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  1. #1
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    Website updated. No 5 spot on the list of bikes...

    Whoa! It's official.

    Bob

  2. #2
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    It's a sad day...

  3. #3
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    Yeah, I was hoping to find a 2013 close out at my (semi) local Turner dealer the other day for CHEAP. No dice. The shop guy said they were all snapped up months ago. I thought 26ers were out.
    I will cause thee to ride upon the high places of the earth...
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  4. #4
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    Wow, that's kinda sad. I'm still in love with my 5 Spot. Hope DT keeps some spares around for it.

  5. #5
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    When I visited Turner last month, I think they said they hadn't sold a Spot in months.

  6. #6
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    Website updated. No 5 spot on the list of bikes...

    I guess they need the space on the webpage for when the Mach6 killing 6Spot comes out

    Farewell to 26ers though.

  7. #7
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    There are about 25 5 Spots left, just too few to take up the space or time in the new web site. The last of the 5 Spots are on sale, just call or email with size request.

    DT

  8. #8
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    I guess the burner is doing everything and more than the spot has been doing.

  9. #9
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    Well at least I can now say I own a classic mountain bike.
    Skye

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by bikesinmud View Post
    I guess the burner is doing everything and more than the spot has been doing.
    I demoed a Flux and a Burner a few weeks back. The Burner I think is more what the RFX used to be and the Flux is definitely what my Spot is as far as a trail bike. I've owned a Spot for many years now and can say that with the larger wheels a Flux with less travel is a better trail bike then my Spot. I apologize to Turner for not typing this up sooner, a full report will be coming. However, bottom line. Based on the roots, rocks, and technical trail riding I like to do here, the new Flux with its larger wheels, lighter weight out climbs, descends and just rides better than my 2007 Spot with HL rear and 27.5 with Magura Thor.

  11. #11
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    Thanks TurnerBikes for a great 10 year run on what has become a classic bike. Many happy trails were ridden with my 03 and then 08 Spots. Still rocking the RFX.

  12. #12
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    Interesting. After the this little chat goes up, only 1 person contacted us today to buy one of the closeout 5 Spots. You guys might be shedding a tear for the past, but no one actually wants to buy a piece of it. Oh sure. 2 stroke motocross bikes and 57 Chevy's have their place, but it is a pretty small place. RIP 26" trail bike.

    DT

  13. #13
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    The website shows 5 spots in only small and xl frames with orange ano. Anything else kicking around?

  14. #14
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    yes DT you are right, it would seem the days of the 26" are waining. hopefully in the future the spot name can be resurrected in different form. shame the burner wasn't named the Spot 27.5, the Burner is a great name and great bike, love mine
    who knows, the Burner was resurrected maybe one day the Spot will as well. I also really liked mine over the years, 08, 09, and 11. The Burner for me now does what the Spot did for me just better.
    Product designer @RSDBikes.com

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  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by turnerbikes View Post
    Interesting. After the this little chat goes up, only 1 person contacted us today to buy one of the closeout 5 Spots. You guys might be shedding a tear for the past, but no one actually wants to buy a piece of it. Oh sure. 2 stroke motocross bikes and 57 Chevy's have their place, but it is a pretty small place. RIP 26" trail bike.

    DT
    I am just waiting for the ibike and outerbike demos to go on sale... Santa is coming.

    Need (want) a large burner, flux, czar or sultan. Not sure which...
    Last edited by bobo_krkk_NIN; 11-07-2013 at 06:28 AM.

  16. #16
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    This gave me all the reasons why I should keep my 5spot. Its a classic. And since its no longer in production, we owners should feel privileged we own one ready to shred some trails! Im keeping this to "my royce can attract more chicks than your ferrari brah!"

  17. #17
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    Im I just an old retogrouch fart for still loving my 08 Flux ..... Colorado riding
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Website updated.  No 5 spot on the list of bikes...-downsized_0426131804.jpg  


  18. #18
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    went to the updated website, checked out a few bikes' geometry & "what the...?" why would Dave bother listing wheelbases? such useless info
    breezy shade

  19. #19
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    Sounds like there's no incentive to upgrade at all here, as they've got 24 bikes worth of spare parts.
    Nice KOM, sorry about your penis.

  20. #20
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    Hodge, the only reason we added WB is that many riders ask. Instead of buying a bike that fits they would rather guess what it will ride like based on wheelbase, and this analysis based on the wheel base of a different brand model, and NOW, wheel size bike! But, instead explaining the bike should fit first we decided to provide the info the riders want and let them buy based on the numbers they think are applicable.

    DT

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by turnerbikes View Post
    ...them buy based on the numbers they think are applicable.

    DT
    Numbers are good. More info the better IMO.

    Cheers DT&Crew

    Deano

  22. #22
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    Hi Dave,

    If you have a spare large triangle from 2011 onwards I would be interested in upgrading..

    Neil

  23. #23
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    I had a total of 4 Five Spots, H-Link, TNT and 2x DW. Getting my first spot was an absolute game changer for me. It was the first suspension bike that did not feel like a noodle to me.

    I now have a Sultan. Maybe I have to add a Burner at some point.

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by turnerbikes View Post
    Interesting. After the this little chat goes up, only 1 person contacted us today to buy one of the closeout 5 Spots. You guys might be shedding a tear for the past, but no one actually wants to buy a piece of it. Oh sure. 2 stroke motocross bikes and 57 Chevy's have their place, but it is a pretty small place. RIP 26" trail bike.

    DT
    I have a two-stroke motorcycle still........and a 26" wheeled bike

    Wouldn't mind having a 2012 Spot as back-up/2nd bike..... but it would have to be discounted deeply to steer me away from the flux or Czar or similar bigger wheeled siren. Se' la vi
    Last edited by KRob; 11-15-2013 at 06:39 PM.
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  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by turnerbikes View Post
    There are about 25 5 Spots left, just too few to take up the space or time in the new web site. The last of the 5 Spots are on sale, just call or email with size request.

    DT
    no mediums
    breezy shade

  26. #26
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    Hi Dave,

    Will Turner still be producing the Full Rebuild Kits for the 5-spot or should I snag a bunch of them up now from you? I just rebuilt my 2009 5-spot this year and it is slicing and dicing the trails in Nor-Cal! I will never sell my 5-spot, probably give it to my son when he is ready for a big boy bike. I will be in Southern California in March and hope to demo either the Flux or Czar for a day and see how it feels.

    Cheers DT!

    Dan Zepeda

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by zgroove View Post
    Hi Dave,

    Will Turner still be producing the Full Rebuild Kits for the 5-spot or should I snag a bunch of them up now from you? I just rebuilt my 2009 5-spot this year and it is slicing and dicing the trails in Nor-Cal! I will never sell my 5-spot, probably give it to my son when he is ready for a big boy bike. I will be in Southern California in March and hope to demo either the Flux or Czar for a day and see how it feels.

    Cheers DT!

    Dan Zepeda
    I think all the non down hill dw bikes use the same basic rebuild kits (bushings and such).
    On MTBR, the reputation is infamous.

  28. #28
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    The dw equipped bikes made in USA from mid 2008 till now use the same rebuild kits, they will be around a long time.

  29. #29
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    Cody Webb on his Beta 300 2 stroke has kicked ass on all the endurocross 4 strokes the last 2 rounds.

  30. #30
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    Maybe DT meant 2 strokes in motocross - more specifically pro MX and trying to make the main and doing well in the big show. Not EnduroCross or FMX (freestyle motocross, gawd I hate that "sport").

    Quote Originally Posted by mtbmitch2 View Post
    Cody Webb on his Beta 300 2 stroke has kicked ass on all the endurocross 4 strokes the last 2 rounds.

  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by bobo_krkk_NIN View Post
    I am just waiting for the ibike and outerbike demos to go on sale... Santa is coming.

    Need (want) a large burner, flux, czar or sultan. Not sure which...
    The demo bikes are for sale. They just don't have them listed on the website yet. I know because I asked a few weeks ago. Just call or email them.

  32. #32
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    Interesting that Dave references 2 stroke motorcycles in his justification for killing/death off the beloved 5 Spot.
    Did you know that KTM is the sole mfg who continued to develop the 2 stroke line of engines. They had done this as all the Euro and Japanese brands killed them off for the 4 stroke engines for a litany of enviro and political BS.
    The marketplace by default bought them(strokers) by the milllions in various sizes.
    Well, about 2006 or so. People began to realize the cost of ownership of these new hi-perf strokers was far in excess of what they were comfortable with spending(it is a hobby after all).
    KTM was the sole mfg still making competitive smokers. The market swung back to smokers and has grabbed a sizeable market share which kept KTM healthy through some really rough years.
    The people that jumped back in realized they were missing the other qualities of the smokers like lighter weight, snappier power, easier starting and maintenance.

    I think the analogy DT uses is very valid and possibly a lesson for even DT here.
    I have tried the 27.5's and for much of the riding I do , it is a very tough sell.
    The angle of attack argument is very real for those that ride lots and lots of rocky rough trail, but that isn't what most riders I know ride, unless they are road trippin to get to a Mammoth or Downieville.
    They suffer in comparison to 26ers on every other comparison possible. Weight, strength, final gearing selections, you name it.
    If I ran the show. I would develop a new 5 Spot. Longer reach, lower BB, lower standover, 56/44 tapered HT and sell this **** out of that *****.
    26 is not dead, but the lying media is selling that story for sure.

  33. #33
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    For the record I HAVE a 2 stroke, but it is not as easy to ride as a 4 stroke. I 'get' the fun that a more nimble flickable playful blah blah blah is, I have had 250 4 strokes and 450 4 strokes and 125 and 250 2 strokes blah blah blah. BUT, the market QUIT buying 5 Spots when the Burner was introduced. When the 4 stroke came out you could buy a nice 250 smoker years after the production as the market quit buying them as well. YOU the buyers have spoken with your spending. Yes, KTM sells lots of 2 strokes but nothing compared to what the industry used to sell, nothing. 4 Strokes are easier to ride, 27.5 is easier to ride, and for most riders on most trails being able to ride the same terrain whatever it is with less mental and physical effort the better. The 'flow' trails that are being built here and there are a notable exception, the 26 will rule them forever. Cut the roots, dig out the rocks and build berms Voila! Instant fun on a 26" wheeled bike for almost everyone. But, how many miles are there of these type of trails compared to 'real' mountain biking? Nothing, hardly measurable.

    Chase, anytime you want to get into the bike business call Sherwood@Ventana or David @ Zen and have them build you up a couple hundred 26" wheeled beauties of your own sweet design. Or if you don't want to do that.... get 199 of your closest friends together and 'spec' a custom 5 Spot, I will gladly draw them up and have Zen weld them up. Deposits required of course! As for assuming what others are riding based on where you ride is just that, an assumption. I look carefully at the photos and videos that mtbr homers post and I see a freakin massive amount of rocks, trails that are solid rocks. Not the wimpy decomposed granite and clay based trails we ride so much here in California, but heavily featured rough terrain. That, is where bigger wheels have an advantage, rock after rock after rock. As for your statements about gearing and wheel strength? true enough, but that ain't keeping the 26" at the top of the shopping list on most of Ya'll.

    DT

  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by turnerbikes View Post
    For the record I HAVE a 2 stroke, but it is not as easy to ride as a 4 stroke. I 'get' the fun that a more nimble flickable playful blah blah blah is, I have had 250 4 strokes and 450 4 strokes and 125 and 250 2 strokes blah blah blah. BUT, the market QUIT buying 5 Spots when the Burner was introduced. When the 4 stroke came out you could buy a nice 250 smoker years after the production as the market quit buying them as well. YOU the buyers have spoken with your spending. Yes, KTM sells lots of 2 strokes but nothing compared to what the industry used to sell, nothing. 4 Strokes are easier to ride, 27.5 is easier to ride, and for most riders on most trails being able to ride the same terrain whatever it is with less mental and physical effort the better. The 'flow' trails that are being built here and there are a notable exception, the 26 will rule them forever. Cut the roots, dig out the rocks and build berms Voila! Instant fun on a 26" wheeled bike for almost everyone. But, how many miles are there of these type of trails compared to 'real' mountain biking? Nothing, hardly measurable.

    Chase, anytime you want to get into the bike business call Sherwood@Ventana or David @ Zen and have them build you up a couple hundred 26" wheeled beauties of your own sweet design. Or if you don't want to do that.... get 199 of your closest friends together and 'spec' a custom 5 Spot, I will gladly draw them up and have Zen weld them up. Deposits required of course! As for assuming what others are riding based on where you ride is just that, an assumption. I look carefully at the photos and videos that mtbr homers post and I see a freakin massive amount of rocks, trails that are solid rocks. Not the wimpy decomposed granite and clay based trails we ride so much here in California, but heavily featured rough terrain. That, is where bigger wheels have an advantage, rock after rock after rock. As for your statements about gearing and wheel strength? true enough, but that ain't keeping the 26" at the top of the shopping list on most of Ya'll.

    DT
    Strokers easier to ride? Maybe Dave. I've owned both types very recently as well. Terrain makes that argument I think, as well as riding styles. Especially if the discussion shifts from Moto/Desert to XC racing and trees as we have up here north of the Grapevine.
    Your points are well taken. I think we are coming from 2 different sides of this discussion which is interesting. Maybe me and the guys I ride with are all screwed up in our priorities?
    So are you really making the argument that 26" is only suitable for flow trails now?
    Really? Because the 3/8" radius difference is that important?
    I love me some Turnerbikes for sure as I got 4 of em. You even made me a custom one way BITD. As far as going elsewhere?Doubtful as your stuff is far superior IMO.

    But in analyzing my next upgrade and giving my enormously tall 13yo son my XL 13 Spot. I developed a list of +/- based on my riding and needs. Which fueled my rant. Another 5 Spot using the same numbers kind of seems boring when facing a $7K purcahse.
    Build me a new Spot with Burner style geo and a tapered HT and my Visa number will be in your system faster than I can type this email. Maybe the 5 Spot just needs to freshened up a bit? Not abandoned. I kinda like her but some bigger titties would be nice.

    As far as my dollars pushing this decision? Is it us asking for 27.5? or is it the industry/media pushing a new format to try and create a market that was maybe saturated,slowing down from economics and possibly at its peak of development?
    My opinion is it is more of the latter.
    In any objective analysis other than the small advantage of AofA of this wheel size the 26" wins hands down.
    If people really want to roll over **** then a 29er is the way to go I think, but you better be fit and lithe and be willing to live with the downsides.

    I may well jump on this 27.5 bandwagon being forced on me but I will not go quietly.

  35. #35
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    Bandaroo- I tried that on an older 5 spot but the geo was jacked up. I need to climb into that fork and shorten the travel to compensate and try it again. I really think the moto setup would be the ticket (for a host of reasons) if the geo was sorted out.
    But Hey. DT probably did that **** 5 years ago and killed it because it sucked and we just don't know.

  36. #36
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    Bandaroo-That seems like way to much work.
    I gotta think that 27.5 in front and shorten the Fox 36 to maybe 130mm might do it?

  37. #37
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    The media has definitely jumped on the 27.5 bandwagon, but it is ultimately the $'s we spend that determine what sticks around. 26 devotees are going to have to get used to having fewer and fewer options out there.

    It's pretty cool & interesting that the owner of a bike co. is discussing this stuff openly with us. Thanks DT!

  38. #38
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    If enough riders want 26'', all you have to do is vote with your wallet. Right now, bigger wheels are selling, 26 are not. Is this clear enough? Riders are wanting bigger wheels, it is not a industry wide conspiracy. I know you have a garage full of 26" equipment, MANY of you do. I know you need the lowest possible gearing, so a small wheel allows lower final gear. I know that you want the strongest wheels that are reasonably light, and 26'' does that. But this is not a personal attack on you Chase or anyone else out there with a **** load of 26" equipment forcing you to upgrade. I will try to be very clear in my next statement.

    The 5 Spot sales almost stopped when the Burner was introduced. I still have stock that was welded before that. IF there were any other small to midsize (Santa Cruz) companies as transparent as Turner Bikes, you would hear the same story. Bronson killed the Nomad etc.

  39. #39
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    Re: Website updated. No 5 spot on the list of bikes...

    Quote Originally Posted by turnerbikes View Post
    There are about 25 5 Spots left, just too few to take up the space or time in the new web site. The last of the 5 Spots are on sale, just call or email with size request.

    DT
    If I may ask, what is the sale price of the Spot?

  40. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by chasejj View Post
    If I ran the show. I would develop a new 5 Spot. Longer reach, lower BB, lower standover, 56/44 tapered HT and sell this **** out of that *****.
    26 is not dead, but the lying media is selling that story for sure.
    Also throw another 20-30mm of travel out back, slack it out slightly and call it an RFX. I went to a local enduro event a few weeks ago, 80% of the bikes where 26. I'm not seeing many people out on the trails with 27.5's yet, do people who buy these actually ride?

  41. #41
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    I've been riding Turners for almost 20 years. Current stable is a 2012 Spot, a new Burner, and a Czar. The Spot doesn't even begin to compare to the new bikes (for the type of riding I do). . . Is it the 26" wheels? Who cares? The new bikes rock, and it is time to move on. . .

    I can't even sell the used Spot because it has 26" wheels. No interest. Our local ski resort is building the countries longest "flow" trail for next summer, so maybe I can actually sell the Spot. . .

  42. #42
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    I've got some 215 gs skis that I'll sell you to go with your 26" wheel bike! Maybe some Killy style striped ski pants to round things out!

    Oh yeah, I have a garage full of old **** that was cutting edge in it's day. . . I had loads of fun riding old style skis and bikes, but all in all, the new stuff rocks!

    DT, keep developing the new stuff. Looking forward to a carbon Burner!

  43. #43
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    I have some killer 205 Volkl's that I won't ski anymore as well. Why? Because the new Super deep sidcut new stuff is wayyyyyy better in almost every way.

    27.5 is not wayyyyy better . I've ridden them both. In one quality they are slightly better, in many ways they are a step back IMO.

  44. #44
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    Dave- No personal attack was ever felt. Just a lively frank discussion.

    I also don't accuse you of conspiring to kill the 26 either. Guys gotta eat. I think many factors played out in a very short period and drove this issue. Some of it was survival, some technical advantages and design.

    But being an old fat bastard who is pretty keen on such things. I've seen this play out before. Old standard is proclaimed dead for rather weak reasons, but change for change sake made some people money.

    Prediction- 3 years from now we will see articles proclaiming a rebirth of 26" format for all the reasons I stated. Because it never should have been droppped.
    Then we will hear of a new Spot with tricked out new-think geo and parts spec., It will hailed as they next great thing because those old and slow/heavy 27.5 and 29ers just won't cut it anymore.
    Last edited by chasejj; 11-10-2013 at 07:15 PM.

  45. #45
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    My take is that the Burner is way better than the spot, but It could be due to the sum of all the other components just as much as the wheel size. Geometry, stiff rims and forks, new suspension, maybe even new paint!

  46. #46
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    No doubt the new Burner geo rocks!! I won't even argue it at all. I have not ridden an XL burner but years of riding many different Turners and other custom bikes I have designed and specified leaves me no doubts I would love the geo of the XL Burner w/o question.
    But for me the ideal would be a Burner with 26" wheels. I wonder how that would ride actually?
    DT- Anybody riding a Burner with 26ers? BB too low maybe? That would be a fun experiment for sure.

  47. #47
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    It's official ..... I am now a dinosaur! (Not a major revelation according to my kids)
    Instead of misprportioned upper limbs like T Rex I have really, really small wheels.

    04 Spot broke .... I was bereft, right up until I rode my 12 DW Spot.

    My next bike was going to be a Burner.
    Now it will be a .....................Burner!

    I imagine it will also be an eye-opener as to how MTBs keep getting better.

    Thanks DT,
    I am always impressed by the feedback we get from the company owner and designer on this forum.

    cheers from a Kiwi fan

  48. #48
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    I have a 4 stroke 350 and a 2 stroke 150, both KTM's. I would compare the 350 to the Sultan and the 150 more 2 the DW 26er Flux. Both are fun in their element. Looking forward to trying out a 650b flux. BTW, KTM has succeeded in expanding their marketshare and for the first time sold over 100000 units in 2012. E bikes, fun bikes, huge sales in India are contribute to a company that builds what the riders want.
    DT is not afraid to market different bikes, for instance the new Flux and Burner both made in the USA.

  49. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by chasejj View Post
    No doubt the new Burner geo rocks!! I won't even argue it at all. I have not ridden an XL burner but years of riding many different Turners and other custom bikes I have designed and specified leaves me no doubts I would love the geo of the XL Burner w/o question.
    But for me the ideal would be a Burner with 26" wheels. I wonder how that would ride actually?
    DT- Anybody riding a Burner with 26ers? BB too low maybe? That would be a fun experiment for sure.
    If one were to run the same model of tire, 26" wheels would drop the Burner BB by 1/2", but you'd be carrying around extra-long chainstays (by 26" standards) for no good reason.
    God hates figs. Luke 13:6-9

  50. #50
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    Juan! Brilliant.
    DT can just swap a the Burner CS for a dusty set of old 2013 Spot stays. Nobody want them anyway and voila! 26" badass Spot with a longass front-center just like I likes it.
    Something tells me DW messed with the kinematics/pivot locations though.

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