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  1. #1
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    No good Why Wont Trek Sell Framesets

    Why is it that Trek will not sell just frames for any other model of the 08 Fuel EX Series, apart from the ultra priced Carbon one???

    surely i am not the only person who thinks they have great frames, but are kind of let down by the Bontrager Finishing Kit?

    So wouldnt it be nicer if they gave you the option of doing custom builds to your own spec by selling just the frames, or maybe Frames with the Fox Shock and Fork Perhaps, i belive PACE do something like that.

  2. #2
    Nightmare on Lyrik st. VI
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    Frame sets are overpriced anyway. Just pick up the cheapest model with the frame you want, and sell the parts you don't need. It's a bit of a hassle, but in the end the final cost of the frame will probably be cheaper than what they would sell the frame for. Also, you can take advantage of end of year sales because stores have bikes in stock they want to get rid of, whereas they almost never stock frames and you have to pay full price for them.

    If any of the bikes has a spec close to what you want (fork, drivetrain, etc.) a better option is to get that one and sell the unwanted parts.

    In my case I got a Remedy 8 for $2800 whereas the frame only was about $2000. I wouldn't buy the bontrager parts if I were building the frame up, but that's not because they are bad. It's just a problem of brand recognition and because they are actually more expensive than other more popular alternatives, because you can't find them on the internet. For what I saved I don't mind a few bontrager parts.

    Also, you can ask at your LBS to swap them, if you want. I traded the stem for a Race Face Atlas at no additional cost. I returned the saddle for credit. I kept the handlebar, and the seatpost. Glad I didn't invest in a Thomson, because I'm getting a Joplin now. So it remains the handlebar and the wheels. The wheels are actually quite good, strong for their weight, topped with a 5 year warranty.

    So my suggestion is don't give up on building your Trek as you want just because there are no frames available. There are many ways to skin the cat. Building a frame up is almost guaranteed to be the most expensive one.

  3. #3
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    Ive seen a 08 Fuel EX alu frame for sale in germany.

    And I sure hope it will be possible to buy a remedy 09 frame this year. From what I heard, the 08 got sold right away, or made in very small quantities - any way, the where gone in seconds.

  4. #4
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    i think i saw something simalar on Ebay as well.......just the frame, but brand new, in box (different to full bike box) with all the Trek Tags on it.

    i would have thought it wouldnt have been this hard to get a hold of one, i mean surely Trek would have to have some somewhere to replace broken frames from bikes still under warranty.

  5. #5
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    thanks for posting that amrgb my thoughts exactly to be honest i was looking at a fuel ex9 but stepped up to the 9.8 and the spec was rubbish no rp24 and the bontrager finishing gear put the nail in the coffin for me and I walked away

    I would buy the frame alone and could spec it better for just a bit more money
    Im not so impressed with treks idea of spec I would have thought you got the same spec as the ex9 but on the ex9.8 frame especially for the difference in price

    i suppose i was prepared to pay uk money 2100 for the ex9 and strip the bits but the ex9.8 is nearly 900 more and comes with some pretty heavy parts on it im not sure its any lighter than the ex9 either??

  6. #6
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    I was seriously considering a trek this year but the specs are not that good. I dont ever remember an LX bike coming at 3,300.
    http://www.trekbikes.com/us/en/bikes...fuel/topfuel8/

  7. #7
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    after seeing you guys replies and scanning through the rest of the forum, i think i will finally give up on this idea of getting the EX8 Frame.

    have started to fall in love with a Black Yeti 575 Frame now, great price from Jenson as well!!!!!!!

  8. #8
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    It's ticks me off too - i was looking at getting a new Top Fuel SSL but i had to buy the WHOLE bike with all the bontrager kit i didn't want, sure i could sell it, but it's a hassle i can do without and i dont want a Trek THAT badly.

    I've gone elsewhere now so Trek have lost out on another customer - i bet we are not the only ones.

    It's daft really. If they offered bikes without the mountain of tacky bontrager parts i'd be happy but noo.

  9. #9
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    it's the opposite of daft. if they have somewhat limited production and are selling all they make of a certain model (like the superfly), they have zero incentive to sell it as a frameset since they will make more money on the fully spec'd bike.

  10. #10
    Lionel Hutz, Esq.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tiffster
    i had to buy the WHOLE bike with all the bontrager kit i didn't want
    The 2009 Top Fuel 9.9 SSL will be available for purchase as a frameset. Look to spend around $3500-$4000. Contact your LBS and see if you can get your name on a waitlist.

    The 2008 Top Fuel 9.9 SSL is (as of the time of this post) currently available as a frameset. Look to spend around $3000-$3300. There's only a handful left in each size, though.
    2007 Trek Fuel EX 8
    1999 Trek 7000 --- Dragonfly Green = Sexy
    2002 Trek 2100
    2008 Felt New Belgium Cruiser

  11. #11
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    Every Trek rep i've spoken to said it wont be....

    Doesnt matter anyway as ive found something better now.

  12. #12
    Lionel Hutz, Esq.
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    Ah. Well I'd listen to them, then. Good to hear you found something, though.
    2007 Trek Fuel EX 8
    1999 Trek 7000 --- Dragonfly Green = Sexy
    2002 Trek 2100
    2008 Felt New Belgium Cruiser

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by dewthedru
    it's the opposite of daft. if they have somewhat limited production and are selling all they make of a certain model (like the superfly), they have zero incentive to sell it as a frameset since they will make more money on the fully spec'd bike.
    would you rather sell 100 complete bikes at 6000 dollars a pop, or sell 100 complete bikes at 6K a pop and 20 frames at 3000 a pop?

    for a company with production capacity the size of trek, framesets absolutely make sense. I'm pretty radically against bontrager wheels, but I rode a remedy 9 at sea otter and it came in at sub 30 lbs for a 6 inch bike and as long as the components don't break I'm ok with that.

    That said, I would never go out of my way to buy a mountain of bontrager crap

  14. #14
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    lol. i'm sure they know what they're doing. they have many highly-paid individuals looking at these exact scenarios and while they may lose your business, they obviously think they can make it up in the revenue gained by the components sold on all the other framesets.

    btw, did you even read my post? it starts with "if they have somewhat limited production...."

  15. #15
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    I dont get this

    would anyone like to take a stab at why the topfuel 8.0 and the EX8.0 very so much in price? I mean i get it that they need different price points to sell bikes to everyone, but the 2 bikes are almost speced identically (the cheaper bike having more travel and a fox fork) but the prices are very far apart.

    check it out

    http://www.trekbikes.com/us/en/bikes...pfuel8,fuelex8

    At 2600 the price is pretty reasonable for the EX but 3300 for the top fuel? What am i missing?

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by dewthedru
    lol. i'm sure they know what they're doing. they have many highly-paid individuals looking at these exact scenarios and while they may lose your business, they obviously think they can make it up in the revenue gained by the components sold on all the other framesets.

    btw, did you even read my post? it starts with "if they have somewhat limited production...."
    your right. companies with highly paid consultants have never made mistakes before.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by heythorp
    would anyone like to take a stab at why the topfuel 8.0 and the EX8.0 very so much in price? I mean i get it that they need different price points to sell bikes to everyone, but the 2 bikes are almost speced identically (the cheaper bike having more travel and a fox fork) but the prices are very far apart.

    check it out

    http://www.trekbikes.com/us/en/bikes...pfuel8,fuelex8

    At 2600 the price is pretty reasonable for the EX but 3300 for the top fuel? What am i missing?
    You are paying for the race lite wheels (over the rythm... $$ there). Better crank on the top fuel, and race lite handle bar and seatpost. Not much but it all adds up. Is it worth the difference? Probably not.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by William42
    your right. companies with highly paid consultants have never made mistakes before.

    who said consultants? my point is that i can assure you there's no one back in wisconsin reading this thread thinking, "oh crap. if we would have sold the framesets by themselves, we would have made more money."

    is it the right decision? i have no idea. but i am certain that they made the decision with capacity, component profitability, market position, etc. in mind.

  19. #19
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    I'm not sure why this got so ugly, but I think dew is right. If someone could buy a frameset and build a nicer bike out of it than Trek for the same price, why wouldn't they?

    Certainly, Trek is making money on the Bontrager group. But they are also ensuring that each and every bike is up to some kind of Trek brand-quality.

    They might not like, for example, someone building up an EX9 with a 15 year old crankset, Avid BB7s, a RockShox tora 318 SoloAir and a couple of homebuilt disc wheels ( I bought a used EX9 frameset and did just that, for about $800 total including frameset/shock). If someone else sees the bike, they might think it comes that way for that price, and be turned off by it. i.e. it hurts their brand!

    Most people upgrade a bike. They almost never downgrade components. All most people will ever see is bikes that have been UPGRADED from their original spec. So when you force people to buy the original bike complete, you almost never see bikes that are less than original spec, and more often see bikes tricked out from original spec. This HELPS their brand.

    So whether its a branding issue, or a production issue, or whatever, they have chosen to sell their bikes how they want to. There is no sense being mad at them. You can always buy a used frameset and build it up however you like for thou$and$ less than you can purchase the bike new. Drawbacks are that you might not be able to get this year's bike now, and you wont get the frame warranty.

  20. #20
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    tell me about it. i bought a superfly and swapped out parts immediately.

  21. #21
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    lets take a look at another company that seems to have a similar strategy (specialized anybody?) They have budget builds ala the fsr xc, the pitch, the bighit. But they also have their "this is a ridiculous bike" lines like the epic, the sxt, the demo lines. Guess whether or not they sell framesets and whether or not their framesets sell well enough that they make more money by selling framesets then not selling framesets; They, like trek, throw tons of their own in house stuff on even their highest end modals.

    Trek has obviously made a conscious decision on this, but that doesn't mean it was a good decision. I'm not disagreeing that there are reasons for a company like trek to not sell framesets, I'm merely pointing out that it is a very well established fact that selling completes AND framesets makes more money as long as you have the goods to match whatever price you set your stuff at.

    I would probably be riding a trek bike, but I have to have bontrager wheels, bars, stem, pedals, etc. Who the F**k wants an expensive set of bontrager wheels? How can you make a good argument for buying a trek bike for a ton of money when the guys down the street are putting out an as nice, if not nicer frame, (or complete) that doesn't involve buying a bunch of crap components.

    I know trek made a conscious decision. That much is quite clear. I also know that there ARE reasons for it. All I'm arguing is that there are better reasons in favor of making a frameset, even if its a limited production type deal and you sell it for alot of coin, (talk about a good way to hype your bike, make it so exclusive only rich people can ride it and its bound to look good) and that I think trek is making a mistake by not selling a frameset.

  22. #22
    Nightmare on Lyrik st. VI
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    Everyone just assumes the Bontrager parts are garbage. Which isn't necessarily true.

    But even if they are, it's quite easy to make a deal with the LBS to swap the parts out. The only Bontrager bits on my Remedy are the wheels (I'm liking them), the bar (I can't see no reason to swap it). I swapped the stem for a burlier Race Face Atlas (the stock one looked too XC, but I'm happy with one on my XC rig), the seatpost for a Joplin, and the grips for Ourys (after trying Ourys, anything other than that would have to go).

    You guys make it sound like Bontrager parts are Walmart level parts. Besides, there aren't that many Bontrager parts on the bike anyway, and most of them are low-tech parts. The handlebar weighs 30g more than others? Is that a reason for not getting the frame you want?

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by amrgb
    You guys make it sound like Bontrager parts are Walmart level parts. Besides, there aren't that many Bontrager parts on the bike anyway, and most of them are low-tech parts. The handlebar weighs 30g more than others? Is that a reason for not getting the frame you want?
    I can't understand where the Bontrager haters are coming from, considering the fact that Bontrager gear comes with a 5-year warranty and has no user weight limit.

  24. #24
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    Ditto with the two above posters. Why the flack for Bontrager? Its good stuff and sometimes killer prices. FSA, ritchey.etc can't be THAT much better if at all.

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    +1 one the no user weight limit coming from a fatty like me.

  26. #26
    Nightmare on Lyrik st. VI
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    Quote Originally Posted by DukeNeverwinter
    Ditto with the two above posters. Why the flack for Bontrager? Its good stuff and sometimes killer prices. FSA, ritchey.etc can't be THAT much better if at all.
    I can only partially agree with you on the price. If you're looking at msrp, Bontrager parts are not badly priced. But they can't be found online which means you don't get the usual discounts you can get on other brands shopping online. If you shop around you can get other "superior" brands for the same or less.

  27. #27
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    The trouble with Bontrager parts IMO are these:

    Weights - Bontrager are outragous on some of the claimed weights. For example Bonty Race X lite centrelock wheels are suppose to weigh 1540grams. Even without rim strips, adapters or valves mine weigh 1670grams. And it's like that with everything. The Race X lite Pro saddle i had which was meant to be 150g was 170g.

    Now for some people thats not a problem, but when your paying for the higher end stuff for the weight savings its pointless. Especially if your a XC person.

    I also don't like Bontragers massive branding - the new Race XXX wheels for example, could the "Bontrager" stickers be any bigger?! I like my stuff stealthy and svelt. (this isn't just bontrager i feel about with this, specialized too)

    Which in turn brings into another issue from the above, whilst they are a better quality brand they just dont look it.

  28. #28
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    FWIW - The Bontrager stuff that I've weighed has been spot on with what their website quoted - seat posts, stems, bars, etc. I haven't had a bad experience with any of their parts yet.

  29. #29
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    ditto. Maybe nots the wheels but everything else I have bought is pretty darn close.

  30. #30
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    I feel that the bad reputation that Bontrager has gotten is partly because people just regurgitate what other people have said without actually having any experience with the product. Just how I "know" that Fire XCs are some of the bestest tires, even though I only know one guy who rides on them. Or how when talking about Rockshox a buddy of mine remarked "Rockshox are crap," even though I KNOW he's never ridden on a RS fork, ever. If you hear something enough, it becomes like gospel--even if it's not true.

  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by deftones156
    I feel that the bad reputation that Bontrager has gotten is partly because people just regurgitate what other people have said without actually having any experience with the product. .
    So true. A seatpost is pretty much a seatpost. You can shave a few grams here or there, but rims, stems, seatposts, handlebars, cranksets, grips, are pretty much all function the same... for the life of the bike.

    It pays to be picky with things that contain bearings... bottom brackets, headsets, hubs, and with things like brakes and gearing. Most of the things that make up the Bontrager portion of the group, though, are inconsequential as long as they perform there function.

  32. #32
    organically fed
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    I think Bontrager stuff is sh!t.

  33. #33
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    I think you've been brainwashed

  34. #34
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    The Sh!t!!

  35. #35
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    Do you think brands like Raceface, FSA, Syncros, Funn, Titec, whatever... each has it's own manufacturing facility? I don't think so. It's safe to say most are made by the same couple of taiwanese factories, including Bontrager and Specialized's stuff.
    Not all but most.
    Bontrager stuff is fine.

  36. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by amrgb
    Frame sets are overpriced anyway. Just pick up the cheapest model with the frame you want, and sell the parts you don't need. It's a bit of a hassle, but in the end the final cost of the frame will probably be cheaper than what they would sell the frame for. Also, you can take advantage of end of year sales because stores have bikes in stock they want to get rid of, whereas they almost never stock frames and you have to pay full price for them.

    If any of the bikes has a spec close to what you want (fork, drivetrain, etc.) a better option is to get that one and sell the unwanted parts.

    In my case I got a Remedy 8 for $2800 whereas the frame only was about $2000. I wouldn't buy the bontrager parts if I were building the frame up, but that's not because they are bad. It's just a problem of brand recognition and because they are actually more expensive than other more popular alternatives, because you can't find them on the internet. For what I saved I don't mind a few bontrager parts.

    Also, you can ask at your LBS to swap them, if you want. I traded the stem for a Race Face Atlas at no additional cost. I returned the saddle for credit. I kept the handlebar, and the seatpost. Glad I didn't invest in a Thomson, because I'm getting a Joplin now. So it remains the handlebar and the wheels. The wheels are actually quite good, strong for their weight, topped with a 5 year warranty.

    So my suggestion is don't give up on building your Trek as you want just because there are no frames available. There are many ways to skin the cat. Building a frame up is almost guaranteed to be the most expensive one.
    A Remedy frame would not sell for $2k. You can get handmade frames for less than that. Trek's marketing model pushes the entire bike, it's what 99% of their customers want. They sell complete bikes.
    Draft College Republicans

  37. #37
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    I've still got my bontrager titec titanium handlebars.
    Bought 'em when they first hit the market, think it was '92
    I wouldnt trade them in for anything.

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