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Thread: Smuggler

  1. #601
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    Quote Originally Posted by ansman View Post
    Here is mine. A lot of Hope parts and a Bikeyoke dropper post.
    I'm pretty sure I've ridden this bike! Neil from velotek.se arranged me a demo in February. Thank you very much for helping me to make a right decision and get a Smuggler. If you ever come to Estonia with bike I can show you some nice trails around here.

  2. #602
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    any other XL (or L) riders have advice? About to buy pick up a Smuggler after coveting one for the past year.
    I'm 6'2", long legs and arms, and a bit torn between L and XL. I did get to pedal around on a L, my main concern there was that it required a lot of seat post.
    thanks!

  3. #603
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    I'm 6'3", also long legs and arms. XL is good for me with 70mm stem and 30mm of spacers. I have not tried L, but I think it is too small for our size.

  4. #604
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    6'2 here long torso and arms. I ride a large Smuggler with 40mm stem and 780mm bars, 140mm fork and 1 degree angle set all which change the geometry slightly. I have a 125mm dropper reverb and about 70mm of the post 'base' showing above the seat clamp.

    Comparing to most other bikes it's a fairly big large IMO, TT and reach are decent and I find it comfy.

    However, I am pretty sure I could also ride the XL no problem at all and actually I don't think there's much difference in standover height or seat post mast height on them is there - maybe 20mm or so?

  5. #605
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    XL has 38mm longer seattube and 26 longer reach

  6. #606
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    Every time this thread gets bumped, I click on it knowing I'll see: Transition introduces the carbon Smuggler. <sigh>

  7. #607
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    Quote Originally Posted by smartyiak View Post
    Every time this thread gets bumped, I click on it knowing I'll see: Transition introduces the carbon Smuggler. <sigh>
    Seems like there's a new Transition 29er in the works called the Sentinel. Looks like a lot more travel and so far just spotted in AL, likely a prototype. Singletrackworld.com has a write-up on what's been spotted.

  8. #608
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThatNateDude View Post
    Seems like there's a new Transition 29er in the works called the Sentinel. Looks like a lot more travel and so far just spotted in AL, likely a prototype. Singletrackworld.com has a write-up on what's been spotted.
    My hope is that they introduce a Carbon Smuggler, and an aluminum Sentinal at the same time.

  9. #609
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    Just finished building it up.
    Smuggler-img_20170714_121649.jpg
    Gotta get up to get down.
    LMB

  10. #610
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    Quote Originally Posted by BaeckerX1 View Post
    Just finished building it up.
    Click image for larger version. 

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    Bling Bling. Nice Build BaeckerX1!
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  11. #611
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    My Smuggler is still going strong and has a few upgrades since my last post.

    Cane Creek DBinline
    Cromag Trailmaster Saddle
    Wolf tooth elliptical chain ring 30T
    Schwalbe Magic Mary (F) / Nobby Nic (R)

    Smuggler-bm_smuggler.jpg
    Last edited by roadracerX; 07-14-2017 at 08:19 PM. Reason: edited pic

  12. #612
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    Quote Originally Posted by roadracerX View Post
    My Smuggler is still going strong and has a few upgrades since my last post.

    Cane Creek DBinline
    Cromag Trailmaster Saddle
    Wolf tooth elliptical chain ring 30T
    Schwalbe Magic Mary (F) / Nobby Nic (R)

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Whoa settle down on those colour combinations!

    /Jks - love the stealth build.

  13. #613
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    Quote Originally Posted by trailbrain View Post
    Bling Bling. Nice Build BaeckerX1!
    Thanks man. I'm having fun with it so far. We're still getting to know each other, but I think it's going to be a long and successful relationship.
    Gotta get up to get down.
    LMB

  14. #614
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    Finally got me a Sumggler, was going to wait for the new model but got a good deal on this demo one.

    Fox 36 fork
    Full XT drive line and brakes
    Easton Arc rims with DHF 2.5 and DHR 2.4
    Chromag pedals, stem and bar. But might change the blue bar and grips to a better suited colour.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Smuggler-img_0384.jpg  


  15. #615
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    Quote Originally Posted by bbunnys View Post
    Finally got me a Sumggler, was going to wait for the new model but got a good deal on this demo one.

    Fox 36 fork
    Full XT drive line and brakes
    Easton Arc rims with DHF 2.5 and DHR 2.4
    Chromag pedals, stem and bar. But might change the blue bar and grips to a better suited colour.
    Nice, how much travel are you running on the Fox 36?

  16. #616
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    Quote Originally Posted by bbunnys View Post
    Finally got me a Sumggler, was going to wait for the new model but got a good deal on this demo one.

    Fox 36 fork
    Full XT drive line and brakes
    Easton Arc rims with DHF 2.5 and DHR 2.4
    Chromag pedals, stem and bar. But might change the blue bar and grips to a better suited colour.
    Nice! Is that the Fox 36 with the Evol up front? How much drop on your fox transfer post?
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  17. #617
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    Quote Originally Posted by trailbrain View Post
    Nice! Is that the Fox 36 with the Evol up front? How much drop on your fox transfer post?
    Given the length of that and the fact that it's the longest size Fox makes, I can guess with 99% certainty that it's a 150mm post.

    P.S. I have a 150mm Transfer on my other bike.
    Gotta get up to get down.
    LMB

  18. #618
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    Swapped my "lying around the garage" Command Post for a 160mm BikeYoke Revive. Damn that thing is awesome so far!

    I'm loving the Smuggler, but I do seem to be losing air in the shock even after pumping it up multiple times and cycling the suspension to fill the negative air chamber. I hope it sorts itself out so I don't have to warranty the Monarch. It's also a bit weepy with oil still, but I heard the Monarchs take awhile to bed in and then they're fine. Anyone else experience this?

    Other than that, the bike rides faster and more confidently than my 27.5 160mm carbon "enduro" bike. It just goes through the rough stuff like it's not there. The bike is super stiff and plows over whatever you point it at with zero noticeable flex or protest. They absolutely nailed the geometry on this bike and I can't imagine how their new SBG geo can be much better. It really is super confidence-inspiring on steep, rocky tech. It feels like it would be really difficult to go over the bars, even when tiptoeing through weird, off-camber, wheel-trap-filled boulders. I also felt instantly comfortable sitting on the bike, and the pedaling position is solid. When really charging through fast, rocky stuff you can feel it a bit more than a longer travel rig, but it somehow skips over it all without losing speed or getting bogged down, all while maintaining serious traction/grip. I love the sporty feel, and I haven't been in a situation yet where I felt like I wanted more travel. It deftly straddles the line between a short-travel XC bike and a long-travel plow bike. It just uses the travel it has so well and feels like it has way more than it does. I'm sure that's a combination of the 29-inch wheel rollover and the suspension design.

    I have to say I'd never thought I'd ever be on a 29er, but this latest crop of aggressive 29ers really made me want to try one. Straight-line speed is insane and I'm carrying much more speed with less pedaling on wide open tracks. It's damn nimble for as long as it is, but I still find myself shooting wider on some turns than my 27.5 bike, and I'm getting used to the extra effort to turn the big wheels and long wheelbase in tighter turns. I'd say I'm overall faster, but still losing a little speed over my 27.5 in tight, repeat corners (though that's quickly changing as I adapt to the bike). The increased traction has definitely been noticeable on my dry, loose trails.

    As for the uphill, this bike makes technical climbs so much easier. The 29 inch wheels and the suspension design really make for a bike that can easily get over rocky ledges and roots. It's a bit heavier than what I'm used to at 31.3 lbs with my size large frame (even with carbon bars and cranks, plus an X01 Eagle drivetrain). I would prefer it was in the 30s at least, but the extra weight isn't killing me, and I'm setting a lot of new climb PRs. I could get it there if I wasn't running ultra-wide Flow MK3 rims and a Pike instead of the Yari, but I love how stiff and burly the Yari is. The suspension is a traction machine, and just climbs through the gnarliest, loosest trails. It's efficient enough for the massive Colorado climbs without draining excess energy, but it's not an ultra-efficient power-machine like the DW-link or Yeti bikes. Still, [in my opinion] it rides at speed through the rough way smoother than these bikes so one can pick their poison. That being said, the climb switch on the Monarch really firms things up and makes a noticeable difference if that's your thing or you're stomping up long fireroads.
    Gotta get up to get down.
    LMB

  19. #619
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    Ditto, smuggler is super capable. I have a giant reign, this year the smuggler has been ridden 1800miles, reign 200 (90% uplifted!), preference is always the smuggler, feels faster and more sure footed, reign is a bit of a plow machine with very little feedback. Contemplated taking the smuggler to the megavalanche, there are a quite a few sections which are rough/very rocky so would be hanging on a bit, so took the reign instead.


    Had a car park ride on a Trek Fuel EX and was a surprised at how small it felt compared to my smuggler, on paper the fuel should feel longer, but in reality felt tiny. The plan was to merge the reign and smuggler into one bike, fuel being the best match on paper.

    Keeping the smuggler, turning it into a super smuggler for upcoming trips to peebles/innerleithen and Molini. Ohlins STX ordered, 170mm dropper (to replace 150mm), -1degree headset and a 150mm air shaft for the pikes.

    Cutting down to one bike isn't going to happen, waiting for the sentinel to become available.

  20. #620
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    Just finished building my Smuggler today, unfortunately it was too late to go and get it dirty. I'm pretty stoked with how it turned out, hopefully I can get it and give it a run before the weekend.

    Fox 34 factory 150mm fork
    Sram X1 drivetrain with guide brakes
    Raceface cranks
    WTB rims on hope hubs



    Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk
    Last edited by Finksta; 07-30-2017 at 12:13 PM. Reason: Spec added

  21. #621
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    Running 140 Fork

  22. #622
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    Quote Originally Posted by BaeckerX1 View Post
    Given the length of that and the fact that it's the longest size Fox makes, I can guess with 99% certainty that it's a 150mm post.

    P.S. I have a 150mm Transfer on my other bike.
    Yep is a 150mm dropper.

  23. #623
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    Quote Originally Posted by Finksta View Post
    Just finished building my Smuggler today, unfortunately it was too late to go and get it dirty. I'm pretty stoked with how it turned out, hopefully I can get it and give it a run before the weekend.

    Fox 34 factory 150mm fork
    Sram X1 drivetrain with guide brakes
    Raceface cranks
    WTB rims on hope hubs



    Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk
    Nice build! You're gonna love it. I'm curious on any feedback you have with the fork set at 150mm.

    Does it still climb well or does the front start to feel light?
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  24. #624
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    I managed to get out for my first ride on it yesterday. It climbs amazingly well still. The front end stays planted and doesn't wander at all. I knew this bike was going to be good after everything I've read on it, but it has blown all of my expectations out of the water.

    Comparing it to my carbon stumpjumper (130/140) it does everything better. They really have knocked it out of the park with the suspension, I just cannot believe how plush this thing is with only 115mm travel. It actually feels like it has more available than my stumpy. I just can't wait to give it a proper workout this weekend.

    Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

  25. #625
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    Smuggler-p5pb15010128.jpg

    Ohlins STX22 is a big improvement over the monarch, rear end is a lot more composed and more grip.

    Fitted a -1 degree angleset, as have a 46mm Pike fitted, not had a proper ride on it yet, but quick ride on some local trails and it feels more stable.

    Going to fit a 150mm air shaft, as the 140mm shaft with a luftkappe makes the fork sit at 136mm, should be sitting around 146mm with the 150, so will slacken the bike out a bit more.

    Very impressed with the smuggler, so much so that I've sold my Giant Reign, ridden it a handful of times this year, smuggler is quicker most of the time and more engaging.

  26. #626
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    Quote Originally Posted by arashi View Post
    I just wanted to share an update on my Smuggler. I slapped a Cane Creek DB Inline Coil last night.
    Hey there, thanks for the info. Just wondering if you could give some more details about how it's going? I've been super keen to do this too and was having trouble finding anyone who had added a coil to a Smuggler.

    I ended up emailing Transition the other day and was super stoked to get a reply from the owner. This was his advice:

    "I have had a bit of experience with coils on the smuggler. I would say if you can find an air shock go that route. Mainly because our bikes are linear that on a coil they end up going through the last bit of travel to easily. You might see some fitted on our bikes but they have custom stoppers that are larger and help add some progression to the end of the stroke. I would hang tight and wait for the new DPX2 to become available! As for the offset bushing, go for it, I ran them on my Scout coupled with a longer travel fork and I loved it!"

    So I thought that has pretty much put the nail in the coffin and then remembered that I'd seen am image of your ride with a DB on it and would love to know your feelings on the liner nature of the coil approach and bottoming out.

    Thanks so much!

  27. #627
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    hey everyone, who all changed the travel in their Pike from 130 up to 140? I know many of you have your Smuggler at 140 and I'd like to try it out. Right now I have the Pike that came with my Smuggler build at 130. Do I need to get a 140 air shaft to go up? Or are there spacers that can be removed?

    Thanks!

  28. #628
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    Quote Originally Posted by monts View Post
    hey everyone, who all changed the travel in their Pike from 130 up to 140? I know many of you have your Smuggler at 140 and I'd like to try it out. Right now I have the Pike that came with my Smuggler build at 130. Do I need to get a 140 air shaft to go up? Or are there spacers that can be removed?

    Thanks!
    You need to get the air shaft. The Pike doesnt use a spacer system.

  29. #629
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    Quote Originally Posted by fracaxis View Post
    You need to get the air shaft. The Pike doesnt use a spacer system.
    Yep correct. Air shafts are pretty cheap though.

  30. #630
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    long term review, 2015 smuggler

    I have had my '15 smuggler since August of 2015 so just over 2 years now and it's still going strong. I have done everything on it, XC local trails, back country mountain trails, bike park, you name it. Roughly 2,335 miles (according to Strava). The only major change I have done to it is adding 30mm ID light bicycle carbon rims to it, wide carbon rims + minions = <3. I have kept up the maintenance on the pivots (enduro max bearings) & suspension.

    I did recently upgraded the drive train to X01 Eagle and man I really have to say it was well worth it, the range it provides really is beneficial to a bike like this.

    was going to put a pic but damn wtf
    '15 Transition Smuggler

  31. #631
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    Quote Originally Posted by toodles View Post
    Yep correct. Air shafts are pretty cheap though.
    Hey thanks, So I need this, right? What about the small parts?https://smartbikeparts.com/search_de...php?itm=FK8640

  32. #632
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    Just go on YouTube and watch a video. It will explain the whole procedure.

  33. #633
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    Quote Originally Posted by fracaxis View Post
    Just go on YouTube and watch a video. It will explain the whole procedure.
    Thanks, I found a couple videos; I'll figure it out. Can anyone comment on going from 130 to 140 on their Smuggler? Noticeable difference?

  34. #634
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    Quote Originally Posted by monts View Post
    Thanks, I found a couple videos; I'll figure it out. Can anyone comment on going from 130 to 140 on their Smuggler? Noticeable difference?
    I've gone 150 on mine, love it. I was worried that the front wheel might feel a big vague and wander a bit on steep climbs, but it's not a problem at all. Still climbs like a goat.

    Once you're pointed downhill, I think the 150 fork suits this bike really well. I still find it hard to believe that it's only 115mm in the rear, with my sag set at the recommended 33% I am rarely hitting bottom out while I'm consistently using all the travel on my fork.

    Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

  35. #635
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    Any idea when the 2018 will be announced?

  36. #636
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    Ive been running a 130/160 Fox Talas for a 1.5 years and have only ridden in 160MM since go. Bike climbs like a billygoat and when you point it downhill it gets happy!
    Quote Originally Posted by monts View Post
    Thanks, I found a couple videos; I'll figure it out. Can anyone comment on going from 130 to 140 on their Smuggler? Noticeable difference?

  37. #637
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    Wink

    Quote Originally Posted by truelonghorn View Post
    Ive been running a 130/160 Fox Talas for a 1.5 years and have only ridden in 160MM since go. Bike climbs like a billygoat and when you point it downhill it gets happy!
    Thanks for the info! some extra squish in the front would be nice. I've hit some pretty big stuff with current 130/115 set up, but imo more travel = more fun

  38. #638
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    Hi everyone, just got a medium frame. I'm curious about the fit of the 150mm drop Reverb. Does the Reverb go in all the way or is there a substantial amount of it sticking out as it too long for it to fit completely inside the seattube?

    Thanks!

  39. #639
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    Quote Originally Posted by anthdan View Post
    Any idea when the 2018 will be announced?
    bumped travel to 120/140. Looks great.
    Transition Teases Four New 2018 Mountain Bikes in Hilarious Video - bturman - Mountain Biking Videos - Vital MTB

  40. #640
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    Agreed, it looks rad!
    MBR had some specs online for a few hours, but they've been removed again.
    What I remember:
    Boost rear
    430 mm Chainstay
    Reach 450 for the Med, 475 for the Large.
    Threaded BB

    Can't wait to see the full specs on their site!

  41. #641
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rynee View Post
    Agreed, it looks rad!
    MBR had some specs online for a few hours, but they've been removed again.
    There were a few sites with specs up early this morning but they seem to all have been pulled down - probably different people running different parts of the websites that didn't know about the various embargoes in place.

  42. #642
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThatNateDude View Post
    There were a few sites with specs up early this morning but they seem to all have been pulled down - probably different people running different parts of the websites that didn't know about the various embargoes in place.
    Yep...someone on the Sentinel thread was quick with the SS trigger though

  43. #643
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rynee View Post
    Yep...someone on the Sentinel thread was quick with the SS trigger though
    Yeah, looking at the specs from the sentinel thread....couldn't copy and paste the link here for some reason.

    Smuggler looks cool. In addition to the normal Transition awesomeness - threaded bb, molded down tube and chain stay protectors, etc - it will now have external brake line routing and 180 post mount. Both positives in my opinion. Tire clearance is listed for the other bikes but not the smuggler. Wonder what that will be but I suspect better than the current version.

    Looking at the geo specs it does look like I'd be dropping down to a small. Really like the numbers on the current version as the medium fits me really well. Kinda bummed about that as it doesn't seem to be too different than the small Django 29 I'm on now, which is a bit small for me. Will have to see how the sbg and new fork offset changes things.

  44. #644
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    Quote Originally Posted by deserat View Post
    Yeah, looking at the specs from the sentinel thread....couldn't copy and paste the link here for some reason.

    Smuggler looks cool. In addition to the normal Transition awesomeness - threaded bb, molded down tube and chain stay protectors, etc - it will now have external brake line routing and 180 post mount. Both positives in my opinion. Tire clearance is listed for the other bikes but not the smuggler. Wonder what that will be but I suspect better than the current version.

    Looking at the geo specs it does look like I'd be dropping down to a small. Really like the numbers on the current version as the medium fits me really well. Kinda bummed about that as it doesn't seem to be too different than the small Django 29 I'm on now, which is a bit small for me. Will have to see how the sbg and new fork offset changes things.
    Tire clearance for Smuggler is still 2.3. But even on current model can fit a 2.4 fine on back.

  45. #645
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    2.4 isn't enough IMO, new bikes should take Maxxis 2.6 tires.
    I got some bad ideas in my head.

  46. #646
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    Still looks very metal. #carbonisreal

  47. #647
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    Quote Originally Posted by smartyiak View Post
    Still looks very metal. #carbonisreal
    Want. Carbon.

  48. #648
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    Quote Originally Posted by Travis Bickle View Post
    2.4 isn't enough IMO, new bikes should take Maxxis 2.6 tires.
    Agree - 29 x 2.6WT is about to be the new standard.

  49. #649
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    Quote Originally Posted by Travis Bickle View Post
    2.4 isn't enough IMO, new bikes should take Maxxis 2.6 tires.
    I agree. 2.6 clearance would be super nice to pair with the new smuggler at 120mm rear travel.
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  50. #650
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    Smuggler

    Quote Originally Posted by bbunnys View Post
    Tire clearance for Smuggler is still 2.3. But even on current model can fit a 2.4 fine on back.
    As long as it's a 2.4 dhr wt on a 35 id wheel I'm happy.

  51. #651
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    I know you should ride before buying, I know I know. I have an opportunity to order a 2017 (now the old model) smuggler at a pretty fair price and am considering selling BOTH my yeti ASRc and my santa cruz bronson to get the smuggler as a do-it-all bike and then make a little profit in the process. I can find a different build kit at a shop locally to at least size up the fit, but i can't test it on the trail.

    for those of you who have ridden good cross country bikes and/or good longer travel all-mountain bikes, how do you think the smuggler compares? can it climb almost as well as a cross country bike (lock out the shock, take a 4-5 pound weight penalty, now whats really holding you back?) and descend well enough to compare to a good all-mountain bike with occasional trips to moab, downhill parks, etc. might just be too much to ask of one bike...

  52. #652
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    Quote Originally Posted by Training-Wheels View Post
    I know you should ride before buying, I know I know. I have an opportunity to order a 2017 (now the old model) smuggler at a pretty fair price and am considering selling BOTH my yeti ASRc and my santa cruz bronson to get the smuggler as a do-it-all bike and then make a little profit in the process. I can find a different build kit at a shop locally to at least size up the fit, but i can't test it on the trail.

    for those of you who have ridden good cross country bikes and/or good longer travel all-mountain bikes, how do you think the smuggler compares? can it climb almost as well as a cross country bike (lock out the shock, take a 4-5 pound weight penalty, now whats really holding you back?) and descend well enough to compare to a good all-mountain bike with occasional trips to moab, downhill parks, etc. might just be too much to ask of one bike...
    My two cents worth is its a bike that can do it all. Before I had my current Smuggler I had a 140 travel Stumpjumper and a hard tail XC bike. I'm a bigger rider 6ft 5 and 250 pounds.
    My local trail ride is normally a 30km loop with long climbs ascending 900m then single track and rocky down hills. So some rough terrain and some flat climbs.

    Trying to find a do it all bike for this was hard after trying a few. XC bike great up hills but way to rough on body and bike coming down. Stumpjumper was opposite. Great downhill. But maybe due to my size slow up hill and I always had bad pedal bob regardless of trying different brand shocks.

    I think the Smuggler is perfect for both. I find it efficient up hill and pedals great. I'm pretty much the same speed as I was on XC hard tail.
    Downhill I was worried about only having 115mm travel in the rear. But ive found it totally fine. Feels like a lot more that it actually is. Its not quite as plush as the Stumpjumper, but dam close.

    My only complaint is I get slightly sore hand after a while on the rough stuff. But I think it might be the fork. I'm running a 140 Fox 36. Which I'm finding hard to dial. Stumpjumper had 150 Pike which personally I found more plush. But still dialing the Fox so might get better.

  53. #653
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    Thanks man. appreciate the detail. most reviews make it seem like this bike really could be the best of both worlds, but we've all heard that "climbs like an xc bike, descends like a downhill bike" thing which i have never found to be true - but I've never ridden long and slack shortish travel 29er. that just might be the secret...

  54. #654
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    Not sure about all the bike park stuff, but I have seen many dudes rocking process 111s on some gnary-ass WV enduro days while others are going upwards of trek slash (and my BMC TrailFox). From a friend who has a smuggler, it does seem peppy enough on the climbs and fun the other way. No need to kid yourself that it will be as good as your ASRc going up, but good enough until you get to the fun stuff.

    Of course, now I am wanting a Sentinel since it is in that pretty blue I first lusted after a Smuggler in.

  55. #655
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    still love my original first year Smuggler with 140 fork. fantastic all around trail bike, great climber and descender. the changes to the 2018 look awesome. the sweet spot for this bike just got broader, i'm glad they kept in in the lineup, i thought for sure it was gone.

  56. #656
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    for geometry nerds out there, what do you guys think about the fit of smugglers? compared to other size large xc and trail bikes I've ridden, the effective top tube on a large smuggler is significantly shorter than anything modern, BUT the reach is still longer than most. the reason is because it has a long reach (basically the distance from the bb to the head tube) but also has a very steep seat tube which makes the effective top tube short. kind of feels like a medium while sitting, then when you stand and aren't in contact with the steep seat tube it feels more like a large.

    for reference I'm 6'1 and usually ride a large. i think this feels good, but i didn't get a chance to ride an XL.

  57. #657
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    Quote Originally Posted by Training-Wheels View Post
    for geometry nerds out there, what do you guys think about the fit of smugglers?
    I'm a big fan of this 'modern' geometry. I find that the steep seattube puts me in a good climbing position and the longer reach feels good going downhill. I thought the fit of the XL Smuggler was very comparable to mt 2015 XL Process 111 and and also to my Lg 2017 Guerrilla Gravity Trail Pistol - reach number are similar on all 3 (note that GG makes bikes a lot bigger than most, hence the Lg instead of an XL.) For reference, I'm about 6'3" and have relatively long arms and average leg length.

  58. #658
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThatNateDude View Post
    I'm a big fan of this 'modern' geometry. I find that the steep seattube puts me in a good climbing position and the longer reach feels good going downhill. I thought the fit of the XL Smuggler was very comparable to mt 2015 XL Process 111 and and also to my Lg 2017 Guerrilla Gravity Trail Pistol - reach number are similar on all 3 (note that GG makes bikes a lot bigger than most, hence the Lg instead of an XL.) For reference, I'm about 6'3" and have relatively long arms and average leg length.
    i agree to an extent. I'm a big fan of modern geometry and I'm basing that off of a kona process 134, santa cruz bronson 2 and yeti asrc (all of which i have owned). but the smuggler is a little different. if you compare the numbers, the effective top tube on the smuggler is a lot shorter than those, a LOT shorter than a process. the only reason i looked it up was because i was so confused after i sat on a smuggler and almost hit my knees on the handlebars and then checked to make sure it was actually a large. this is a bike thats supposed to be on the long side. i think it is just transition's unique take on modern by keeping the reach long, but putting you way more forward while seated which kind of makes the top tube seem short. so, it might feel a little odd while seated, but i think after getting used to it it could be a really good thing. i just expected it to be very similar to a process, and it isn't. at least while seated. a medium process actually has a longer effective top tube than a large smuggler. if you're measuring the effective top tube, a smuggler is in no way considered a long bike, even compared to hardtail xc bikes with 100mm stems. if you compare reach, it is long. thats pretty unique for the two to be different.

  59. #659
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    Quote Originally Posted by Training-Wheels View Post
    i agree to an extent. I'm a big fan of modern geometry and I'm basing that off of a kona process 134, santa cruz bronson 2 and yeti asrc (all of which i have owned). but the smuggler is a little different. if you compare the numbers, the effective top tube on the smuggler is a lot shorter than those, a LOT shorter than a process. the only reason i looked it up was because i was so confused after i sat on a smuggler and almost hit my knees on the handlebars and then checked to make sure it was actually a large. this is a bike thats supposed to be on the long side. i think it is just transition's unique take on modern by keeping the reach long, but putting you way more forward while seated which kind of makes the top tube seem short. so, it might feel a little odd while seated, but i think after getting used to it it could be a really good thing. i just expected it to be very similar to a process, and it isn't. at least while seated. a medium process actually has a longer effective top tube than a large smuggler. if you're measuring the effective top tube, a smuggler is in no way considered a long bike, even compared to hardtail xc bikes with 100mm stems. if you compare reach, it is long. thats pretty unique for the two to be different.
    If it felt small you could always go to an XL. I pick bikes based on reach and stack, not by the letters (M, L, XL, etc.) a manufacturer puts on it.

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    my point isn't really about the size. my point is about the difference in the effective top tube being very short while the reach is still kind of long (regardless of whatever size fits best). its unusual, and definitely not the same as the process 111 and other bikes like that. just wondering what others think of it, if they had to get used to it, etc.

  61. #661
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    Quote Originally Posted by Training-Wheels View Post
    my point isn't really about the size. my point is about the difference in the effective top tube being very short while the reach is still kind of long (regardless of whatever size fits best). its unusual, and definitely not the same as the process 111 and other bikes like that. just wondering what others think of it, if they had to get used to it, etc.
    Comparing the Reach and Effective Top Tube numbers between an XL Smuggler (Reach = 483mm, ETT = 647mm) and a Lg GG Trail Pistol (Reach = 490mm, ETT = 648mm) I see an even longer reach (7mm) with only 1mm more ETT. I have no issue or concerns with the bars feeling too close seated or standing on my bike (the GGTP) with very similar geometry as far as those 2 numbers go.

  62. #662
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    Well I've posted enough in other build threads, thought I'd post here too.

    Swapped out my Honzo Ti frame for a '17 XL Smuggler....

    -Pike DPA 120/150
    -Saint brakes
    -XT/XTR 11-46
    -Nextie 33mm internal rims on DT240s R / Hope Pro2 Evo F w/ CX-Rays
    -XO cranks, 26T Absolute Black Oval
    -35mm/35mm Atlas stem, 800mm Chromag BZA bar

    This is my first full suspension since my '08 Fisher HiFi Deluxe.

    This bike is similar to my Honzo geo, but around an inch less TT and an inch more CS. I was a bit concerned as I loved my Honzo, but after a few rides...

    I gotta say the geo on this thing is damn near perfect. Still climbs well with the fork at 150mm, and I don't notice the "long" CS length.

    In hindsight, I think some of the TT's are a bit too long (and still getting longer...). I'm 6'7, and even with a 35mm stem, I feel like sometimes it took work to work through tight turns, whereas this bike seems to do it more easily.

    Any, no regrets so far (except the weight...)

    Smuggler-20171007_171928.jpg
    2016 Honzo Ti
    2015 Kona Paddy Wagon
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  63. #663
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    thats a subtle geometry characteristic that a lot of people are overlooking on this bike (my self included until I first sat on one). the top tube is very short, but only because the seat tube is steep. the reach is still pretty long, probably more comparable to your kona, but yeah the tt is very short on any bike with a steep seat tube. makes climbing steep and technical trails much easier in my opinion, but makes it a little odd on fast twisty flat areas. luckily i don't have too many flat areas near me.

    Quote Originally Posted by noot View Post
    Well I've posted enough in other build threads, thought I'd post here too.

    Swapped out my Honzo Ti frame for a '17 XL Smuggler....

    -Pike DPA 120/150
    -Saint brakes
    -XT/XTR 11-46
    -Nextie 33mm internal rims on DT240s R / Hope Pro2 Evo F w/ CX-Rays
    -XO cranks, 26T Absolute Black Oval
    -35mm/35mm Atlas stem, 800mm Chromag BZA bar

    This is my first full suspension since my '08 Fisher HiFi Deluxe.

    This bike is similar to my Honzo geo, but around an inch less TT and an inch more CS. I was a bit concerned as I loved my Honzo, but after a few rides...

    I gotta say the geo on this thing is damn near perfect. Still climbs well with the fork at 150mm, and I don't notice the "long" CS length.

    In hindsight, I think some of the TT's are a bit too long (and still getting longer...). I'm 6'7, and even with a 35mm stem, I feel like sometimes it took work to work through tight turns, whereas this bike seems to do it more easily.

    Any, no regrets so far (except the weight...)

    Click image for larger version. 

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  64. #664
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    Hi noot,
    Awesome, i'm in a similar boat. Although i'm moving from a 13 honzo M to a 17 smuggler L, and 16 honzo ti L. They will share everything but the drivetrain. I'm looking forward to the first ride!

  65. #665
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    Part of the reason for the swap to this specific frame was the 142 rear axle and threaded BB - this meant I could swap everything but headset. And as training wheels mentioned, reach is within 2mm.

    I did look for a process 111 but they were out of XL. The new process g2s look great (I do love kona), but having to buy a new rear hub a year after lacing up the dt240 was too much for an "experiment"...
    2016 Honzo Ti
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  66. #666
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    Yeah, same here. Threaded bb, non-boost,similar geo , bottlecage were my reasons. I almost ordered a 2016 medium 111 dl, which would have been a great package too,but on the smaller side. L was n/a. I figured the smuggler frame was superior though.
    And when the 2018 sbg frames were announced, the 2017 dropped in price. So it was a no brainer.

  67. #667
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rynee View Post
    Yeah, same here. Threaded bb, non-boost,similar geo , bottlecage were my reasons. I almost ordered a 2016 medium 111 dl, which would have been a great package too,but on the smaller side. L was n/a. I figured the smuggler frame was superior though.
    And when the 2018 sbg frames were announced, the 2017 dropped in price. So it was a no brainer.
    Looking forward to hearing if your thoughts match my own

    When's your first ride ETA?
    2016 Honzo Ti
    2015 Kona Paddy Wagon
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  68. #668
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    Quote Originally Posted by noot View Post
    Looking forward to hearing if your thoughts match my own

    When's your first ride ETA?
    hopefully this coming sunday

    so far, i pressed in the headset, prepared the internal routing of the shift cable housing, and test-mounted the fork (stem is just a placeholder):
    Smuggler-smuggler20170910_112749.jpg

    i'll keep u posted. have a nice day!

  69. #669
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    Hi Smuggler Fans,

    I am very close to pulling the trigger on the 18 smuggler, mainly because I've been a bit obsessive about steering geometry on fork offsets, and Transition is breaking away from the status quo, and I need to support that.

    That said, my only worry is weight... Do you have the frame only weight? I usually figure AL to carbon is about 1lb more, but I heard this frame is quite heavy?

    Thx!
    W

  70. #670
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    Quote Originally Posted by holiday View Post
    Hi Smuggler Fans,

    I am very close to pulling the trigger on the 18 smuggler, mainly because I've been a bit obsessive about steering geometry on fork offsets, and Transition is breaking away from the status quo, and I need to support that.

    That said, my only worry is weight... Do you have the frame only weight? I usually figure AL to carbon is about 1lb more, but I heard this frame is quite heavy?

    Thx!
    W
    I haven't seen any weight figures out just yet. However, I ordered the bike and the LBS said it should be here early november. I'm going to have them weight it. Size XL, GX model

  71. #671
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    Quote Originally Posted by holiday View Post
    Hi Smuggler Fans,

    I am very close to pulling the trigger on the 18 smuggler, mainly because I've been a bit obsessive about steering geometry on fork offsets, and Transition is breaking away from the status quo, and I need to support that.

    That said, my only worry is weight... Do you have the frame only weight? I usually figure AL to carbon is about 1lb more, but I heard this frame is quite heavy?

    Thx!
    W
    Transition makes all their bikes on the burlier side, even the ones for "lighter" duty, so they always tend to carry a little extra weight compared to some other similar bikes. If you ride hard and value durability, I'd say go for it.
    Binary • Transition Bikes • Demon Dirt •

  72. #672
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    Quote Originally Posted by holiday View Post
    Hi Smuggler Fans,

    I am very close to pulling the trigger on the 18 smuggler, mainly because I've been a bit obsessive about steering geometry on fork offsets, and Transition is breaking away from the status quo, and I need to support that.

    That said, my only worry is weight... Do you have the frame only weight? I usually figure AL to carbon is about 1lb more, but I heard this frame is quite heavy?

    Thx!
    W

    i would wait. i heard from a reputable shop owner that sells a lot of transitions that they are releasing a carbon smuggler "early this winter". i don't know anything other than that, but he has given me two other tid bits of advice like that before they were publicly available and both ended up being correct (the color of a new kona before it was released and the price/build kit on an ibis before it was released). i love my smuggler. only thing i would change is maybe a carbon frame - so if i were purchasing now, i would wait. if you beg the guys at transition they might give you a hint as to how long you would have to wait. i had a niner customer service guy once say "i can't tell you to wait or not and i can't give you any detail about what is coming in the future, but you should check our website in april. ill say that. make sure you look at our website in april." the part i wanted was put on their website on april 1st...

  73. #673
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    Quote Originally Posted by Training-Wheels View Post
    i would wait. i heard from a reputable shop owner that sells a lot of transitions that they are releasing a carbon smuggler "early this winter". i don't know anything other than that, but he has given me two other tid bits of advice like that before they were publicly available and both ended up being correct (the color of a new kona before it was released and the price/build kit on an ibis before it was released). i love my smuggler. only thing i would change is maybe a carbon frame - so if i were purchasing now, i would wait. if you beg the guys at transition they might give you a hint as to how long you would have to wait. i had a niner customer service guy once say "i can't tell you to wait or not and i can't give you any detail about what is coming in the future, but you should check our website in april. ill say that. make sure you look at our website in april." the part i wanted was put on their website on april 1st...
    Great tips and feedback, thx!

    So, with this info, I did go ahead and order the X01 smuggler yesterday!
    I figure I can ride it and bond w/ the new GEO all winter. If I love it, and training wheels is correct about the carbon smuggler, I'll just get the frame only in spring and swap everything over and sell the AL frame. Should still have value as an almost new 2018 frame w/ progressive ideas.

    Looking forward to trying the transition.

    Thx!
    W

  74. #674
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    Quote Originally Posted by leakslikasieve View Post
    I haven't seen any weight figures out just yet. However, I ordered the bike and the LBS said it should be here early november. I'm going to have them weight it. Size XL, GX model
    Fanatik Bike Co. has the 2018 Patrol in their bike builder lineup. As such, they've got some estimated frame weights. S- 8.1 M- 8.39 L- 8.65 That's without the DPX2, which they've weighed at 420g. I'm going to guess that the Sentinel, Scout, and Smuggler frames are similar.

    I'm still getting one.

  75. #675
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    don't forget the weight difference between the alloy and carbon frames from most makers is about 5% of the total bike weight. ie. unless you are xc racing, or extremely frail and struggle to get a bike on and off your bike rack, it just doesn't matter.

    get a light wheel set and use light tires, that you do notice.

  76. #676
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    Quote Originally Posted by cunningstunts View Post
    don't forget the weight difference between the alloy and carbon frames from most makers is about 5% of the total bike weight. ie. unless you are xc racing, or extremely frail and struggle to get a bike on and off your bike rack, it just doesn't matter.

    get a light wheel set and use light tires, that you do notice.

    if you're still buying carbon just for the weight savings, and if you trust the strength of a tiny quarter inch wide weld more than a carbon frame, then you have completely missed the point and might want to reconsider. having that said, aluminum is still good - but carbon is generally superior in strength, ride characteristics and least importantly, weight.

  77. #677
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    Quote Originally Posted by Training-Wheels View Post
    if you're still buying carbon just for the weight savings, and if you trust the strength of a tiny quarter inch wide weld more than a carbon frame, then you have completely missed the point and might want to reconsider. having that said, aluminum is still good - but carbon is generally superior in strength, ride characteristics and least importantly, weight.

    Stoked to have my smuggler coming next week!

    2 things,
    1. I think the longer travel 29er may be the carbon frame released this winter based on follow up questions, not the smuggler, but still excited to get on my AL smuggler.

    2nd, So, seems I'm frail and totally missing the point, thx.

    I buy carbon when I have the option as it's lighter and often has a good feel (not always).
    I have broken Carbon, steel and Al frames over the last 25 years... but more carbon frames then AL frames, but breakage isn't my real concern as I'm light and ride w/ finesse.

    Weight is very important to me, as I'm 5ft 11, 160lbs (while maybe not frail, definitely not strong either) and at almost 50, I like a bike to be 25-28lbs to be able to move it around like I'm used to. I'm an old XC guy, but like moderately techy riding and need to be able to manipulate the bike to put it where I want it. No big air, but I can ride a bit (w/ podiums in the expert class at downieville DH 10 years apart.) On this bike, I doubt if I get it to 28, but I think w/ good wheels (on order) and and some other bits, I hope I get it under 30lbs and see how it goes.

    Anyway, thanks for the opinions... excited to try out a new brand to me, and one that is thinking outside the box.

    Cheers,
    W
    Last edited by holiday; 3 Days Ago at 03:19 PM. Reason: carbon

  78. #678
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    I found the time to build it up completely on the weekend, and took it for a 10 min spin:

    Smuggler 2017 in L
    RS Debonair
    Fox 36 hsc/lsc @ 150
    Sram x7 10 speed
    OneUp 32tooth oval
    Ice tech XT brakes (203 / 160)
    KS Dropzone 125 + WTB Volt Pro
    Roox Dominator Bar (780) and Commander Stem (31.8 x 35)
    Minion DHF 2.5 on WTB Asym i29/WTB Laserdisc front (20mm)
    Minion DHF 2.3 on WTB STi23/Joytech rear (asap: WTB Frequence i23 on Hope Pro2 Evo)

    For climing, the fork at 150 is a bit too laid back for my taste. I guess I'll lower it to 140 over the winter months. I still need to figure out the correct settings and pressures for the fork and damper - both are new for me.
    The track I rode it on was too mellow to make any serious statement about the bike's handling. I'll post up more once I get a few rides done.

    Smuggler-20171021_133017.jpg

    Smuggler-20171021_132916.jpg

    Smuggler-20171021_133007.jpg

    Smuggler-20171021_133023.jpg

  79. #679
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rynee View Post
    I found the time to build it up completely on the weekend, and took it for a 10 min spin:

    Smuggler 2017 in L
    RS Debonair
    Fox 36 hsc/lsc @ 150
    Sram x7 10 speed
    OneUp 32tooth oval
    Ice tech XT brakes (203 / 160)
    KS Dropzone 125 + WTB Volt Pro
    Roox Dominator Bar (780) and Commander Stem (31.8 x 35)
    Minion DHF 2.5 on WTB Asym i29/WTB Laserdisc front (20mm)
    Minion DHF 2.3 on WTB STi23/Joytech rear (asap: WTB Frequence i23 on Hope Pro2 Evo)

    For climing, the fork at 150 is a bit too laid back for my taste. I guess I'll lower it to 140 over the winter months. I still need to figure out the correct settings and pressures for the fork and damper - both are new for me.
    The track I rode it on was too mellow to make any serious statement about the bike's handling. I'll post up more once I get a few rides done.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    I really like my smuggler with a 140mm front

  80. #680
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    Quote Originally Posted by monts View Post
    I really like my smuggler with a 140mm front
    Yeah, for me 140mm also is the sweet spot. Climbing and handling wise I feel there are no negative effects compared to 130mm but definitely much more comfortable on the small bumps. And the higher front gives a little more secure feel on the steep stuff.

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