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  1. #1
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    Got my Ti Spring from 123Bikes

    Just weighed my 550# T Spring on my lab balance. 302.62g

    Anybody knopw the weight of a steel 550#? Mine is on my bike at the shop.

  2. #2
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    Got mine too

    I received mine as well, yesterday. 3 month wait.

    The weight of my 550 spring on a digital postal scale is 12.0 oz.

    The weight of the Ti spring is 10.7 oz.

    Not sure what that equates to in grams.

    That makes for a whopping 1.3 oz weight savings. $153.86 per oz!!!!

    One side note.....Due to the increased spring length I had to back the preload adjuster all the way out to get the spring on.


    Yipes. I know I am completely outta control now!
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    What the EFF is "All MOUNTAIN"???

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by steve3
    1.3oz. X 28.3gms.= approximately 36.8 grams. Not much of a savings for the price.

    I wasn't aware that the length had to be increased on the Ti springed models to be equivalent to steel.
    It looks like they sold him a spring with a 2.5-2.75 iinch stroke capability.Ti vs Steel/in a given stroke Ti can be shorter.He should ask 123 what stroke that spring was designed for.If you use the correct stroke the weight savings will be greater.

  4. #4
    Baked Alaskan
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    it does look too long

    Quote Originally Posted by DHRracer
    It looks like they sold him a spring with a 2.5-2.75 iinch stroke capability.Ti vs Steel/in a given stroke Ti can be shorter.He should ask 123 what stroke that spring was designed for.If you use the correct stroke the weight savings will be greater.

    Look at DGC and Pete's Ti springs, they seem shorter. Weight is about half of the steel equal, at least it was for a friends Fox. I'd send it back. Just my .02.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by DHRracer
    It looks like they sold him a spring with a 2.5-2.75 iinch stroke capability.Ti vs Steel/in a given stroke Ti can be shorter.He should ask 123 what stroke that spring was designed for.If you use the correct stroke the weight savings will be greater.
    I know, I was surprised at the length and minimal weight savings as well. I shot them an email inquiring as to whether this 550 spring was "one size fits all" deal or what? I really didn't get much of a response. I'm going to contact them again.

    I'm somewhat disappointed with the whole transaction, though. I placed my order in early december, my CC had been processed and 3 months later I've got a whopping 1.3 oz weight saving for my $200.00. No one to blame but myself.

    I've seen pictures of DGC's bike as well. His 550 spring is considerably shorter, and I imagine a few oz lighter to boot.


    DGC, if you watching....what are your thoughts?
    What the EFF is "All MOUNTAIN"???

  6. #6
    Daniel the Dog
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    Cool factor is extrodinary but the weight savings is pathetic....

    Quote Originally Posted by Aquaholic
    I received mine as well, yesterday. 3 month wait.

    The weight of my 550 spring on a digital postal scale is 12.0 oz.

    The weight of the Ti spring is 10.7 oz.

    Not sure what that equates to in grams.

    That makes for a whopping 1.3 oz weight savings. $153.86 per oz!!!!

    One side note.....Due to the increased spring length I had to back the preload adjuster all the way out to get the spring on.


    Yipes. I know I am completely outta control now!
    Geeze! You could pull of a hunk of dirt and save more weight.

    Jaybo

  7. #7
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    I'd send that spring back - Buyer Beware

    Quote Originally Posted by Jaak
    Just weighed my 550# T Spring on my lab balance. 302.62g

    Anybody knopw the weight of a steel 550#? Mine is on my bike at the shop.

    It looks way too long.

    I was ranting about this subject about a month ago. I was upset that 123 was talking about how great the ti springs were and how there would be a significant weight savings. 123 didn't list lengths or weights. That was the first clue.

    I was concerned that the weight savings would not be large. Well guess what?

    What's the point of having a Ti spring that basically weighs the same as the stock spring? Wow....$200 for a silver colored spring. Maybe I'll paint my stock spring silver and save the $200.

    I hope that 123 takes care of you. This is total bull sh!t. Buyer beware when anyone tries to sell stuff without giving specifics

    Let us know how you fare with 123..

  8. #8
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    Just terrible

    Quote Originally Posted by Jaybo
    Geeze! You could pull of a hunk of dirt and save more weight.

    Jaybo
    I think that it's a complete ripoff. For $200, you can upgrade to better components for the bike.....components that will save more weight than that Ti spring.

    I was considering getting that spring from 123. Boy am I glad that I didn't! I'll only buy a ti spring if AND when I get full specs for it....weight, rate, length, and probably a guarantee of some sort......not a silver spring that for all intents and purposes is no different than the stock spring.

    Heck....you could almost see that weight savings just by switching form a 2.25" spring to a 2.0" spring.....no ti.

    I'm gonna go ride. I hope that 123 remedies this or I'll scratch them off for all future purchases.

  9. #9
    Daniel the Dog
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    Bonking ... not feelin' well Sounds like BS bike marketing crude....

    Quote Originally Posted by WarrGuru
    It looks way too long.

    I was ranting about this subject about a month ago. I was upset that 123 was talking about how great the ti springs were and how there would be a significant weight savings. 123 didn't list lengths or weights. That was the first clue.

    I was concerned that the weight savings would not be large. Well guess what?

    What's the point of having a Ti spring that basically weighs the same as the stock spring? Wow....$200 for a silver colored spring. Maybe I'll paint my stock spring silver and save the $200.

    I hope that 123 takes care of you. This is total bull sh!t. Buyer beware when anyone tries to sell stuff without giving specifics

    Let us know how you fare with 123..
    The bike industry is full of misinformation and marketing. For example, I just held a Manitou Black Elite and a Fox Vanilla in my dirt stained paws. Both are supposed to be 4.1 lbs or whatever. The Black Elite was noticably lighter. I could go on and on about this weight marketing crap. Most of it is just designed to seperate us suckers from our dough. I'm feeling ornery today.

    I have fallen prey to this fictitious marketing a bunch of times. Kind of like the dog that keeps running into the car bumper.

    Jaybo

  10. #10
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    Naff all i can do over here

    Just reading this thread in the U.K. and feeling slightly sick when UPS phones wanting a credit card for import duty and VAT for my TOO BIG ti spring.....nightmare, although i currently have a 2.25 steel so i might save another 5grams or so (trying to make myself feel better) Are there any possible advantages of running a longer spring? Maybe we could run a smaller bump stop for more active travel (getting desperate now)

  11. #11
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    The jury is still out.....

    OK, just got off the phone with 123Bikes.

    This 550 Spring is being returned. I have not ridden on it other than a quick driveway prerun. I'm going to try the 500 lb'r, which is 256 grams(47grams lighter than the 550).

    The way it was explained to me was that they went with the longer length spring to accomodate multi length shocks. While primarily designed for us 5 spotters, the same spring will work on an ID. "One size fits all".

    Had I known that, I probably would not have spent the $$$ on this.

    My concern is that I am somewhat in between spring rates. I run the 550(steel) with absolutely no preload. The preload collar just kisses the spring. I'm going to try the 500lb spring with a bit of preload. I just hope that it's enough spring for me.

    BTW, the 500 lb spring is the same length as the 550.


    Still, not a signifiant overall weight savings at the end of the day.

    Me thinks a can of silver paint may have been the hot setup.


    Stay tuned!
    Last edited by Aquaholic; 03-09-2004 at 01:26 PM.
    What the EFF is "All MOUNTAIN"???

  12. #12
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    This POS is going back

    Quote Originally Posted by WarrGuru
    It looks way too long.

    I was ranting about this subject about a month ago. I was upset that 123 was talking about how great the ti springs were and how there would be a significant weight savings. 123 didn't list lengths or weights. That was the first clue.

    I was concerned that the weight savings would not be large. Well guess what?

    What's the point of having a Ti spring that basically weighs the same as the stock spring? Wow....$200 for a silver colored spring. Maybe I'll paint my stock spring silver and save the $200.

    I hope that 123 takes care of you. This is total bull sh!t. Buyer beware when anyone tries to sell stuff without giving specifics

    Let us know how you fare with 123..
    I'm glad I kept the box. I am sending this POS spring right back where it came from. Talk about misleading.

  13. #13
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    Thank you,I know not to order one.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aquaholic
    I received mine as well, yesterday. 3 month wait.

    The weight of my 550 spring on a digital postal scale is 12.0 oz.

    The weight of the Ti spring is 10.7 oz.

    Not sure what that equates to in grams.

    That makes for a whopping 1.3 oz weight savings. $153.86 per oz!!!!

    One side note.....Due to the increased spring length I had to back the preload adjuster all the way out to get the spring on.


    Yipes. I know I am completely outta control now!

    I would send it back, nor even 2 oz is a joke. However it looks there long (does it fit the romic?) and <2oz does contraddict a posting from long time ago (classic forum) that claimed:

    Romic w/ Ti spring 552 grams
    Romic w/ steel spring 729 grams

    which is a more sizable gain. But this is crazy, the only reason to go titanium is weight savings and there should be an official site with specific comparisons (including lenghts, and spring rates) ... man ... less than 2 oz ....
    Last edited by Davide; 03-09-2004 at 04:42 PM.

  14. #14
    Lay off the Levers
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    Upset $200 Can O' Paint...

    Quote Originally Posted by Aquaholic
    OK, just got off the phone with 123Bikes...

    ...The way it was explained to me was that they went with the longer length spring to accomodate multi length shocks. While primarily designed for us 5 spotters, the same spring will work on an ID. "One size fits all"...Me thinks a can of silver paint may have been the hot setup.
    Oh what a total crock of crap...now did they REALLY expect someone with a stock spring to try one of these and be satisfied?

    Someone there should have realized that anyone who'd be willing to shell out 200-doobies for a friggin' spring would probably want to weigh it to justify the cost. Now I wonder how much the EW steel spring weighs? And can anyone explain why it's so difficult to get a proper Ti spring? It's not a strategic metal anymore what's the deal?

    Silver paint indeed. I hope they don't sweat your refund. Sorry to hear about the experience. And if they don't come clean, you should post this in the "General" board.

    Since DGC left, 123's been looking sort of rough.
    Faster is better, even when it's not.

  15. #15
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    Interesting

    Quote Originally Posted by Jaak
    Just weighed my 550# T Spring on my lab balance. 302.62g

    Anybody knopw the weight of a steel 550#? Mine is on my bike at the shop.

    Just looked again at 123bikes.com website. They list the weight of the Ti spring 256 g. I did not use a scale to weigh mine. I use a $4,000 analytical balance! The spring does not weigh 256 grams. It weighs exactly 302.62 grams. That is a difference of 46.6 grams. (1/10 of a pound) Also, I have a hard time beleiveing that they just got this number. When I ordered my spring, no weight was listed--not even a ballpark figure. Why? Oh well, mine is going back anyway. I won't be shopping at 123bikes again.

    "Fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me." ~Chinese Proverb

  16. #16
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    Ti spring weight

    I have also been salivating for the Ti spring for months. Went so far to have it overnighted to me (cabin fever). With my Rapala digital fish scale (actually pretty accurate).
    Steel Romic 500 lbs.x 2.25= 12 oz.
    Ti 550 lbs.= 10 oz.
    WOW (2 oz.)! It barely fit, the length is about 1 1/2" longer. It does look better but not $199 + shipping better. Also the new 5 spot has no American flag on it and the medium weighs about 5 oz. more than the '03 I had (7 lbs. 6 oz. vs 7 lbs. 1 oz. before ti upgrade) Are the frames or front triangles being sourced out? I can't imagine the powder rear and 5 spot stickers adding 5 oz.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Larsey
    I have also been salivating for the Ti spring for months. Went so far to have it overnighted to me (cabin fever). With my Rapala digital fish scale (actually pretty accurate).
    Steel Romic 500 lbs.x 2.25= 12 oz.
    Ti 550 lbs.= 10 oz.
    WOW (2 oz.)! It barely fit, the length is about 1 1/2" longer. It does look better but not $199 + shipping better.
    Sorry to hear about this. I hope you get it taken care of.


    Quote Originally Posted by Larsey
    Also the new 5 spot has no American flag on it and the medium weighs about 5 oz. more than the '03 I had (7 lbs. 6 oz. vs 7 lbs. 1 oz. before ti upgrade) Are the frames or front triangles being sourced out? I can't imagine the powder rear and 5 spot stickers adding 5 oz.
    Good questions... I could imagine the powdercoat would weighing 2 oz though... It's some pretty thick isht, especially the Red and Blue as they are double layer treatments. You might have noticed the Turner website quotes the weight of a medium black frame and points out other colors weigh different. But I have no idea. As for the stickers, I have spares of both sets, the new stickers feel lighter.

    ...And I'd be highly suprised if DT started with overseas fab. I'm pretty sure they are still using Sapa in Portland.

    From the new website:
    Quote Originally Posted by www.turnerbikes.com
    "Where are Turner frames designed and built?[size=-1]
    The frame ideas and designs come from a world none of us can really understand, no not another planet but David Turners mind. All of the design works is done in Temecula CA. In a tiny office with insufficient air conditioning in the summer and not enough heat in the winter. Out of the same office we handle all of the marketing, sales, quality control and final assembly. Every frame is loved with pride and joy until it has been delivered to its proud new owner. As for the actual fabrication, our frames our built by a facility in Portland Oregon and yes in their spare time they tinker with spacecraft and jet airplanes.[/size]"
    Faster is better, even when it's not.

  18. #18
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    Don't have them in hand now but I've had a 550 and a 700lb Ti spring for the 1.5 stroke Romics. Both were considerably shorter and with fewer turns then the steel spring. In fact, the Ti spring would only allow about 3 turns of preload before you ran out of threads on the shock body.

  19. #19
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    Hey Steve3

    I was going to drop you an email but yours is disabled. Anyway Supergo has '04 Burners (red, blue and black) on sale for $949.95. They said they bought out the whole batch, sounds like a killer deal. The shock is a Fox RL. I would guess it still has Pro Pedal but don't know that for sure.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bikezilla
    Oh what a total crock of crap...now did they REALLY expect someone with a stock spring to try one of these and be satisfied?

    Someone there should have realized that anyone who'd be willing to shell out 200-doobies for a friggin' spring would probably want to weigh it to justify the cost.

    Since DGC left, 123's been looking sort of rough.
    Uh, maybe the weight weiners are in a tizzy but there are plenty of folks that would shell out $200 and not weigh the spring, other than holding the steel in one hand and the ti in another and realizing that the ti is a bit lighter..

    I look forward to riding with David again this Summer and the service from 123 hasn't changed since he left, from my perspective. He was handling the tech side of things rather than the sales side of things after all.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Larsey
    I have also been salivating for the Ti spring for months. Went so far to have it overnighted to me (cabin fever). With my Rapala digital fish scale (actually pretty accurate).
    Steel Romic 500 lbs.x 2.25= 12 oz.
    Ti 550 lbs.= 10 oz.
    WOW (2 oz.)! It barely fit, the length is about 1 1/2" longer. It does look better but not $199 + shipping better. Also the new 5 spot has no American flag on it and the medium weighs about 5 oz. more than the '03 I had (7 lbs. 6 oz. vs 7 lbs. 1 oz. before ti upgrade) Are the frames or front triangles being sourced out? I can't imagine the powder rear and 5 spot stickers adding 5 oz.
    That is hilarious!

    Whining about a 5 oz difference?

    Christ, these kinds of questions beg the question:

    Are folks interested in how frames ride or interested in obsessing about who much they weigh?

  22. #22
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    Weight

    I wouldn't exactly call it whining. Just curious why the 5 oz. increase in weight from a '03 Silver 5 spot with polished rear and a '04 Red 5 spot with powder coat rear. My main question is the frame didn't have a flag on the seat tube and thought maybe they were sourcing out the front triangle. Isn't this board for info and questions like that?

  23. #23
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    Pitcture of Romic with Ti Spring 6.5/1.5

    Quote Originally Posted by AK Chris
    Look at DGC and Pete's Ti springs, they seem shorter. Weight is about half of the steel equal, at least it was for a friends Fox. I'd send it back. Just my .02.

    Just bought this shock on ebay here's the link if you want to see what it looks like.
    http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...tem=3664793695 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...tem=3664793695

    It looks a lot shorter with fewer turns. don't know if it is lighter or not.

  24. #24
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    So let me ask you this......

    Would you rather run a heavier spring with no preload, or a 50 lb lighter spring with a bit of preload? And why?
    What the EFF is "All MOUNTAIN"???

  25. #25
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    Both

    Quote Originally Posted by Aquaholic
    Would you rather run a heavier spring with no preload, or a 50 lb lighter spring with a bit of preload? And why?
    I do exactly that. I run a 500# spring with no preload most of the time. Occasionally I want the bike to be more plush, so I switch to a 450# spring with 3 turns of preload....saaaaaweeeeeet!

    One spring rate is not "right" and the others "wrong". It's preference. I just love the ability to switch springs. You can't do that with air shocks without affecting sag.

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