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  1. #1
    No, that's not phonetic
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    Cool-blue Rhythm From the annals of Homer Bastardized R&D vol. 17: The FrankenFox

    The Problems: Too linear DHX Air; too progressive RP3.

    The Solution: Swap air canisters.

    I am a big fan of both DHX Air shocks and RP3s. The DHX Air requires very high air pressures on higher leverage bikes like the 6-Pack. The RP3 works great and can run lower air pressures but is thought not to be beefy enough for 6-Pack use. I swapped the air cans on my DHX Air and RP3, and took the DHX Air Lite out for a cruise today. First off, I ran it at about 20psi lower pressures than I would have with the standard DHX Air sleeve. I sort of spaced out and grabbed Barny's DHX Air for the conversion and didn't change her stock settings from full-out BO and 100psi BV. I normally turn the BO half way in and run 140psi BV. Despite the shock being way "softer" set up and less progressive (in BO) than I normally run, it exhibited admirable bottom out resistance. I will have more time to experiment over the next bunch of rides.





    Incidentally I am also riding Spot seat stays on the Pack presently. They are about 1/2" shorter in length than the stock Pack stays, so lower the back of the bike by about that much. Lower bb, slacker angles, couch on wheels ride. I dropped the oil volume in my Z1 FR1 by 10cc and bumped the air preload 5psi. Less sag and a somewhat less progressive stroke. Nice.
    My video techniques can be found in this thread.

  2. #2
    mtbr platinum member
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    This should be an entertaining thread. I can already hear it, "How come Push worked on Tscheezy's DHX-Air?, Will Darren Push mine too?"
    Oh, the drama.


    Glad to see that it fit.
    I stopped driving my bike into my garage - I'm now protected with Roof Rack Ranger app for my iPhone.

  3. #3
    not so super...
    Reputation: SSINGA's Avatar
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    very interesting and cool TS. Is the RP3 can smaller?
    Nothing to see here.

  4. #4
    No, that's not phonetic
    Reputation: tscheezy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SSINGA
    Is the RP3 can smaller?
    Exactly. That's why it "fixes" the DHX complaints in this case.
    My video techniques can be found in this thread.

  5. #5
    No, that's not phonetic
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    Quote Originally Posted by bikerx40
    Will Darren Push mine too?
    I have a whole sheet of Push stickers. What else do you want Pushed? RST shocks, anyone?
    My video techniques can be found in this thread.

  6. #6
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    Holy Hamsters; just look at all the cool things you can do with a Turner; bery creative. If this creation turns out to fix the problems of the DHX Air you'll be famous. Wait a minute, you're already famous Nice work.
    turtle

  7. #7
    Lay off the Levers
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    Mighty interesting. When you get down to da desert loan that puppy to El Ching and see if he can make it bark.

    The wheels are always turning eh TS?
    Faster is better, even when it's not.

  8. #8
    No, that's not phonetic
    Reputation: tscheezy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bikezilla
    The wheels are always turning eh TS?
    Akshully I mentioned to someone in another thread that I had ridden an RP3 on a Rocky Mountain Slayer 50 which seemed to have a large volume DHX Air-style can on it (to that bike's detriment, ironically). BikerX40 PMed me and...

    Quote Originally Posted by BikerX40
    I read in some thread that you thought that the larger DHX-A air sleeve may be compatible with the RP3. With people complaining about the DHX-A needing a lot of added air pressure to fight excessive bottoming, wouldn't the smaller RP3 air sleeve possibly help achieve more ramp-up earlier in the shock stroke and allow lower main spring air pressure?
    The rest is wrenching (pun not intended ).
    My video techniques can be found in this thread.

  9. #9
    the 36 year old grom
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    Quote Originally Posted by tscheezy


    The rest is wrenching (pun not intended ).
    maybe I should try a DHX can on my motolite

  10. #10
    MK_
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    Cool. I thought of doing that as an alternative to filling the air sleeve with oil/grease to reduce the volume. I suspected that running the RP3 can would make the air spring too progressive, though. Sounds like it is working out for ya, though. Nice.

    _MK
    .
    "No man goes before his time -- unless the boss leaves early."
    -- Marx, Groucho

  11. #11
    No, that's not phonetic
    Reputation: tscheezy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by demo_slug
    maybe I should try a DHX can on my motolite
    Yeah, I put the DHX air sleeve on Barny's 5-Spot's RP3. Hopefully that fixes the situation with that shock on her bike. Despite a Pushing and a lot of sag, she was not getting anywhere near the last inch of travel. She had been getting full travel with the DHX Air and a bit less sag along with a plush ride prior to the pushed RP3. If the DHX Air can doesn't make matters better, I'll put a full DHX Air back on her bike. It's hard to argue with success.
    My video techniques can be found in this thread.

  12. #12
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    There's a thread ayce started on the ventana forum and it looks like a rp3 air can on a dhx air there as well, with dhx air stickers on, but not the dhx air 5.0 stickers mine had, have fox started selling them with smaller air cans??

    DHX Air on X5...

  13. #13
    not so super...
    Reputation: SSINGA's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robbz
    There's a thread ayce started on the ventana forum and it looks like a rp3 air can on a dhx air there as well, with dhx air stickers on, but not the dhx air 5.0 stickers mine had, have fox started selling them with smaller air cans??

    DHX Air on X5...
    I think you're right.



    My DHx-A
    Last edited by SSINGA; 03-15-2006 at 09:46 AM.
    Nothing to see here.

  14. #14
    No, that's not phonetic
    Reputation: tscheezy's Avatar
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    I don't know why they didn't just make the sleeve an option like the AVA on the old Floats. Seems to make perfect sense from a tuning flexibility standpoint.
    My video techniques can be found in this thread.

  15. #15
    FM
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    Quote Originally Posted by demo_slug
    maybe I should try a DHX can on my motolite
    That could be really cool. Darren at Push confirmed my suspicion that the motolite has a steep rising rate. It feels great with my stock rp3, but I think a more linear feeling shock might perform better on big hits.

  16. #16
    not so super...
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    Quote Originally Posted by FM
    That could be really cool. Darren at Push confirmed my suspicion that the motolite has a steep rising rate. It feels great with my stock rp3, but I think a more linear feeling shock might perform better on big hits.
    Wanna try a "can" swap?
    Nothing to see here.

  17. #17
    FM
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    Quote Originally Posted by SSINGA
    Wanna try a "can" swap?
    yeah that would be cool, but I'd like to wait just a bit. I'm currently on a borrowed Rp3 while mine is getting pushed. So I'd like to see what the pushed one feels like before I swap.

    based on my impressions of both bikes and shocks, I think that would be a win/win for us.

  18. #18
    Registered Dietitian
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    Hey Cheese-man...

    ...dumb question, but if the RP3 can is smaller in volume, why do you need less pressure for the same sag? I would have thought that the larger (DHX-A) can would mean lower pressures (high volume-lower pressure). I'm sure I'm missing something here
    Registered Dietitian, Cycling Coach, E3: Elite Human Performance

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  19. #19
    not so super...
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    Quote Originally Posted by FM
    yeah that would be cool, but I'd like to wait just a bit. I'm currently on a borrowed Rp3 while mine is getting pushed. So I'd like to see what the pushed one feels like before I swap.

    based on my impressions of both bikes and shocks, I think that would be a win/win for us.
    Just let me know when/if you want to experiment.
    Nothing to see here.

  20. #20
    FM
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    Quote Originally Posted by tommyrod74
    ...dumb question, but if the RP3 can is smaller in volume, why do you need less pressure for the same sag? I would have thought that the larger (DHX-A) can would mean lower pressures (high volume-lower pressure). I'm sure I'm missing something here
    RP3 = smaller air chamber = less volume = ramps up quicker

    DHX-air= larger air chamber = more volume = more linear spring rate, requires more pressure to prevent bottom-out.

    SSinga, give me about 2 weeks. I will throw in some incentive for you when the time comes!

  21. #21
    No, that's not phonetic
    Reputation: tscheezy's Avatar
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    Once you start compressing the smaller volume of air (RP3 can), the pressure increases faster than with the larger air reservoir the bigger can (DHX) provides. Note that the piston on the DHX Air does not span inside the entire diameter of the air can, but rather there is a sleeve within a sleeve. The piston pushes on the contents of the inner sleeve, which is allowed to expand into the outer sleeve via a small air exchange port. You could run a lower pressure in the DHX Air if the piston was as wide as the outer sleeve, but it's not. Large diameter pistons and cylinders equals low pressure. Volume (which would seem to come from diameter, but not in this case) is not really applicable here.
    My video techniques can be found in this thread.

  22. #22
    not so super...
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    Quote Originally Posted by FM
    SSinga, give me about 2 weeks. I will throw in some incentive for you when the time comes!
    That works for me since I'll be in south Florida all next week
    Nothing to see here.

  23. #23
    Baked Alaskan
    Reputation: AK Chris's Avatar
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    the mad scientist strikes again!!!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by tscheezy
    The Problems: Too linear DHX Air; too progressive RP3.

    The Solution: Swap air canisters.
    You just keep topping yourself. I'm surprised the detailed instructions with photos hasn't been posted. Nice job though.

    So this is what happens when you live on an island in Alaska.

    I'm going to crack open my RP3 and DHX for a lube-job when the Spot and RFX traingles are getting PC'd. This should be fun.
    The red couch has moved from Alaska to Florida...

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by tscheezy
    Yeah, I put the DHX air sleeve on Barny's 5-Spot's RP3. Hopefully that fixes the situation with that shock on her bike. Despite a Pushing and a lot of sag, she was not getting anywhere near the last inch of travel. She had been getting full travel with the DHX Air and a bit less sag along with a plush ride prior to the pushed RP3. If the DHX Air can doesn't make matters better, I'll put a full DHX Air back on her bike. It's hard to argue with success.
    tscheezy, I was having the same problem as Barney, but for different reasons. This higher volume sleeve that came off of a Blur shock fixed my travel problems.

    With the standard RP3 sleeve, I was only seeing 3.75-4" of consistent travel from my Ventana built frame. This while also running excessive sag. Now I'm in the 25-30% range, and am getting full travel from the shock.


  25. #25
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    Chad answered that was how the DHX Air came with the smaller sleeve.

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