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  1. #1
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    GoPro video editing software

    what's everyone using to edit their GoPro (or similar cam) footage?

    also, is there a way to go from GoPro to HDMI into a TV? does using the supplied cords still transmit an HD signal to the TV?

    thanks

    mx

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    Quote Originally Posted by mx_599
    what's everyone using to edit their GoPro (or similar cam) footage?

    also, is there a way to go from GoPro to HDMI into a TV? does using the supplied cords still transmit an HD signal to the TV?

    thanks

    mx
    i use Cyberlink's software to edit my footage

    and no, there is no adapters to do this and if there was, im sure the signal would look horrible.

    the component cables that come with the GoProHD do transmit HD, but im 99% sure it only outputs 1080i, not 1080p. if it even did output 1080p, the majority of tv's do not accept 1080p via component.

  3. #3
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    I'm using Adobe Premiere to edit my GoPro footage. It has a pretty steep learning curve if you don't have any video editing background knowledge (I don't), but there isn't much you can't do once you figure things out. It's definitely overkill if you just want to put some clips together with a few transitions and a title.

  4. #4
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    Not sure of your computer setup, but i use all Mac stuff.
    Use the free MPEG Streamclip application to "up res" your footage to Apple Pro Res at the same setting you shot (ie: 720p, etc). The footage is 10x the original file size, but now programs like Final Cut Pro and others know how to interpret the footage whereas in its original codec from the GoPro HD camera (Ambarella AVC encoder, 1280 × 720, Millions) it will tweak if you try to edit with it. Maybe depends on the GOP structure if it is based from MPEG2 somehow. Not sure. But you need to upres it to a higher quality codec. Then edit it.
    I just happen to use Final Cut Pro but there are probably lots of others, i just happen to love FCP so i have stuck with it for a looong time.

  5. #5
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    I second the Cyberlink PowerDirector Ultra

  6. #6
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    If you got Window Movie Maker Live, maybe in the bundle of software your PC came with, you have something that will work. You can also download it for free. There are of course better programs.

  7. #7
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    I have been using iMovie.

    However I just tried to use Sony Vegas Platinum HD, and for the life of me can't get it to produce the same quality as the original file.

    Whats the secret? I set my projects to 720p @59.94fps .. the same as the original footage. Its the rendering I'm having issues with. I'm getting crazing ghosting and degraded colors/clairty.

    I tried rendering to sony .mp4 with 16,000 bit rate ( camera records 15,000-16,000 in 720p 60fps)

    Any tips?

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by KTMDirtFace
    I have been using iMovie.

    However I just tried to use Sony Vegas Platinum HD, and for the life of me can't get it to produce the same quality as the original file.

    Whats the secret? I set my projects to 720p @59.94fps .. the same as the original footage. Its the rendering I'm having issues with. I'm getting crazing ghosting and degraded colors/clairty.

    I tried rendering to sony .mp4 with 16,000 bit rate ( camera records 15,000-16,000 in 720p 60fps)

    Any tips?
    iMovie sucks. Bail it completely. Use Final Cut Pro if you can get a copy. FCP Express might be ok too, just way more basic. But better than iMovie.

    Not exactly sure how Sony Vegas works, but all you need to do is match your original footage with an "up res" version.
    Download the FREE MPEG Streamclip for either Mac or Windows.
    Load in a .MP4 original file from your GoPro HD camera into MPEG Streamclip.
    If you shot it in 720p, 30fps, then select a codec like Apple Pro Res 422, 720p, 30fps.
    It will be 10x the size of the original file, but applications like FCP, etc can work with it and edit unlike the original .MP4 file. You don't have to worry about bitrates for this file or anything, the codec does it all already.
    Here is a sample screenshot.


    Are you "up res" ing the original file or working in Vegas with the original .MP4 file.
    You have to up res the file first, then edit with it. I am pretty sure that original codec has a GOP Structure which is based from MPEG2 and you can't straight edit MPEG2 without converting it first.
    Hope this helps.

  9. #9
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    I can straight up edit the original file no problem in Vegas Platinum HD 10.0. ( and iMovie ).

    Its the make movie.. or render as.. in vegas that that is hammering the quality. I don't know why, and I don't know what settings to export..its to bad there is no "use source settings" or something.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by KTMDirtFace
    I can straight up edit the original file no problem in Vegas Platinum HD 10.0. ( and iMovie ).

    Its the make movie.. or render as.. in vegas that that is hammering the quality. I don't know why, and I don't know what settings to export..its to bad there is no "use source settings" or something.

    Yeah, you will be still be able to edit the footage, but it is not a proper way to do it. The footage will sometimes stutter when jumping from edit to edit because of the GOP Structure and finding an "i frame". Try the MPEG Streamclip up res.

    But...
    I am not sure if your problem is because of what i mentioned above or just because you have some render setting wrong.
    The problem with trying to set a render setting is that Vegas most likely does NOT have a codec for (Ambarella AVC encoder, 1280 × 720, Millions). When you render it is using your sequence settings for the render.

    What i would recommend is to try and up res it with MPEG Streamclip which does not take that much time. It works pretty fast. Then just replace all your .MP4 original GoPro HD files in your timeline with the new file.

    I use Apple Pro Res 422 on Mac, Final Cut Pro. Then when i make a new sequence, i make sure to match the original .MP4 settings such at 720p, 29.97fps, upper field, etc in my New Sequence.
    This way when i drag the new up ressed file into my timeline, it does NOT need to be rendered. Then it will edit, play, render, and add effects perfect.

    Hope this helps.
    Reply back if not.
    It might just be a Vegas thing.
    I have used FCP since 1998 in it's Beta stages before Version 1.0. It smokes Sony crap. I would invest in FCP Studio or get a copy somehow.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by xnofriendsx
    Yeah, you will be still be able to edit the footage, but it is not a proper way to do it. The footage will sometimes stutter when jumping from edit to edit because of the GOP Structure and finding an "i frame". Try the MPEG Streamclip up res.

    But...
    I am not sure if your problem is because of what i mentioned above or just because you have some render setting wrong.
    The problem with trying to set a render setting is that Vegas most likely does NOT have a codec for (Ambarella AVC encoder, 1280 × 720, Millions). When you render it is using your sequence settings for the render.

    What i would recommend is to try and up res it with MPEG Streamclip which does not take that much time. It works pretty fast. Then just replace all your .MP4 original GoPro HD files in your timeline with the new file.

    I use Apple Pro Res 422 on Mac, Final Cut Pro. Then when i make a new sequence, i make sure to match the original .MP4 settings such at 720p, 29.97fps, upper field, etc in my New Sequence.
    This way when i drag the new up ressed file into my timeline, it does NOT need to be rendered. Then it will edit, play, render, and add effects perfect.

    Hope this helps.
    Reply back if not.
    It might just be a Vegas thing.
    I have used FCP since 1998 in it's Beta stages before Version 1.0. It smokes Sony crap. I would invest in FCP Studio or get a copy somehow.
    Thanks I will try the MPEG stream-clip up-res. I don't think that will solve my issue though. I can already drag the original go-pro file int.. cut/clip it instantly add effects and watch it in the preview without any wait time for conversion. The problem lies in when I need to render it out to a completed video file. I don't know what settings to use, everything I tried so far has made the quality worse than the original. EDIT: I cant figure out/find apple pro res in stream clip. for windows.

    What format/settings to you use when you export/render to the final product?

    Here is an example... I took a file called jumps.mp4 right off my go pro.
    Put it in stream clip to get the info from it..
    Stream: Jumps.mp4
    Path: C:\Jack\VIDEO\Jumps.mp4

    Duration: 0:00:32
    Data Size: 58.85 MB
    Bit Rate: 15.31 Mbps

    Video Tracks:
    GoPro AVC encoder, 1280 x 720, 59.939999999999998 fps, 15.19 Mbps

    Audio Tracks:
    MPEG 4 Low Complexity AAC stereo, 48 kHz, 128 kbps

    Stream Files:
    Jumps.mp4 (58.85 MB)

    Then I put it directly into vegas pro and exported as a sony .mp4 with these settings.


    Then loaded the new file into steamclip to get the info
    Stream: JumpVegasTest.mp4
    Path: C:\Users\Jack\Documents\Vegas Movie Studio HD Platinum 10.0 Projects\JumpVegasTest.mp4

    Duration: 0:00:32
    Data Size: 56.47 MB
    Bit Rate: 14.69 Mbps

    Video Tracks:
    AVC Coding, 1280 x 720, 59.939999999999998 fps, 14.57 Mbps

    Audio Tracks:
    MPEG 4 Low Complexity AAC stereo, 48 kHz, 128 kbps

    Stream Files:
    JumpVegasTest.mp4 (56.47 MB)


    Its slightly less of a bitrate and filesize? it doesn't look as clear to me when i watch them side byside..maybe i'm dreaming?
    Last edited by KTMDirtFace; 09-13-2010 at 07:15 PM.

  12. #12
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    If you add your footage to your timeline and edit it up, plays fine, etc...
    Then in most editing programs, you just select your sequence, and File>Export and choose how you want to export it from there.
    The export quality/setting will either depend on 1. Your Sequence setting and it will use that to export. or 2. When you export, it brings up a window for your choice of Codec, Bitrate, Etc.

    Using #2 is how you should know your exact settings you want to use. Whether it be for web, DVD, HD, Streaming, etc.
    The quality/bitrate can vary anywhere from 1000kbps (1mbps) to 100000kpbs (100mbps) at any resolution from 320 x 240 to 1920 x 1080 or higher.
    This is what an "export" is.

    Render is when you have your timeline and add let's say black and white. Then you render it out to play it.

    But if you are trying to export it, keep the quality to something pretty high like this...
    This is from Quicktime Info from a Apple Pro Res 422 Export out of MPEG Streamclip.
    This is not Full HD, but 720p at a pretty high bitrate at 110mbps, how i edit footage.
    1 min, 15 sec is a 1000mb (1Gb) file.


  13. #13
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    EDIT: nevermind -I see you are using a 16,000,000 Bit rate and other settings similar to mine. I don't understand how your footage could be worse !?

    I use neoscene which is very similar to streamclip in that it creates a high quality file 10 times the size of the raw .mp4 that higher end editing software just seems to work better with.

    I too, a few projects ago had a worse output several times. Then I carefully checked the render settings--somehow the bit rate was set very low.

    My render as settings in Vegas 9 Pro are:

    Internet 16:9 HD 30p template
    which provides......Sony AVC format
    1280X720
    29.97 frame rate
    Field order fixed
    1.0 pixel aspect
    Bit rate: 6,085,000

    An 11 minute or so project usually yields 490-500 MB file size which is entirely too long a project anyway.....

    Vimeo Plus is a nice sight IMO.



    Quote Originally Posted by KTMDirtFace
    ......
    What format/settings to you use when you export/render to the final product?
    Last edited by ArmySlowRdr; 09-13-2010 at 07:22 PM.

  14. #14
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    Yea vimeo plus is awesome I use it.

    Strange maybe i'm just dreaming. also If I make the bitrate any higher than 16,000,000 it crashes out and wont export.

    The main thing i'm seeing is major ghosting with my go-pro chest mount. Is that just normal? I don't think I notice it as much in the original file.

    Edit Here is an example: I edited this in Vegas, 720p@60fps project setting. Stretched out the jump portion to be 50% longer ( slow mo ). Whats with the ghosting of the handle bars big time...(watch the handle bars)



    If I play the original unedited file in slow motion with VLC at half speed I don't seem to notice this as bad.

  15. #15
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    i am confused about the "up res" that you guys are talking about. is this supposed to be a necessary step before working with the video? is it necessary for the GoPro? does it degrade the HD quality at all?

    thanks

  16. #16
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    I read in Douglas Spotted Eagle's "Vegas Pro 9 Editing Workshop" that the velocity envelope filter has a dialog box in which resampling can be selected. According to this author slowing down or speeding up causes artifacts and thus suggests the use of resampling.

    You can give it a shot....


    Quote Originally Posted by KTMDirtFace
    .......

    The main thing i'm seeing is major ghosting with my go-pro chest mount. Is that just normal? I don't think I notice it as much in the original file.

    Edit Here is an example: I edited this in Vegas, 720p@60fps project setting. Stretched out the jump portion to be 50% longer ( slow mo ). Whats with the ghosting of the handle bars big time...(watch the handle bars)

    .....

  17. #17
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    Alright I'm pretty sure I must be officially out of it...I think the settings I exported at are working just fine, must be in my mind!

    The ghosting must be some other issue..probably the camera shaking on my chest.

    EDIT: Hrmm Thanks ArmySlowRdr i'll look.

    EDIT 2: I think I figured out how to work this program now...screwing around a bit with it.

    Last edited by KTMDirtFace; 09-13-2010 at 10:10 PM.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by mx_599
    i am confused about the "up res" that you guys are talking about. is this supposed to be a necessary step before working with the video? is it necessary for the GoPro? does it degrade the HD quality at all?

    thanks

    It is not totally necessary and there are ways to just make a basic edit with the original GoPro HD .MP4 file. But... if you want to do the somewhat professional way of editing, you will need to "up res" the file.
    What you have with the original .MP4 GoPro HD file is anything but true HD. It uses a very compressed video codec called Ambarella AVC encoder, 1280 × 720, Millions. This codec makes it so you can have a 1 minute long 720p clip and the file size is around 100mb estimate. The bitrate is 8.77mbps (8700kbps) Whereas a TRUE HD 1 minute long file is in the Gigabytes and in the 100's of Mbps.
    So we Up Res it to covert it to a better codec to work with while editing in programs like Final Cut Pro.
    I Up Res it to the Apple Pro Res 422 codec at 111mbps (111000kbps), 1280 x 720
    Although this is making the quality/bitrate waaaay higher and the overall size way higher, it doesn't mean it will make the quality any better, it just preserves it.
    The footage will never get any better than the original codec and bitrate it was originally shot on.
    I even contacted GoPro to see if they could bring their bitrate from 8mbps to like 25mbps with a firmware update or something they had as a beta or something. I don't care about getting 4 hours of footage on a 16gb card. I care about quality. Once they get up in that range, the quality will be pretty sick.

    But i Up Res footage so my editing program works with it better. The original GoPro HD file codec, i think, is based on MPEG2 which has a GOP Structure (Group Of Pictures) which places an Information Frame "i Frame" roughly every 12-15 frames. This makes it hard to edit with as the original file in a timeline because it wants to jump when edited which i have seen it do from clip to clip in Final Cut Pro. It might not be based on MPEG2 but something weird is going on with the original file if you try and edit with it in a professional program. Hence... the Up Res.

    Sorry for the long reply.

  19. #19
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    thanks for your time with that explanation, that helps explain it much more.

    i will look into this when i got to edit

  20. #20
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    ah very nice looking there--I do think you have it.

    Quote Originally Posted by KTMDirtFace
    ....
    EDIT 2: I think I figured out how to work this program now...screwing around a bit with it.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by xnofriendsx
    It is not totally necessary and there are ways to just make a basic edit with the original GoPro HD .MP4 file. But... if you want to do the somewhat professional way of editing, you will need to "up res" the file.
    That is simply not true.

    PP CS5 handles raw goproHD files without any need to up res them.

    I think that the "professional" way of editing would be to use the most streamlined workflow possible rather than have to go through extra steps just to edit the raw footage.

    Quote Originally Posted by xnofriendsx
    It might not be based on MPEG2 but something weird is going on with the original file if you try and edit with it in a professional program. Hence... the Up Res.
    See above.

    There's nothing weird going on while editing raw goproHD files, even doing more than a "basic edit," in PP CS5.

    It must be an Apple thing...

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by sputnik
    That is simply not true.

    PP CS5 handles raw goproHD files without any need to up res them.

    I think that the "professional" way of editing would be to use the most streamlined workflow possible rather than have to go through extra steps just to edit the raw footage.



    See above.

    There's nothing weird going on while editing raw goproHD files, even doing more than a "basic edit," in PP CS5.

    It must be an Apple thing...
    While it may work, it is very processor intensive to work with the Ambarella Codec which is based from H.264 (MPEG4 Layer 10).
    Using MPEG Streamclip is definitely a more professional way of working with these files and it exports out pretty fast.
    Do a basic search on H.264 and playback issues while editing. It is not a Mac thing, it is just how that codec works because it has a GOP Structure if you know anything about that.
    That is great that PP CS5 works fine and if someone is using that, then continue to do what works for you. But it is still not the best way to work with the Ambarella Codec. Even ask GoPro, which i have asked their in house editor. He told me the best way to work with the codec is to up res the footage with various programs like MPEG Streamclip.
    I would be curious to see how well an average computer handles that codec with a ton of filters added to the footage and it's playback on that average computer processor.
    But go with what works well for you. Whatever that may be...

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by KTMDirtFace
    Alright I'm pretty sure I must be officially out of it...I think the settings I exported at are working just fine, must be in my mind!

    The ghosting must be some other issue..probably the camera shaking on my chest.

    EDIT: Hrmm Thanks ArmySlowRdr i'll look.

    EDIT 2: I think I figured out how to work this program now...screwing around a bit with it.

    nicely done.

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by xnofriendsx
    Using MPEG Streamclip is definitely a more professional way of working with these files and it exports out pretty fast..
    How are you defining "more professional"?

    I'm having trouble understanding how adding additional, and unnecessary, steps to your workflow is "more professional."

    Quote Originally Posted by xnofriendsx
    But it is still not the best way to work with the Ambarella Codec..
    Why not? Playback is not an issue and you skip the extra steps that you are suggesting.

    How is adding more steps to your workflow the "best way to work with gopro footage?

    Quote Originally Posted by xnofriendsx
    I would be curious to see how well an average computer handles that codec with a ton of filters added to the footage and it's playback on that average computer processor.
    I think you may have workflow/efficiency issues.

    The way that many people edit their clips is to make their cuts/trims, lay the resulting clips out on the timeline, then determine their preferred transitions, and preview the entire timeline to make sure that the timing is what they envisioned.

    THEN it's time for color correction, filters, etc. No matter what the source footage (miniDV, HDV, ACHD, h.264, etc.), playback can be compromised if you are scrubbing/previewing the timeline with lots of filters prior to rendering the timeline. You can still see if your color correction is correct but playback can be herky jerky.

    How are you defining an "average computer"? My 4-5 year old box is only running a Core2 2.93 GHz with 4GB of RAM and I have no trouble editing gopro footage, despite not doing it the "more professional" way that you claim is necessary.

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by sputnik
    How are you defining "more professional"?

    I'm having trouble understanding how adding additional, and unnecessary, steps to your workflow is "more professional."



    Why not? Playback is not an issue and you skip the extra steps that you are suggesting.

    How is adding more steps to your workflow the "best way to work with gopro footage?



    I think you may have workflow/efficiency issues.

    The way that many people edit their clips is to make their cuts/trims, lay the resulting clips out on the timeline, then determine their preferred transitions, and preview the entire timeline to make sure that the timing is what they envisioned.

    THEN it's time for color correction, filters, etc. No matter what the source footage (miniDV, HDV, ACHD, h.264, etc.), playback can be compromised if you are scrubbing/previewing the timeline with lots of filters prior to rendering the timeline. You can still see if your color correction is correct but playback can be herky jerky.

    How are you defining an "average computer"? My 4-5 year old box is only running a Core2 2.93 GHz with 4GB of RAM and I have no trouble editing gopro footage, despite not doing it the "more professional" way that you claim is necessary.
    Well, if you were ever a professional editor, then plenty of my fundamental explanations above would suffice. But obviously you don't get it. Sorry.
    Go with what works for you, i will do the same.

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