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  1. #1
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    Tapered Headtube?

    Tapered headtubes, 1 1/2 lower & 1 1/8 upper cups.
    Pros, cons, etc., what are your thoughts?

  2. #2
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    I'd like to see one on the Sultan


  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1soulrider
    Tapered headtubes, 1 1/2 lower & 1 1/8 upper cups.
    Pros, cons, etc., what are your thoughts?
    I think the '10 RFX is getting one. That's what I think.

    Pros: Light enough. Plenty o' stem options. Stiffer than 1.125". Can run a ZeroStack HS and 1.125" fork to get a steeper head angle.

    Cons: Can't run the 1.5 fork you already own. Not as stiff as 1.5.

  4. #4
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    Tapered head tubes...lame just like 15mm front axles.

    How much weight can really be saved? Does it justify the increased costs? I think not.

    Make all head tubes 1.5" and give people the option of running 1.5" steer tubes forks or 1.125" zero stack or normal.

  5. #5
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    Thank god we get to discuss this again, the 2 days of silence was killing me.
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

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  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by jncarpenter
    I'd like to see one on the Sultan
    Only because you want the Zocchi rumored to being made for that Niner bike

  7. #7
    Natl. Champ DH Poser/Hack
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    im still lookin for all those 1 1/8" headsets, headtubes and steeretubes that failed and brought on this need for somethin diff. we need more industry standards designed to save us from ourselves. the 1.5 idea is the outlawing of lawn darts in the bike world if ya ask me so why not create yet another new pointless standard for the bike co's marketing teams.
    No, I'm NOT back!

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nagaredama
    Tapered head tubes...lame just like 15mm front axles.

    How much weight can really be saved? Does it justify the increased costs? I think not.

    Make all head tubes 1.5" and give people the option of running 1.5" steer tubes forks or 1.125" zero stack or normal.
    x1 , took the thoughts right out of my head.
    It's Better To Die On Your Feet Than To Live On Your Knees. (Emiliano Zapata)

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    I don't get the need for another standard. Either make them all 1.5", or all 1 1/8th".

    Personally for anything like the RFX or bigger, I'd prefer full 1.5", that way people can run whatever they want like Nagaredama mentioned. Plenty of companies make step down headsets now.
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  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1soulrider
    Tapered headtubes, 1 1/2 lower & 1 1/8 upper cups.
    Pros, cons, etc., what are your thoughts?
    I must have missed the last discussion on this - not that it matters

    Pros:
    -Stiffness is increased over 1 1/8" and not far off 1.5 (theoretically)
    -Can use any 1 1/8" stem - this has been the Achilles heel of 1.5 for non hard core FR/DH 1.5 users. There is currently limited selection of 1.5 stems and they are relatively heavy compared to 1 1/8". With a tapered setup people can use any old standard stem
    -Can still run a standard 1 1/8" fork with a lower cup reducer
    -Looks badass

    Cons:
    - Creates reason for people to whine. There really aren't any negatives to a tapered steerer
    “Life is like riding a bicycle. To keep your balance, you must keep moving.”

    ― Albert Einstein

  11. #11
    Huh?
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    Didn't DT mention in one of his post that there is almost no discernable difference in stiffness between the two 1 1/8 and 1.5? If I recall correctly most of the flex in a fork was found to be in the lower crown and that the move to 1.5 wasn't going to make a difference?

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by aixelsyd
    Didn't DT mention in one of his post that there is almost no discernable difference in stiffness between the two 1 1/8 and 1.5? If I recall correctly most of the flex in a fork was found to be in the lower crown and that the move to 1.5 wasn't going to make a difference?
    Flex in the crown (or rather at the crown/steerer tube junction) is exactly why a 1.5 or tapered steerer tube is going to be more robust.

  13. #13
    AW_
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    Steerer tubes occasionally do break, or bend. If the 1.5 is more resistant to this, then I am all for it. According to RockShox, the 1.5 steerer tube is both lighter and stiffer than 1.125.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by AW_
    Steerer tubes occasionally do break, or bend. If the 1.5 is more resistant to this, then I am all for it. According to RockShox, the 1.5 steerer tube is both lighter and stiffer than 1.125.
    I could be wrong, but I think it was ebxtreme who sometime last summer said after riding some 1 1/8th" head tube/fork bikes back to back with some 1.5" head tube bikes with 1.5" steerers, he could tell a definite difference in stiffness, especially in the steep stuff.
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  15. #15
    FM
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    Quote Originally Posted by rscecil007
    I could be wrong, but I think it was ebxtreme who sometime last summer.....
    Well, he bent a 1-1/8th steerer on a older zocchi 66, so that counts for "noticing"
    I'm not sure if it was a steel or alu steerer.
    He weighs like 160 after shaving. I think thats a pretty good case for some kind of beefier standard!

    I also know that it's tough to make a 50mm stem for 1.5 and 31.8 bars- so +1 for tapered.

    If headsets will be readily available for this standard, I'm on board. I would be bummed to see straight 1-1/8 on the new RFX. I'm not sold on bigger steerer tubes so much, but I have noticed 1.5 headsets are less noise & maintenance with the extra crown race surface.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by FM
    Well, he bent a 1-1/8th steerer on a older zocchi 66, so that counts for "noticing"
    He weighs like 160 after shaving. I think thats a pretty good case for some kind of beefier standard!

    I also know that it's tough to make a 50mm stem for 1.5 and 31.8 bars- so +1 for tapered.


    1.5" 50mm stem

    But I like the extra beefiness for us guys who hover around that 200 lb mark geared up. Makes me feel better at any rate.
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  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by aixelsyd
    Didn't DT mention in one of his post that there is almost no discernable difference in stiffness between the two 1 1/8 and 1.5? If I recall correctly most of the flex in a fork was found to be in the lower crown and that the move to 1.5 wasn't going to make a difference?
    I think this would only apply to double triple clamp forks.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by juan_speeder
    I think this would only apply to double triple clamp forks.
    I was trying to find where he talked about it and now that you mention this it could have had more to do with the DHR remaining at 1 1/8.. Since most DH bikes use the bigger forks but the steerers are almost all 1 1/8. That and the dual crown makes up any lack of stiffness that a single crown would have

  19. #19
    the refurbished one
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    cons: they look funny! no, really...
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    Sokrates is dead, Galilei is dead, Newton is dead, Einstein is dead, Pantani is dead and i am feeling sick too.

  20. #20
    MK_
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    If the biggest benefit of the tapered steerer is stem availablity, a 1.5 head tube still allows you to run a tapered setup.

    _MK
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    "No man goes before his time -- unless the boss leaves early."
    -- Marx, Groucho

  21. #21
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    stiffer

    It was correctly pointed out to my way back statement about 1 1/8th being plenty stiff as the distance between the cups is not enough for someone to feel the flex..... that most of a single crown fork flex is below the crown race, so that settled it for me, I 'got' it, that is why the tapered exists. Cane Creek makes em, King makes em and lot of imports are available with the 'mixed' bearings. All the advantages of 1.5 with none of the stem and upper head set drawbacks.

    I am NOT trying to replace the Highline with this bike. The Highline is gone. Deal with it. If someone wants a monster bike that pedals well buy a 7 Point on sale and laugh off of every 25 to flat. CC will be the distance judge.

    DT

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by turnerbikes
    It was correctly pointed out to my way back statement about 1 1/8th being plenty stiff as the distance between the cups is not enough for someone to feel the flex..... that most of a single crown fork flex is below the crown race, so that settled it for me, I 'got' it, that is why the tapered exists. Cane Creek makes em, King makes em and lot of imports are available with the 'mixed' bearings. All the advantages of 1.5 with none of the stem and upper head set drawbacks.

    I am NOT trying to replace the Highline with this bike. The Highline is gone. Deal with it. If someone wants a monster bike that pedals well buy a 7 Point on sale and laugh off of every 25 to flat. CC will be the distance judge.

    DT
    So you're saying the next sultan will have a tapered HT?


  23. #23
    Elitest thrill junkie
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    If we don't hurry up and claim that we wan't some other sort of headtube configuration Dave might get wise.

    I vote for Gary Fisher Evolution 1.25" top AND bottom. Compramise.
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

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  24. #24
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    How many forks are/will even be available in this format? And how many people would actually choose to run one if the bike had a 1.5" headtube and they could run any of the three options (1 1/8", tapered, 1.5"). Ten percent, if that? Less than those that would run a full 1.5" I'm sure.

    So for the sake of not inconveniencing the (small) tapered crowd with having to run a reducer on their top headset cup, the 1.5" crowd gets tossed on the street, just as 1.5 160mm forks are widely available ?
    A government big enough to give you everything you want is a government big enough to take from you everything you have.

  25. #25
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    I don't give a sh!t about tapered headtubes. My Highline has 1.5, my Gruitr has 1.125. Thomson makes their Elite X4 stem in both sizes and that is the ONLY stem I ride. To hell with that "new" standard crap. Pick one or the other. 1.5 gives you the option to run anything you want. Period.

    And yes they look terribly ugly.

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