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  1. #1
    I should be out riding
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    Tokul post storm clean-up?

    Anyone heard if Hancock has the trails cleared yet?

  2. #2
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    lol, I'll tell you tomorrow. hopefully they are still hiding from the snow.
    Regional Race Manager, Knolly Bikes
    Washington State, Australia, New Zealand, South Africa

  3. #3
    Moist and Delicious
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    Take some pics. It'd be great to see what's what up there.
    Today I will gladly share my experience and advice, for there are no sweeter words than "I told you so."

  4. #4
    FM
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    luxatio erecta
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    It would be really great to have some clarification around maintenance at Tokul east etc
    I know evergreen is working on this, but...I'm gonna email Hancock today and inquire.

  5. #5
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    Hancock said i could pay $75 to moor my sig at Tokul. Think i should pull that trigger?
    .~...|\
    ...~.|.\
    ..~..|..\
    .~...|...\
    ~....|....\
    ...~.|.....\
    ....~|____\
    _____||_________
    .\....FAILBOAT..../

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skookum View Post
    Hancock said i could pay $75 to moor my sig at Tokul. Think i should pull that trigger?
    Got it, thats pretty clever. Its a shot in the dark, about a .357 chance.

  7. #7
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    "Someone" had a great day at TE today. He cleared an entire trail top to bottom, but only took 2 decent pics. There were about 10 trees 6" or greater diameter across the trail and loads and loads of debris. Here is what he got today. (see pics)

    It was about 80% rideable in this condition, if you have Snaux tires. (2.8 DH32 front/Vredstein Bulldog 2.5 rear). Now it is probably 90-95%, depending on skills/power/endurance in the snow. The downhills are super nice....so I hear.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Tokul post storm clean-up?-crazy-ivan_clearing-trees-001b.jpg  

    Tokul post storm clean-up?-crazy-ivan_clearing-trees-002b.jpg  

    Regional Race Manager, Knolly Bikes
    Washington State, Australia, New Zealand, South Africa

  8. #8
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    Thanks. Gonna take a lot of work to clear everything. Maybe the roads have enough blowdown to keep the permit checkers out too?

  9. #9
    Just roll it......
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    When the winds get howling through the Snoqualmie valley, that zone takes a beating!

    One idea. Clear the trails and see if Hancock goes in to clear the roads. Without road access, will their enforcement guys get out of their trucks? In my experience, they will eventually get to it, but not for a long while.

    During the gnarly windstorms in '06 or '07 (?), we had a crew of us at East with 4 or 5 chainsaws and another 5 or 6 dudes clearing. There must've been 35+ big trees down on the trails, a bunch on the roads (one that had a wicked sideload) and so many smaller trees and debris.

  10. #10
    FM
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    luxatio erecta
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    Absolutely effing no go



    If you were to purchase one of Hacocks' fancy permits, you will agree to this fine print during the check-out process:

    This permit is for recreational access only. Permittee agrees not to cut, damage or destroy any timber located on Snoqualmie Forest. The cutting, damaging or destroying of any such timber shall be considered willful trespass and Permittee shall be liable to the Owners in a sum equal to three times the damage sustained on account of the cutting, damaging or destruction of such timber. Permittee shall pay Owners for all other damage to Snoqualmie Forest caused directly or indirectly by the acts or omissions of Permittee.
    They've also added a liability waiver.

  11. #11
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    Not surprising....

    But, we'll have to reign in some foresters to walk the knife edge and tell us whether cutting out blowdown is considered "timber". IMHO, blowdown has always been immune to that rule.

    All the more reason for Glenn to get the very details hammered out and publicized.

    Hand saws can be covert enough but running a chain saw may be pushing it...

  12. #12
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    If you look up the definition of "timber" you can decipher it as even downed trees. Is Hancock (or whoever the logging co is) going to go in and harvest a downed 10" diameter tree? I doubt it.

    If they really intended to keep users from removing any downed tree or large branches that have come down on trails, it kinda makes no sense to even bother with a pass.

  13. #13
    I should be out riding
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    Quote Originally Posted by Borneo View Post
    IMHO, blowdown has always been immune to that rule.
    I disagree on blowdown, it's really a judgment call of whether the blowdown could make a log, and how likely it is to become a log. A tree blocking a trail is annoying to us, but is an investment to others.

    Quote Originally Posted by Borneo View Post
    All the more reason for Glenn to get the very details hammered out and publicized.
    Definitely looking forward to hearing from Glenn on this. I sent email in through Hancock's site this week, but haven't gotten a response yet. Probably too busy clearing trails and checking permits.

    Quote Originally Posted by Borneo View Post
    Hand saws can be covert enough but running a chain saw may be pushing it...
    Personally, I wouldn't take a chain saw on private land (or public land) without landowner approval.

  14. #14
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    Gotcha. I'll have to go with Jimbo though. There should be a diameter requirement. A small (less than 8-10" dia) tree isn't very marketable.

    Yeah, not being able to do any real trail clearing is yet another buzz kill. All the more reason to see if a "legit" work party can be arrainged then. It seems from the wiki post that they would be up for that.

    As for chain saws, to each their own.... We could go old school double pull wilderness style but what a waste of time and effort.

  15. #15
    OMG!
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    "rode" tokul today. was a fun hike. absolutely gorgeous out.

  16. #16
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    Be careful with your assumptions...

    Quote Originally Posted by Borneo View Post
    A small (less than 8-10" dia) tree isn't very marketable.
    When was the last time you visited a modern saw mill equipped with single-pass scanners and 3D optimizers? There are quiute a few saw mills in PNW that specialize in processing of small diameter logs, from as small as 3". Sure, one 3" down tree may not make the forester to run over to salvage it, but enough of them after a severe storm will definitely cause them to evaluate the value of timber that can be salvaged.

    Best not to make that kind of judgment call on timber that you don't own.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bruiser View Post
    When was the last time you visited a modern saw mill equipped with single-pass scanners and 3D optimizers? There are quiute a few saw mills in PNW that specialize in processing of small diameter logs, from as small as 3". Sure, one 3" down tree may not make the forester to run over to salvage it, but enough of them after a severe storm will definitely cause them to evaluate the value of timber that can be salvaged.

    Best not to make that kind of judgment call on timber that you don't own.
    When was the last time you saw a logging company go in the middle of the woods to pick up one 10" diameter tree that was down?

  18. #18
    Just roll it......
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    Janicki been harvesting blowdown on Galbraith recently. However, it was in areas that they had already harvested and was easily accessible. They're not cutting new skidders in to harvest anything that's for sure. We talked to the owner the other day though and they've stopped with that (after only a couple days) because there really wasn't enough to make it economically worth it for the effort (their words). Trust me, there was a $h!t-ton of blowdown.....by our standards, at least.

    My point: is blowdown potentially harvestable? Of course, every tree could conceivably become pulp.

    Is it something that loggers are going to pull out in a special mission? Nope.

  19. #19
    Yebo Numzaan
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    update

    The pictures posted above are a pretty good indication of whats out there. That is the most significant storm damage that i have ever witnessed.

    Looks like someone has started clearing from the bottom.

    There are still a few significant trees on the upper section of FT3K..but from about 1/2 way it looks good and from there all the way down OG to the SVT. I believe LF has a big tree near the top..but then is mostly good.

    Definitely be safe out there...there are trees, branches, pogo sticks everywhere...nice day for riding today.
    I support EMBA

  20. #20
    i'm schralping yer thread
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    Trail gnomes were busy last night clearing high-value 3D laser-millable blowdown. Sorry Bruiser.

  21. #21
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    I think the plethora of 3-10" logs rotting on the ground all over the place at Tokul shows just how much they care about harvesting blowdown...

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jimba View Post
    When was the last time you saw a logging company go in the middle of the woods to pick up one 10" diameter tree that was down?
    I've done so on numerous occasions when I worked in logging, and on even more occasions, picked up old blowdown when the area around the blowdown was cut. Lots of times salvage logging was deferred until enough would be in the area to make it worthwhile. I've cut plenty of blowdown out of trails too - I think it's really a matter of common sense, and not being as cavalier about other peoples property as Borneo was suggesting.

    I passed a logging truck on the Snoqualmie Parkway today that had a log with about a 3" top.

    Still no response yet from Hancock to the question I submitted on their website earlier this week.

  23. #23
    Yebo Numzaan
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    FT3K / LF / OGDH are now all clear

    CI is clear from the cedar bridge

    If anyone has ridden Safety First / Gun Range or the first section of CI to the bridge...please post an update.

    just a word...there may still be hazards out there. I noticed quite a few branches that had been impaled into the ground and were now sticking out like spears...there may be some that were missed.

    Thanks to who ever has been out there e.g. on LF and OG
    I support EMBA

  24. #24
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    Good to know.

    Any detail on GS across the top?

    West is apparently pretty clear.

  25. #25
    Yebo Numzaan
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    Met a dude in the lot that had ridden it...Said it was 'deep' (water)...but no horror stories..so blow downs must have been ok. Blow downs definitely worse based on the angle / slope of the land.
    I support EMBA

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