that you can fix up.

    When I ride there and collect more GPS tracks, I'll fix more stuff.

    Yeah, I know, people only ride at Duthie now, I've heard.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by roundnround View Post
    Oh yeah, plenty of issues with the map, that's why I started fixing and adding stuff. To make a good map, you have to first make a bad map that you can fix up.

    When I ride there and collect more GPS tracks, I'll fix more stuff.

    Yeah, I know, people only ride at Duthie now, I've heard.
    I've been riding Tolt nearly every Wednesday morning for the last several months. It's clear I'm not the only one riding out there, but I've never seen anybody else on bike (solo midweek morning deal). The switchbacks.com map is actually pretty accurate; I'd start with that over everything else.
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  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by r1de View Post
    I've been riding Tolt nearly every Wednesday morning for the last several months. It's clear I'm not the only one riding out there, but I've never seen anybody else on bike (solo midweek morning deal). The switchbacks.com map is actually pretty accurate; I'd start with that over everything else.
    r1de, we should meet up out there some Wednesday. I am only a couple of miles away from the west side entrance so I do ride out there fairly often.

    roundnround, the map from switchbacks.com is the one I use to navigate out there and is pretty accurate. Jon over there at switchbacks.com will take tracks and names as corrections too. If you want GPS tracks of various trails, let me know and I'll start carving out individual trails as GPX or KMZ files.
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  12. #12
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    Here is a map that shows some of the new trails near FernWorld.
    Tolt trail names.. seeking old timers!-tolt-north.jpg
    Mike

  13. #13
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    Flint, thanks, will have to go check out those new north-end trails.

    DRSpalding - yeah, Jon's maps aren't bad though some of the names were made up by people submitting the tracks to him.

    Maybe I should just quit drawing by hand and talk with Jon about transferring his maps to OSM...

  14. #14
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    Borneo, Not only is someone riding Tolt, they are doing trail work as well! The trails were in great shape. Most of the usual puddles were even dried up.

    Thanks to whomever is out knocking back the ferns and such. Still one of the few places you can ride fast and stay on singletrack for 2+ hours.

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