Any Race Day sightings? Or (I think I'm dreaming here) anybody actually ridden a Race Day? Gary Fisher and crew were riding Hall (Front Range, Colorado) last week. My riding buddy saw him, I wasn't there. He recognized the signature goatee. If I'd been there I woulda asked about the Race Day, but I've heard he's such a fast rider I probably wouldn't have had the chance.
Got my Raceday Procaliber today!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I am so happy because I finally got the bike. The one and only. It was worth every day of every month I waited!
I got a 16" because I saw how long the cockpits were, usually I ride a 17.5 which always felt borderline long for me. I had to push the seat forward some on the 17.5
Out of the box the bike was a hair under 25lbs with out pedals.
After my build up the bike weighed 22.5lbs with pedals!
My Cake was 24.5 with the same parts and a reba fork.
By my estimates that puts the frame wieght of the Procaliber at or under 5lbs...
The 16" Raceday with a 90mm stem and 5mm offset seatpost, the cockpit is the same as was on my 17.5 cake, but the wheelbase is way shorter.
Result is much improved climbing and cornering. This bike is long and low, the way a racebike should be.
By the time I got it built and tuned, the rain started and my first ride was cut short, but here is what I noticed:
CLASSIC GENISIS GEOMETRY, EXTREMELY STIFF LATERLY...I MEAN REALLY REALLY STIFF, TRACKS LIKE ITS ON RAILS IN G OUTS AND ROOTY CORNERS, INSPIRES CONFIDENCE. DESCENDING AND GENERAL FLAT TRAIL RIDING WAS SIMILAR TO THE SUGAR, BUT QUIETER, AND AGAIN THE STIFFNESS IS OBVIOUS.
CLIMBING WAS AMAZING. THE FRONT WHEEL STAYS STUCK AND STRAIGHT, AND OUT OF THE SADDLE EFFORTS THAT WERE IMPOSSIBLE ON THE CAKE, THE PROCALIBER BEGGED FOR, PLENTY OF REAR WHEEL TRACTION. I AM CONVINCED THIS BIKE WILL MAKE ME FASTER ON ALL CLIMBS.
I only have one ride so thats about all I can say so far. The instructions for the shock psi and fork seemed pretty spot on to start with, I will definately do some experimenting with shock psi to see what works best. this is one hardcore race bike.
someone got a Race Day
Bradski, for a few weeks you'll be the only one on any trail in the world with that bike. Congratulations! Hard to believe you could drop 2+ lbs by substituting your parts for that lightweight stock build. How'd you do that?
I'm interested in how the Race Day compares with the Sugar (I have an older Sugar and two Sugar+ bikes), not with the Cake as I have no experience with the Cake. What I've always said about the Sugar is it's basically a hardtail with cush when you need it--you don't give up anything in weight or quickness, just some suspension to help out. I always liked the Genesis geometry (I'm 5' 9"), run a 90 mm stem and keep the saddle pretty centered. The front end of my Sugars always felt light but that seemed to me to be one of the reasons they climbed so well is that the front wheel could climb up and over obstacles easier than a heavier front. I just had to learn not to pull up too hard while climbing to keep wheelyitis at bay.
Get a few more real rides in and please give us some more impressions.
believe it or not (I'm walkin on air)
Here are the parts I swapped;
replaced stock race lite wheelset with race x lites, saved about 200g
replaced stock rotors with aluminums saved over 100g
replaced juicy 7 brakes with oro puros
replaced bontrager bar and stem with raceface deus stem and 99g next sl flat bar
replaced stock seatpost and seat
replaced xo triggers with xo twisters
replaced bontrager crank with fsa mega exo carbon, no real wieght savings
triple ti eggbeater pedals
homemade tubless tires instead of included tubless ready tires
The cake had a reba, the procaliber has a sid wc.
I would say the procaliber handles similarly to the sugar, however it's geometry is designed around a 10% sag shock setup. The sugar geometry is the same with 25% sag. The headtube is not as steep as the sugar. Also the ride is silent without the ol chainstay slap. Its hard for me to give a fair comparison to my sugars because I always rode a 17.5, and now am on a 16 which probably will account for some handling differences.
How's the bike treating you so far? I just sold my Giant Trance 1 with hopes of getting something a little racier. The ProCaliber is on my short list with a Trek Fuel EX 9 or Top Fuel 98.
I just rode a SuperCaliber
I borrowed the GF rep's 17.5" Race Day, had a window of opportunity to test drive it, went up to Hall Ranch outside of Lyons, Colorado...just in time for the first thunderstorm I've seen around here in months! Everyone I met on the trail cast a weary eye on the black cloud and lightning ahead. At first I was comparing everything to the Sugars I own, knowing exactly what technical stuff I could clear on my other bikes, then I just tried to concentrate on how the Race Day handled. It seemed to wander on the climbs and I could never get really used to it on the ups--but I only had maybe 30 minutes of lightning-filled climbing. It had 3 inches of travel in back and I kinda wished it had 3" in front instead of 4". I knew the R7 Super because I have a Skareb Super, it rode the same. The shock was a new Manitou platform unit which was cushier than the Cane Creek AD10 on my original Sugar, but maybe not as plush as the Fox on my Suger+ bike. It felt fast which is what I look for in a climbing bike. Wished I'd had another hour on it.
Then I turned around and tried to outrace the rain. It felt really balanced and centered on the way down. Jumping over berms in the trail I would launch and it would just sail perfectly flat and true. That's probably the fastest I ever came down Hall. The Super and the Manitou in back felt really balanced. The Juicy 5s didn't really any different than my Hayes HFX 9s. The wide-apart seat stays sometimes hit my calves (whereas my calves never hit anything on my other bikes). I could shift my heels over to avoid that, but it's something to consider on a test ride.
I've already got Sugars and I love the way they ride. If I didn't have any bike at all and bought the Race Day I'd be getting a very light frame which rides great--kinda like my Sugars. I don't know if I see any reason for me to buy one just yet but if you want quick, light, climbs fast and descends faster, check out a Race Day.
xcguy or bradski,
Have either of you had any incidents of the pedals slapping the ground while riding the Race Day? The 12.2 inch bottom bracket height is rather low for a full suspension. I once owned a FS bike that frequently pedal slapped the ground no matter what shock pressure I ran and I would rather not own another bike that has a penchant to do that.
Never slapping the actual ground, although you will hit rocks while bottoming out the suspension more than a higher BB bike. My opinion about high BB bikes (like more than 13") is that I don't like having to search for a rock to put my foot down when I stop because I'm so high up in the air, or have to get off my saddle when I stop before I fall over. I had a high BB bike at first and actually dislocated half the fingers on my right hand before I got it through my head I couldn't "dab" my toes when I stopped to balance myself. That factor far outweighed not hitting my pedals on rocks occasionally. My bikes now max out at a 12 3/4" or less BB and I can just dab, which beats the sh!t out of not dabbing and falling over. For me, at least. I"ve gotten blank looks at bike stores when I asked how high the BB was on a bike I was looking at, like nobody else in the world thought about it but me. Just for the record, I have an original Fisher Sugar with a 11 7/8" BB (full XTR with vee brakes) along with my other 4" travel disc brake bikes. I took the Sugar to Moab last October and it was a great experience. Never missed disc brakes, the low BB was great because of all the gnarly stuff I was riding/having to dab, and it weighs 25.25 lbs. You could build up the Race Day lighter than that I bet. And dab.
Originally Posted by Squating Goat
I ve had my Raceday for about 4 weeks now and I love it. Its a hardcore race bike to the fullest. The frame is way lighter than my sugars and it feels very balanced with the 3" fork up front. Unfortunately we have had a 6 week break in the Ohio racing scene, so I won't race it for one more week. I did get a week in Fruita and Moab on it though. At first I was wondering why the bike was spec'd with a lockout until I had a few rides. Its a bob machine! If I adjust air psi to cancel the bob I loose a signifigant amount of travel. So unless you love flipping levers I would upgrade to an SPV type shock. I mounted a Rockshox mc33 on it tonight, we will see how that floodgate works tomarrow. The bike handles like a good racebike should, superfast! There is some lateral flex of the swingarm, but I never feel it on the trail, the bike feels very stiff and responsive, and the suspension spring rate feels very "linear". I would describe it as feeling more plush compared to the sugar in the rear. Climbing traction seems a little better, and its cornering is the best of any bike I have owned. The procaliber frame wieght is a claimed 4.5lbs! And by my estimates its damn close. Easily 5lbs or less.
So far so good, Ive had no issues with this bike yet. I swear I can pedal a gear higher almost everywhere compared to my Cake, but raceday will be the real test.
Race Day frame weight etc
Finally a number on the frame weight! That means I could take all the medium level stuff off one of my disc Sugar+s and have a bike that weighs about 25 lbs--but who's counting?
I wondered about that pivot location, if it would work in a past generation of rear shocks without platform. Bradski now informs us that, no, it's a Bob monster. The Sugars were completely the opposite, no Bob to be found, no platform or SPV needed. I can understand that the Fisher designers wanted to get rid of the supposed chain suck (which, miraculously, I never experienced more than any other bikes I've owned but many others did) and an elevated chainstay certainly eliminates a chain stuck down there.
I have to repeat that I've never descended like I did on the Race Day. An incredibly balanced cornering bike. It was like it knew where to go and I was just along for the ride. I would have loved to check out it's climbing abilities without the lightning, but I'll probably buy a frame next year (if it's available in frame-only) and then I can test test test.
I don't race, but I can imagine that races are won on the descents. Bradski?
Moab AND Fruita on your new bike?? I'm jealous.
Originally Posted by bradski
Just curious, which model did you get? The Procaliber and the Supercaliber are speced with Manitou S-Type SRL shocks with a platform valving in them. I've found the opposite situation as you have on my Race Day 29er Prototype...it doesn't bob much at all unless I go out of my way to make it bob.
29'er pro caliber
There's a write up on Cameron Chambers' 29'er version of the race day here:
Cameron only had five or six rides on the new bike when I talked with him, it's a good looking bike.