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  1. #1
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    New question here. Clipless release headaches

    Hi!

    After many years of riding Shimano 747 pedals, I decided to ditch them due because they had a tendency to release unexpectedly when pulling them upwards( bunny hops, jumps, etc.)
    For the last month I have been riding a set of Crank Brothers Candy pedals, and they hard release unexpectedly, BUT, I started to experience non-releases in emergency situations, resulting in many unnecessary crashes on my spot. I am already using the smaller 15 degree cleat setting. I have also been trying flat pedals, but find that I like clipless much more.

    Any ideas on how to get the middle ground - confidence while jumping PLUS proper release in emergency situations? Did anyone experience similar issues with the Candy or 747 pedals and found a solution?

    Thanks!
    Tal

  2. #2
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    think i may be of some assistance here. shimano makes 3 spd cleats:

    sm-sh51. 4 deg of float and the standard issue cleat
    sm-sh52. 6 deg of float and made for the 858 pedal
    sm-sh55 multi release. 0 deg of float and will release on twist or pulling up

    you may have the 55's by the sounds of it or yer tension is way too light. ask if ya need to know how to adjust it. diff between 55's and 51's is easy to tell by the silver/chrome color as opposed to the others being black. theres a huge difference betewwen a 0, 4, 6 and 15 deg cleat so it takes some practice to use the crank bros without feelin like yer gonna get stuck.

    personally i love my crank bros and use nuthin else these days. i own 4 pair and another is commin soon. way more consistant and easy to use plus with the mud and snow i now ride in they are a must. nuthin wrong with spd's, i ran em for 12 years. if ya cant embrace the candys, try the sh51's. that should fix ya up. lemme know how it goes.
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  3. #3
    KDK
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    I had the same problems with my CBs (both Mallets and Candys). Bear in mind that the CB cleat when brand new is quite difficult to clip and unclip. Also try putting one of these plastic spacers between the shoe sole and the cleat. Sometimes that does the trick.
    Last edited by KDK; 10-05-2005 at 12:49 AM.

  4. #4
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    good call on the spacers. that one got past me tonight.
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  5. #5
    PSI
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    Quote Originally Posted by tald
    Hi!

    After many years of riding Shimano 747 pedals, I decided to ditch them due because they had a tendency to release unexpectedly when pulling them upwards( bunny hops, jumps, etc.)
    For the last month I have been riding a set of Crank Brothers Candy pedals, and they hard release unexpectedly, BUT, I started to experience non-releases in emergency situations, resulting in many unnecessary crashes on my spot. I am already using the smaller 15 degree cleat setting. I have also been trying flat pedals, but find that I like clipless much more.

    Any ideas on how to get the middle ground - confidence while jumping PLUS proper release in emergency situations? Did anyone experience similar issues with the Candy or 747 pedals and found a solution?

    Thanks!
    Tal

    Tald,

    I've been using /tweeking CB's for a couple years.... Since you can't adjust the pedal tension on CB's you need to adjust the cleat. If you are experiencing hard release the cleat is either too deep in the sole or the angle relative to the shoe is pointing outward too much .

    two ways to remedy this are 1. to use the plastic spacers under the cleat. and 2. rotating the cleat in the shoe. the more you turn it inward (0.5 degree at a time) the easier/earlier the release will be.

    The advantage of CB's is that they are set-and-forget (once you got em set). with spd's i was always playing with the pedal tension.

    PSI

  6. #6
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    foot training or stick with Shimano

    I had this same issue and it has gradually become much less of a problem for me (but has not totally gone away). The natural reaction in an "emergency" release situation is to pull up on the pedal. With SPDs you can get away with this: If you pull hard enough you will come out. At least that's the way mine worked. If you are going to stick with the Crank Bros. you are going to have to train your leg muscles to be more disciplined about NOT pulling up, and instead twisting down and out. It's just a matter of putting in the miles; there are probably no shortcuts. If you don't want to do that I suggest sticking with the Shimanos and taking advantage of others' tips on cleats, tension, etc. (Failing to come out of my eggbeaters does seem to be more of an issue during "slow motion" falls. I've never had an issue during a true crash at speed; in that circumstance I always seem to just come out automagically.)

  7. #7
    Rolling
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    Quote Originally Posted by tald
    Hi!

    After many years of riding Shimano 747 pedals, I decided to ditch them due because they had a tendency to release unexpectedly when pulling them upwards( bunny hops, jumps, etc.)
    For the last month I have been riding a set of Crank Brothers Candy pedals, and they hard release unexpectedly, BUT, I started to experience non-releases in emergency situations, resulting in many unnecessary crashes on my spot. I am already using the smaller 15 degree cleat setting. I have also been trying flat pedals, but find that I like clipless much more.

    Any ideas on how to get the middle ground - confidence while jumping PLUS proper release in emergency situations? Did anyone experience similar issues with the Candy or 747 pedals and found a solution?

    Thanks!
    Tal
    I used 747s and eventually they wore out (after 4 years). I had similar problems as you did but because the pedal wore out, not because of the design!

    ...and here is the summary of moving to eggs and why I am back to shimano.

    Done with eggbeaters

    Right now, using shimanos, since that post, I can't be happier. I stay in when I need to and get out when I need to. Plus the new shimanos are better with mud. I don't like most of shimano stuff anymore, but I sure like their pedals.

  8. #8
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    Wow - thanks for the fantastic replies!!!
    As I see it, I have the following to do:
    1. Try the CB spacers.
    2. Angle the CB cleats in order to engage quicker.
    3. Move back to the 747 and try a stronger spring tension. [I was already using the SH51 cleats]
    4. Get new SH51 cleats for the 747.

    I already tries the spacers, but found that they result in excessive play on my shoes.
    I also modified the cleat angle - seems to release easier. I will wait and see for a while (all the non-release crashes with the Candy were on crawling speed on technical terrain).
    If this doesn't work either [liderman - my kidneys found your thread quite depressing - hope all is well!!], I will also move back to Shimano.

    Thanks!!
    Tal

  9. #9
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    Results

    Hi all,

    Just want to close this thread and give the results: the spacers didn't work (too much space), but the angling of the cleats did the trick . Candies are now quite spectacular. Thanks for all the great advice!!!

    Tal

  10. #10
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    watch for the CB pedals wearing a groove in your shoes tho. There's a guy on ebay in the UK who makes stainless steel plates that go under the cleat called sole savers which stops your shoes wearing out so fast. I've gone to ATAC XS and couldn't be happier.

  11. #11
    No Justice = No Peace
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    Ditch the CB

    I rode mine of r a month or two. After a seriously long nad troublesome ride in Tahoe, I threw them inthe lake. Bought a new set of 959's and I haven't looked back.

    On some of my bikes, I even use the cheap Shimano pedals with the plastic buckets around what looks like an old 747. 50 bucks, work great
    "Welcome to my underground lair...."

  12. #12
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    New question here. Angling the cleats - please advise

    Hey Tal,

    I've been experiencing the same problems with my Candy C pedals and wanted to know how exactly you "angle the cleats"?
    Where can I find instructions on doing so?

    TIA,
    Oren


    Quote Originally Posted by tald
    Hi all,

    Just want to close this thread and give the results: the spacers didn't work (too much space), but the angling of the cleats did the trick . Candies are now quite spectacular. Thanks for all the great advice!!!

    Tal

  13. #13
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    i havent seen tald around lately so ill chime in here and see if i can help. all ya need to do is loosen the 2 4mm bolts on each cleat and turn them so the forward end points inward towards the bike, thus releasing earlyer. this may take a few adjustments to get it to the point of release you prefer. start with small tweeks till ya get it right. while yer at it, make sure the threads are greased and be sure to tighten both a little at a time, one after the other, till both are snugged up. theyre also easy to strip so go easy and use a fresh tool. hope this works for yer tastes.
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  14. #14
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    Hi Oren - just what cactuscorn suggested.

    As opposed to my Shimano experience, cleats angled somewhat to the inside still feel very natural on the Candies (no spring pressure toward the center), but they release much quicker.

    Actually though, while this "angling" really quickened & improved the release of the Candies, I did still find myself recently in too many situations where I could not unclip in time - significantly reducing confidence. I have more than enough years of clipless riding experience, but it seems that my 5-spot (and the terrain it enjoys) is definately showing my limits with clipless.
    As a result, I've actually moved to flat pedals (Easton flatboys) for trail riding. Its a whole new experience, seems like I need to re-learn everything, (how to climb efficiently, how to bunny-hop, ...), but the fun factor is WAY WAY up there (as is the speed of moving a leg down when needed).

    Cheers!
    Tal

  15. #15
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    clipless pedals generally do not hold you clipped in when you bunny hop if your bunny hop technique relies on heavy pulls at the feet. I have unclipped from every brand of clipless made by using inferior bunny hop technique. if you learn to hop on platforms, then go to clipless, you won't have the same degree of unwanted releases.

    just remember, they aren't ski bindings designed to keep you retained. they're just supposed to keep your feet attached on the backside of the pedal stroke, to give more efficient pedaling.

  16. #16
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    gonzo, sadly the problem with the candies wasn't premature releases, but actually the opposite.

  17. #17
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    I mainly ride platforms now, but I do have a pair of Shimano 747's which I use regularly on my cyclocrosser [they used to be on my mtb, back in the day].....

    You may not know it, but Shimano makes two kinds of cleats for their pedal - the SM-51 and the SM-55. The difference between the two is how the cleat releases.

    The SM-51 will only disengage from the cleat by twisting out to the side. I liked these cleats, since I could keep my 747's tension really slack and not pop out the top when pulling up on the pedals on steep climbs, or bumpy ground. But, they released out to the sides very nicely.....

    The SM-55 "multi-release" has a design that allows the cleat to not only disengage from the side, but also vertically. this is great for a beginner, since they can actually pull out of the pedal by lifting their foot up and out of the pedal - not so great when going uphill or doin bumps....so you have to crank the tension up, which makes it harder to release anytime...not good.

    Check your cleat and see if you have the "multi-release" type....it's amazing how many people still like this pedal after all these years....
    Last edited by jokermtb; 02-01-2006 at 09:02 PM.
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  18. #18
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    Thanks, man, I've tinkered around with them last night and hope to test them out on some level terrain over the weekend!
    Though I must admit that Tald's reporting that he gave up on the Candies is somewhat discouraging as I'd hate to have to go back to platforms or shell out another $60+ on an new setup...
    Oren

  19. #19
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    Oren,

    I definately did not give up on the Candies. I REALLY like them in comparison to all other clipless pedals I have ever used. They are my first pick when going for long XC rides with fast friends on non-technical terrain. Candies and Mallots are also used everywhere for technical riding (look at PSI as an example). Its just that since the 5-spot, I am just finding myself in more technical terrain (nothing special - just technical for me), and feel more comfortable playing with the flats. Actually, I seem to be in the minority.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by tald
    gonzo, sadly the problem with the candies wasn't premature releases, but actually the opposite.
    well that sucks, and call me rosanne rosannadanna for being so clueless!

    since the cleats are fairly soft brass, a few passes with a file should do the trick. take your cues from the difference in the cleat profiles when you compare the 15 deg and 20 deg release installations. you want to remove even more than the change from 20 deg to 15 deg shows, and remove it in the same places.

    know what I mean?

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