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  1. #1
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    I like the Niota AL but...

    The Motolite is my current front runner for a new frame... I posted a similiar thread in the litespeed forums but no responses yet:

    "I know no little about the Niota other than the web research I've done. I'm in the market for a new frame and and the Niota AL has caught my eye. On paper it looks like it will suit my needs quite nicley but I've read very little in the way of reviews on it. by todays 'standards' i'm pretty much a straight "All Mountain" guy. I ride alot of NE rooty , rocky and twisty single track and like to jump and drop but am not a freerider. I prefer to keep my bike reasonably light b/c one group I ride with is pretty fast and logs some pretty decent milage in a day. A "snappy" ride is very important to me if that makes sense. I like the steeper HT angle of the Niota for example. "

    The niota seems nice but the lack of info makes me wonder if it's a bit unproven. At anyrate, I thought it would only be fair to let titus owners have a crack.

    Thanks!

  2. #2
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    hmmm, what's the travel?

    A little disclaimer. I have very little ride experience on the Moto-Lite, and absolutely 0 on the Lite Speed. Having said that, it looks to me that the litespeed would be more comparable to the Racer X. The geomtry seems to meant for straight XC, where as the ML would be better suited for XC/AM. If you are looking to do some tech. downhills, I would lean to the ML.

    The litespeed looks sharp though and very light weight.

    mcgrath

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by mcgrath
    hmmm, what's the travel?

    A little disclaimer. I have very little ride experience on the Moto-Lite, and absolutely 0 on the Lite Speed. Having said that, it looks to me that the litespeed would be more comparable to the Racer X. The geomtry seems to meant for straight XC, where as the ML would be better suited for XC/AM. If you are looking to do some tech. downhills, I would lean to the ML.

    The litespeed looks sharp though and very light weight.

    mcgrath
    It's got 5 inches of travel. It is their "AM" bike but I agree with you it's cut pretty XC like.

    http://www.litespeed.com/bikes/2006/mtn/nal_geo.aspx

    I'm not entirely sure what fork is used to get the geometry measurements...

  4. #4
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    Jwind, for what its worth. The MotoLite I built up is the ExoGrid Ti frame. So naturally I was in the Ti market, I looked at the LS Niota, but as mcgrath has mentioned although it has 5 inches of travel, the small amount of info I gleened really gave me the distinct impression it was more directed at the XC market, with a little AM lets say. Pretty much like the Racer X, where by the MotoLite is more AM with some XC if that makes sense.

    The LS Niota is a sweet ride, looks the business for sure

    I came form a pretty bling I must say Ellsworth Id, my MotoLite feels far more at home on AM type riding, but still hauls a s s if you build it wisely.

    Good luck, am not by any means wanting to come across pushy. One thought, if you are in the market for a Ti frame, which you must be looking at the LS Niota, do check out the ExoGrid MotoLite. It gives a ride that is hard to describe. Complient but stiff at the same time.

    Best of luck anyways....
    The_Lecht_Rocks: whafe - cheeers - may i offer an official apology for the wagon wheeler "dis-belief"

  5. #5
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    umm, trying to delete posts doesnt work.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by mcgrath
    umm, trying to delete posts doesnt work.
    I ride quite a bit of varying terrain. I frequently rie with a group that is mostly XC-ish (long rides/long distance/fast speed) so weight is a slight concern. No more that 32lbs although I'd prefer to be down around 30. One ride we do has a punishing climb. These XC-iish rides are fun but I also like to jump rollers/stumps and drop some stairs on one ride we do. The more technical the better. I love to open it up on the downhills but am willing to give up some plushness in exchange a stiffer ride (laterally in particular) and responsiveness.

    BTW, thanks whafe. Your input is greatly appreciated.

  7. #7
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    Go ML

    I would say go with the ML, the Niota looks to be a single pivot or VPP design, I dont want to start the whole Horst Link debate but if you mostly ride ride rooted, rocky, technical singletrack you would want something that is always active like the ML, other designs "tend" to stiffen under pedalling and braking forces, I think you would be much happier with a Motolite. Titus has a reputation as some of the most laterally stiff bikes around with the box section chain and seat stays and the 4 bearing main pivot. I have a large ML built up pretty solid and it weighs 29 lbs. I am no expert on the Litespeed but I think MB Action did a test on it last year, not sure what they thought about it.

  8. #8
    Ti is addictive
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    There is no way the litespeed can come close to stiffness of the motolite. Also I think Titus on a bad day still has better Quality Control then Litespeed and the customer service is far better to.

    Not to be critical but search over ABG's bikes that are Aluminum (ie Tomac, lowend litespeed road frames, etc.) There has been issues in the past and I'm sure there still is.

  9. #9
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    My dealer buddy sells Litespeed and I asked him specifically about the Niota. He had ridden a test bike and didn't care for it. His words: "There's just too much 5hit going on back there" He said that under suspension compression, it felt as if the BB was swinging forward under the rider.. While he was pretty non-specific, his overall impression was that if felt strange as you could feel the suspension working with every bump.

    It's a sweet looking bike that's for sure. Dead sexy in person in the titaniumn model, but I'm not buying one to hang on my wall and admire.

    My personal slant is that it's an option if you just gotta have a Litespeed. When compared to other bikes there's no real compelling reason to own one other than exclusivity.

  10. #10
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    Noty to many positive things around here about the LS... I'm far from hung up on it so please continue. I've looked at alot of frames but I just keep comeing back to the Motolite.

  11. #11
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    heh, you sound like me up until Thursday when I said enough was enough and thre down the dough for the Moto lite. I kept coming back to it. I thought I was dead set on the 5 Spot. I had the Moto-Lite ruled out for a little while there.

    Your riding style seems to fit mine pretty closely. It seems like I climb all the time just to get to a downhill section. A good climber is what I really needed as well as a capable descender. My riding pals were telling me I ought to go bigger to start doing the 5' drops. I figured if I wasn't doing them with the FXR, a bigger bike won't help.

    I narrowed it down to the 5 Spot and Moto Lite. I think you should ditch the Lite speed idea in favour of a better descending ride.

  12. #12
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    Niota AL

    The Niota AL is a without a doubt a very solid bike. One of my close friends rides and races one and it can hang with the Racer X I run (If it is in 4" mode which it usually is). The litespeed can be either 4 or 5" of travel and has titanium link arms. I think if you are strictly All-mountain as you say then the Motolite would be my first choice (I have ridden both). However, if you are a little Cross Country as well then the Niota is also a top shelf ride.

    That still doesn't change the fact that you can get a Motolite frame for a GREAT price right now though. I agree with a lot of other posters - it does appear to be more XCish that can add an extra inch of travel when needed.
    "You can't discern by calculating in your mind how it will work. You have to feel how it rides differently to understand."

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jwind
    The Motolite is my current front runner for a new frame... I posted a similiar thread in the litespeed forums but no responses yet:

    "I know no little about the Niota other than the web research I've done. I'm in the market for a new frame and and the Niota AL has caught my eye. On paper it looks like it will suit my needs quite nicley but I've read very little in the way of reviews on it. by todays 'standards' i'm pretty much a straight "All Mountain" guy. I ride alot of NE rooty , rocky and twisty single track and like to jump and drop but am not a freerider. I prefer to keep my bike reasonably light b/c one group I ride with is pretty fast and logs some pretty decent milage in a day. A "snappy" ride is very important to me if that makes sense. I like the steeper HT angle of the Niota for example. "

    The niota seems nice but the lack of info makes me wonder if it's a bit unproven. At anyrate, I thought it would only be fair to let titus owners have a crack.

    Thanks!
    I think that the Moto Lite will really fill your needs. I think that what amazes me of the bike is that it is very balanced overall. I don't know if it's the best climber, descender, agile, or lighter bike out there, but it does everything pretty well.

    I believe that MBA didn't really like that bike on a review they did. I'm too lazy to search for that issue, sorry, but I believe (don't quote me on that, haha) that they felt it was not very stiff in the rear. I don't know much about that bike other than that. If you put the ML on 4" on front, you have a pretty nice XC setup, and if you move it to 5" more for descending. I believe that a variable travel fork is a plus for this bike. Good luck!

  14. #14
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    Thoughts from someone who hasn't actually ridden the Niota...
    -Put a travel adjustable fork on the ML. Want a steeper head angle? Take 10mm or so off the fork; done.
    -Steeper head angles are overrated anyway. Those guys on DH bikes with 65 degree HA's go through tight twisties faster than I'd ever dream of. Unless you've ridden slack angles a lot, got the knack of rear-biased steering and drifting, and just plain didn't like it... don't worry about it.
    -One of my friends ordered a Litespeed directly; it took 4 months for the bike to ship and another 3 for her to get billed. That can't bode very well for the customer service; if they're too lazy to take someone's money in a timely fashion they probably aren't going to be too quick to spend money to make someone happy. Comments and reviews on this site seem to back that opinion up.
    -I've inspected both of them up close and personal. Put them next to each other, and the Niota looks like a noodle. Is the ML stiffer while riding? I don't know, I haven't ridden the Niota yet.
    -I haven't heard of a Motolite breaking "just riding along," or while being thrown off six foot drops, or at all for that matter.
    -Ever heard of a Titus with misaligned dropouts? I haven't either.

    I looked at the Niota for a bit while shopping for bikes, before I had ever heard of the Moto-Lite. I kept looking.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by rzozaya1969
    I believe that MBA didn't really like that bike on a review they did.
    That was the Ti one... he wants the Aluminum. A Ti bike will flex more than an Al one being everything equal.

    Basically, if the Ti Niota weighs less or equal to the Al one, it'll be flexier. Titus goes further with their Ti bikes and add material to compensate for that. The result is a more durable and equally stiffer bike than an Aluminum one. Notice they also keep the rear end in Aluminum, which keeps the weight and stiffness in check... and I'd say price too.

    Yeah... Surprisingly, MBA wrote (between the lines) that the Ti Niota was a noodle and it was not worth the 5 grands asking price.
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  16. #16
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    If you your are riding anything that invlolves rocks, roots and some smaller jumps I would avoid the Niota Al. A friend has just had the rear triangle replaced under warranty. The first one had cracked at two of the tube joints and one of the pivots was about to fall off. He is not an aggressive rider, more of an XC racer. Look at the Motolite or a Turner.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Warp

    Yeah... Surprisingly, MBA wrote (between the lines) that the Ti Niota was a noodle and it was not worth the 5 grands asking price.

    That's an absolute deal breaker for me. Stiffness is of the utmost importance to me -- hence my attraction to the motolite.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Furrner
    If you your are riding anything that invlolves rocks, roots and some smaller jumps I would avoid the Niota Al. A friend has just had the rear triangle replaced under warranty. The first one had cracked at two of the tube joints and one of the pivots was about to fall off. He is not an aggressive rider, more of an XC racer. Look at the Motolite or a Turner.

    I know this said friend and whil Litespeed took care of him in a honest and timely manner, the AL Niota seem to have a breakage issue and does truly "have too much going on back there" as someone else said.

    Want an ABG bike that should be sweet check out the new Merlin Works 4.0 that is coming out. If you truly want an all mountain bike I'd say the Moto Lite is more your bike than the Niota not to say there are not other options. Turner 5 spot would be a good bike for instance.

    I love my Racer X and can't see needing more then 4" of travel for basic trail riding.
    Titus Racer X
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  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Asahi
    I know this said friend and whil Litespeed took care of him in a honest and timely manner, the AL Niota seem to have a breakage issue and does truly "have too much going on back there" as someone else said.

    Want an ABG bike that should be sweet check out the new Merlin Works 4.0 that is coming out. If you truly want an all mountain bike I'd say the Moto Lite is more your bike than the Niota not to say there are not other options. Turner 5 spot would be a good bike for instance.

    I love my Racer X and can't see needing more then 4" of travel for basic trail riding.

    Re: Turner 5 spot.

    I like the 5spot but the HT angle is slightly steeper on the Motolite -- which I prefer. It's also slightly lighter with equal travel

    Re: Racer X

    I like 5 inches of travel -- plust the motolite has the option of 4 or 5.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jwind
    I like 5 inches of travel -- plust the motolite has the option of 4 or 5.
    My thoughts exactly, like the option that is there to run either 4 or 5 inches..

    The BB is lower on the 5 Spotty, great bike, handles great, but the low BB is not for me.

    Warp, you mention the flex with the Ti, easy answer MATE, go the the bit of love making with the carbon Ti blend, and you have ExoGrid. Makes the ride, well like sex on toast...
    The_Lecht_Rocks: whafe - cheeers - may i offer an official apology for the wagon wheeler "dis-belief"

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jwind
    That's an absolute deal breaker for me. Stiffness is of the utmost importance to me -- hence my attraction to the motolite.
    I just checked and the Al Niota is heavier than the Ti one.

    Al Niota - 5.34 pounds (darn good weight!)
    Ti Niota - 4.93 pounds ( )

    Unless there would be some serious alloy management or tube manipulation, the Al Niota will be stiffer than the Ti one.

    In comparison, the Ti ML is actually heavier than the Al one and the Exo-Grid comes at the same weight than the Al (but with a better ride, according to Whafe and others).
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  22. #22
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    I will add that the guy I know that rides the Niota AL is only about 110lbs (very light) so he may not be a good indicator of how much abuse this bike can take. It sounds like you have already decided not to go with the litespeed though? If you choose the Motolite you will not regret it. My brother owns a Ti Motolite and swears it is the sweetest bike he as ever ridden. That is a big honor considering he came off of a Ventana El Saltamontes.
    "You can't discern by calculating in your mind how it will work. You have to feel how it rides differently to understand."

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