Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 100 of 262
  1. #1
    DGC
    DGC is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation: DGC's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    1,345

    DW 5 Spot RP23 mod

    So if you read my review of the DW Spot, at the end i mentioned the bottom out on the shock. I have heard only a few people mention the same thing, easy to bottom out.
    Instead of bumping the air pressure up, losing sag and losing small bump performance, I have come up with a mod that will end the ease at bottom out and keep all small bump and mid stroke plushness pretty much the same. Does not take an expensive rebuilt custom tuned shock either. Everyone of you can do this mod in a few minutes. it is very simple.
    If you remember some years ago I was making shims for the DHX air for the 5 Spot. Instead of just dumping the shock and moving onto the RP23 I wanted to try to ramp up the end of the stroke on the dhx-a, it did not fix the mid stroke wallow, but it sure made for a nice decending shock. The same idea applies here. I had throughout all the riding/testing on the DW 5 Spot done a ride or loop on the shock as stock, then lnstalled the shim and did the same ride minutes later. I did this many times to be sure the shim idea was going to be acceptable. Not only did it turn out acceptable, but the results were so good, I won't go back to the stock set up.
    All I am essentially doing is reducing the air sleeve volume. The outer large sleeve that is, NOT the main air sleeve. I will say this again later, leave the main air sleeve on the shock, it does not need to be removed.
    The shim is made of ski base material, or better known as plastic. EXACTLY 1.2mm thick. I have tried thicker, around 1.5-1.7mm and it makes it nearly impossible to get the air sleeve back on. Any ski shop has this stuff. It is quite cheap. A few bucks or maybe 5 bucks and your set. It gets sold to us ski shops in sheets and even rolls. Many thicknesses are offered so stick with the exact 1.2mm rule and you will be fine. Get an accurate set of calipers to measure, or borrow some. I have tried a few different width pieces and I found the one I will reccomend being about the best size for the average rider on the DW 5 Spot.
    The size i felt works real good is 135mm long by 20mm wide. Keep the length exact at 135mm's. My riding weight is 190 lbs., I like agressive rough technical rides with plenty of chance for small air's, so trust me this size is good to start with. If you were really having a bottom out problem and are doing lots of small drops and kickers then maybe a little wider, but make yourself known and I will tell you what I think based on your needs. I tried a 23mm wide piece, I like the 20mm better.
    First off, get enough of the materail or something similar that is plyable enough to roll up into the size of a half dollar, stiff and brittle wont work. There should be other stuff out there just about the thickness and softness as the ski base stuff i use. Plastic is all over the place if you think about it.
    Once you got the material, cut your piece with a sharp box knife, thin blades work best. Next, with the shock off the bike, release all air from the shock air valve. LEAVE the main air sleeve on the shock. Then remove big metal c-clip that sits on the end of the outer air sleeve. I use a c-clip tool and barely put any pressure on each end of the c-clip and it raises up enough to get of with your fingers from here. Then grasp the outer air sleeve and push down on it away from the top of the shock and it will easily pop right off. Clean any dirt from both ends of the air sleeve as there are 2 big air seals that need to reseal properly. Installing the shim is shown in one of my pictures, roll the shim up tight so you get get it on the air sleeve without touching the edge of the shim to the seal. Put the shim inside and at the end of the air sleeve (bottom end) in which the c-clip sits against. The other end (top end) of the air sleeve is where the air bleed hole is located, this is where air comes from the main sleeve, don't cover it up with the shim. Make sense so far?
    When you position the shim against the inside of the body and at the bottom end of the air sleeve you can actually click or press the shim ends together for a good fit, that is why I say exactly 135mm long on the shim. It will stay there securely. Then put c-clip back in place, it will sit in its groove, then air up the shock and go ride it......!!!!!!
    It is simple to do this.
    I am running about 5-10 psi. less air with the shim. Remember you are taking away air space or volume so a little less air might be what you end up with. I have been running sag right about 15 or 16mm's, about 5/8 of an inch.
    Trust me, this works damn good. Sounds a little wierd, but if both Rock Shox and Fox are using plastic spacers in their shocks then there is no reason to doubt this mod if you need a little ramp at the end of the stroke for bottom out protection.

    Remember this line...........Try it, you'll like it. """Mikey likes it and he hates everything....!!!!"""

    Any questions? Ask away.
    Attached Images Attached Images
    OUCH...!!!!!!

  2. #2
    gnuH
    Reputation: kiwirider's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Posts
    1,164
    At 135x20x1.2mm you get a volume reduction of 3.24cc.

    You could do what I do and squirt in an extra 3/4 of a 5cc pillow pack of Fox Fluid into the air can and get the same result. Don't even have to remove the shock from the bike to get the fluid in. I've been doing this for about 18 months and have not experienced any problems with fluid migrating into the negative air chamber or blocking the bleed hole. Ramps up the last inch or so of travel nicely.

    PUSH also offer a bottom out 'bumper' as part of their tune that serves the same purpose. A few 575 riders have had the bumper installed with good results.

  3. #3
    DGC
    DGC is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation: DGC's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    1,345
    Quote Originally Posted by kiwirider
    At 135x20x1.2mm you get a volume reduction of 3.24cc.

    You could do what I do and squirt in an extra 3/4 of a 5cc pillow pack of Fox Fluid into the air can and get the same result. Don't even have to remove the shock from the bike to get the fluid in. I've been doing this for about 18 months and have not experienced any problems with fluid migrating into the negative air chamber or blocking the bleed hole. Ramps up the last inch or so of travel nicely.

    PUSH also offer a bottom out 'bumper' as part of their tune that serves the same purpose. A few 575 riders have had the bumper installed with good results.
    Only problem with extra lube in there, is it will eventually come out, changing the amount of effect from when first put in, and it will make more of a mess especially when riding in warm weather. I had tried this a few years back with the dhx-a, it made a mess and I could feel a loss of progressiveness 2 weeks after the change, there was lube all over the shock shaft. A thick grease would be better than float fluid if you choose this route over the shim. Push is charging how much to tune your shock....and add the shim?
    OUCH...!!!!!!

  4. #4
    I'm more of a dog person
    Reputation: unclekittykiller's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Posts
    864
    i just read somewhere that the 2010 RP23 will include the Boost Valve technology to control bottoming better. Sounds like you will need to use the PP lever to turn it off and on though, which won't do much if you ride it wide open.

  5. #5
    DGC
    DGC is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation: DGC's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    1,345

    2010

    Quote Originally Posted by unclekittykiller
    i just read somewhere that the 2010 RP23 will include the Boost Valve technology to control bottoming better. Sounds like you will need to use the PP lever to turn it off and on though, which won't do much if you ride it wide open.
    I heard the same, though I also heard the shock was not quite finalized, so we will see in a few months what comes of it.
    OUCH...!!!!!!

  6. #6
    Powered by ice cream.
    Reputation: Enel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Posts
    6,309
    Thanks for that. I don't have a Sultan, but I do need to reduce the volume of a large can RS Monarch and I think that will do the trick.

    Apparently, RS makes "tuning bands" for the shock, but I have not found anyone who carries them.

  7. #7
    gnuH
    Reputation: kiwirider's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Posts
    1,164
    Quote Originally Posted by DGC
    Only problem with extra lube in there, is it will eventually come out, changing the amount of effect from when first put in, and it will make more of a mess especially when riding in warm weather. I had tried this a few years back with the dhx-a, it made a mess and I could feel a loss of progressiveness 2 weeks after the change, there was lube all over the shock shaft. A thick grease would be better than float fluid if you choose this route over the shim. Push is charging how much to tune your shock....and add the shim?
    Haven't had this problem with the RP23. Nothing seems to migrate into the neg chamber and certainly not out and onto the shock shaft. How where your seals? Old I expect.

  8. #8
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Posts
    4
    I just called Fox about the bottoming on my 09 5 Spot and asked about both the shim or adding fluid to the air chamber to solve it.
    They suggested I could make the compression more progressive by using a Fox standard size air sleeve(I guess the rp23 that comes stock with the 09 5 spot uses a larger sleeve).
    The sleeve and seal kit together were $40 and ordered it while I had them on the phone.
    I was directed to check their website under "tech & service" to find a air sleeve maintainence video so I can do it myself.

    Wanted to be sure I wouldn't void a warranty and thought Fox was helpful with their advice(although it cost more).

  9. #9
    Bite Me.
    Reputation: cutthroat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Posts
    4,531
    The LV (or "standard") air sleeve is a common fix for heavier riders and bottoming out problems. It's a very simple procedure - you also get a bit more plushness in the early part of the stroke since you run a lower initial air pressure than with the HV sleeve. It's more progressive at the end stroke due to the lower volume so your BO resistance goes up- a good combo all around, but basically the same idea as this ghetto option.
    When I see an adult on a bicycle, I do not despair for the future of the human race. ~H.G. Wells

  10. #10
    DGC
    DGC is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation: DGC's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    1,345

    volume reduction

    Quote Originally Posted by Enel
    Thanks for that. I don't have a Sultan, but I do need to reduce the volume of a large can RS Monarch and I think that will do the trick.

    Apparently, RS makes "tuning bands" for the shock, but I have not found anyone who carries them.
    Your welcome.
    You can probably get a LBS to order you a shim for your RS shock. If not, they may be willing to send you one direct, call SRAM. Or better yet, I can make a call for you tomorrow.
    My original post shows you can do this shim mod to suit more than just a Turner or a Fox. I show specifics as it pertains to the 2009 DW 5 Spot and the RP23 that comes with it. I have been testing my shims in my shocks for the last 4 years or so. It is a very clean, easy and effective way to change the last bit of travel, or bottoming effect.....it works damn good.
    OUCH...!!!!!!

  11. #11
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    189
    why not just run a coil over?

  12. #12
    err, 27.5+
    Reputation: AL29er's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    4,944
    Quote Originally Posted by DGC
    The shim is made of ski base material, or better known as plastic. EXACTLY 1.2mm thick. I have tried thicker, around 1.5-1.7mm and it makes it nearly impossible to get the air sleeve back on.
    I have been considering this mod to my float. Rumor has it that fox doesn't make a low volume sleeve for the 8.5x2.5 version, so this type of fix is the only way to go. At any rate, you mention that it gets impossible to assemble with thicker plastic. Would you mind elaborating? Mechanical interference I would imagine, but does the plastic get knocked out as you assemble?

    Ever thought of using something softer? I was on McMaster and see you can get sheets of polyurethane in .060" (about1.5mm). Even if there was interference, with a bit of float fluid to aid, the rubber would deform and still slip on.
    http://www.mcmaster.com/#8824t125/=16mxmx
    Quote Originally Posted by saturnine
    that's the stupidest idea this side of pinkbike.

  13. #13
    DGC
    DGC is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation: DGC's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    1,345

    softer would be fine

    Quote Originally Posted by AL29er
    I have been considering this mod to my float. Rumor has it that fox doesn't make a low volume sleeve for the 8.5x2.5 version, so this type of fix is the only way to go. At any rate, you mention that it gets impossible to assemble with thicker plastic. Would you mind elaborating? Mechanical interference I would imagine, but does the plastic get knocked out as you assemble?

    Ever thought of using something softer? I was on McMaster and see you can get sheets of polyurethane in .060" (about1.5mm). Even if there was interference, with a bit of float fluid to aid, the rubber would deform and still slip on.
    http://www.mcmaster.com/#8824t125/=16mxmx
    Softer material would work fine, it is the thickness I speak of that would make it nearly impossible to get the sleeve back on. 1.2mm thickness works real well. I have tried in the 1.5-1.75mm thick and had to really push damn hard to get the sleeve back on. I would say 1.5mm thich as the max. Thing is at 1.2mm, you can always put in a wider shim. If it feels like too much boost at the end of the stroke, cut a few mm's at a time off and try it. The plastic does not get knocked out as you assemble with it being too thick, it just makes it almost impossible to get the sleeve back on. At 135mm in length the shim sits in the sleeve failry snug and almost clicks against itself as the ends meet.
    OUCH...!!!!!!

  14. #14
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Posts
    2,591

    tried it

    I got a ride in last night with a shim like DGC shows. Amazing difference.
    This will probably work on all kinds of bikes and lengths of shocks for a couple bucks worth of plastic. I felt no difference in the first 3/4 travel and then it had the smoothest ramp up right at the end. At first I did not think it was working, with all the small bump mid stroke compliance still intact. This small bump mid stroke compliance is something that is super important to my riding, the dw-link has allowed for very light valving to be used so that the rear of the bike will absorb smaller bumps than anything I have done before and I don't want the mid stroke to be firmed up AT ALL. This mod just effects the very last bit of travel, at least in this size of shim. If someone bigger and faster than myself wanted more ramp up, they can either use a slightly thicker or slightly wider piece of plastic. It was so easy to install and with a sharp razor can be tuned perfectly. don't spend money on a small air can until you have tried a couple sizes of this. The small air can will radically alter your whole air spring, the shim in roughly the size DGC has created is an end travel adjuster.

    HDPE that can be had in sheets will work, but a cheap little trash can with thin walls from the Dollar Store works just as well, no shipping! I found that it was important to cut it the right length! If the strip is a little too short it will not 'pop' out tight and round on the inside wall of the XV sleeve which will make it grab the shock when I tried to slide the XV over the shock. If the sheet is a little thicker, make the strip a little narrower, simple.

    DT

  15. #15
    mtbr member
    Reputation: PUSHIND's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    1,880
    So, this modification has always been curious to me as we've talked about offering something like this to our customers. I just happen to have one of these bikes here so I figured I'd check it out. Here are the results:

    The first graph shows the air spring curve comparison between stock and the DGC modification.
    The second graph shows the air spring curve comparison between stock and the PUSH bottoming system.

    Darren
    Attached Images Attached Images

  16. #16
    mtbr member
    Reputation: nybike1971's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Posts
    1,882
    Quote Originally Posted by PUSHIND
    So, this modification has always been curious to me as we've talked about offering something like this to our customers. I just happen to have one of these bikes here so I figured I'd check it out. Here are the results:

    The first graph shows the air spring curve comparison between stock and the DGC modification.
    The second graph shows the air spring curve comparison between stock and the PUSH bottoming system.

    Darren
    Darren,

    Very interesting data, thanks for posting it!

    What are the two curves for each color? Is that hysteresis between the compression and rebound stroke or just different air pressures?

    Also, is the negative spring rate in the bottom set of curves at the beginning of the stroke or the inversion in the upper curves also at the beginning of the stroke a measure of the error bars on the graph? If not, how do you make sense of that behavior?

  17. #17
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Posts
    7,963
    Darren, how about a third graph showing the difference between an LV can and an HV can, with no mods to either.
    So it seems to me to be, this thing that I think I see.

  18. #18
    err, 27.5+
    Reputation: AL29er's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    4,944
    Darren, very cool. The push bottoming obviously does a better job at the end of stroke without messing with the rest of the curve. For a falling rate bike it looks like the DGC mod would be better since it has effect over the entire curve.
    Quote Originally Posted by saturnine
    that's the stupidest idea this side of pinkbike.

  19. #19
    Outcast
    Reputation: Renegade's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Posts
    8,567
    Darren, that's pretty cool, but what would be even more cool is if you would finish working on my RP3 and send it back to me.
    ****

  20. #20
    mtbr member
    Reputation: PUSHIND's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    1,880
    What are the two curves for each color? Is that hysteresis between the compression and rebound stroke or just different air pressures?
    It shows both the compression and extension stroke....if you focus on the upper part of the line that's the actual force on compression.


    Darren, that's pretty cool, but what would be even more cool is if you would finish working on my RP3 and send it back to me.
    Doh! Fed Ex didn't have any service yesterday due to the weather so it'll be leaving today.

  21. #21
    Outcast
    Reputation: Renegade's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Posts
    8,567
    Quote Originally Posted by PUSHIND
    Doh! Fed Ex didn't have any service yesterday due to the weather so it'll be leaving today.
    That's what you said Tuesday!

    edit: he actually called me!
    Last edited by Renegade; 03-27-2009 at 01:55 PM.
    ****

  22. #22
    gravity curmudgeon
    Reputation: cowdog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Posts
    1,460
    That is interesting.

    You know, I would love to see a graph of the pushed rp23 on a TNT 5.5 spot for comparison. Purty please!

  23. #23
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Posts
    114
    Quote Originally Posted by PUSHIND
    It shows both the compression and extension stroke....if you focus on the upper part of the line that's the actual force on compression.

    So the difference in compression and rebound at any point is fricition in an air shock?

  24. #24
    mtbr member
    Reputation: wormvine's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Posts
    3,160
    The cylindrical plastic lid of a blank CD-R spindle works well for the mod. Not as soft a plastic as p-tex but...
    Someone else suggested it on one of DGC's threads and it works great.

  25. #25
    DGC
    DGC is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation: DGC's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    1,345

    quite interesting

    Quote Originally Posted by PUSHIND
    So, this modification has always been curious to me as we've talked about offering something like this to our customers. I just happen to have one of these bikes here so I figured I'd check it out. Here are the results:

    The first graph shows the air spring curve comparison between stock and the DGC modification.
    The second graph shows the air spring curve comparison between stock and the PUSH bottoming system.

    Darren
    Darren,
    As i see the graph's, my shim gets progressive on a more gradual curve, where your bottoming system allows a more linear feel longer then ramps up hard at the very end. Thank you for posting this, cool to see.
    Here is a picture of another shim I have used in the past on the dhx-a. I am testing a version of this currently on the DW, the shim is 135x17mm with the added raised end.
    Anyways, thanks again for posting these graph's.
    Attached Images Attached Images
    OUCH...!!!!!!

  26. #26
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    8,904
    Interesting mod, DGC...and quite innovative and inexpensive

    The PUSH mod looks great too. I wonder if a rider can tell if there is a difference. Of course, knowing my inability to use sharp tools and my ham-fisted nature, I'd have to go with Darren's mod by default.

  27. #27
    err, 27.5+
    Reputation: AL29er's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    4,944
    Darren, any idea how an AVA sleeve compares to the previous curves?

    I called a bud and inquired about a LV sleeve for an 8.5x2.5 and he did confirm that they don't make it at Fox. But he did have an older RP3 with AVA he is going to let me play around with.
    Quote Originally Posted by saturnine
    that's the stupidest idea this side of pinkbike.

  28. #28
    mtbr member
    Reputation: PUSHIND's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    1,880
    Darren,
    As i see the graph's, my shim gets progressive on a more gradual curve, where your bottoming system allows a more linear feel longer then ramps up hard at the very end. Thank you for posting this, cool to see.
    Here is a picture of another shim I have used in the past on the dhx-a. I am testing a version of this currently on the DW, the shim is 135x17mm with the added raised end.
    Anyways, thanks again for posting these graph's.
    Yeah, it was cool to measure the results. As you see, there's definitely merit to what you're doing.

    Interesting mod, DGC...and quite innovative and inexpensive

    The PUSH mod looks great too. I wonder if a rider can tell if there is a difference. Of course, knowing my inability to use sharp tools and my ham-fisted nature, I'd have to go with Darren's mod by default.
    The results are large enough that you would be able to feel the difference for sure.

    Darren, any idea how an AVA sleeve compares to the previous curves?

    I called a bud and inquired about a LV sleeve for an 8.5x2.5 and he did confirm that they don't make it at Fox. But he did have an older RP3 with AVA he is going to let me play around with.
    You know if I recall correctly, the AVA fully closed is just slightly larger than the current standard volume air canister. I'd have to double check that one.

    Anyway, I'm on my way to Fruita/Moab until Wednesday with my 5 Spot in tow....I'd love to stay and chat, but got some riding to do!

    Darren

  29. #29
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Posts
    5,826
    Would the shim size be the same for a 7.5 x 2 shock on the V2 Sultan?

    It's freakin pouring here, and I need a good garage project.

    Thanks!
    Whining is not a strategy.

  30. #30
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Posts
    5,826

    My Tiny Contribution

    For those of you who find suitable plastic shim material that isn't exactly 1.2 mm thick, here's a simple formula for figuring out the width of your shim, based on the thickness of your plastic material.

    Width (in millimeters) = 24 Divided by Thickness (in millimeters)

    So for the CD stack cover I found that is 0.9 mm thick, width is 24/0.9, or 26.7 mm.

    Since I'm not super agressive, and am working with a shorter shock, I'll probably just try 20 mm to start with anyway.
    Whining is not a strategy.

  31. #31
    mtbr member
    Reputation: nybike1971's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Posts
    1,882
    Quote Originally Posted by wormvine
    The cylindrical plastic lid of a blank CD-R spindle works well for the mod. Not as soft a plastic as p-tex but...
    Someone else suggested it on one of DGC's threads and it works great.
    That was a great tip. Thank you!

    First ride on the shimmed HV RP23. Still not as progressive as I'd like it. I'll try to cut a wider shim.

  32. #32
    DGC
    DGC is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation: DGC's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    1,345

    custom shim for a custom ride

    Quote Originally Posted by nybike1971
    That was a great tip. Thank you!

    First ride on the shimmed HV RP23. Still not as progressive as I'd like it. I'll try to cut a wider shim.
    That is the whole idea with the shims, make the size you want based on your riding. As you use bigger shims though you might start to feel a little loss of mid stroke plushness, but a few more mm's should be fine. Play with it and find out what works for you. I don't like the feel of air shocks when they are too linear long and deep in the travel then ramp up real hard, feels too punchy to me. But, that is me. Different strokes for different folks. That is the problem I had with the dhx-a on the TNT bike.
    The CD spindle idea shows what I said recently, there is all kinds of plastic out there if you think of it. The next one I am trying is a 1.5mm thick not as wide with a ramp on the end like I pictured above last night. It might get too much like the punchy feel I don't like, we'll see.
    Glad to see your trying this shim mod.
    Attached Images Attached Images
    OUCH...!!!!!!

  33. #33
    mtbr member
    Reputation: nybike1971's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Posts
    1,882
    Quote Originally Posted by DGC
    That is the whole idea with the shims, make the size you want based on your riding. As you use bigger shims though you might start to feel a little loss of mid stroke plushness, but a few more mm's should be fine. Play with it and find out what works for you. I don't like the feel of air shocks when they are too linear long and deep in the travel then ramp up real hard, feels too punchy to me. But, that is me. Different strokes for different folks. That is the problem I had with the dhx-a on the TNT bike.
    The CD spindle idea shows what I said recently, there is all kinds of plastic out there if you think of it. The next one I am trying is a 1.5mm thick not as wide with a ramp on the end like I pictured above last night. It might get too much like the punchy feel I don't like, we'll see.
    Glad to see your trying this shim mod.
    DGC,

    I should have said this explicitly. That's a brilliant mod because it is so simple and so easy to customize. So, thanks!

    Could you explain the "ramp" at the end of the shim in the picture? I am not sure I understand it.

  34. #34
    DGC
    DGC is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation: DGC's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    1,345

    ramp

    Quote Originally Posted by nybike1971
    DGC,

    I should have said this explicitly. That's a brilliant mod because it is so simple and so easy to customize. So, thanks!

    Could you explain the "ramp" at the end of the shim in the picture? I am not sure I understand it.
    First off, your welcome. It can be installed in a minute or 2, very easy to do as you said, more people in here should give it a try.
    The ramp is for a pocket in the air sleeve. On the inside of the air sleeve there is a slightly machined 1/4 inch long pocket, it is very slight in depth. If there is a decent amount of lube in the air sleeve you wont even see the depression it is so slight. My feeling is if you fill that pocket entirely with a tight fit, you will get a slightly more progressive feel at the very end of the stroke. More bottomout protection. I have used black electrical tape, and layered it to get the effect i want. Now I am trying to make that 1/4 end ramp with pitex or something more solid.
    The picture shows i believe 2 layers of tape. I have before on the dhx-a crammed as many as 5 layers in there before, but that makes it real hard to get the sleeve back on the main air body.
    OUCH...!!!!!!

  35. #35
    DGC
    DGC is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation: DGC's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    1,345

    Rs

    Quote Originally Posted by Enel
    Thanks for that. I don't have a Sultan, but I do need to reduce the volume of a large can RS Monarch and I think that will do the trick.

    Apparently, RS makes "tuning bands" for the shock, but I have not found anyone who carries them.
    I called SRAM, 2 different people acted as if they never have heard of shims in an air sleeve before. Both denied RS making them. I have talked with someone outside SRAM who says they do have them and has seen them. Probably has not made it to the consumer end of the market yet, maybe it exists in the race department. I would bet they will have a few in a drawer at Sea Otter. If your Monarch has the external HV sleeve then make one as I have done here for the Fox.
    OUCH...!!!!!!

  36. #36
    Powered by ice cream.
    Reputation: Enel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Posts
    6,309
    Quote Originally Posted by DGC
    I called SRAM, 2 different people acted as if they never have heard of shims in an air sleeve before. Both denied RS making them. I have talked with someone outside SRAM who says they do have them and has seen them. Probably has not made it to the consumer end of the market yet, maybe it exists in the race department. I would bet they will have a few in a drawer at Sea Otter. If your Monarch has the external HV sleeve then make one as I have done here for the Fox.
    Thanks for checking into that for me. That is pretty much the same response I got to inquiries. I have a pretty reliable source that says they exist.

    The Monarch is built a little different from the Fox. Here is a pictorial of it being taken apart.

    First let all the air out.

    <a href="http://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/Vrs2SdGjMW5j9X2FOHsvhg?feat=embedwebsite"><img src="http://lh4.ggpht.com/_krWgAPsu4g0/SdACiOUv4KI/AAAAAAAAGQ4/0quPJnnIMTs/s800/IMG_0926.JPG" /></a>

    Take off the O-ring at the bottom.

    <a href="http://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/_KoP8PlCQEm9rqBMev54Mw?feat=embedwebsite"><img src="http://lh4.ggpht.com/_krWgAPsu4g0/SdACjK67mUI/AAAAAAAAGRA/1UjgMSgnZRk/s800/IMG_0927.JPG" /></a>

    Slide the sleeve off.

    <a href="http://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/hzC57o6Ba2PiIDYYpvUQ6Q?feat=embedwebsite"><img src="http://lh4.ggpht.com/_krWgAPsu4g0/SdACkMIrYTI/AAAAAAAAGRI/is9g4VXbn7Q/s800/IMG_0928.JPG" /></a>

    <a href="http://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/_YpPOXmmD3rPlgsy0rhPJw?feat=embedwebsite"><img src="http://lh6.ggpht.com/_krWgAPsu4g0/SdACk3KS8zI/AAAAAAAAGRQ/gx5ECM-_Zt8/s800/IMG_0929.JPG" /></a>

    As you can see, the sleeve does not have the lip in it like the Fox. The lip is on the shock body. In some ways, this makes it easier to adjust the air volume with just some rubber bands.

    <a href="http://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/juSiaaWo1cfRDxqhjl9I1g?feat=embedwebsite"><img src="http://lh3.ggpht.com/_krWgAPsu4g0/SdAClyoHuFI/AAAAAAAAGRY/UgB_DrGQYYo/s800/IMG_0930.JPG" /></a>

    My shock was way, way too linear for my bike. Bottomed easily with correct sag. I added two layers of cut inner tube and a rubber band from some Broccolli. Ramps up nicely now. Seems a little less progressive than the small volume Fox currently on the bike. I suppose you could just as well wrap it with some tape.

    I actually prefer the small volume Fox RP23 as far as the spring goes, and it requires no fussing. Nice to have the option to tune the spring though. No trail time on the RS with the more progressive spring yet.

  37. #37
    err, 27.5+
    Reputation: AL29er's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    4,944
    Quote Originally Posted by PUSHIND
    You know if I recall correctly, the AVA fully closed is just slightly larger than the current standard volume air canister. I'd have to double check that one.

    Anyway, I'm on my way to Fruita/Moab until Wednesday with my 5 Spot in tow....I'd love to stay and chat, but got some riding to do!

    Darren
    Riding is overrated, just hang here and BS about our shocks instead

    Interesting on the AVA. I will give it a try regardless. If it doesn't do the trick then I will check out this shim deal.
    Quote Originally Posted by saturnine
    that's the stupidest idea this side of pinkbike.

  38. #38
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Posts
    1,876
    would be interesting if Darren or DT commented on the upcoming boost valve version of the RP23:


  39. #39
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Posts
    5,826
    I tried the mod on my Sultan. Very easy to do with DGC's instructions. Thanks.

    It worked fine, but I don't really think the Sultan needs it, maybe because of its lower leverage ratio compared to the Spot.

    I used a shim about 75% the volume of DGC's (135 x 20 x 0.9), and with 15 mm of sag, I no longer used full travel on a rough, technical ride where I normally gently feel bottom once or twice. If I were doing a lot of drops, I would slip that shim right back in.

    I need a shim that will make my March legs feel like they do in July!

    Thanks again, DGC!
    Whining is not a strategy.

  40. #40
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Posts
    223
    Quote Originally Posted by PUSHIND
    So, this modification has always been curious to me as we've talked about offering something like this to our customers. I just happen to have one of these bikes here so I figured I'd check it out. Here are the results:

    The first graph shows the air spring curve comparison between stock and the DGC modification.
    The second graph shows the air spring curve comparison between stock and the PUSH bottoming system.

    Darren
    Hey Darren,
    I have the PUSH bottoming system on my Mojo (w/std air can). So does my shock have the same curve as you've shown? I have felt that it was too big of a change from the stock shock, i.e., it prevents bottoming too much such that I never use the last 8mm of shock travel, even on the biggest drops that I do.

  41. #41
    Outcast
    Reputation: Renegade's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Posts
    8,567
    Quote Originally Posted by MB24
    Hey Darren,
    I have the PUSH bottoming system on my Mojo (w/std air can). So does my shock have the same curve as you've shown? I have felt that it was too big of a change from the stock shock, i.e., it prevents bottoming too much such that I never use the last 8mm of shock travel, even on the biggest drops that I do.
    Darren, similar situation for me too. I've gotten a few rides in on the RP3 since you reworked it; I have the HV can with the P-bottoming system. The last 1/2 inch of shock stroke is unobtainable. What exactly is the Push bottoming system? Do you guys put a stiff elastomer in there?
    ****

  42. #42
    mtbr member
    Reputation: PUSHIND's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    1,880
    The bottoming system that's installed in your shocks only effects the last 1/4"(6.35mm) of travel, so in both of your cases the bottoming system is a factor. Are you measuring the distance between the wiper and travel indicator o-ring to get your measurements? Unlike the SPOT, the MOJO is very linear in nature so it's uncommon to not get full travel. With the SPOT, it's mechanical nature is such that you get a lot of bottoming protection from the linkage so the bumper that is used is much softer.

    Darren

  43. #43
    Outcast
    Reputation: Renegade's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Posts
    8,567
    Darren, yes, I'm measuring from the wiper to the o-ring. The travel feels slightly linear untill the shock has compressed 1.5 inches, then it sofly but surely hits that wall. It lfeels just like your graph looks, but skewed.
    ****

  44. #44
    Rolling
    Reputation: lidarman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    11,110
    Funny how it's a modification. I thought the large air volume was a mod from this to a more linear response. People used to complain about the increasing rate of air shocks. Now it's the other way around.

    That PushInd curve looks very sweet though. Kinda like a soft bottoming feature..IE like the rubber bumper on a coil shock.
    Last edited by lidarman; 04-08-2009 at 04:17 PM.

  45. #45
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Posts
    223
    Quote Originally Posted by PUSHIND
    The bottoming system that's installed in your shocks only effects the last 1/4"(6.35mm) of travel, so in both of your cases the bottoming system is a factor. Are you measuring the distance between the wiper and travel indicator o-ring to get your measurements? Unlike the SPOT, the MOJO is very linear in nature so it's uncommon to not get full travel. With the SPOT, it's mechanical nature is such that you get a lot of bottoming protection from the linkage so the bumper that is used is much softer.

    Darren
    Yes, measuring from the wiper lip to the 0-ring, I can use only 43mm on the bigger drops. It does feel like your graph. Before the bottoming system was installed, I would bottom the shock a bit too often.

    >Mojo, Pushed RP23 w/std air can

  46. #46
    mtbr member
    Reputation: DH_WP's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Posts
    963
    Wow, this is such a huge resource of information.... one question though... how do I do this on a standard PR23 that I am constendly bottoming out when I run the recomended 15mm sag on my Mojo... I need the Boost at the end of the stroke thing...
    I weight about 86kg.

    Thanks

  47. #47
    mtbr member
    Reputation: PUSHIND's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    1,880
    It's tough to diagnose over the internet. I would say for Renegade and MB to just shoot my an email or call so we can discuss it further....or in Renegade's case just swing up with your bike!

    That PushInd curve looks very sweet though. Kinda like a soft bottoming feature..IE like the rubber bumper on a coil shock.
    That's a big part of it...see photo.

    Darren
    Attached Images Attached Images

  48. #48
    mtbr member
    Reputation: DH_WP's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Posts
    963
    Darren

    Can the guys at TF-Tuned do the bottom out thing for me?

    I will be sending my Rp23 over that way at the end of the month... is there anything specific I should ask for to get teh best performance fof my mojo?

  49. #49
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Posts
    1,545
    Great discussion going on here. Any experience with DT-Swiss shock? I'm on the Mojo and do aggressive riding. There are no HV sleeve to take out, but injecting grease into Air chamber may work.
    Anyone tried this?
    I used to run tubes like you are, but then I got thorn in my wheel.

  50. #50
    trail fairy
    Reputation: trailadvent's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Posts
    9,554
    Great idea DGC like others have said quite cool, Ive gone with the CD lid plastic setup, and went a little wider 25mm vs 20mm since Im heavier and a little out of shape at mo but gym will get me back there hopefully In few months, one of reasons Im playing with my air shock, Id rather be running a coil Avy etc, [no new bike stuff till working again] I do have a Romic which is working out surprisingly well but thought this would be fun to try, since its lying around.
    <o></o>
    Im using a DHXa, and it was slightly in stuck down mode which was weird because it did extend and function properly on the bike, but was slightly shorter in stroke than it should have been, because it worked fine I thought it must have been swapped for wrong stroke in the beginning as mine was a warranty replacement for being stuck down since new! But no some air must have gotten in the negative chamber, either that or the grit and crap that had built up in there had been the issue as there was some crap in there not much but ya only need a little!
    <o></o>
    So for the outer can 25mm width by 135 in length was perfect fit and I got the can fitted again no probs!
    <o></o>
    Like you say its very simple to do, so easy everyone should try it, nothing can go wrong, just follow the above, basically the same as the owners manual anyways.
    <o></o>
    So I definitely feel a difference in initial stroke and then some nice ramp up, it does feel more progressive, Ive not set my normal air setting so I could still cycle the shock through enough of its travel to get a feel in static mode, nice definite difference, still need to do a proper ride though to prove the setting and shim is right Ill make some smaller and wider now and see over time how much difference they make, be nice to get rid of that crap mid stroke run a little less in the main chamber for smoother initial bump feel and more sag but with ramp up at end without over doing the bottom out adj on the bor knob or extra psi in the piggy back!
    <o></o>
    So will report over some time, my wee get back on the bike loop has a bit of everything its a perfect test loop, berms roots lots of downs and climbs too 2ft drops lol whoops, Im not up to jumping at normal riding so true bottom out ramp up will be some time off yet, but I was getting full travel on this trail with 220psi in the man chamber previously so I had to ramp up the bottom out resistance knob, so be interesting if I can use less air in the main and dial back the bor on the piggyback with the shim mod in there!
    Last edited by trailadvent; 04-14-2009 at 10:02 PM.
    Just riding a muddy trail. . ..

    MAXXIS 4C!
    Helmet for your neck

    Leatt FAQs


  51. #51
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    93
    This mod rules!

    Tried it on my '07 Spot with PUSH-tuned RP23 with HV can this weekend and it let me drop 10psi on the shock and run about 2mm more sag to end up with the same amount of travel left (1/4" left from top of O-ring to end of body) on a local trail that includes a few 1 to 2 ft dirt jumps and drops. The small bump compliance improved a lot by being able to reduce pressure and add a little sag. All this without introducing any BOB or need to run Propedal even at the lower sag (about 14 mm vs 12 before).

    I'm assuming that using all the travel or "bottoming out" would get that O-ring to just about to fall the end of the shaft, right (maybe 1 or 2mm from the end of the body), right?

    Thanks!

  52. #52
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Posts
    55
    Thanks for the info. & instructions

    My Intense Tracer VP suffers with the same problems and I have just installed a 25mm wide CD lid shim.

    Cheers

  53. #53
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Posts
    5,826
    Quote Originally Posted by iDrew
    My Intense Tracer VP suffers with the same problems and I have just installed a 25mm wide CD lid shim.

    Cheers
    CAUTION: THIS MODIFICATION IS SUITABLE FOR TURNER BICYCLES ONLY!
    Whining is not a strategy.

  54. #54
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Posts
    175
    Hello,

    I think i gonna try it also.

    What type of plastic is it or where can i find it? Where is the material normally used for?

    As far as i understand it is used in the ski business?

    Thanks in advance.

  55. #55
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Feuerlocke's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Posts
    4
    Hi there!

    I solved the whole bottoming out problems by changing to a DHX Air 5.0. I do like to run a bit more sag, to get the bottombraket low and I am running a Talas with 140mm in Front, so sometimes also the headangle was a bit to steep for my riding style. For my kind of riding the RP23 was also a bit to linear, especialy in the mid travel.

    On the DHX Air the volume of the piggybag is almost the smallest - 150psi on the boostvalve. I had to remove some material from the volumeadjuster to fit it into my Spot. But my spot is a prototype, so I dontt know if you got that same thing going on with the new Spots.
    But the main improvement - imho - is the boost valve. If the new Shocks from Fox work the same as the DHX Air then you get a "bottomless" and perfect suspensionfeel. As I am not a english nativespeaker ist hard for me to tell you the exactly differences but "perfect" matches the feeling really good. I ride different bikes everyday, caus its part of my job, but there is really no bike that comes even close to my spot in the setup I ride it now. No joke here!
    But I will try the DGC modification also, simply because the RP23 is lighter.
    Anyways, I will show you my Spot here in the next few weeks, then you all see why i love it

    ---------------------------
    26Zoll.com • The page is in german, but you can look at the pictures ...
    Last edited by Feuerlocke; 05-12-2009 at 07:53 AM.

  56. #56
    trail fairy
    Reputation: trailadvent's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Posts
    9,554
    Quote Originally Posted by fatboy66
    Hello,

    I think i gonna try it also.

    What type of plastic is it or where can i find it? Where is the material normally used for?

    As far as i understand it is used in the ski business?

    Thanks in advance.
    All is revealed in the first post, someone mentioned a CD cylindrical cover that's what I used on my DHXa, probably use and ice cram container, anything around home works great for me I had it in stock and a stanley knife rest is history I went a bit wider as I'm heavier don't notice the mid travel blow through anymore it ramps up nice on the DHX no bottom out and I'm running at least 20psi less in the main chamber probably more like 30 but who's counting! Get err done report back! Def worth trying less or more imo especially on the DHXa DG probably has it pretty dialed on the RP float, I don;t have one so can't comment on that shock!
    Just riding a muddy trail. . ..

    MAXXIS 4C!
    Helmet for your neck

    Leatt FAQs


  57. #57
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Posts
    175
    Thanks. I cut out the cd cover.

    It is 0.9 mm thick and i made it about 2.2 wide.

    I gonna install it today and then i am gonna test it in Lake Garda Italy next week.

  58. #58
    mtbr member
    Reputation: obergine's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Posts
    52
    hi guys,
    nice mod
    i was just about to order a low volume air sleeve but now i'll have to give this a try

    does this mod also prevent the shock from wallowing in the mid stroke? (depending on the size of the shim?)

  59. #59
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Posts
    21
    I think that, depending on the size of the shim, the "spring rate" progressiveness will be more noticeable earlier in the travel. With the recommended sizes above, the change is very subtle, but noticeable and measurable towards the end of the stroke.

    The cool thing is, it's so easy to make a few shims of different sizes and then take with you to your local trail to test and swap, back and forth and figure out what works best for you between shim size and air pressure, etc.

  60. #60
    DGC
    DGC is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation: DGC's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    1,345

    Dgc

    Quote Originally Posted by obergine
    hi guys,
    nice mod
    i was just about to order a low volume air sleeve but now i'll have to give this a try

    does this mod also prevent the shock from wallowing in the mid stroke? (depending on the size of the shim?)
    It will lessen mid stroke wallow a little as you are reducing the air volume inside the sleeve, but before you commit to the idea for reducing the wallow, read the rest of my post:

    I found more mid stroke support on the TNT and Horst Spots far more necessary than on the DW bike. I tried a bigger 25mm shim on my DW but that is too much for me. The front end then feels too steep with even more mid stroke support than the DW already supplies in stock form. You get harshness from the mid stroke on, and nearly impossible to get full travel by using too much shim. The rear of the bike starts to get bounced off line, I even felt the front to rear suspension pitching in some corners. So at the aid of more mid stroke support, other things then change.
    How much is too much shim? It depends on you the rider. So pay attention to the ride once you try the shim.
    A few mm's of shim width goes a long way on the DW as does Pro Pedal.
    Before I really brought my shim idea out in the open about 4 years ago, I spent months riding different sized shims mostly in my dhx-a and RP23 on my TNT bike, I even tried cutting out circles and other shapes into the shim, adding tape to the edges etc.
    I did the same with my DW Spot by bringing along 5 shims to start with, though on the second shim try, I had the sized pretty much nailed down thanks to the time and work spent on the shims previously. Trying different sizes is a good way to find out what you will like. 2-3 mm's of width change will be felt on the DW Spot.

    Think of it like using tri flow for chain lube, a little goes a long way, a lot can get you into trouble...!!!!!
    OUCH...!!!!!!

  61. #61
    mtbr member
    Reputation: obergine's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Posts
    52
    Quote Originally Posted by DGC
    It will lessen mid stroke wallow a little as you are reducing the air volume inside the sleeve, but before you commit to the idea for reducing the wallow, read the rest of my post:

    I found more mid stroke support on the TNT and Horst Spots far more necessary than on the DW bike. I tried a bigger 25mm shim on my DW but that is too much for me. The front end then feels too steep with even more mid stroke support than the DW already supplies in stock form. You get harshness from the mid stroke on, and nearly impossible to get full travel by using too much shim. The rear of the bike starts to get bounced off line, I even felt the front to rear suspension pitching in some corners. So at the aid of more mid stroke support, other things then change.
    How much is too much shim? It depends on you the rider. So pay attention to the ride once you try the shim.
    A few mm's of shim width goes a long way on the DW as does Pro Pedal.
    Before I really brought my shim idea out in the open about 4 years ago, I spent months riding different sized shims mostly in my dhx-a and RP23 on my TNT bike, I even tried cutting out circles and other shapes into the shim, adding tape to the edges etc.
    I did the same with my DW Spot by bringing along 5 shims to start with, though on the second shim try, I had the sized pretty much nailed down thanks to the time and work spent on the shims previously. Trying different sizes is a good way to find out what you will like. 2-3 mm's of width change will be felt on the DW Spot.

    Think of it like using tri flow for chain lube, a little goes a long way, a lot can get you into trouble...!!!!!
    thanks a lot for those comments

    i'll try it on my horst linked bike
    the thing that i'll keep in mind is field testing then i'll see if i need to add or cut some mm's to the shim

  62. #62
    trail fairy
    Reputation: trailadvent's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Posts
    9,554
    Quote Originally Posted by obergine
    hi guys,
    nice mod
    i was just about to order a low volume air sleeve but now i'll have to give this a try

    does this mod also prevent the shock from wallowing in the mid stroke? (depending on the size of the shim?)
    Well I did this to my DHXa which I took off the spot and currently running it on the RFX light ghey

    Since I'm not in fighting shape at mo and my riding is ghey as well hardly worthy of riding the RFX but I love my Dh setup plus its comfy so for injury recovery is better body position for me I find I'm riding most in intial stroke and especially mid stroke and I haven't noticd any wallow, I'm running about 30psi less in the main chamber so probably closer to 30% sag now so I don;t get too sore in my neck and back and I'm not bottoming out with my lard arse and clumsy riding ability at mo!

    I made my shim bigger due to using a TNT version Turner and also I'm bigger than DGC its working great for me, I'm somehow even thinking its not such a bad shock at mo! So am happy, still coil is nicer, but I'm surprised at how this is performing!

    Def do it before getting a LV can its so easy and cheap to do
    Just riding a muddy trail. . ..

    MAXXIS 4C!
    Helmet for your neck

    Leatt FAQs


  63. #63
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Posts
    2,013
    Fitted a piece of plastic from 1 litre milk bottle to my 08 spot with rp23.Tried a piece 20 mm wide and went out for a quick blast made a very good improvement.Came back and swapped this out for a 24mm wide one and went for a 15mile ride this evening,wow what a difference i had been playing with air pressures in the rear shock for about a month and couldnt get what i wanted.This mod allows me to run the correct sag and still gives me a good ramp up at the end of the stroke,i couldnt get this before i could get plush but bottoms out or harsh that dosent bottom out.I am 225lbs so i am a fairly large lad.Thsi saves me buying a standard can kit to fit mine.
    Thanks DGC

  64. #64
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Posts
    1,104
    Very neat, going to try this on my '08 Ventana for the same reasons. Also borderline clyde at about 225 lbs nekid and running into the same issues. If anyone has comments I'm all ears. Very neat...

  65. #65
    DGC
    DGC is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation: DGC's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    1,345

    Ventana

    Quote Originally Posted by dieselcruiserhead
    Very neat, going to try this on my '08 Ventana for the same reasons. Also borderline clyde at about 225 lbs nekid and running into the same issues. If anyone has comments I'm all ears. Very neat...
    As far as on your Ventana goes, try some different shim sizes til you get what you like.
    I brought an 05 Specialized Enduro with a dhx-a back to life big time when I put a shim in it. But there is mostly Turner bikes using the shim so far though a few have tried it on other bikes, have at it on your Ventana and post back after some saddle time.
    You could start with 137x22mm and see how it feels, if it is too much, just take that shim out and trim it down 1-2mm. A difference in length of just 1mm can be felt.
    OUCH...!!!!!!

  66. #66
    Trophy Husband
    Reputation: geolover's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Posts
    3,012
    Quote Originally Posted by DGC
    But there is mostly Turner bikes using the shim so far though a few have tried it on other bikes,...
    I've got about 4 rides on a Float R with the "DGC" shim mod fitted on my Titus Supermoto. I cut a piece of a quart-sized yogurt container to 135x20mm (not a very straight cut).

    So far, I really like it. It has diminished much of the mid-stroke wallow and bottoming is much more controlled.

    DGC, thanks for the tip.
    Extreme stationary biker.

  67. #67
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Posts
    1,104
    I ended up using about 4 ccs of oil, seems to be dialed bike really snapped to life so far... If it helps, had a lot of trouble finding P tex base even here in Park City of all places... I might switch to the p tex though now that I finally sourced some...

  68. #68
    Happy when not-last.
    Reputation: MinskyBA's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    221
    Quote Originally Posted by DH_WP
    Wow, this is such a huge resource of information.... one question though... how do I do this on a standard PR23 that I am constendly bottoming out when I run the recomended 15mm sag on my Mojo... I need the Boost at the end of the stroke thing...
    I weight about 86kg.

    Thanks
    The whole idea behind this is reducing the volume of air. Rather than adding a plastic shim, which obviously works wonderful but sketches me out, you can add shock oil instead. I'm about 10 lbs heavier than you and have the same problem. After talking to derby I think I've got the solution:

    1) Remove shock from bike
    2) REMOVE ALL AIR
    3) With the can-side mount padded and gripped in a vice, you'll be able to unscrew the can (just use your hands, it should come off with a solid twist). Even with the main chamber empty there's still pressure on it, so it'll spring open a bit when you get past the last thread - don't freak out.
    4) Add shock oil. For your weight start with about 3/4 tsp (~3.75ml)**.
    5) Have fun trying to hold the can to the threads while turning it enough to catch.
    6) Replace shock on bike.
    7) Ride and report back.

    I've gotten as far as step 6, but I'm waiting on replacement handlebars and fork-lower :-(.
    I know it'll ramp up the compression, I'm dying to know if it'll prevent bottoming.


    **3/4 tsp (~3.75ml) is the same volume as adding a shim that's 120mm x 20mm x 1.5mm. To figure out a different volume, google is an amazing tool: "3600 cubic mm in tsp"

    -Minsky
    All your base are belong to ME.

  69. #69
    mtbr member
    Reputation: PUSHIND's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    1,880
    You don't want to add oil into the air cylinder of a FLOAT series shock as it will bypass the main air seal via the transfer port in the air can and collect in the negative chamber of the shock. The pooling will negatively effect the function of the shock and additionally cause excessive weeping of fluid onto the shock body causing the seals to prematurely wear.

    Stick with the DGC mod as a DIY mod as it doesn't tamper with the shocks function in a negative way.

    Darren

  70. #70
    gnuH
    Reputation: kiwirider's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Posts
    1,164
    Darren - refer to my post # 7 above - Haven't had this problem with the RP23 (touch wood). Nothing seems to migrate into the neg chamber and certainly not out and onto the shock shaft....

    Anyway, can I send you my shock yet?
    A green bird with a red body. We could look it up in a book. Or we could look up

  71. #71
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Posts
    1,104
    I did the oil route on my RP23 as well, 3.5cc and it worked wonderfully. It's also been at least a month like that an no weeping so far. That said I wanted to do the shim mod but couldn't find P-tex here at that thickness including here in Park City of all places. I might just cut up my trash can like DT

  72. #72
    I'm more of a dog person
    Reputation: unclekittykiller's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Posts
    864
    i'm using a cutout from the sides of a bucket of soda ash i used for my pool. thickness is around 1.0-1.1mm . material is probably some variation of polyethylene.

  73. #73
    mtbr member
    Reputation: TNT-Spot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    418
    Quote Originally Posted by frorider
    would be interesting if Darren or DT commented on the upcoming boost valve version of the RP23:

    This is a something to watch out. Will the TURNER Bikes be equipped with the 2010 Fox Float RP23 Boost Valve.

  74. #74
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Posts
    1,104
    Earlier in the thread I think they mentioned they're not.. . Or, elsewhere in the forum.. I'm going to have to read up on the boost valve, see what hte hell it is... I recall DT saying it wasn't for them...

  75. #75
    banned
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    91
    cut and installed the shim last night. Rode this morning and no bottoming out at all on a route I usually hit bottom on several times... and I was ruinning 30% sag. I'm short on funds so it was great to find a solution using some plastic I had around the house. Great innovative thinking here. Thanks for the low... no cost solution.

  76. #76
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Posts
    5
    I've been having the same thoughts for some time. I experience almost a perfect linear travel and would want my shock to be somewhat more responsive. But I already ride with the lowest amount of air pressure, any lower and I will bottom out. I weigh 70KG and ride a 2004 5spot with a fox float RL propedal AVA. Now I understand what the AVA is for! This reduces the volume of the air chamber, so in a sense I already have the mod on my bike! And I just took a quick look at it and I have it set to achieve the largest air chamber. Now I will set it to the mid setting for my next ride, and try a little lower air pressure. Expect an update soon, I'm really interested to see if it will have the same effect as DGC's mod.

  77. #77
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Posts
    143
    Quote Originally Posted by PUSHIND
    You don't want to add oil into the air cylinder of a FLOAT series shock as it will bypass the main air seal via the transfer port in the air can and collect in the negative chamber of the shock. The pooling will negatively effect the function of the shock and additionally cause excessive weeping of fluid onto the shock body causing the seals to prematurely wear.

    Stick with the DGC mod as a DIY mod as it doesn't tamper with the shocks function in a negative way.

    Darren

    So.. no problem adding oil into air cylinder on DHX?? just in Float?

  78. #78
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Posts
    153
    Just did DGC's mod on my '09 Tracer VP. The bike came with the '10 RP23 w/ Boost Valve. In setting the proper sag, the linkage rate on the Tracer would blow through the stroke on medium drops, even with the PP / Boost Valve turned on. Plushness suffered a bit also. No amount of tinkering could get me the results I was looking for. FYI, the shock dimensions are 7.875" x 2.25". Geared up with Camelback, I weigh about 180lbs. The bike is set to 6" travel mode for both the front and rear.

    I used 1.19mm thick plastic from a CDR spindle case, as P-Tex isn't easily found here in Georgia. I sized it at 137mm x 21mm. A very easy install, though I did have to remove the bottom shock spacers as they are 41mm wide, bigger than the HV sleeve. The first noticeable difference is 10lbs less air to reach correct sag. Small bump compliance is still excellent, and the shock/bike now ramps up nicely at the end of the stroke. I'll get the bike out this week for some proper testing and report back to all.

    My hats off to DGC for the experimenting and the detailed instructions.

  79. #79
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Posts
    143
    I did the same mod on DHX 5 for Orange Patriot and was fine. thanks DGC

  80. #80
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Posts
    41
    Hi all! I just tried this mod... I used cd-r spindle plastic for the shim & since I don't have a set of calipers I'm not sure of the thickness. So I cut up a 135 x 27mm piece. So far so easy. I then removed the shock from the bike & proceeded to remove the c clip. Easy again. Now here is where I fark up! from dgc's Instructions, popping off the air sleeve should be easy... But I had a ***** of a time trying to get it off! I really put in some elbow grease and almost gave up when suddenly there was a loud pop and the sleeve gave way! There was a bit of fluid that must have been forced out and the bottom o ring popped off! So i put the oring back on & check that both are seated snugly and carefully put in the shim & put the sleeve & then c clip back on. Once installed I add 135psi, prior to this mod i ran 145psi to get 17mm sag on my dw 5spot, I was expecting to see a simar amount of sag as before (due to the reduction in air volume), but I got close to 20mm. I re read dgc's post & I realised I forgot to remove all the air from the shock first!

    So I hope I havent broken any of the internals of the shock by removing the air sleeve whilst it was pressurized? I hope not... If any thing would I have lost some shock fluid, could that explain why there is more sag? ... do I need to add more shock fluid?
    Last edited by lzyboy; 11-12-2009 at 06:32 AM.

  81. #81
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Posts
    153
    I wouldn't think you damaged any internals. The diffucult removal of the sleeve was probably due to air pressure on the seals. The pressure still inside the shock was applying pressue to both seals in the HV sleeve, forcing them tight (by design) hence the effort needed to remove it. As long as the seals are okay, you should be fine. I'm assuming the bit of shock fluid that came out is Float fluid, used in the maintainance. If so, just service the shock. Clean the insides of the cannister, grease the seals, and add 2cc of fresh Float fluid.

    At the lower air pressures you are running, I wouldn't think there would be as much difference in your before and after pressures. I'm about 5% less. Set the sag where it needs to be without worrying too much about the psi..Then check out the ride and fine tune from there.

    FYI, a 27mm wide piece seems a bit wider than dgc's recommendations. The shock may be too progressive and not use full travel. Testing will tell.

  82. #82
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Posts
    41
    Cheers rsvrjimbo02!
    What you're saying about the difficulty of removing the air sleeve makes real sense... even to a non mechanically minded person like myself.

    I'll pull it apart again tonight and check for damage to the seals and do a general service on the sleeve as you suggested.

    On the way out the door to work this morning I checked the air sleeve how tight a seal do the o-rings form when the can is pressurised? Should I be able to rotate the sleeve by hand? I was able to turn it fairly easily I'm not talking limp wristed handshake sort of pressure, more like a giving it a firm hold and turning.

    Oh, as for the width of the shim I was going by the suggested width of a 0.9mm thick CD-R spindle from one of the previous posters being 27mm. Like you said once I get a bit more time to test it out properly I'll be able to fine tune it!! Bring on the weekend!!!

  83. #83
    DGC
    DGC is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation: DGC's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    1,345

    pow

    Quote Originally Posted by lzyboy
    Cheers rsvrjimbo02!
    What you're saying about the difficulty of removing the air sleeve makes real sense... even to a non mechanically minded person like myself.

    I'll pull it apart again tonight and check for damage to the seals and do a general service on the sleeve as you suggested.

    On the way out the door to work this morning I checked the air sleeve … how tight a seal do the o-rings form when the can is pressurised? Should I be able to rotate the sleeve by hand? I was able to turn it fairly easily … I'm not talking limp wristed handshake sort of pressure, more like a giving it a firm hold and turning.

    Oh, as for the width of the shim … I was going by the suggested width of a 0.9mm thick CD-R spindle from one of the previous posters being 27mm. Like you said once I get a bit more time to test it out properly I'll be able to fine tune it!! Bring on the weekend!!!

    Man your somewhat lucky the thing did not hit you releasing the air sleeve with air still in there. No harm done.
    Once you get lube on the air sleeve o-ring seals, it will allow the body to move easier even with air in there. No worries, just be sure it feels generally fine riding it, then you should not have any damage.
    The shim size you chose is quite big, but see if you like it. a cd-r spindle plastic is thinner so you will be close to what you want, If it ramps up a bit too much for you, just take that existing shim and trim it down a few mm's.
    OUCH...!!!!!!

  84. #84
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Posts
    153
    The HV sleeve can spin on the canister, even when pressurized. I have an '08 HV RP23 on my Stumpjumper, and that sleeve spins fairly easily when turning. PUSH told me to use a strap wrench on the canister itself to remove the canister for service as the HV sleeve would spin. As long as it is sealing and holding air, you are fine.

  85. #85
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Posts
    41
    Id thought I'd better post an update, I bit the bullet and went out and bought a set of digital calipers! Fairly cheap ... $29AUD from Dick Smiths (for the benefit of any Aussie readers on this board!) and measured my shim thickness. It was actually around the 1.12 to 1.2mm mark, so goes to show that not all CD-R spindles covers are made the same! So, I cut down the width to 22mm. I measured sag and ended up using putting in 140psi to get about 15mm of sag.

    So, I took the bike out on the trail and did some testing. Unfortunately I'm one of those guys who's not really in tune with their bike whilst riding so I cant really remember in detail how the bike rode before the shim, but I do remember doing a test by pre-loading and popping off a gutter and the shock pretty much used all its travel. Now this is something that I'd hope the shim would sort out. Anyway, back on the trail, and during fast blats down rough sections (no drops or jumps), the shock is super plush and seems to not excessively use all its travel. However, going off a small 1 foot kicker, I found it used up all of its travel, I didnt feel any harsh bottoming out but yes, the o-ring was right at the bottom! So, I changed the PSI to 145 but it made no difference.

    So post ride, I visited the LBS and explained the situation to the suspension tech guy there. So he set up the sag for his weight and did the "gutter" test and sure enough, all travel used.

    He said that he'd had previous conversations with some Fox techs who solved this by packing in Slick Honey at the top of the main chamber (same spot where the bumper of a Pushed RP23 goes). So he gave that a try, although I'd not sure how much he packed in there.

    We performed the "gutter" test again after the fact and this time, the o-ring was approx 8-10mm from the bottom.

    I have yet to go for a proper ride since to see how this affects the overall ride.

    And Im a bit dubious about this as a long term solution to the problem either...

  86. #86
    Daniel the Dog
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Posts
    6,742

    Hmmm

    A 2,5k frame and shock should not need any modifications. Early model bug?

  87. #87
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Posts
    41
    Quote Originally Posted by Jaybo
    A 2,5k frame and shock should not need any modifications. Early model bug?
    I think this is an issue with the shock or the setup of the shock, I dont think its got anything to do with the frame!

  88. #88
    DGC
    DGC is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation: DGC's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    1,345

    PUSH bumper

    Quote Originally Posted by DGC
    So if you read my review of the DW Spot, at the end i mentioned the bottom out on the shock. I have heard only a few people mention the same thing, easy to bottom out.
    Instead of bumping the air pressure up, losing sag and losing small bump performance, I have come up with a mod that will end the ease at bottom out and keep all small bump and mid stroke plushness pretty much the same. Does not take an expensive rebuilt custom tuned shock either. Everyone of you can do this mod in a few minutes. it is very simple.
    If you remember some years ago I was making shims for the DHX air for the 5 Spot. Instead of just dumping the shock and moving onto the RP23 I wanted to try to ramp up the end of the stroke on the dhx-a, it did not fix the mid stroke wallow, but it sure made for a nice decending shock. The same idea applies here. I had throughout all the riding/testing on the DW 5 Spot done a ride or loop on the shock as stock, then lnstalled the shim and did the same ride minutes later. I did this many times to be sure the shim idea was going to be acceptable. Not only did it turn out acceptable, but the results were so good, I won't go back to the stock set up.
    All I am essentially doing is reducing the air sleeve volume. The outer large sleeve that is, NOT the main air sleeve. I will say this again later, leave the main air sleeve on the shock, it does not need to be removed.
    The shim is made of ski base material, or better known as plastic. EXACTLY 1.2mm thick. I have tried thicker, around 1.5-1.7mm and it makes it nearly impossible to get the air sleeve back on. Any ski shop has this stuff. It is quite cheap. A few bucks or maybe 5 bucks and your set. It gets sold to us ski shops in sheets and even rolls. Many thicknesses are offered so stick with the exact 1.2mm rule and you will be fine. Get an accurate set of calipers to measure, or borrow some. I have tried a few different width pieces and I found the one I will reccomend being about the best size for the average rider on the DW 5 Spot.
    The size i felt works real good is 135mm long by 20mm wide. Keep the length exact at 135mm's. My riding weight is 190 lbs., I like agressive rough technical rides with plenty of chance for small air's, so trust me this size is good to start with. If you were really having a bottom out problem and are doing lots of small drops and kickers then maybe a little wider, but make yourself known and I will tell you what I think based on your needs. I tried a 23mm wide piece, I like the 20mm better.
    First off, get enough of the materail or something similar that is plyable enough to roll up into the size of a half dollar, stiff and brittle wont work. There should be other stuff out there just about the thickness and softness as the ski base stuff i use. Plastic is all over the place if you think about it.
    Once you got the material, cut your piece with a sharp box knife, thin blades work best. Next, with the shock off the bike, release all air from the shock air valve. LEAVE the main air sleeve on the shock. Then remove big metal c-clip that sits on the end of the outer air sleeve. I use a c-clip tool and barely put any pressure on each end of the c-clip and it raises up enough to get of with your fingers from here. Then grasp the outer air sleeve and push down on it away from the top of the shock and it will easily pop right off. Clean any dirt from both ends of the air sleeve as there are 2 big air seals that need to reseal properly. Installing the shim is shown in one of my pictures, roll the shim up tight so you get get it on the air sleeve without touching the edge of the shim to the seal. Put the shim inside and at the end of the air sleeve (bottom end) in which the c-clip sits against. The other end (top end) of the air sleeve is where the air bleed hole is located, this is where air comes from the main sleeve, don't cover it up with the shim. Make sense so far?
    When you position the shim against the inside of the body and at the bottom end of the air sleeve you can actually click or press the shim ends together for a good fit, that is why I say exactly 135mm long on the shim. It will stay there securely. Then put c-clip back in place, it will sit in its groove, then air up the shock and go ride it......!!!!!!
    It is simple to do this.
    I am running about 5-10 psi. less air with the shim. Remember you are taking away air space or volume so a little less air might be what you end up with. I have been running sag right about 15 or 16mm's, about 5/8 of an inch.
    Trust me, this works damn good. Sounds a little wierd, but if both Rock Shox and Fox are using plastic spacers in their shocks then there is no reason to doubt this mod if you need a little ramp at the end of the stroke for bottom out protection.

    Remember this line...........Try it, you'll like it. """Mikey likes it and he hates everything....!!!!"""

    Any questions? Ask away.

    I have been meaning to post this picture for a long time, finally found it burried in the files. This is the BO bumper on the PUSH system.
    Darren already posted a pic sometime back, but here is a better close up if anyone is interested.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails DW 5 Spot RP23 mod-_mg_1685-copy.jpg  

    OUCH...!!!!!!

  89. #89
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Guitarzan415's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    510

    Looks easey enough!

    With a little elbow grease and the right parts (old shock bumper, trip to the hardwear store for a washer and O-ring) it looks doable!

  90. #90
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Posts
    1

    Genomarg

    Hi there from New Zealand. I have just completed Darrens RP23 air sleeve reduction mod on my 2009 Trek Remedy.
    This bike had the 7.787 x 2.25 RP23 HV can, therefore the thickness of the shim was not critical for installation, although I ended up with a similar 1.5 x 20 x 137 size for first impression.
    The high volume can has approx 3mm clearance around the shock housing.
    The material below is readily available from most engineering plastic suppliers.

    UHMWPE
    Ultra High Molecular Weight Polyethylene

    Ultra High Molecular Weight Polyethylene (UHMWPE) is often referred to as the worlds toughest polymer. UHMWPE is a linear high density polyethylene which has high abrasion resistance, as well as high impact strength. UHMWPE is also chemical resistant and has a low coefficient of friction which makes it highly effective in a variety of applications.

    Cheers from New Zealand
    Shane

  91. #91
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Vespasianus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Posts
    4,691
    Quote Originally Posted by Shane Fever
    Hi there from New Zealand. I have just completed Darrens RP23 air sleeve reduction mod on my 2009 Trek Remedy.
    This bike had the 7.787 x 2.25 RP23 HV can, therefore the thickness of the shim was not critical for installation, although I ended up with a similar 1.5 x 20 x 137 size for first impression.
    The high volume can has approx 3mm clearance around the shock housing.
    The material below is readily available from most engineering plastic suppliers.

    UHMWPE
    Ultra High Molecular Weight Polyethylene

    Ultra High Molecular Weight Polyethylene (UHMWPE) is often referred to as the worlds toughest polymer. UHMWPE is a linear high density polyethylene which has high abrasion resistance, as well as high impact strength. UHMWPE is also chemical resistant and has a low coefficient of friction which makes it highly effective in a variety of applications.

    Cheers from New Zealand
    Shane
    So how dos it effect the ride of the Trek?

  92. #92
    Underskilled
    Reputation: CaveGiant's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Posts
    4,118
    fantastic info,
    I am having trouble bottoming my WFO/rp23, this seems a perfect solution.

    I was wondering about putting a bit of heavy grease in the outer chamber to reduce volume more. I am hoping the thick grease will not migrate like oil.

    Any thoughts,

    P x

  93. #93
    spr
    spr is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Posts
    84

    RP23 changes

    Are there any changes in the RP23 from the original shock for the DW Spot?
    What about 2010 shock?
    thx

  94. #94
    Cannonball!
    Reputation: coiler-d's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Posts
    515
    Quote Originally Posted by iDrew
    Thanks for the info. & instructions

    My Intense Tracer VP suffers with the same problems and I have just installed a 25mm wide CD lid shim.

    Cheers
    How did it work with the Intense?

  95. #95
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Posts
    9
    The DW 5.SPOT has a RP23 HV air can valved in light/light with recommended sag from TURNER of 17mm. The 2010 bikes are NOT coming with the the new "boostvalve" shock. I Tried one on my bike and it worked fine but went back to the stock shock. Next for me is to try the shim and see what it rides like.

  96. #96
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Posts
    153
    Quote Originally Posted by coiler-d
    How did it work with the Intense?
    I tired this mod on on 09 Tracer w/2010 RP23. Fiddled with a cople sizes and got decents results, but not what I was looking for. I also tried the standard air can, which improved the bottoming, but stiffened up the small bump compliance more than I wanted. FYI, I weigh 175-180 with wintter gear. Bigger riders may have a more difficult time getting it adjusted right.

    My final solution was to send it off to PUSH. I had the Big Hit kit installed also. Now the shock is awesome. A plush ride that doesn't blow through the suspension, and can take some pretty good hits without any harsh bottoming ; 3.5' drops to flats. I haven't tried anything bigger than that.

  97. #97
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Posts
    928
    Hey DGC you rock! The mod was as you state extremely simple, and since I am at a similar weight your suggested size reduced a lot of trial and error.
    This thing is fantastic Added exactly the end-of-travel ramp-up I needed on my DW-Spot while keeping the ride just plush.
    Kol Hakavod!!
    Last edited by tald; 04-02-2010 at 12:29 PM.
    Hear no evil. See no evil. Speak no evil. (Do it !?!)

  98. #98
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Posts
    44
    Mod seems to have done the trick but havent had the time to get out and ride it yet, so I will post back again later. I used the side of a cylindrical CD stack and it came out to be about 1.17-1.22 mm thick. Varied a little bit, but could also be my Digital caliper being a little bit off. I ended up using a 21mm wide piece and so far so good. This is on a Fox RP23 mounted on a GT Force frame. I am also about 205lbs riding weight rider so the HV was a bit too linear for me. Again, like I said, I will post back after I hit the trails.

  99. #99
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Posts
    107
    I did the DGC shim-mod to a 2008 DHX Air 4.0 on RM Slayer. Great mod.
    I used a lower volume shim though as the Slayer did not need a massive adjustment. About 2.75cc worth of shim. 0.8x137x25 - my plastic was thin.
    Was able to run lower pressure for more plush at the start but with slightly better mid and more resistance to bottoming.
    Super easy mod.
    A1. Thanks.

  100. #100
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Posts
    44
    UPDATE: So I got out and rode with the shim (135x21x1.2) and it did the trick but not to the extend i was looking. Went home, made another shim (135x24x1.2) rode it again last night, and that did the trick. Feels great, running 15 psi lower than originally, giving me more plushness and better bottoming resistance at the end of the stroke. I bottom maybe twice during the ride, and one of those was due to a 5 ft drop onto a sloped landing. Thanks DGC!

Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast

Members who have read this thread: 15

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •