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Thread: Turner Geomtry

  1. #1
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    Turner Geomtry

    I am considering buying a Flux.



    I currently have a Raleigh M-80 2004 XS. I have been riding for less than a year. I have been told that by numerous people that the Raleigh is too small both on height and top length. The top tube is 20.9 in, the height is 14 inches, stand over height is 27.7 inches.

    I really like what I have read and heard about the Turner Flux. I plan on racing and trail riding for recreation. The Flux seems to fit the perfectly for what I want the bike for. I am taking a trip to Arkansas next week, in which I will demo the flux for a day. The local LBS owner raves about this bike, he has one of his own.

    The only problem I am having is with the Turner fluxes geometry, particularly stand over height and top tube length. My inseam is 29 1/4 inches. The xx-small flux would work with a stand over height of 29 inches. The problem is that the top tube length on the xs- flux is 21.2" which is just barely longer than the top tube on the Raleigh which makes me believe the XS Flux would be too short length wise. When I look at the Small Flux the top tube length is 22.4" which is nearly an 1 1/2" longer than the Raleigh. I have been told that in the world of bike sizing where centimeters can make a difference that the inch 1 1/2" difference in top tube length should make a world of difference in confront level on the bike. The only problem is that the stand over height on the Small Turner flux is 30" which is obliviously bigger than my 29 1/4" inseam.

    Everything that I have learned about bike sizing tells me that the Turner Flux just isn't going to fit me and I should forget about buying one.

    Well here is were the confusion comes in. When I talk to the LBS owner (the one with the flux) he tells me that I will be surprised at how low the top tube is on the fluxes (he doesn't have any for me to test this out on other than his large that he rides). This statement confuses me because I thought that was what stand over height was all about ie you want to look at stand over height versus insight height to determine if a bike will fit. If stand over height is greater than inseam height than the bike is too big, this is correct, right?

    On top tube length, does bike type and set-up matter? Is it possible that the XS flux will fit me and that I really shouldn't using my Raleigh as a comparison because the bikes are completely different in design ie hard tail versus FS? To me it seems like that if the a top to length 20.9 inches is too short on a hard tail than it will be too short on a FS. The only way set-up could make a difference is to use a longer stem? I have been told that a bike should fit with out changes ie buying a longer stem to make for short top tube should not be an option?

    When I expressed these concerns to the LBS owner he tells me that we will make the bike fit. Given what I have been told and read this seems like the wrong approach.

    Also the place that I am demoing the Flux from bike from seems to think that the small will work for me. The person I have been working with on the Demo is just barely under 5’7” and rides a medium Flux. Unfortunately at the time I will be in Arkansas they will not have a small for me to try, I will be demoing the medium Flux, which I think still should answer a lot of my questions.

    The other two bikes that I am considering are Specialized Stump Jumper FSR and the Titus racer x 100. I plan on riding the Titus and also a Jamis, I also might have a chance to ride a Specialized Epic.


    I was hoping to hear from other flux owners on what they thought given the info I have provided above. And if you still remember the questions from above, answers to them would be great as well.


    Thanks for any insight that can be given.

  2. #2
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    more questions than answers

    hey stbtber,

    a few less initials will ya? kiddin pal.

    if i understand it right, yer on a lower end hard tail w/ a b/bkt height of about 11" to 11.5, considerably lower than a dual suspension bike will ever be. this will always be a sacrifice to some extent. if you have a inseam of 29.25", ill asume yer about 5'6" but id rather you tell us so we can be of more help. if im right, yer just between a small flux and a medium on paper. if you have a short inseam and a longer torso and/or arm you may want to opt for the bigger frame. screw the standover and go with a top tube that fits the rideing position as this is a far more usefull and important measurement due to the fact that you spend 90% or more of yer time on the bike, not posing in the parking lot. if anyone sizes a bike based off of standover alone, just walk away and find a guy who knows how to fit a rider to a bike properly.

    the flux has a simply amazing xc/race/trail ride that will not dissapoint and it has a very low top tube compared to most dualies, so yer (almost) lbs is right. the m800 is gonna have a very upright position as its a entry level bike afterall so useing it to compare a high performance bike like the flux is kinda silly due to dramatically different geometry phylosophys.

    its possible and perfectly acceptable to make small changes with stem and seatpost choice to dial in the fit, once you have the best frame fit or the best compromise in frame fit if yer body type is a bit off of normal. almost sounds like this is the case so yer height and inseam are key here, maybe even a arm length. be sure have a VERY close pal get right up in the pit and groin to get a accurate measurement. its also ok to do more dramatic stem and s/post changes to rough in a test ride fit of a bike thats too big or small. dont be afeared as long as yer not buyin it.

    hope this helps and be sure to keep askin questions as they arise.
    No, I'm NOT back!

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    Im in the same boat with a Five Spot Im looking at. Im a 29 inseam and the lowest standover is at 30. And thats for both the Flux and the Spot. Wondering if Im going to have a problem.

    On a sperate issue, Im wavering between Spot and Flux. I love fast XC and have a hardtail now...wondering how much responsiveness Im going to lose wit hthe Spt and if I should go with the Flux. . Ill post that one seperately....dont want to hijack this thread.

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    Actually I am 5'4". This is kind of funny because until I measured myself just now I thought I was 5'6". Imagine being 28 years old and finding out your even shorter than you realized.

    Oh well, Inseam measurement was taken just as you described, so I think it is pretty accurate.

    The LBS I bought the Raleigh from sized me based on stand-over height alone, which is why the Raleigh is too small. I will say I have had the time of my life on the Raleigh over the last year but have also taken some pretty bad spills, one resulted in a broken foot and ankle, which required a cast for 8 weeks. I have been told by people that have witnessed some of my accidents that is do to the bike being too small. When I bought the Raleigh I had no clue to what I was doing after all it is my first MTB. The LBS I bought it from did not really deal in MTBs, so they apparently had no clue to what they were doing either, this defiantly was a bad mix.

    I am fully expecting to be blown away by the ride on the Flux given the bike I am ridding now.

    Thanks for the reply that is the info I was looking for. I will post back and let you know how the demo went.

  5. #5
    JmZ
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    Standover's part of it.

    Best bet is to get on the bike and to ride it. Only then will you know.

    Short of that... check out some of the fit calculators (be creative and google can be your friend. I've found Wrencsciene's calculator to be pretty close for my fit.)

    I've bought bikes by standover before. Learned that lesson when it always felt cramped and short.

    I've bought bikes by top tube length before too. Learned that lesson too, when I never felt confident on the bike. Always worried about those quick dismounts.

    Last bike I bought had a mix of a good top tube length and standover. And it's the first bike in a long time to whisper... c'mon...faster, faster.

    There are some tweaks you can do with stems, posts, handlebars. For some using a seatpost to get the right positon is almost hearsy, but honestly I don't care. My bike fits nicely.

    One last note... take a look where the standover is measured from. Most bikes measure it from the center of the top tube, but some companies don't follow the same ways to figure out measurements.

    Good luck,

    JmZ

    Quote Originally Posted by cactuscorn
    hey stbtber,

    a few less initials will ya? kiddin pal.

    if i understand it right, yer on a lower end hard tail w/ a b/bkt height of about 11" to 11.5, considerably lower than a dual suspension bike will ever be. this will always be a sacrifice to some extent. if you have a inseam of 29.25", ill asume yer about 5'6" but id rather you tell us so we can be of more help. if im right, yer just between a small flux and a medium on paper. if you have a short inseam and a longer torso and/or arm you may want to opt for the bigger frame. screw the standover and go with a top tube that fits the rideing position as this is a far more usefull and important measurement due to the fact that you spend 90% or more of yer time on the bike, not posing in the parking lot. if anyone sizes a bike based off of standover alone, just walk away and find a guy who knows how to fit a rider to a bike properly.

    the flux has a simply amazing xc/race/trail ride that will not dissapoint and it has a very low top tube compared to most dualies, so yer (almost) lbs is right. the m800 is gonna have a very upright position as its a entry level bike afterall so useing it to compare a high performance bike like the flux is kinda silly due to dramatically different geometry phylosophys.

    its possible and perfectly acceptable to make small changes with stem and seatpost choice to dial in the fit, once you have the best frame fit or the best compromise in frame fit if yer body type is a bit off of normal. almost sounds like this is the case so yer height and inseam are key here, maybe even a arm length. be sure have a VERY close pal get right up in the pit and groin to get a accurate measurement. its also ok to do more dramatic stem and s/post changes to rough in a test ride fit of a bike thats too big or small. dont be afeared as long as yer not buyin it.

    hope this helps and be sure to keep askin questions as they arise.
    JmZ

    From one flat land to another.

    Advocate as if your ride depends on it...

  6. #6
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    slopey

    the top tubes on turners slope down quite a bit, so try it out, you may find that it is not an issue.......

  7. #7
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    cool. with the new numbers id have to say a small might just do it. a xs will be way short for sure and a med could be like ridin a surfboard but since yer gonna be on one, give er a go. ive never thought much of fit caculators, specially those found on line. man ive seen some wacky numbers like a road frame i was designing for my dad that came up with a 63cm seat tube and a 58cm top tube. huh???? yould think he had a 38" inseam but was only 6' tall. go with a pro to fit ya is my suggestion. this cat in are-kansas might be yer guy. may i ask who yer goin to? i met some shop owners while on a visit there this year. too bad i didnt bring the turner but the road riding is good.
    No, I'm NOT back!

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    Quote Originally Posted by cactuscorn
    may i ask who yer goin to? .
    Competitive Cycles is the name of the shop that I am demoing the turner from.


    Thanks
    Chris

  9. #9
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    Flux demo

    Just got back from my Arkansas Trip in which I demoed a turner flux.

    I demoed the medium. I really thought this bike was going to be too big. Boy was I surprised. Stand over height was a little tight but acceptable.

    I absolutely fell in love on the first ride. I felt comfortable on the bike almost immediately. I demoed the Flux at camp Robinson in Little Rock, AR. There is not a lot of climbing but enough for me to test the Flux.

    I couldn’t believe how great and how much fun it was to ride this bike. It handled so great.

    I have to check on some things, but I maybe able to order the frame in the next several weeks, if not in the next several weeks, by Dec for sure. Then I will have to gradually build it up. I will not be using any parts from my old bike. I would expect the bike to be ready to ride by April. I want nothing but the best for this bike so it is going to take time. I can’t wait!
    Last edited by Single Track MTBer; 10-30-2005 at 07:00 AM.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by SpeedThrills
    Im in the same boat with a Five Spot Im looking at. Im a 29 inseam and the lowest standover is at 30. And thats for both the Flux and the Spot. Wondering if Im going to have a problem.

    On a sperate issue, Im wavering between Spot and Flux. I love fast XC and have a hardtail now...wondering how much responsiveness Im going to lose wit hthe Spt and if I should go with the Flux. . Ill post that one seperately....dont want to hijack this thread.


    hey man, im just like you and was in the same boat ive plumped for the medium and a 5 spot, i made the decision to go with the spot because with position and choice of equipment u can make it as you want it, i like a low slung stretched out feel so that will be my build. but even for a full suss trail bike the spot and the flux have very low stand over heights. proportionately the small is very small. you wont believe it till you see it. go ride one first let us all know what u think!!
    God....whatever i feel like doing!!!

  11. #11
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    If you stick a 19.75" fork on a 5 Spot(which is what it was designed around ) it will despite a very dropped top tube still going to have a standover (where you normally stand over the bike ) of around 30-32 " period

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