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  1. #1
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    Trek Stache for XC racing... am I crazy?

    So here's the deal. I'm in need of a new xc hard trail and while I do a fair amount of XC/endurance racing I also hit jumps and drops on my XC bike. I also like to spend 2 or 3 hours tuning laps at Rays Indoor MTB park in Cleveland. My current frame is a 2006 Niner Air 9 with a hair line crack.

    I've been considering a Superfly 9.6 carbon or Superfly 8 aluminum. I was trying to figure out which frame would be stronger for my type of riding and then the Trek Stache crossed my mind. I'd run xc parts, SRAM XX1 and possibly a 100 mm fork. I hope the frame is about 4 lbs and would like to get the bike down to about 24 lbs.

    So am I crazy? Has anyone set up a Trek stache for XC racing, weighted the frame or run a 100mm fork?

    I know 2 bikes would be best with the Stache for training and a lighter weight Superfly for racing but can't do both.

    Let me know what you think and thanks for the input!

  2. #2
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    Re: Trek Stache for XC racing... am I crazy?

    Carbon would would ride way better for xc races.

    Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk 2
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  3. #3
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    jumps and drops on an XC bike aren't a good idea.

    if you lighten the Stache to 24 pounds...I doubt lightweight wheels and build to get it there will last to that abuse either.

    How much do you weigh?
    Mike
    Toronto, Canada
    2014 Giant TCX SLR2
    2013 Trek Stache 8
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  4. #4
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    Look into getting the Remedy 8 there made for drops.
    Remedy 8 29 - Trek Bicycle
    The 7 doesnt have a thru axle u could up grade it tho and get different rims
    Remedy 7 29 - Trek Bicycle

  5. #5
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    Good point on the carbon being more complaint, keep taking that for granted.

    I weight about 185 lbs when I get on the bike. For wheels I run Stans 355 or Crest rims, DT 240 hubs and 32 DT comp 2.0-1.8 spokes. Currently my front wheel is a DT 190 with Sapim CX ray spokes (really need to save it for racing but it's so nice!). I tried the CX ray spokes in the rear but broke 2 or 3. Haven't broken any in the front.

    I build my own wheels and usually get two years out of them. I should starting to build up training wheels with Stans Arch rims. I've had a few 355 start cracking at the spoke holes after a year of regular use (only on the rear). I use a tension meter and keep with in the suggested tension.

  6. #6
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    Might consider Light Bicycle rims for some stiffness.

  7. #7
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    Unless you are going to a carbon frame, just race on your stache. The geo is too similar, IMHO.

    I used crests for years on first 26 then race 29ers. Crest wheels are flexy, and I say that as a 165lbs racer... you owe it to yourself to try the light bicycle carbon rims. I have two sets now and I am addicted! I'll never own crests again.

  8. #8
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    Thanks for the input. I do like the idea of carbon rims and agree they are better than aluminum. Price is the reason I don't run carbon rims.

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    I've raced on alum and carbon bikes and wheels. One more piece of perspective: I would rather have an alum bike with carbon wheels, rather than a carbon bike with alum wheels. every racer I've talked to with carbon wheels agrees with this sentiment. My $.02.

  10. #10
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    I think the Light-Bicycle AM (wide) carbon rims would be an excellent match for the Stache, and I'd race XC on one in a heartbeat

  11. #11
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    The Stache as a frame and fork combo would make a fantastic XC bike in my opinion, it would allow the more creative line choice that a trail rider might choose. Just lighten up the wheels and some of the parts and you'll easily have a 23-25 hard charging bike capable of setting some good times. The frame is still and it's certainly not the lightest out their but you'll probably enjoy the ride more.

  12. #12
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    Around here the stache would make a fine race bike on our courses. Annnddd if you run a 100mm fork it is quite literally almost identical in geometry to my superfly al... but much prettier. Go for it.

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    Why does a longer travel fork hurt you on XC as compared to a shorter travel? Can't you simple by a bit more air in the longer travel shock? Thanks

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    I have 120mm fork on my Scott Scale and I don't see any reason why you couldn't race it in XC...it's a fantastic setup.

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    The Trek Factory Demo was here last weekend. I road a Stache 8 and several sizes of the Superfly 9.8 on my trails.
    I felt the Superfly 9.8(9.6 is same frame) to be a very impressive frame- the solo air SID fork lacked small bump compliance. 435 chainstays made it quick but it was still stable. Trek's compliant carbon engineering was the biggest draw. The aluminum Stache was heavier and the rear didn't have the flow feeling of the Superfly going over bumps. I'm thinking that carbon frame will handle all the drops, rocks and roots I normally ride with an aluminum frame, just more smoothly. The 9.8 carbon Fuel EX also got through everything but didn't have the connected minimalist feel of the Superfly. It's a sweet bike.

  16. #16
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    Cool! Thanks for the mini review of the two bikes. I think the compliance of the frames is a big issue. Good to hear how they compare. Are you use to the G2 geometry or did you find you fit better on one size up from what you normally ride?

    The Stache is closer to the geometry I'm use to. Just to get the seat height right on a Superfly I would have to run size up and that would put me running a 70 ot 80mm stem, although I hear that's not uncommon with the G2 geometry.

  17. #17
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    I rode a 19.5, then a 20.5 and then an 18.5 Superfly 9.8. I rode an 18.5 Stache. I'm 5'10.75" with a 32" inseam.
    I usually ride a 48mm offset Manitou Tower Pro fork, so, close to the 51mm G2. I could have ridden any of those sizes, although the 20.5 handled a little slower because of the increased wheelbase. I got the initial impression the 19.5 and then the 18.5 were a little cramped. They both had a 90mm stem. And the initial steering was quicker than I expected. But as I rode them the weight distribution seemed excellent and I melded in with the 18.5 for great trail feel through the rear and the right amount of weight on the front. It is a pretty unique feeling of solid but compliant frame going over all the bumps.
    For contrast I demoed a Niner Air 9 RDO carbon with the same fork. Light but not anywhere near the damping.
    The Team Issue XR2 2.20 tires were high volume and as grippy as the Nobby Nic I usually ride and fast rolling--another surprise. Any cramped feeling disappeared quickly with the normal fore and aft movements from climbing and descending. I spent 5 hours on the different Superfly sizes over two days of the demo. The SID solo air bounced off rocks and roots during climbs even with only 90psi. Luckily there is a mod to add some of the old dual air compliance.

  18. #18
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    The Stache should be great for racing (and for a Tough frame--one would think!)

    I had an older Paragon (and mine, and everyone I knew who had an older Paragon had a frame crack..) Granted I did not know 5 people who had one!?!? but they did crack..

    My new Superfly is the 'bees knees' so to speak (geometry and sturdiness..)

    Now me, I do not trust carbon frames (being 200 lbs)-- and on thing I leaned form everyon I talked to about MTB'ing in South Eastern Pennsylvania (rocky, rooty, etc..) was:

    1. 3 things to not buy carbon (bars, seat post and stem)---AND FRAME!!

    because knowing folks who had a crack (they are like glass)--and will cut the hell outta you if they break... --BUT That is just me!!--I just don't trust them (from what I have heard)----and being 200lbs I would Only go with an aluminum frame...

  19. #19
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    Everyone has their fears--rational and irrational.
    I caught the end of my Easton Haven carbon bar on a tree and flipped the bike and me-- no problems---- quality carbon products.
    I had a soft landing.

    Carbon vs aluminum Santa Cruz test lab.
    Pinkbike Visits The Santa Cruz Test Lab Video - Pinkbike

    Trek is a major manufacturer with design and quality standards backed by a lifetime warranty.

    At the demo Trek also had their carbon road bikes with damping engineering. Testers were commenting about the bikes soaking up the road bumps. For high end road bikes there are no new wheel sizes. It's all about carbon and compliance. No aluminum.
    I'm feeling a crossover from Trek's top of the heap road frame engineering to their mountain bikes.
    Last edited by eb1888; 09-21-2013 at 01:26 PM.

  20. #20
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    Am in the same boat. Torn between a stache or superfly. I talked to my LBS and they said there's really not anything to stop the stache from being ridden as an XC. It may not be the lightest with the components but you're still getting the same platinum aluminum in both frames. It basically came down to geo preference if you take away the small weight differences.

    I didn't love the way the stache handled in comparison to the superfly so I went with the later. But if you like the way the stache handles go for it.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by eb1888 View Post
    The Trek Factory Demo was here last weekend. I road a Stache 8 and several sizes of the Superfly 9.8 on my trails.
    I felt the Superfly 9.8(9.6 is same frame) to be a very impressive frame- the solo air SID fork lacked small bump compliance. 435 chainstays made it quick but it was still stable. Trek's compliant carbon engineering was the biggest draw. The aluminum Stache was heavier and the rear didn't have the flow feeling of the Superfly going over bumps. I'm thinking that carbon frame will handle all the drops, rocks and roots I normally ride with an aluminum frame, just more smoothly. The 9.8 carbon Fuel EX also got through everything but didn't have the connected minimalist feel of the Superfly. It's a sweet bike.
    I'm a big boy (currently 255 lbs dripping wet, the lightest I've been in quite some time), so I find the Stache's compliance excellent for me. Bikes that average riders feel are compliant, many times feel like a bouncy, wet dish towel to me. Many steel bikes fall into this category for me. I sometimes forget that my extra size makes bikes feel different to me than for average size riders.

    A demo ride is likely needed to see which would suit someone best.

  22. #22
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    The more time I spend on my Stache the faster I get. It has proven to hang with a LOT of bikes in just about every setting! Some downhill, jump lines, technical descents, flowing single track etc... The appeal is that it is kind of a swiss army knife and as such it may not be the LAST word in XC race speed, it WILL do everything pretty damn good and give you an edge in certain sections depending on course layout.

    I plan to start racing next year and while I am in NO WAY an experienced race authority I will do it on my Stache for sure!

  23. #23
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    I've had my first 20 Km ride on my Stache 8 (stock) and see no reason why it couldn't be raced in a beginner/sport class race.

    Sure there is a weight penalty, but dropping 2 pounds off my 210 pound carcass is a lot easier and cheaper than dropping the weight off the bike.
    Mike
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  24. #24
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    XC racing is not about the bike, it's all about your legs and lungs. Go ride and have fun!

  25. #25
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    I did my first ever race on my Stache 8 this weekend. It was a super short distance as I could not make the start time for the other lengths due to personal timing. I have to agree that I think XC racing has more to do with your strength and cardio however The Stache is a versatile bike overall and where perhaps other bikes may climb better I think you can use it's other strength's to your advantage. I was surprised to see I was able to descend and rip through technical terrain faster than other riders on what could be considered more nimble bikes however I think this comes full circle. It really comes down to the rider and as such as long as the bike you are starting with does not absolutely SUCK you can use it to race XC in lower category class races.

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