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  1. #1
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    Why do the new DW bikes come with HV cans?

    I understood from the Ibis forum that DW link does best with low compression tunes and LV air cans on the RP23. Just curious why the DW Turners are all sporting the HV air cans. I assume the shocks are tuned for low compression around the suspension design, but anyone know the answer? I see so many Homers swapping out to LV cans I was getting curious.
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  2. #2
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    Are there alot of homers switching from HV to LV cans on dw link turners? I don't think I've seen/heard of any...

    Anyway, dw posted it somewhere and he can explain it better, so I'd try and find the long and short of it because he's careful with his words and anything else will have errors, but heres a brief (probably crappy) explanation to tide you over.

    the mojo was designed around a very progressive air spring shock to give the best traction. With the 5spot (and turners in general I think) the linkage itself is being designed to be slightly progressive, so the increased linearity/small bump sensitivity of a HV can is a benefit. Thats how I understand it, whatever the case there is a definitely a reason they are doing it.

  3. #3
    jrm
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    My guess

    The shorter length rocker on the DW link'd bikes equates to more progression thru the shocks stroke. The HV can reduces the progression thru the shocks stroke making it more linear.
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  4. #4
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    High Volume Cans versus Low Volume Cans. I know my choice!
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  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by snowdrifter
    High Volume Cans versus Low Volume Cans. I know my choice!

    I can't wait until mudpie replies!

    D.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by William42
    Are there alot of homers switching from HV to LV cans on dw link turners? I don't think I've seen/heard of any...
    Nor have I, but I've seen many swap out to LV cans on the "old" Spot, RFX and Sultans due to wallow. With so much sag designed into the DW link I didn't know if wallow was an issue there too for the bigger sized riders.
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  7. #7
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  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by cutthroat
    I understood from the Ibis forum that DW link does best with low compression tunes and LV air cans on the RP23. Just curious why the DW Turners are all sporting the HV air cans. I assume the shocks are tuned for low compression around the suspension design, but anyone know the answer? I see so many Homers swapping out to LV cans I was getting curious.
    DW custom designs the leverage ratios based on the way that each company wants the bike to ride. DW designed the Mojo's suspension to work with the massive ramp-up of a low volume Fox air shock. On the other hand, I read on another thread that Dave wanted the Turner DW bikes to have the same feel that his bikes have always have, so DW made the Turners suspension progressive using a HV air shock (which would also make it work well with coil shocks).

    ... or something like that.

    Edit - Found the quote.

    Quote Originally Posted by _dw
    A huge amount of time goes into matching leverage rates with air spring curves to give specific wheel rates for each dw-link bike. This is a part of what gives each model it's personality. From a damping standpoint, offerings from all manufacturers are improving, and as time moves on we can make fewer damping compromises due to the improvements.

    If you put a different air spring on your bike, then you could end up riding something that may not be working as it best can, regardless of how much you personally like it. Take for example, you running a FOX RC coil shock on a Mojo. The bike was designed to provide a linear wheel rate with an air spring. (and one with a good deal of end travel ramp at that). When you run the coil spring on the Mojo, you end up with a significantly falling wheel rate after mid travel. I would consider that to be one heck of a downside. At any rate, I don't consider this falling rate situation to be optimal, and you would be hard pressed to find many other people that do.


    You like your setup, and that's cool, but your suspension (on the Mojo) would allow more mid travel traction along with increased bottom out resistance with the 09RP23 compared to your coil Vanilla RC. A 5 Spot would be a much better candidate for the coil. It was designed around a large volume air can with a much lower compression ratio. This allows the use of coil springs as an option.
    Last edited by bikerx40; 01-13-2009 at 06:51 PM.
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  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by inzane
    And graphs, how could it have gone on this long without a single graph?
    Faster is better, even when it's not.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by D-Rock
    I can't wait until mudpie replies!

    D.
    agreed - high volume cans preferably!

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by D-Rock
    I can't wait until mudpie replies!

    D.
    Get Bent ( I am out of pics of hot chics)

    I still remember the first ride on an 08 rfx light, I knew right away the the point just after sag that the travel did not feel right with a HV can. The LV can made a huge difference for me and was never an issue after changing. On the DW there was nothing even close to that sensation w/HV can the travel was smooth and very plush all the way through the travel.

    Sorry no graph

  12. #12
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    HV cans are closer to linear rate then LV cans during most of the travel range, so riders who wish to can simply adapt to a coil shock with no noticeable compromise in the optimal designed wheel rate. In the other direction, LV could be used for riders bottoming a HV can too easily rather than compromising by adding more air pressure or firmer damping.

    I use a coil '02 Vanilla RC on my Mojo which was designed for LV air. And I had to get expensive PUSH tuning to prevent easy bottoming when using the much lighter coil than recommended for my weight and travel to avoid being over sprung in mid-travel. Plus I have to use more than desirable coil preload to maintain sag and to regain a softer and flatter rate of ramp up in mid-travel, that is more near the flat rate during mid-travel of air. It works excellent for me now, better in most ways than 3 air shocks I've tried.

    The HV tune of the 5 Spot and future RFX should make it easy to use a stock retail coil without platform effects with no noticeable compromises.

    The DHX-C may have too much platform at minimum adjustment to work very well with DWL with less than 7 inch travel. Marzocchi offers a DWL tuned WC coil at no extra charge if special ordered that way.

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