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  1. #1
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    Strength: Burner vs. Spot

    How comparable are the frame strengths of these two models? I have heard the Burner is actually stronger than the Spot. I see a lot of people riding their XCE's and Burners pretty aggressively and was wondering.

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    MK_
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jerk_Chicken
    How comparable are the frame strengths of these two models? I have heard the Burner is actually stronger than the Spot. I see a lot of people riding their XCE's and Burners pretty aggressively and was wondering.
    Well, there's a bit of an urban legend surround the Burner. Here's a proper response from DT

    "The Burner does use almost the same tubing as the last 3 years of the XCE. Butted. Small changes along the way to butt length and ratio between center and ends. The Spots is slightly thicker throughout, slightly, and with a larger diameter top tube, an eighth of an inch bigger for rigidity."

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    I also heard a hearsay statement from DT that the Burner is just as strong as the Spot, just made for different riding. Aren't they just about the same weight?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jerk_Chicken
    I also heard a hearsay statement from DT that the Burner is just as strong as the Spot, just made for different riding. Aren't they just about the same weight?
    They weight exactly the same. With the same shock the frame weight is identical. I think that the Spot is a little stronger, given larger and pricier tubing, more extensively machined bottom bracket area and the fact that it is build around 5" of travel, instead of 4; however, it has the achilles heel of the ICT pivot placement which brakes seat tubes under the weld of the main pivot. Burner has older pivot placement and doesn't suffer from the same ailment. It is a mighty strong frame, nevertheless, given that Turner used Burners for 4X racing last year.

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  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jerk_Chicken
    How comparable are the frame strengths of these two models? I have heard the Burner is actually stronger than the Spot. I see a lot of people riding their XCE's and Burners pretty aggressively and was wondering.
    I have a race specific (built up) Burner, been raced in 4X & dual slalom, as well as countless BMX track trips, still holding up without a complaint....AND....it's in it's 2rd year, as it was pro raced in 04 & now 05 by me, I would say it's strong

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    Quote Originally Posted by MK_
    The Spot has the achilles heel of the ICT pivot placement which brakes seat tubes under the weld of the main pivot. Burner has older pivot placement and doesn't suffer from the same ailment. It is a mighty strong frame, nevertheless, given that Turner used Burners for 4X racing last year._MK
    The Burner is basically overbuilt according to DT - plenty strong.

    Not to hijack the thread, but I wonder about the effect the change in pivot placement had on the suspension performance between the two bikes. With all the discussion about TNT vs HL (please no more) I wonder if anyone knows what effect the change in the rocker pivot location had. I haven't ridden the ICT design, but I know you have ridden both types MK. I didn't hear anyone arguing about the change in the linkage design the way I hear the TNT/HL debate raging - but I would bet half a donut that those two changes are similar in one respect - virtually undetectable to the typical rider. Any thoughts?
    When I see an adult on a bicycle, I do not despair for the future of the human race. ~H.G. Wells

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    Quote Originally Posted by cutthroat
    I haven't ridden the ICT design, but I know you have ridden both types MK. I didn't hear anyone arguing about the change in the linkage design the way I hear the TNT/HL debate raging - but I would bet half a donut that those two changes are similar in one respect - virtually undetectable to the typical rider. Any thoughts?
    My thoughts during my first ever climb on the 5 Spot was that it feels pretty much identically to the Burner (mine was stock with X rockers and 3-way swinger), with added benefit of smacking rocks less. That thought was based on the geometry of the bike and how it felt in general. I would be lying if I said that I felt any difference in pedaling efficiency, brake squat/jack, etc. It just felt like it was equally fast on the uphill and worlds faster and more stable on the down. I have since completely forgotten how the Burner felt and so it is hard for me to elaborate further. I have also rebuilt my 5* into a different beast than what it initially was.

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    Good point cutthroat, I've got some time on a buddys Spot and owned a Truth, to me the Burner has a little different feel as far as the rear suspension, a bit firmer and a very slight bit of bob when pedaling over smooth terrain. The Truth and the Spot had no perceived movement when pedaling, and to me they felt identical(rear susp. wise) regardless of the travel diff., although I felt the Spot was a better descender and the Truth was a better climber due to the geometry and 5" vs. 4" forks up front.

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    The leverage on the rear suspension is different, so I'm wondering if that could contribute not necessarily to strength, but decreased likelihood of a failure. And don't forget those gussets up front.

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    A way to rephrase my question is:
    If both suspensions are set up against harsh bottoming (ie: set properly), what height jumps can a Burner do and what height can a Spot do?

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