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  1. #1
    3 "fiddy" for short
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    Turner response to warranty question

    "We are glad to hear that you purchased a 5 Spot. It will give you many
    years of perfect service. As for the change in rear ends. We have virtually
    no warranties with the rears. Currently we do have rears that we plan on
    keeping for warranty into next season, but once these are gone they will be
    gone. The TNT rear will directly bolt up to your current front triangle and
    there should be no issue with your warranty on the frame or rear. We strive
    for great customer service and plan to help you out with any problems should
    they ever arise in the years to come."

    You heard it here first!

  2. #2
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    Wonder if they'll refund your horst and ICT license fee at the same time?

    This was a joke guys
    Last edited by Robbz; 10-01-2005 at 01:42 AM.

  3. #3
    ...master of none
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    Quote Originally Posted by be350ka
    "We are glad to hear that you purchased a 5 Spot. It will give you many
    years of perfect service. As for the change in rear ends. We have virtually
    no warranties with the rears. Currently we do have rears that we plan on
    keeping for warranty into next season, but once these are gone they will be
    gone. The TNT rear will directly bolt up to your current front triangle and
    there should be no issue with your warranty on the frame or rear. We strive
    for great customer service and plan to help you out with any problems should
    they ever arise in the years to come."

    You heard it here first!
    Sounds like a non-issue to me.

    bock

  4. #4
    Amphibious Technologies
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robbz
    Wonder if they'll refund your horst and ICT license fee at the same time?
    You'll have to ask Specialized and Ellsworth for the refund, not Turner. But since you've used the FSR/ICT then you won't get a refund just because you stop using it.

    As Turner said, they really have not had any problems with the rear breaking. Most breaks on bikes with rockers are on the seatube area that is caused by hard bottom-outs.
    "The best you've ridden is the best you know" - Paul Thede, Race Tech

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robbz
    Wonder if they'll refund your horst and ICT license fee at the same time?
    That would make sense since they probably get a refund from Spec/Ells if the rear end breaks. NOT!

  6. #6
    Amphibious Technologies
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    Quote Originally Posted by one964
    Is it just me, or does the Turner response seem a bit lacking in the 'customer care' area, i.e. when they are gone - tough you'll get what we've got - effectively a different bike.
    I think that is an honest and reasonable response. It does not make business sense to continue to make the old linkage when the new one will bolt right onto an old frame.
    "The best you've ridden is the best you know" - Paul Thede, Race Tech

  7. #7
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    Good customer service?

    Newcomer to Turner.
    Just ordered my first - 5-Spot - then the TNT exploded.

    I'm disappointed as I believed all the stuff about 4-bar/horst link, (probably wouldn't be able to tell the difference) and my perception was I was buying the best and buying into the image, etc., etc.

    Next delivery due to UK in mid-Oct and they don't know what they are (and me) are getting. I could still be getting the old type? - so I read this post with interest.

    Is it just me, or does the Turner response seem a bit lacking in the 'customer care' area, i.e. when they are gone - tough you'll get what we've got - effectively a different bike.

  8. #8
    Yay! Bikes !
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    Quote Originally Posted by bock
    Sounds like a non-issue to me.

    bock
    really? it sounds like an issue to me.

    My opinion, based on what we "know", is that this major design change did not occur for the sake of improving their product.

    Any future warranty issues beyond the availability of current HL chain or seat stays, will be subject to being replaced with something other than what you own, something other than what you bought, that is not an improvement but rather "so close you probably won't even be able to tell".

    That's an issue to me.
    Nick.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by SCUBAPRO
    I think that is an honest and reasonable response. It does not make business sense to continue to make the old linkage when the new one will bolt right onto an old frame.
    Honest -yes.
    Reasonable?
    When did potentially upsetting your customers make good business sense?

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nick.
    really? it sounds like an issue to me.

    My opinion, based on what we "know", is that this major design change did not occur for the sake of improving their product.

    Any future warranty issues beyond the availability of current HL chain or seat stays, will be subject to being replaced with something other than what you own, something other than what you bought, that is not an improvement but rather "so close you probably won't even be able to tell".

    That's an issue to me.
    I can understand your concern, but think of it this way. If the bikes never fail on the rear triangle, then those spares should last a long, long time. Most other companies will warranty a frame for 1-5 years, and your bike will probably be over 5 years by the time you have a problem with the rear triangle... if ever. That still puts you out ahead of someone riding on a Specialized with a horst link, who wouldn't get any warranty. You can't expect a manufacturer to carry replacement parts for everything they make for the rest of time. What do you think happens if someone was to make a warranty claim on an RFX? They'd end up with a highline or a 6-pack, or a RFX-6, but none of them would be an RFX. Things change, models change, and if they don't have an exact replacement, they'll give you the closest thing they have. Be happy that DT is going to take care of you, and don't worry about the rear triangle until you have to.

    BL
    MCM #269

    "Lightweight , durable , inexpensive
    Pick 2."

  11. #11
    Now with flavor!!
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    Quote Originally Posted by BikeLust
    I That still puts you out ahead of someone riding on a Specialized with a horst link, who wouldn't get any warranty.
    Specialized has one of the best warranty programs in the business. And whenever applicable, they do the following.......
    Quote Originally Posted by BikeLust
    Things change, models change, and if they don't have an exact replacement, they'll give you the closest thing they have.
    BL
    I've had two swingarm pieces on an out of date frame replaced with something comparable as well as seen cracked front triangles of friends replaced before the part was returned.

    Not the best example.
    STRAVA: Enabling dorks everywhere to get trails shut down........ all for the sake of a race on the internet.

  12. #12
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    One when you ordered the bike you thought you were getting a Horst link. I would think you are within your consumer rights to refuse a TNT frame and get a refund if it bothers you that much. You could then wait for a demo TNT bike to be available, ride it and if you like it, then re-order a TNT 5 Spot sure in the knowledge its the bike for you.

  13. #13
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    Sealed bearings next?

    Quote Originally Posted by SCUBAPRO
    You'll have to ask Specialized and Ellsworth for the refund, not Turner. But since you've used the FSR/ICT then you won't get a refund just because you stop using it.

    As Turner said, they really have not had any problems with the rear breaking. Most breaks on bikes with rockers are on the seatube area that is caused by hard bottom-outs.
    I was joking when I said that my 5-spot was going to be obsolete! But it looks like the Horsts are going to disappear from the Turner line-up ... wow

    Man, I am going to buy a bunch of bushings soon: I am sure next will be sealed bearings.

    Or sell Spotty fast (sorry just joking) I can only imagine what this will do to resale value in a while with all the fanatic Turner idiots claiming that TNT is better than Horst ... new Ibis looks nice
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    Last edited by Davide; 09-30-2005 at 01:51 PM.

  14. #14
    Registered Dietitian
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    Quote Originally Posted by Davide
    I was joking when I said that my 5-spot was going to be obsolete! But it looks like the Horsts are going to disappear from the Turner line-up ... wow

    Man, I am going to buy a bunch of bushings soon: I am sure next will be sealed bearings.

    Or sell Spotty fast, I can only imagine what this will do to resale value in a while with all the fantic Turner idiots claiming that TNT is better than Horst
    Please, please say you're serious this time and will be selling the Spot. Of course, I'll never know if you do or not as you just became the first person on my "ignore" list. I swear, in all the time I've been here I cannot recall EVER seeing you post anything of value.

    Good riddance to bad rubbish.
    Registered Dietitian, Cycling Coach, Ascend Nutrition and Coaching

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by kidwoo
    Not the best example.
    Perhaps not. My main point was to say that while all the FSRs still use horst links, the bike has evolved enough over the years that the parts are not interchangable. What you would end up with (if it was replaced under warranty) would have more significant differences from your original bike than something near identical with the pivot moved 1 inch North. I didn't mean to bash Specialized, and in fact have one hanging in my basement. I've been so happy with my 6-pack that it hasn't seen much use this summer.

    BL
    MCM #269

    "Lightweight , durable , inexpensive
    Pick 2."

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by tommyrod74
    Please, please say you're serious this time and will be selling the Spot. Of course, I'll never know if you do or not as you just became the first person on my "ignore" list. I swear, in all the time I've been here I cannot recall EVER seeing you post anything of value.

    Good riddance to bad rubbish.
    He is just teasing us. I offered to buy his frame to just shut him up, but of course he never responded.
    Riding slowly since 1977.

  17. #17
    Amphibious Technologies
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    sealed Needle bearings

    Quote Originally Posted by Davide
    Man, I am going to buy a bunch of bushings soon: I am sure next will be sealed bearings.
    Not just any sealed bearing...needle bearings are better.
    And don't worry about buying a bunch of bushes...the you can convert your current set-up to a needle bearing system.
    "The best you've ridden is the best you know" - Paul Thede, Race Tech

  18. #18
    Yay! Bikes !
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    Quote Originally Posted by BikeLust
    Perhaps not. My main point was to say that while all the FSRs still use horst links, the bike has evolved enough over the years that the parts are not interchangable. What you would end up with (if it was replaced under warranty) would have more significant differences from your original bike than something near identical with the pivot moved 1 inch North. I didn't mean to bash Specialized, and in fact have one hanging in my basement. I've been so happy with my 6-pack that it hasn't seen much use this summer.

    BL
    I appreciate your other reply.

    One appeal of Turner is that he HASN'T changed for the sake of change. There wasn't the "flash in the pan, best suspension since last year" worry in choosing my frame. There is nothing more irritating than seeing a company push a new design to the market, every year or two in some cases, that is no better than that which came before it, just different. That reason alone has kept he from spending a dime on many lesser brands. What security comes from knowing your model may not exist in another year or two?

    When I bought my RFX I knew it wasn't coming with an everlasting warranty, even with their great reputation for building bombproof frames and exceptional level of customer service. One of the reasons why I picked that frame was because it was (imo) the best frame with all of the features that I wanted that I could afford at the time. Also, that I wouldn't be out-riding the bike any time soon. I wasn't riding anywhere near the limits of the frame, I'm still not regularly exceeding them today, but I'm riding much harder than I ever was and don't see that changing any time soon. Still, I do not worry about my frame.

    I know that everything can break. If I broke it tomorrow I wouldn't expect a warranty replacement but I wouldn't be surprised if I was made an offer that would exceed my expectations. I guess I just don't like the fact that I won't even be able to BUY a original design replacement part should I need one in the future, or even upgrade to the newer, 'better' improved part for a charge if the OE part was no longer available.
    Nick.

  19. #19
    Bite Me.
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    Quote Originally Posted by bock
    So chill out.bock
    Or to put it another way - "Neutralize your Torque" buddy. Cow wafer....
    When I see an adult on a bicycle, I do not despair for the future of the human race. ~H.G. Wells

  20. #20
    ...master of none
    Reputation: bock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nick.
    really? it sounds like an issue to me.

    My opinion, based on what we "know", is that this major design change did not occur for the sake of improving their product.

    Any future warranty issues beyond the availability of current HL chain or seat stays, will be subject to being replaced with something other than what you own, something other than what you bought, that is not an improvement but rather "so close you probably won't even be able to tell".

    That's an issue to me.
    Well, it shouldn't be.

    If all of the following occur, then maybe you'll have an issue:

    1. You break your rear triangle
    2. It's under warranty
    3. Turner no longer has any HL parts available
    4. You're still not convinced (at the time of breakage) that TNT is the equal of the "classic" Turners

    The likelihood of all four events occurring to you at the same time are extremely minimal.

    So chill out.

    bock

  21. #21
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    Yes! needles.

    Quote Originally Posted by SCUBAPRO
    Not just any sealed bearing...needle bearings are better.
    And don't worry about buying a bunch of bushes...the you can convert your current set-up to a needle bearing system.
    Like the bearing kit I installed on my GT STS 8 years ago (https://www.betd.co.uk/product_list.asp?CategoryID=103) and that is still working without a blip ... no grease, no dirt, no maintenance

    But I am expecially looking forward upgrading my 5-spot to TNT linkage
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Last edited by Davide; 10-01-2005 at 02:25 AM.

  22. #22
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    At the end of the day DT has replaced broken XCE rears with newer bikes rear ends, nobody complained about that, they were simply delighted that an older frame would still be supported, unlike certain other ICT brands.

    Davide, sell your spot, please, or at least go to another forum, I hear ellsworth are short of people posting, and you've got an ICT sticker...

  23. #23
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    Thanks for telling me about the ignore list, Davide, you're in the number 1 spot for me as well.

  24. #24
    3 "fiddy" for short
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    Quote Originally Posted by one964
    Newcomer to Turner.
    Just ordered my first - 5-Spot - then the TNT exploded.

    I'm disappointed as I believed all the stuff about 4-bar/horst link, (probably wouldn't be able to tell the difference) and my perception was I was buying the best and buying into the image, etc., etc.

    Next delivery due to UK in mid-Oct and they don't know what they are (and me) are getting. I could still be getting the old type? - so I read this post with interest.

    Is it just me, or does the Turner response seem a bit lacking in the 'customer care' area, i.e. when they are gone - tough you'll get what we've got - effectively a different bike.
    I sent an email to Turner about the warranty issue and the response is listed above. He, DT, told me that the Horsts will still be shipped out until the end of the year and the TNT will start shipping around the turn of the year. Hope this helps!!

  25. #25
    Yay! Bikes !
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    Quote Originally Posted by bock
    Well, it shouldn't be.

    If all of the following occur, then maybe you'll have an issue:

    1. You break your rear triangle
    2. It's under warranty
    3. Turner no longer has any HL parts available
    4. You're still not convinced (at the time of breakage) that TNT is the equal of the "classic" Turners

    The likelihood of all four events occurring to you at the same time are extremely minimal.

    So chill out.

    bock

    hey bock ... chilling out has nothing to do with it.

    I'm not sweating my RFX, never have. It's f#$*ing burly ... the point is should something happen, maybe the best that I'll be able to do is to rebuild the frame to a lesser design. (lesser = my opinion) THAT is an issue. It might not be to you ... is to me.

    I spent today riding and jumping ... my bike didn't break into pieces ( ) ... here is to things staying that way!
    Nick.

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