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  1. #1
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    What happened to Klein???

    Does anyone have any idea what has happened to Klein?

    First they stop making full sussers and now they don't even seem to make hardtails any more. Is this all part of a Trek conspiracy?

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    Rip 1995

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    Some of the Trek Kleins were nice. I loved riding my Chehalis-made Adept..

    But mtb doesnt seem to be a priority there anymore. GK hasnt made an original FS design since the Mantra, and the market for high-end aluminum hardtails has pretty much gone kaput.

    I thought the carbon Mantra was going to be a harbinger of things to come, but the company seems to have been marginalized. They need to free themselves from Trek and re-invent itself, a la Ibis.

    That said, it probably aint ever happening.

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    How can they "free themselves" from Trek when they are Trek?

  5. #5
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    Klein was in deep financial trouble and sold to Trek in the 90's. As soon as it was sold, it appears that Gary Klein took off and stopped having any involvement in the company. While people want to argue the Trek was the big bad giant company, the fact is that if they didn't buy Klein, it would have died within 6 months. It is likely that Gary's lack of involvement is voluntary, given that Gary Fisher and Keith Bontrager are both still heavily involved in the development and design of products for the Trek owned companies that bear their names.
    Riding slowly since 1977.

  7. #7
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    Trek should release a limited series of Kleins and Bontragers every 5 years, give the people what they want!

    Bontrager Steel and Titaniun 29ers

    Rigid Klein Adroits Fuselage, except standard bottom bracket shell

    They would sell out!

    Trek has no vision!!

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Northernlight
    Does anyone have any idea what has happened to Klein?

    First they stop making full sussers and now they don't even seem to make hardtails any more. Is this all part of a Trek conspiracy?
    They're still around, and make a couple of road bikes(one a softtail), a hybrid and the Attitude hardtails. They're a Trek brand now and available through Trek Stores and a few other Trek dealers.

  9. #9
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    Why?

    Quote Originally Posted by snowdrifter
    except standard bottom bracket shell
    The press fit BB is zero maintanance and Trek is semi-reintroducing it on their high end road bikes.

    Propriatary headsets/forks...yup Trek and several others are doing this once again.

    They would surely sell out if they did a limited run...however almost none of the bikes would get ridden, which is really a bigger crime than discontinuing them in the first place.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shayne
    The press fit BB is zero maintanance and Trek is semi-reintroducing it on their high end road bikes.

    Propriatary headsets/forks...yup Trek and several others are doing this once again.

    They would surely sell out if they did a limited run...however almost none of the bikes would get ridden, which is really a bigger crime than discontinuing them in the first place.

    I'm with you on the press in bb, mine lasted 10years before replacing, just stuck on square taper, and if you don't have the press tool, kind of booty to swap spindles around
    for a different crank choice. Dirt Rag had a article recently on Cannondale SI cranks, press in BB, like it was something new.. give me a break!

    I'd ride a 29er Bontrager in a heartbeat The Klein, well..., that could be a little painful, maybe climb Mt. Washington on it.

  11. #11
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    You defo can't buy Klein's in the UK anymore.

    I don't know why they stopped making the Palomino after only a couple of years, was a great Maverick led design and way cheaper than the real thing.

    But like most people, i'm sure that a boutique line of high quality hardtails will always sell...they would just need to keep the designs unique from the Treks that are now almost identical.

  12. #12
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    I think that pressed-in bb's get a bad rap from some but they are durable. I don't understand why they can't make a cartridge bb as durable. I'm sure ther are reasons in terms of tradeoffs between cost, durability, and weight. I'm not complaining so much as pleading ignorance.

    As far as the proprietary headset, it wasn't the headset that was the issue, those were just standard (albeit unusual) bearings that could be picked up from an industrial bearing store. The issue was getting a fork with a corresponding steerer tube. I'm sure that if Klein came out with a run of a few hundred old school aluminum forks they would sell out in a heartbeat. The chances of this happening, however, approach zero. Such a fork would require extensive setup, specially drawn tubes, and jigs and if Specialized didn't run off some extra Ground Controls when they already made them for that revival Stumpjumper, Klein isn't going to come out with an Al fork.

    IANAPLBIDPOOTV (I Am Not A Patent Lawyer But I Do Play One On Tv) but the first Al forks came out in 1990, that was 17 years ago. In the U.S. I believe that patents last for 17 years, so that patents on the early Kleins, forks & frames, should be entering public domain. Hmmmm.....

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  13. #13
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    Klein will live forever, if only in "Seinfeld" reruns.

  14. #14
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    What happened to Klein???
    Started dying in 1997, took it's final breath in 2001.

    I like old and newer Kleins and I don't care they belong to Trek, but after they brought the barrel shaped headtube and made the top tube bigger than the down tube and had those huge dropouts, they completly lost me.

    As much as I know the contract between Klein and Trek ran out this year, but seems got renewed and yes the poster above me is perfectly right, GK has nothing to say anymore ( a consultant sort of....) and barely drops by anyway and he doesn't give a flying **** anymore.
    That it can be done shows GF for instance.

    The real decision makers at Klein/Trek are 2 guys, I wrote them quite many times and complained, even sent in drawings and suggestions (reasonable ones), if they got heard there might be hope for 2008, I guess I was too late for '07, if nothing happens then they don't care as well.....why would they anyway, with Treks Project One, they took away the last thing Klein had......paintjobs.....

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by yellowbook
    , with Treks Project One, they took away the last thing Klein had......paintjobs.....
    wrong, the name itself, Klein.

    They would sell way more Project One Klein MTBs than Trek.

    Two guys, with half a brain.

    Project One Adroit Gator Fade 29er, that would sell.

    Maybe if Trek ever visited this board they could swindle some ideas.
    beaver hunt

  16. #16
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    Klein

    Fellas,

    Was contemplating purchasing a 06 Klein Attitude Frame and still am. It is what it is - I have spoken to numerous people in regards to the fact that Trek didn't introduce Klein to the USA for the 07 model year. They were only avail. in Japan. The market over there for Kleins per their say is huge - go figure. So only time will tell if they are going to be avail. for 08. I am in love with the Sputnik Re-entry Black Deboss frame - they would've had a sale if they were offered to us in 07 for sure. I have heard rumors that Gary might be making a purchase again real soon - lets keep our fingers crossed - hopefully that real Kleins will return in the not so distant future.

    Trek - ? not knocking them but they've always just seemed to big to make a quality rig.

    Peace

  17. #17
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    2 Guys And A Garage

    Quote Originally Posted by MD51
    Trek - ? not knocking them but they've always just seemed to big to make a quality rig.
    That was Trek in the beginning.
    Now they're a corporate monstrosity sure, but they starts small as small can be and for a dozen or so years cranked out some amazing handmade (not "handmade") frames.

    I'm anti-Trek more than the next guy but I have to give them respect for what they've managed to do as a company.
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  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by MD51
    Fellas,

    Was contemplating purchasing a 06 Klein Attitude Frame and still am. It is what it is - I have spoken to numerous people in regards to the fact that Trek didn't introduce Klein to the USA for the 07 model year. They were only avail. in Japan. The market over there for Kleins per their say is huge - go figure. So only time will tell if they are going to be avail. for 08. I am in love with the Sputnik Re-entry Black Deboss frame - they would've had a sale if they were offered to us in 07 for sure. I have heard rumors that Gary might be making a purchase again real soon - lets keep our fingers crossed - hopefully that real Kleins will return in the not so distant future.

    Trek - ? not knocking them but they've always just seemed to big to make a quality rig.

    Peace
    Incorrect. Kleins are available in the U.S. but it will be rare that you find a shop that will carry them. We were a Klein dealer until this year. We stopped carrying Klein in 2007 because they required a $50,000 committment to stock their bikes. That's a hell of a lot of bikes. There are a very minute amount of shops who are carrying them in the US, however most Kleins are going to Japan. I wish we could still order them. I would love to EP an Attitude.

    As far as Gary Klein starting his own company again, we hear lots of rumors being as our shop is based just 45 minutes from the original Klein location. It's been said that the new company will be Chehalis Bikes, however there is skepticism at our shop as it's likely that Trek has a contract with Mr. Klein which prevent him from starting another company or using his old technologies. Just thoughts/rumors and so fourth.

    -Kevin @ Byman's Bikes

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by bmxconvert
    As far as Gary Klein starting his own company again, we hear lots of rumors being as our shop is based just 45 minutes from the original Klein location. It's been said that the new company will be Chehalis Bikes, however there is skepticism at our shop as it's likely that Trek has a contract with Mr. Klein which prevent him from starting another company or using his old technologies. Just thoughts/rumors and so fourth.

    -Kevin @ Byman's Bikes
    That's very interesting and too good to be true, even if they're called Chehalis Bikes!

    Do you have any info on the contract between Klein and Trek, again, I heard it ran out this year.....or will there be a big change in '08?

    Well, time will tell......my gut feeling is thou, that nothings going to happen, everything stays the way it is.

  20. #20
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    I have no idea as to the veracity of the rumors. Non-compete agreements are quite common but they are generally of a limited nature and not life-long. They might say, 'Five years out of the bike biz for you'. I would be surprised if there is a non-compete clause that had a lifetime ban. It's possible that it's lifelong, just not sure how likely. That is complete speculation on my part and only based on general business history.

    Do see my post that the patents on Klein's stuff have either expired (those in the 80's) and the early 90's patents are about to expire.

    Pinguwin
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  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by pinguwin
    I have no idea as to the veracity of the rumors. Non-compete agreements are quite common but they are generally of a limited nature and not life-long. They might say, 'Five years out of the bike biz for you'. I would be surprised if there is a non-compete clause that had a lifetime ban. It's possible that it's lifelong, just not sure how likely. That is complete speculation on my part and only based on general business history.

    Do see my post that the patents on Klein's stuff have either expired (those in the 80's) and the early 90's patents are about to expire.

    Pinguwin
    Lifetime non-competes do not stand up in court in the US. It will be a limited time (5 years is likely).

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    Quote Originally Posted by yellowbook
    That's very interesting and too good to be true, even if they're called Chehalis Bikes!

    Do you have any info on the contract between Klein and Trek, again, I heard it ran out this year.....or will there be a big change in '08?

    Well, time will tell......my gut feeling is thou, that nothings going to happen, everything stays the way it is.
    I wish I had more info, all I know is what Trek has told us. We may possibly hear more after Trek World/Interbike. I'll be sure to ask, but the update won't be for a couple months.

    -Kevin

  23. #23
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    fair enough, thanks!

  24. #24
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    Is there anything wrong with the 06 Attitude frame?

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gary H
    Is there anything wrong with the 06 Attitude frame?
    IMO A LOT!
    The rear dropouts are huge, the top tube is bigger and thicker than the down tube, the barrel shaped head tube, they way they run the cables and the welds used to be a whole lot nicer too.

    Naw, not my cup of tea at all.

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