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  1. #1
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    Time for a breather...

    I propose Tuesday, April 1 to be a day with no added threads to VRC, no replies to posts on VRC, nothing but reading. Take April 1 and go back and read the original posts to this forum. You'll get what this forum's intention was and should be. Start with this one and then go to page 149 and peruse the old threads. There's some great information. I loved being a part of the VRC forum when it started in 2004.

    And this ain't no April Fool's Day joke. It's time to take a collective chill pill.

  2. #2
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    hey good idea and great thread to start out with!

    I do have to say, I really miss those days when the forum was that way. I didnt realize how much it has changed until I read that old post. Veloculture was right about how this forum has sadly gone downhill over the last little while it seems. The key thing to remember is what the forum was intended for. It wasnt a place to show off the junk you picked up or found every other day, it was meant to be a place to admire, chat about and remember the cool, historic, old bikes/people/parts of the early years of mountain biking.

    If the dumpster hounds, no disrespect whatsoever if thats your thing, (we all have our hobbies) that just like the cheap finds could respect that it would be cool and we could get back to our regular programming without all the bickering. Or a lot less of it at least.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fillet-brazed
    If the dumpster hounds, no disrespect whatsoever if thats your thing, (we all have our hobbies) that just like the cheap finds could respect that it would be cool and we could get back to our regular programming without all the bickering. Or a lot less of it at least.

    I'm afraid that statement will cause hurt feelings and bickering.

    I also totally agree with you...but I'm just sayin'.



    @ Mike - Good thought. I'll be post free tomorrow and only look at nice bikes from posts past.
    -eric-

    http://www.rumpfy.com
    Wanted: NDS Suntour XC Pro Microdrive 175mm Crank Arm.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rumpfy
    I'm afraid that statement will cause hurt feelings and bickering.

    I also totally agree with you...but I'm just sayin'.



    @ Mike - Good thought. I'll be post free tomorrow and only look at nice bikes from posts past.

    Well, if you have hurt feelings call your mom and let her know. Tell her about the new Magna too.

  5. #5
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    Considering the first three posts on this thread are from the "unholy trinity" of bike elitism I was somewhat surprised to find out how much I enjoyed browsing the older threads, It pains me to admit it, but if I hadn't bothered I wouldn't have had my morning routine brightened by this gem.........

  6. #6
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    Looking back to the beginning...you probably could have just called this forum "Bontragers and stuff"...
    Lot's of "what's it worth" posts...
    Lot's of Fat, Ritchey and Bridgestone posts too...

    There are folks on here who don't hesitate to post up any old dumpster finds, but I don't mind those. Some of them are pretty cool.

    If the topics were limited to just high end, super rare stuff this forum would be dead. Compared to other forums (such as car and truck enthusiast forums) this place is not that active. I can catch up on posts here in about an hour. Some forums are just constantly going...

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by sho220

    If the topics were limited to just high end, super rare stuff this forum would be dead...
    You mean like how slow forums like FatCOGs are? Nice forum, but so specific it can go days without a post.

    This forum is nice and has unfortunately been helpful in luring me back into gathering cycling junk again (it's all junk kids, baggage of life, sorry), but it looks like an incestuous circle jerk sometimes with all the gushing and ego stroking.
    Quote Originally Posted by banks
    That is one big f'n dude!
    Yes I am!

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fillet-brazed
    It wasnt a place to show off the junk you picked up or found every other day, it was meant to be a place to admire, chat about and remember the cool, historic, old bikes/people/parts of the early years of mountain biking.
    The sentiment is fine but drips w/ "no johnny-come lately" sentiment. From reading through old threads there is no hard and fast definition of "cool and historic" bikes. Sure, some can be easily spotted but I feel that some on this board don't think it's worth posting unless it's a pristine Fat Chance/Yeti/Ritchey/Klein etc. w/ NOS XTR bits. I personally think that's ridiculous. I enjoy seeing any older mtb if it's cool in my eyes. Sure, Slingshots are pretty cool but if someone posted a Huffy that had been lovingly "restored" i'd give that props as well.

    It's about older bikes and it's about passion, not decals and nameplates.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by IF52
    looks like an incestuous circle jerk sometimes with all the gushing and ego stroking.
    haha...concur.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fillet-brazed
    it was meant to be a place to admire, chat about and remember the cool, historic, old bikes/people/parts of the early years of mountain biking.
    Kind of like an MTB Retirement Home?

    Get off my lawn you whippersnappers!!!

  11. #11
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    Mike, you are absolutely right and it's a good thing that you are asking the noobs to look back at once this forum once was.

    and yes, i posted on the day i was not supposed to post. im bad. always been a rule breaker.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by IF52
    You mean like how slow forums like FatCOGs are? Nice forum, but so specific it can go days without a post.

    This forum is nice and has unfortunately been helpful in luring me back into gathering cycling junk again (it's all junk kids, baggage of life, sorry), but it looks like an incestuous circle jerk sometimes with all the gushing and ego stroking.

    well obviously you weren't around here when this forum was alive. this forum was extremely active and full of awesome threads. look back into the past like Mike said. you might be surprised.

  13. #13
    John Galt
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slimpee
    It's about older bikes and it's about passion, not decals and nameplates.
    I agree. I'm a tweener here - I've posted my Paramountain, '85 Fat, '86 Mountain Klein and unusual-but-mass-produced '93 DB Overdrive Comp here (none of which is a "one of ten", or even "one of one hundred" bike); but I've also posted up other, more common finds/projects, such as the '88 Fisher Montare that got me back into older bikes, as well as an older Giant, DB Arrival (yes, the yellow one! ), DB Axis, Stumpy Comp, Raleigh Technium Chill, ParkPre and a few others that have passed through my hands. I feel like all were met with some appreciation. Early on, I probably asked some simple questions, too; but I found helpful folks.

    Personally, I hope there's room for all VRC bikes. This means the high-end restored/survivor bikes ("vintage"), as well as anything that brings back thoughts of where MTBs started. Classic to me is time-based, regardless of 'level' when sold and retro can be a more modern bike made like the older ones.

    For example, It makes me happy to see that someone took an old mid-to-low-level Trek, DB or whatever that they'd almost forgotten about and fixed it up to ride. Even if it doesn't get ridden much, I'll be happier knowing someone discovered the pleasure of fixing something up and maybe the pleasure of remembering how MTBs used to be. At an absolute minimum, it's great that someone puts some care into something usable instead of throwing it away...

    You never know who will get the real bug and turn into a serious collector; so why be rude or otherwise dissuade someone who is just discovering the possibility? The only semi-logical reason I can think of is that more collectors means higher prices; but turning people away to save a buck is pretty selfish and not true to the spirit of any common hobby. I don't think that's really the motivation, anyway.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by cegrover
    You never know who will get the real bug and turn into a serious collector; so why be rude or otherwise dissuade someone who is just discovering the possibility? The only semi-logical reason I can think of is that more collectors means higher prices; but turning people away to save a buck is pretty selfish and not true to the spirit of any common hobby. I don't think that's really the motivation, anyway.
    I don't think it is the motivation either. Challenging people to take pride in what they post would seem to encourage people to step it up and would thus create more demand for desirable stuff not less. At least the result isn't obvious.

    I think the point that keeps getting made is to take some pride in what you post. Heck, your contributions are exemplary - tons of information about the bikes with nice restorations and stories. Takes me back, you know. A low lever bike isn't necessarily a junker but too often, and particularly recently, it has been.

    My preference is bike porn or bikes with stories. What I don't like are crappy photos of beat bikes whose only claim to fame is being old and cheap. I mean, what's the point?

    Like Veloculture says, it is possible to see hundreds of old crappy bikes every day.

    I don't think that every bike needs to be a Potts or a Yeti, but if I had to choose between that and every bike being an Exage or Alvio equipped generic, well, not much choice.

    The thing is that you can get a really good older mountain bike for a reasonable amount of money. Spend a bare minimum of time cleaning and tweaking the thing and then you have something to post. Better yet with some commentary. So, it isn't about posting unobtanium only - I mean seriously you can get a really nice bike for $300-400. They can be found even cheaper, but I'm talking with the bare minimum of effort. That said, a bike that is ridable for $20. Great, but who cares.

  15. #15
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    Just for kicks...went back to page 139...July of 2004...

    here are a few topics from the good 'ol days...

    shill bidding on eBay
    What's my GT Pantera worth?
    Bonty forks
    What's my Retrotec worth?
    Bontrager forks
    Info on MB-1
    eBay spam
    Bontrager brake bosses
    value of old bikes
    grove x for sale
    what tires are these?

    Ummm...nothing's changed...

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by sho220
    Just for kicks...went back to page 139...July of 2004...

    here are a few topics from the good 'ol days...

    shill bidding on eBay
    What's my GT Pantera worth?
    Bonty forks
    What's my Retrotec worth?
    Bontrager forks
    Info on MB-1
    eBay spam
    Bontrager brake bosses
    value of old bikes
    grove x for sale
    what tires are these?

    Ummm...nothing's changed...
    Why don't you list off all of the topics? Looks way better then than now.

  17. #17
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    Just trying to show that it wasn't all roses...still doesn't seem like much has changed.

    By the way...only 33 posts since July 05??? Somebody hasn't been contributing their fair share of high dollar, uber rare mountain bike p0rn...

    Post up that Cunningham!

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by sho220
    Just trying to show that it wasn't all roses...still doesn't seem like much has changed.
    The point is signal to noise. The ratio has gotten much worse. Looking at p. 139, for example makes it very clear.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by bushpig
    The point is signal to noise. The ratio has gotten much worse. Looking at p. 139, for example makes it very clear.
    That's cool...if you're going to limit this forum to high-zoot $hit...have fun moderating a dead forum. You're gonna be busy.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by sho220
    That's cool...if you're going to limit this forum to high-zoot $hit...have fun moderating a dead forum. You're gonna be busy.

    I'd rather have a slower forum with awesome topics and bikes than a Lord of the Flies Magna-Fest.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by singletracktourist
    I'd rather have a slower forum with awesome topics and bikes than a Lord of the Flies Magna-Fest.
    You could always just ignore those topics that aren't quite up to your standards...

  22. #22
    velocipede technician
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    my post for today

    Quote Originally Posted by sho220
    You could always just ignore those topics that aren't quite up to your standards...
    take your own advice


    I'm out.
    looking for 20-21" P team

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by hollister
    take your own advice


    I'm out.
    I do. All the time. If I see something I don't care about I don't click on it. No big deal...

  24. #24
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    i believe this forum is excellent. better than ever. i don't know what are you guys whinning so much about.

    the only problem i see here is me not owning the teal phoenix. that svcks.

  25. #25
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    is it about the joy of collecting old bikes? or is it about buiding a "valuable" collection? you guys know i could not care less about the latter and had my share of grievance and sadness over this opinion..
    as much as you dislike taiwanese low end, stan's stash of alivio bikes i dislike the feel good i just got richer look at the $1000 cook bros just like mine auction on ebay posts. i know i am not popular for saying it... fine. i eat it. f everybody.
    stan has fun around mid to low level bikes. you don't. fine and it's cool to read a joke on his collection every now and then. fine. it's boring when he starts protesting about it and it's even more boring when you read anything anywhere about the good old days of anything.
    making the forum a place full of heated fights? cool. why not? better than a take it too seriously queen's lounge.

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by colker1
    f everybody.
    That rocks...

  27. #27
    All Lefty's, all the time Moderator
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    I dunno, I'm not new really, but not a lifer either. It does seem that things have gotten a bit snippish as of late. Folks kinda getting down on Stan (dude, keep 'em coming, your fine in my book, makes me feel good to know some one has it worse than I do in terms of sheer volume!) other's seem bent on making it only really rare, cool stuff, to the exclusion of others. Hey, you have to start somewhere, I also seem to recall a few threads about stuff other than bikes, guess that should go too? I think Rumpfy and I had some kind words back and forth on old Fords, suppose we should have gone to a car forum, no? I've seen folks give really kind helpful advice on all sorts of CRAP bikes, while others get torn apart for not having a Rocky Mountain that is considered "old enough" to be accepted here, sorry guys, that's lame. If you pull your first bike out of the back of the garage, the one that first lit the flame for you, it's dusty, 10 to 15 years old, has a Judy on it, and you happen to be an MTBR person, where are you going to go first for info? The brand forums most likely. When it's obvious that most folks there worship at the temple of NEW, you'll most likely learn of this forum, where you've a 50/50 chance of getting help, or getting scorched. I spend a lot of time in the Cannondale forum, helping as many folks as I can, with old and new stuff. Can't tell you how many times I've answered the same questions, though my post count should give some indication When I get frustrated, guess what, I just don't log in that time, or day. Sure, every now and then I let a bit of attitude slip, and if I hurt someone's feelings, I apologize, as I should. No one signs on to get abused about their bike stuff. So, I say, take the kind road, help those who wander in, post all the cool old crap you like, and maybe help the Huffy owner understand what the main reason VRC is here for. Kinda like the roadie thing, many of us have multiple personalities, (some refuse to admit it though!) If you don't have anything nice to say, just don't. If no-one does, the thread dies, and they go away. The internet is a big thing, remember, the guy who's posting about his beloved POS Ross, might be the fella interviewing you for your new job..... Peace.
    This is a Pugs not some carbon wannabee pretzel wagon!!

    - FrostyStruthers



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  28. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by MendonCycleSmith
    Hey, you have to start somewhere
    Yes, exactly.
    Quote Originally Posted by banks
    That is one big f'n dude!
    Yes I am!

  29. #29
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    The forum is titled Vintage, Retro, Classic...

    No where does it specify that mass-produced bikes are excluded. Posting about a mass-produced bike vs. a boutique bike only seems to violate some peoples' ideas of what the forum should be about. Bottom line, life is too short to bicker over nonsense. Besides, posts about less-interesting bikes are often ignored or get few replies, so they disappear quickly from the front page. If something doesn't interest you, try ignoring it instead of berating the member who started the thread. Now, how much is this Pacific I just found in the dumpster worth.....


    Craig

  30. #30
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    I'll +1, ditto, or echo a lot of what Mendon had to say. Like many of you hear I was in bike retail for a number of years. Sold and bought my first mountain bike in retail in 1983 when they finally made their way to the upper Midwest. Naturally like many here I have a special spot in my heart for those old bikes I once assembled and sold but also love and respect the true Marin County, Cunningham, Ritchey and other roots that deserve to be revered. While I'm a big GT fan..(who wouldn't be if they'd worked for one of their distributors for years) I have a darn hard time wondering over to the GT manufacturers thread when all the talk isn't about mountain biking. After all isn't mountain biking about taking a rigid steel frame fat tire bike down some good single track or fire lane? Freeriding,
    AM, downhilling....lets face it they are what synchronized swimming is to the Olympic 100M freestyle. It's darn hard to spend time in that forum when 90% of the new posts are about the NEW which is what the industries become. Change is good for the production companies it gets new people excited about riding bikes. My guess is that the average age of the poster and reader on this thread is probably the highest on this web site and for good reason. What youngster in their right mind would find old ancient mountain bikes interesting (besides the Rumpfmeister) when they can ride pogo bikes like the guys on youtube and in the Dew commercials. Don't get me wrong...I still visit other threads and answer and help with questions when I know I can help. Others on this thread can confirm I've come to them for answers because I learned by being a part of this thread that they were the "GO TO" for certain questions.... like where can I get Ritchey decals. I've also gone to others with info on bike finds that I know would interest them. To the thread brethren I am thankful. I truly believe that the bike industry of today is missing out by not offering more product that is similar to that from THE era of what mountain biking once was. Many of us from the early days are now grown, have raised our families and now have more time/income to spend on toys like bikes. The first year I visited VRC I read almost every thread started and must admit that as time has gone by I've become more selective but still visit daily, some days for hours. To all that have mentioned bike porn...what can I say we all love it. I don't care if it's the $319 special that Rumpfy started on or a Ham. Stan and others have posted bikes that I know I've assembled over 100 in my younger days and those pics bring back some good memories from the shop days. We must also face what VRC bikes have become also.....back in 2004 who would have ever thought that some of these vintage mountain bikes could become serious investments or collectors items? I do sense a frustration from those who were around at the start....that there herds would be much bigger and more unique had VRC and Retrobike not become what they have. To them I say thanks for getting it all going. To me it's about bikes. I don't care who you are once you have a dozen in your basement you ride more or you catch it at home. A love for riding is what it's all about! Everyone in my house rides more because of my interest in biking and for that I'm grateful.
    Needed: 26.8mm XTR seatpost, blue GT/Grundig Jersey.

  31. #31
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    Well I guess it's hardly surprising that in a forum where old farts spend their time reminiscing about the good ol' days of mountain biking, eventually these old farts would start reminiscing about the good ol' days of the forum itself.
    It's only natural.
    Warning: may contain sarcasm and/or crap made up in an attempt to feel important.

  32. #32
    All Lefty's, all the time Moderator
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    Quote Originally Posted by trailville
    ........It's only natural.
    Nice.
    This is a Pugs not some carbon wannabee pretzel wagon!!

    - FrostyStruthers



    www.mendoncyclesmith.com

  33. #33
    discombobulated SuperModerator
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    Cool thread idea...
    Maybe this weekend I will post up a little VRC CDT passion project. It wont be 'period correct' nor will it contain some wierd NOS X950 short cage whoozit.
    It will be my first mtb, brought back with an amalgam of newer parts.
    I cant wait to to ride it once more!
    CDT

  34. #34
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    The concept seemed to have escaped most folks. I mean WTF, a post requesting everyone to chill out and all everyone seems to do is continue to bicker. Personally, I don't mind outings, what it's worth, for sale/trade/wanted, or posts of "blue collar" bikes. Bikes with good stories, or stories about bikes are the best. I also don't even care about the plethora of bikes Stan posts. They add to the flavor and have made some others happy when Stan off-loads them.

    I started posting here because I had information and contacts to help people figure out what they had, how to, or just general info. I still will.

    What I do mind are poor photos (if you're proud enough of the bike you want to post it, take pride in posting good photos - a picture's worth a thousand words), negative comments for the sake of being negative (if you have constructive criticism - and if you don't, you aren't human , make it constructive and not a pointed beat-down comment), making people feel stupid about a question they ask or a comment they made (bzzzzztttt, time out). But I realize that this is the anonymous internet and we just move on.

    Happy Hump Day.
    Last edited by ssmike; 04-02-2008 at 08:39 AM.

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