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  1. #101
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    a real shame but,

    everything was telling us it was gonna happen. i guessed awhile back on another thread that the Quervo wasn't gonna make the cut & probably not the La Bruja. maybe not even the Terremoto. i hope you meant that it will. look @ the Cuervo, they still can't sell them all after what, a year after droppin' to a grand, $2000 plus less than a Turner downhill frame! yikes! and also from Turner, he gave up on the Highline & still hasn't come out w/ the DW RFX. WOW. things have changed.

    i hope Gibson is making changes that people are gonna like & sales keep him in business. seeing a guy like him having to fold would be just flat fuggin' terrible
    breezy shade

  2. #102
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ciclistagonzo
    PFFFFT!!! LOL! Great, time to clean Diet Pepsi off my Monitors!

    I hope the new V's are at least as strong and beastieful as my dream girl ! TIG.
    Last edited by TIGMAN; 05-26-2011 at 09:07 PM.

  3. #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1962
    i couldn't take it anymore so i had to find out for myself. i was hoping they would revamp the la bruja but i kinda knew from what i was told before. the sales aren't there for the freeride and downhill frames. but for you XC and AM guys you lucky b*sturds the new changes look great, Can't wait till the end of march to see the improvements they look to be great. i wasn't sure about the pressfit BB and never heard about them but now after the talk i think it will be a great idea and lighter. no more threads to strip out. the bad thing the changes will not be interchangeable with the old stuff so no upgrading your last years and older frames. the great thing is tradein or sell your old ventanas to get the sweet new stuff. so i guess i'll have to stay with my la bruja and can't get one with the new changes. you other guys are lucky.
    do you have any more details? im assuming you gave ventana a call and got the scoop or what? thx.

  4. #104
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    I'd love to have something similar to Canfields Yelli Screamy. Spent the day riding one with Chris Canfield a couple months back, the bike rocks.

    I know I can get something like this custom from Ventana, I asked, just couldn't afford it.
    I only ride bikes to fill the time when I'm not skiing.

  5. #105
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    terremoto. yes

    Quote Originally Posted by nhodge
    everything was telling us it was gonna happen. i guessed awhile back on another thread that the Quervo wasn't gonna make the cut & probably not the La Bruja. maybe not even the Terremoto. i hope you meant that it will. look @ the Cuervo, they still can't sell them all after what, a year after droppin' to a grand, $2000 plus less than a Turner downhill frame! yikes! and also from Turner, he gave up on the Highline & still hasn't come out w/ the DW RFX. WOW. things have changed.

    i hope Gibson is making changes that people are gonna like & sales keep him in business. seeing a guy like him having to fold would be just flat fuggin' terrible
    ...i was told yes on the terremoto. but i sure was hoping for the La bruja too because when it comes to ventana i always want the latest and greatest...
    i need to ride more. building jumps takes to much time...my other hobby is kicking the crap outta my home built mook jong.

  6. #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by gnomer
    do you have any more details? im assuming you gave ventana a call and got the scoop or what? thx.
    ...after i was told about the La bruja i was bumed and didn't feel like going in to deep about the changes but i know you guys are gonna love them...
    i need to ride more. building jumps takes to much time...my other hobby is kicking the crap outta my home built mook jong.

  7. #107
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    Quote Originally Posted by TIGMAN
    I hope the new V's are at least as strong and beastieful as my dream girl ! TIG.
    ...hey man thats my girl how did you get her pic...
    i need to ride more. building jumps takes to much time...my other hobby is kicking the crap outta my home built mook jong.

  8. #108
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    Quote Originally Posted by OldHouseMan
    I'd love to have something similar to Canfields Yelli Screamy. Spent the day riding one with Chris Canfield a couple months back, the bike rocks.

    I know I can get something like this custom from Ventana, I asked, just couldn't afford it.
    Good to know that Sherwood is willing to build something like that. I may need to talk to him about what sorta fiscal pain it would involve.

  9. #109
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    Quote Originally Posted by OldHouseMan
    I'd love to have something similar to Canfields Yelli Screamy. Spent the day riding one with Chris Canfield a couple months back, the bike rocks.

    I know I can get something like this custom from Ventana, I asked, just couldn't afford it.
    ...i ran into chris on MLK jr. day. he was in my town, It was kinda funny i was riding my bike with a new shovel in hand going up to build when i saw this guy talking to this old guy on a bike as i rode by i noticed the young guy on the one bike looked up and it was chris. i didn't get to really ride the proto ONE because he didn't have much time but it sure looked like a nice bike and everyone that has a canfield seems to love them. i may have to jump ship over to canfield...
    i need to ride more. building jumps takes to much time...my other hobby is kicking the crap outta my home built mook jong.

  10. #110
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    Quote Originally Posted by 2TurnersNotEnough
    Good to know that Sherwood is willing to build something like that. I may need to talk to him about what sorta fiscal pain it would involve.
    ...another thing i forgot to say and one of the reasons why i called was to find out if they would build a La bruja with the new changes and i got a no because of cost and tooling to build one frame...
    i need to ride more. building jumps takes to much time...my other hobby is kicking the crap outta my home built mook jong.

  11. #111
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1962
    ...i was told yes on the terremoto. but i sure was hoping for the La bruja too because when it comes to ventana i always want the latest and greatest...

    thanks for the info on the Terremoto, i feel better already

    sorry 'bout the La Bruja
    breezy shade

  12. #112
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1962
    ...another thing i forgot to say and one of the reasons why i called was to find out if they would build a La bruja with the new changes and i got a no because of cost and tooling to build one frame...
    I think it's funny that you equate, most travel to "latest and greatest". Bruja V2 was a fine machine, but I always felt that T-Moto was a superior weapon.Besides at 160mm of travel, are you really missing much by not having that extra 10mm? And it's not that much more to get a semi-custom to get the slacker head tube of the Bruja, and heck with the new 180 forks out there, you probably could go stock frame and get Bruja V2 angles. Considering the impending changes, (Slacker angles, lower BB) I bet the new T-Moto will blur the lines between OLD T-moto and Bruja V2 anyways.
    -Aaron G.

    "Before D.W., "anti-squat" was referred to as pedal feedback."

  13. #113
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ciclistagonzo
    I think it's funny that you equate, most travel to "latest and greatest". Bruja V2 was a fine machine, but I always felt that T-Moto was a superior weapon.Besides at 160mm of travel, are you really missing much by not having that extra 10mm? And it's not that much more to get a semi-custom to get the slacker head tube of the Bruja, and heck with the new 180 forks out there, you probably could go stock frame and get Bruja V2 angles. Considering the impending changes, (Slacker angles, lower BB) I bet the new T-Moto will blur the lines between OLD T-moto and Bruja V2 anyways.
    ...thats not what i said, I don't equate latest and greatest to more travel. travel has nothing to do with it, i should have said or added to what i said was latest and greatest design. i like how sherwood always improves on his design for instance i cracked two different frames one from jumping it at where i live and the other at northstar. one cracked at the seat tube top tube junction. i noticed when i was at the shop picking up this frame there was one hanging up and had a big crack at ST/TT junction. he said the guy cracked it jumping. so i picked the frame up brought it home and built it up and guess what happened, Cracked it jumping two years later so he then added the gusset. i like how he improves on his frames. as for the 160 MM terremoto i had and loved it but i needed more for northstar cause i was riding harder and faster, So i got the 180 MM La bruja for like dogbone trail at northstar and i noticed the extra 20 MM of travel. more buttery...
    i need to ride more. building jumps takes to much time...my other hobby is kicking the crap outta my home built mook jong.

  14. #114
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1962
    ...i ran into chris on MLK jr. day. he was in my town, It was kinda funny i was riding my bike with a new shovel in hand going up to build when i saw this guy talking to this old guy on a bike as i rode by i noticed the young guy on the one bike looked up and it was chris. i didn't get to really ride the proto ONE because he didn't have much time but it sure looked like a nice bike and everyone that has a canfield seems to love them. i may have to jump ship over to canfield...
    seems like a ton of money for a bike made overseas....

    i can handle paying for the quality control that Ventana has.

    I could buy a bike made in china, but i would certainly expect it to be significantly cheaper, ie. banshee, etc...

  15. #115
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1962
    ... So i got the 180 MM La bruja for like dogbone trail at northstar and i noticed the extra 20 MM of travel. more buttery...
    I agree with 90% of what you said, evolving/improving frames etc...

    But for the record. La Bruja is not 180, it's actually 175mm, and T-Moto is 162mm. The Falling rate at the end stroke is what keeps you from getting the Full 178mm that the AVG. 2.8:1 rockers mathematically show you get. (2.8 X 2.5 = 7 x 25.4 177.8mm)

    T-moto is Less falling rate with the new rockers so it gets the full 6.35" = 162mm.
    Hence the whopping 13mm difference.

    HOWEVER, the 2.5" stroke on Bruja makes it more supple, ie the Buttery effect you feel.

    I had to figure all this out, because I wanted to run the V2 Bruja rockers on my V1, needed to see if mathematically if it would work or make a difference, before investing. It did, and I now run'em and they work great, lower BB, more supple and I netted 12mm of travel. (Went from 148mm to 160mm at the middle chainstay setting, technically I can get 163 if I use the longest Cstay setting)

    Curious, why not run a Cuervo since you're a Northstar fan?
    -Aaron G.

    "Before D.W., "anti-squat" was referred to as pedal feedback."

  16. #116
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ciclistagonzo
    T-moto is Less falling rate with the new rockers so it gets the full 6.35" = 162mm.
    Hence the whopping 13mm difference.
    So were the V2 rockers more progressive than the 150mm rockers? I had a bit of a hard time controlling bottoming while using a shock that didn't have a BO control. That last inch of travel was blown thru easier than the previous.

    I'd like to see just the opposite - progressiveness built into the rockers/linkage.

  17. #117
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    Quote Originally Posted by CharacterZero
    So were the V2 rockers more progressive than the 150mm rockers? I had a bit of a hard time controlling bottoming while using a shock that didn't have a BO control. That last inch of travel was blown thru easier than the previous.

    I'd like to see just the opposite - progressiveness built into the rockers/linkage.
    I think so, I think the 150 may have been close to linear, 1/2 progressive 1/2 Falling, its the Falling rate that Mechanically prevents the B.O. I think V2, (it's been 2-3 yrs since I had the conversation) are 2/3 pro, 1/3 Falling and they are not linear. ie the amount of pro is equal to the falling. May explain what you felt. Since I never ran the 160 V2 I don't know for sure, but mathematically it makes sense.

    Shock setup and falling rate can go TOO far though. When I ran the Air Swinger shock on Bruja with V1 Rockers, I Had to basically case a jump or hit something crazy hard to get the last 2/3" of stroke. Switch back to the now Pushed Vanilla RC with B.O. Bumper and V2 BRUJA rockers and while the shock shows I'm using full travel, I don't feel harsh B.O.
    Last edited by Ciclistagonzo; 02-11-2011 at 12:29 PM.
    -Aaron G.

    "Before D.W., "anti-squat" was referred to as pedal feedback."

  18. #118
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ciclistagonzo
    I think so, I think the 150 may have been close to linear, 1/2 progressive 1/2 Falling, its the Falling rate that Mechanically prevents the B.O. I think V2, (it's been 2-3 yrs since I had the conversation) are 2/3 pro, 1/3 Falling and they are not linear. ie the amount of pro is equal to the falling. May explain what you felt. Since I never ran the 160 V2 I don't know for sure, but mathematically it makes sense.

    Shock setup and falling rate can go TOO far though. When I ran the Air Swinger shock on Bruja with V1 Rockers, I Had to basically case a jump or hit something crazy hard to get the last 2/3" of stroke. Switch back to the now Pushed Vanilla RC with B.O. Bumper and V2 BRUJA rockers and while the shock shows I'm using full travel, I don't feet harsh B.O.
    A hot shower after riding should take care of your harsh BO issues.
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  19. #119
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    Called and ordered two new frames last night. New El Chiquillo for my daughter as she has already outgrown her last and the new 2011 El Rey 29er when available. Although my current El Rey only has a few rides on it I'm sold on what's proposed for the new frame. Anyone looking for a 2010 El Rey frame PM me and you'll get a screaming deal.

  20. #120
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    Spoke with Theresa today. The new changes to the El Rey sound interesting. Geo numbers should be out soon. Images in a month or so.
    Currently at Mayo Clinic being tested for a kidney transplant. Donors welcome.

  21. #121
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    Quote Originally Posted by trb2929
    Spoke with Theresa today. The new changes to the El Rey sound interesting. Geo numbers should be out soon. Images in a month or so.
    care to elaborate on what she shared with you?

  22. #122
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    Quote Originally Posted by gnomer
    care to elaborate on what she shared with you?
    Not a whole lot to share that has not already been mentioned. El Rey will get a HA change, shorter CS along with the other things on the list. She was not sure yet if a 5" rocker was going to be available since the EL Cap was no longer going to be an option. At least that is what I understood. She said the geo numbers should be out in some form soon. Images as soon as some of the new orders are fill. She said a lot of items need to be manufactured to make it all happen. Give them time as they seem pretty positive these changes were to better the line not just a cosmetic change. Price should be in the range as previous frames. There will be a trade option available. But might get more on the open market. Seemed like the 4 or 5 inch travel bikes were the priority. But that was just may take. I'm not speaking for Ventana.
    Currently at Mayo Clinic being tested for a kidney transplant. Donors welcome.

  23. #123
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff in Bend
    Doesn't a 150mm hub give you a symetrical wheel? If so shouldn't that be the standard width hub and not be just for downhill?
    142mm is the same actual hub width as 135mm, so chainline is not affected, and many hubs can be adapted.

  24. #124
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    Spy pictures !

    What's taking so long......this isn't like the new RFX thingy is it ?

    Nevermind me , I'm just anxious to see the new V's ! TIG.

  25. #125
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    Quote Originally Posted by TIGMAN
    What's taking so long......this isn't like the new RFX thingy is it ?

    Nevermind me , I'm just anxious to see the new V's ! TIG.
    I'm curious to how they ride, not only how they look, especially with the shorter chainstays on the mid-travel (140-160mm) 26" bikes.
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