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  1. #1
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  2. #2
    No, that's not phonetic
    Reputation: tscheezy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by xclr
    FWIW
    I don't suppose you noticed which forum this was, eh?
    My video techniques can be found in this thread.

  3. #3
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    And the decline of Ellsworth ramps up? Seems like a well beaten path there going down...

  4. #4
    dog's best friend
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    next... Walmart

    nuff said

  5. #5
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    I dunno, this line gave me a nice chuckle:
    We have conducted some extensive training so the Ellsworth and Instant Center Tracking stories are properly told which should result in an excellent partnership,” said Wisenteiner.
    I guess the "properly told" story depends on who you speak to. Maybe it's something like TE thought of it while caring for sick kids in Cambodia or running a peace conference with Bono?

  6. #6
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    My favorite line from the article:

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Wisenheimer, Ellsworth VP of Sales and Marketing
    We have conducted some extensive training so the Ellsworth and Instant Center Tracking stories are properly told which should result in an excellent partnership, said Wisenteiner.
    I don't care what side of the ICT/TNT debate you're on, that's funny.

    "...so the...ICT stories are properly told..."

    So they've got a complete training curriculum for spreading their propaganda . Hah, that's funny. Ellsworth (the man and the company) takes quite a beating on the Turner board but sometimes they really do bring it on themselves.

    Patrick

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jerk_Chicken
    I dunno, this line gave me a nice chuckle:
    You beat me to it.

    Patrick

  8. #8
    Living the Dream
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    I don't see the REI deal lasting

    REI has a great return policy I.E. Return Every Item. I can imagine what will happen when they have to warranty a bunch broken ICT machines and then try to return them to Tony the Tiger.
    "And I shout that your all fakes and you should have seen the look on your face"

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by PCinSC
    My favorite line from the article:



    I don't care what side of the ICT/TNT debate you're on, that's funny.

    "...so the...ICT stories are properly told..."

    So they've got a complete training curriculum for spreading their propaganda . Hah, that's funny. Ellsworth (the man and the company) takes quite a beating on the Turner board but sometimes they really do bring it on themselves.

    Patrick
    This is an example of the Ellsworth Story:

    ICT is a patented concept around which most Ellsworth frames are designed, allowing Ellsworth engineers to create an extremely efficient suspension design. ICT aligns the Instant Center on the chain torque line, so a rider’s pedaling motion won't activate the suspension. To understand why, you must first understand the following three items:

    1) Instant Center (IC) -- The IC is the point at which the suspension is balanced at any specific point in the suspension cycle. At that instant, forces are neither working downward nor upward. As a suspension moves through its cycle, so does the IC. The IC is located at the intersection of two imaginary linkage lines: in the case of an Ellsworth suspension frame, the first line is drawn from the rear lower chain stay link through the BB pivot into infinity in front of the bike; the second line is drawn from the rear rocker pivot through the seat tube pivot out into infinity in front of the bike.

    2) Chain Torque Line (CTL) -- The CTL is an imaginary line that follows the chain from the top of the middle cog on a cassette over the top of the middle chainring on the crank out into infinity in front of the bike. As the name suggests, this is the line at which the rider is placing torque on the chain.

    3) The Intersection -- When the IC and CTL consistently intersect or track the cycle of the suspension, this is the Ellsworth patented zone known as ICT. Because these lines intersect, the chain torque has no effect on the suspension through its cycle. Thus, rider’s pedaling motion does not activate the suspension

    While ICT is featured on the four-bar engineered Ellsworth frames: Truth, Epiphany, Moment and Rogue, the patented ATLAS design is featured on Ellsworth’s two single pivot bikes: Distance and Chaos. ATLAS uses a one-piece CNC machined swingarm and a single pivot, making the design both simple and affordable.

    The secret to the ATLAS design is similar to that of ICT – it’s all about the chain torque line. Ellsworth places the forward pivot on the chain torque line, and the rear dropout well below it. This creates both minimal arcing of the axle path and maximizes the efficiency of the pedal stroke. And, the one-piece swingarm mated to the frame with sealed cartridge bearings provides the ultimate torsional stiffness. The end product is a smooth riding bike that won’t rob you of energy or your hard-earned cash.

    Ideas like these are the product of passion – passion that fuels creativity – creativity that produces fantastic bikes. A mantra inside the Ellsworth catalog is, “…no expense will be spared in creating the lightest, most energy efficient bikes in the world, without limits, compromises … or equals.” Arrogant? We don’t think so. Ride one and see.

  10. #10
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    I'm a homer too! I just thought that it's funny how Turner flies under the radar and TE has to ally with REI.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jerk_Chicken
    This is an example of the Ellsworth Story:
    Is it OK that I didn't read all the way through it? I got bored. If some salesman tries to spring that treatise on me while I'm shopping for a bike I'm gonna laugh in his face. And I don't have anything against Ellsworth's personally.

    Patrick

  12. #12
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    who





    cares......
    Sit and spin my ass...

  13. #13
    DGC
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    ... and if we just ... you know what we need?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerk_Chicken
    I dunno, this line gave me a nice chuckle:

    I guess the "properly told" story depends on who you speak to. Maybe it's something like TE thought of it while caring for sick kids in Cambodia or running a peace conference with Bono?
    We need someone from the boards here in the know to play a customer interested in an Ellsworthless bike and see what "properly told" story really gets told from salesman to salesman and store to store with REI.
    OUCH...!!!!!!

  14. #14
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    apparently Bicycle Retailer now uses the term "boutique" as a synonym for

    OVERPRICED
    BOGUS WARRANTY
    EASILY BROKEN
    HUGE RIPOFF

  15. #15
    Daniel the Dog
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    I think the only problem is sketchy QA and warranty service

    The new Ellsworth bikes are made in my town by some folks who try very hard to do their craft very well. Nonetheless, I have to believe the quality assurance is better on the Pacific rim. For example, I just picked up a Moment frame that had some roughness int the seat tube and some toothpaste looking welds around the bottom of the head tube. Still a beautiful machine that I could ride all day. The smoothness of the pivots is very nice...my Turner ain't that smooth. Impact ride? Probably not but still very smooth pivots.

    Jaybo

    PS Ellsworth bike are not easily broken. That is just silly.

  16. #16
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    Saw a new Ells on the trail the other day. The bridge between the rocker plates caught my eye. Anything that ups the lateral rigidity of a bike seems like a good idea to me. Not shopping or anything, just wonder why DT hasn't monkeyed around with this idea (or maybe he has, and found it be nothing more than eye candy).
    The drive towards achievement and success is the motive power of civilization.

  17. #17
    No, that's not phonetic
    Reputation: tscheezy's Avatar
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    Turner uses rockers that taper together in front so that the upper shock bolt can be shorter. If there were a permanent rocker bridge behind the seat tube, there would be no way to get the rockers onto the bike unless they did away with the rocker convergence at the upper shock bolt. And a bolt-on bridge inbetween the rockers (so that you could separate them for installation) would basically be cosmetic. Seems a little pointless. I would rather they keep putting the money into the huge cnc block at the bb. That's where the meat needs to be.
    My video techniques can be found in this thread.

  18. #18
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    The bushings are one piece axle assemblies, so they're supposed to "tie" the rockers together on Turners, as opposed to other manufacturers bolting them toeach side individually.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jaybo
    PS Ellsworth bike are not easily broken. That is just silly.
    troll, and a weak one at that. almost as weak as the several broken Ellsworths I've seen personally, one of which I broke.

  20. #20
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    No beef with either of the points above, just saying a bridge might make things even stiffer.

    Which can only be good.

    The Ells bridge (just got a quick look) was carbon. I didn't really care for the gucci, roadie-style look on a dirt bike.
    The drive towards achievement and success is the motive power of civilization.

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