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  1. #1
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    El Comondante Ultimate?

    I'm thinking of building one up as a quasi race/extra long ride/ backup to my new Ciclon. I'm signed up for a metric century trail ride in Oct...and I *could* do it on the Ciclon, but....

    Anyway, anyone have thoughts on the 12 frame still set up with 1&1/8" head tube vice the tapers head tube? I did see someone who had that added in addition to being set up for 120mm fork...but think for me, 120 is too much for what I'd want to do with the bike.

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    Stock is 1 1/8" but if you want the taper, you can, it's a small upcharge I believe. Judging by the way the whole market is going, it might be the best way to future proof your frame. 120mm is lot of travel up front for a hardtail, I split time between an 80mm Toro and and 105mm Chiquo and I think the the 105 is more than enough.
    -Aaron G.

    "Before D.W., "anti-squat" was referred to as pedal feedback."

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by sam-eye-am View Post
    I'm thinking of building one up as a quasi race/extra long ride/ backup to my new Ciclon. I'm signed up for a metric century trail ride in Oct...and I *could* do it on the Ciclon, but....

    Anyway, anyone have thoughts on the 12 frame still set up with 1&1/8" head tube vice the tapers head tube? I did see someone who had that added in addition to being set up for 120mm fork...but think for me, 120 is too much for what I'd want to do with the bike.
    My 650B HT is designed around a 120mm fork. It handles great. I would ditch the idea of a 29er and have Sherwood make you a 650B HT. That would be a future proof frame for sure......29ers are falling out of favor.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mtnbiker4life View Post
    My 650B HT is designed around a 120mm fork. It handles great. I would ditch the idea of a 29er and have Sherwood make you a 650B HT. That would be a future proof frame for sure......29ers are falling out of favor.
    Opinion, not fact. 650b is just the latest flavor that seems to be gaining speed.
    Here, the 26er is dead and 29er is the norm. 650b (for our area) fixes a problem that doesn't exist.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sevenpedaler View Post
    Opinion, not fact. 650b is just the latest flavor that seems to be gaining speed.
    Here, the 26er is dead and 29er is the norm. 650b (for our area) fixes a problem that doesn't exist.
    So is your statement.

    And you come from a very biased opinion. You're 6'7", of course the 29'er is better.
    But a 5'8" person might not agree, let along a 5' 1" etc etc.

    Besides, Mtb4life is trying to be humorous and sarcastic, I know that because I know him, but it doesn't come across on the boards.
    -Aaron G.

    "Before D.W., "anti-squat" was referred to as pedal feedback."

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    Quote Originally Posted by sevenpedaler View Post
    Opinion, not fact. 650b is just the latest flavor that seems to be gaining speed.
    Here, the 26er is dead and 29er is the norm. 650b (for our area) fixes a problem that doesn't exist.
    We're all opinionated to what works best for us. Even Chris Sugai a Steve Jobs wannbe had a lot to say about 29ers.......probably because that's what his company sells. Opinion yes, bias absolutely and truthful no one knows for sure.

    Chris Sugai, owner of Niner, is quoted in Feb 08's MBA saying:
    "Twenty-nine inch wheels will supplant 26-inch wheel bikes by 2017. In ten years, all mountain bikes sold from $1000 to $1500 and above will have 29-inch wheels. There will be holdouts, of course, and 26-inch wheel bikes will be sold at places like CostCo and K-Mart, but the 29er will take the place of the 26-inch bike as far as the average mountain biker goes."

    It could go something like this 650B wheels will supplant 26-inch and 29-inch by 2017. In three years, all mountain bikes sold from $1000 to $3500 and above will have 650B wheels. There will be holdouts, of course, and 26-inch and 29-inch wheel bikes will be sold at places like Costco, Walmart and Performance. But 650B wheels will take the place of 26-inch and 29-inch bikes as far as the average mountain biker goes.

    I tried 29er and absolutely hated it.....handle like my childhood red big wheel. But you obviously like them, good for you. Two years ago I had Sherwood build me a 650B HT and it worked for me.

    .

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    Quote Originally Posted by mtnbiker4life View Post
    We're all opinionated to what works best for us. Even Chris Sugai a Steve Jobs wannbe had a lot to say about 29ers.......probably because that's what his company sells. Opinion yes, bias absolutely and truthful no one knows for sure.
    .
    When the tire selection of 26" wheels exists for another wheel, I might consider it While the 29" tires are coming close, there's no way I'm going to find myself on one. Like mtnbiker4life, I don't care for them.

    Would I buy a 650B in the future? Probably, butI don't know right now. I rode around an older Bastardo and was pretty impressed. But right now, I'm enjoying my El Ciclon way too much for my trail riding to wait to replace it with anything else.

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    650b Geometry?

    Quote Originally Posted by mtnbiker4life View Post
    Two years ago I had Sherwood build me a 650B HT and it worked for me.

    .
    Did Sherwood base the geometry off of a standard bike?

    I'm not opposed to the idea of a 650b. Though, I have a redline SS 29er now. It is fun, but heavy...and quite frankly, it is a cheap bike that probably didn't have as much thought go into its design as say a Ventana.

    The main knock I've always heard about 29ers is that they aren't as responsive in terms of maneuvering. I can see this with my redline. I also can see the other knock of larger rotating moment of inertia...and a little more effort to accelerate.

    But, some of what I've read about Sherwood's 29ers says that they are designed well enough that you don't notice much of a decrease in maneuverability when compared to a 26er.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by sam-eye-am View Post
    Did Sherwood base the geometry off of a standard bike?

    I'm not opposed to the idea of a 650b. .
    Yes and no. Vince's frame (Mtb4life) is based off of my frame. My "Chiquo" was designed around the 26" wheeled Chiquillo. After adjusting the wheelbase for 650B clearance, (Adding 3/8") we kept the BB DROP the same as Chiquillo, and then adjusted the Head angle to 70 (from 71) for the specific fork I was going to use ( X-Fusion Velvet) set at 105mm.

    Sherwood took the learning experience from mine and then designed Vince's. I think the only significant difference is the BB height. Vince's is 1/4-1/2" lower than mine.

    I LOVE my Chiquo, it's the best all around handling bike I have, and if need be could be my one and only bike.
    -Aaron G.

    "Before D.W., "anti-squat" was referred to as pedal feedback."

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ciclistagonzo View Post
    Yes and no. Vince's frame (Mtb4life) is based off of my frame. My "Chiquo" was designed around the 26" wheeled Chiquillo. After adjusting the wheelbase for 650B clearance, (Adding 3/8") we kept the BB DROP the same as Chiquillo, and then adjusted the Head angle to 70 (from 71) for the specific fork I was going to use ( X-Fusion Velvet) set at 105mm.

    Sherwood took the learning experience from mine and then designed Vince's. I think the only significant difference is the BB height. Vince's is 1/4-1/2" lower than mine.

    I LOVE my Chiquo, it's the best all around handling bike I have, and if need be could be my one and only bike.
    Are you sure yours wasn't design around mine??? Mine is designed around a 495mm A2C fork w/69 degree HA Ole'

  11. #11
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    Fork and Porduction time

    I hate to say it, but you guys are swaying me toward the 650b

    What fork are you guys using? Gonzo...you said you were "going to use" the X-fusion velvet. Did/are you using it?

    Was kind of thinking a lefty to avoid dealing with fork crown cleareance.

    Finally, isn't the shop kind of busy right now with the new models? I'm thinking a one off wouldn't happen very quickly? Ideally I'd want one made with the ultimate's modular drop outs to allow me to run whatever drive train I choose.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by sam-eye-am View Post
    I hate to say it, but you guys are swaying me toward the 650b

    What fork are you guys using? Gonzo...you said you were "going to use" the X-fusion velvet. Did/are you using it?

    Was kind of thinking a lefty to avoid dealing with fork crown cleareance.

    Finally, isn't the shop kind of busy right now with the new models? I'm thinking a one off wouldn't happen very quickly? Ideally I'd want one made with the ultimate's modular drop outs to allow me to run whatever drive train I choose.
    I'm running a Fox Float dropped to 120mm.....plenty of arch clearance and have never touched the tire to underside of crown. It's the perfect HT set up. I sold all my 26ers after I got my 650B.

    .

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by sam-eye-am View Post
    I hate to say it, but you guys are swaying me toward the 650b

    What fork are you guys using? Gonzo...you said you were "going to use" the X-fusion velvet. Did/are you using it?

    Was kind of thinking a lefty to avoid dealing with fork crown cleareance.

    Finally, isn't the shop kind of busy right now with the new models? I'm thinking a one off wouldn't happen very quickly? Ideally I'd want one made with the ultimate's modular drop outs to allow me to run whatever drive train I choose.
    I'm running the X-Fusion Velvet R, Nothing Fancy, just plain works.
    Lefty would be a nice alternative, just way more $$$ than I had at the time I built my frame.

    Sherwoord, actually T would be better for answering turn around time, but I don't think a one of will take that long, it's one of the amazing things about V HQ. once you are on the queue they get it down pretty fast.

    Ah, so you want a version like mine! (this is just to rub it in to Vince! ) I chose the swinger droputs for the same reason, Gears, SS, Gates Belt, even 26" if I want to.

    -A
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails El Comondante Ultimate?-slidershot.jpg  

    -Aaron G.

    "Before D.W., "anti-squat" was referred to as pedal feedback."

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