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  1. #1
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    El Guapo V3 - chain rubbing seatstay

    I am putting together my new frame, and it seems my chain is rubbing the seatstay. I can't think of anything I did that would cause this. I just moved my parts over from my old frame (2009 El Guapo).

    Anyone else seen this or have advice on how to resolve?

    Thanks,

    *MD*
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails El Guapo V3 - chain rubbing chainstay-imag0097.jpg  

    Last edited by *MoonDogg*; 10-15-2012 at 01:51 PM. Reason: changed chainstay to seatstay

  2. #2
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    What kind of hub are you using?

  3. #3
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    Sure looks like you are missing a spacer on the drive side of your hub, your cassette lockring shouldnt be that close to the drop out.

  4. #4
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    I tore my cassette body down to clean it, and make sure it was adjusted correctly. There is nothing missing, it's built exactly how it should be. I put a different wheel on, and its pretty much the same.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails El Guapo V3 - chain rubbing chainstay-imag0099.jpg  

    El Guapo V3 - chain rubbing chainstay-imag0098.jpg  


  5. #5
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    I just looked at my V2, with 10 speed its really close to the seatstay/dropout but the chain makes a definite angle in when it comes off the smallest cog. Is it possible the spacing on your cranks is different? Do you have any spacers between the bearing cup and the frame on the drive side?

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by *MoonDogg* View Post
    I tore my cassette body down to clean it, and make sure it was adjusted correctly. There is nothing missing, it's built exactly how it should be. I put a different wheel on, and its pretty much the same.
    Looks the same with my v3 on 2 different wheelset. It just lightly rub through.

    What i did was put a patch of 3M scorcthgard sticker. That help protecting the paint so far

  7. #7
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    Wheels/Hubs are Easton Havoc AM, and crankset is a Hammerschmidt. Everything is exactly the same as it was on my old frame.

    Looking closer, it looks like the dropout might be just slightly further outboard than it should be compared to the opposite side, and compared to my old frame. Also, the weld on the drive side sticks out a lot further than on the opposite side, where it is very flat and flush with the dropout & stays.

    I put a washer in there as a temporary solution.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails El Guapo V3 - chain rubbing chainstay-old-frame-1.jpg  

    El Guapo V3 - chain rubbing chainstay-new-frame-1.jpg  

    El Guapo V3 - chain rubbing chainstay-new-frame-2.jpg  

    El Guapo V3 - chain rubbing chainstay-washer.jpg  


  8. #8
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    you had me checking mine when i saw your pic!

    am using the v3 as well and mine has the clearance.

    hope the washer will be a temp solution.

  9. #9
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    Are those Havoc Am hubs cup and cone by chance?

    I remember needing to replace the axle on an old XT qr hub and that thing was a headache to get the cup/cone torqued back in the right spot. Used to cause similar problem on my ML, think I had to count 4 threads on each end or something like that

  10. #10
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    Comparison to the old 09 EG dropouts is like apples to oranges. The V2-V3 have totally different shaped tubing in the rear stays. I would suggest a thinner washer you dont want to spread out the rear triangle any more then you have to. I used to have a HS on my 09 Delirium T, if I remember they kind of sit outboard a little more then a standard crankset in terms of chainline, that might be the issue?

  11. #11
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    Just out of curiousity, do you have a spacer on the bottom bracket on the drive side? Reason I ask (and I could be wrong), the V3 has a 73mm BB and I believe the 09 had a 68mm BB, HS install instructions, say one 2.5mm spacer on the 68mm and no spacer on the 73mm, if you swapped it straight over with a spacer, that could be the problem.

  12. #12
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    @DeerhillJ: No it's not, and there is no adjustment for the axle in the Havoc hub.

    @craigstr: The shape of tubing is irrelevant. The clearance required for the chain is the same. In relation to the plane of the dropout, the seatstay on my new frame, on the drive side, appears to sit further inboard than on the non-drive side. Also, the weld on the drive side sticks out a great deal further than the non-drive side. This is where my chain is rubbing. I believe the dropout is ever so slightly mis-aligned, and the weld poorly placed.

    Also, the shell on my old frame is 73mm, and I'm not using any of the HS spacers.

    As far as the washer, I do plan on putting a smaller one, though the one in there actually fits without having to spread the rear triangle. Actually, when not using the spacer, and clamping down the skewer, the dropout is pulled in quite a bit. I noticed this the first time I mounted the wheel, and before I noticed the chain rubbing. Another reason for me to believe the dropout is not aligned correctly.

    *MD*

  13. #13
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    MD...I was just trying to rule out all user error. When I was comparing the tubing shape I just meant it would be hard to compare due to the different shapes. It is clear something not right with that dropout. Have you contacted Titus to see if they can ship you a new seatstay?

  14. #14
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    I appreciate your input. You brought up few things I had not thought about, like the shell width and spacers.

    I did send an email to their tech support address, but have not heard back from them.

    *MD*

  15. #15
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    dropout isn't welded on right surely?

    wheel should slot in there perfectly, like mine does.. you can get that massive washer in there without force, something very wrong!

  16. #16
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    after 2 years, my damn post jinx it. =\

    now my chain is rubbing on the chainstay at the smallest cog.

    only noticed it now because i havent been riding after i set up the eg and now i just started back not too long ago and i see this! argh.

    any solutions from you guys?

    thanks.

  17. #17
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    for the first time, i noticed it on my bike ('10 model) the other day too. dunno if it is caused by the recent move to 1x11 or not. i have never heard it rub. i think i'll have a closer look at the damage to see if it is likely to compromise the weld that it is rubbing on. if only cosmetic, i am not going to worry about it.

    btw, i saw your bike in the other thread. is that a 2x xt crank you have there, running it single ring in the big ring position? if so, wouldn't that crank setup have a chainline >50mm?

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by sclyde2 View Post
    for the first time, i noticed it on my bike ('10 model) the other day too. dunno if it is caused by the recent move to 1x11 or not. i have never heard it rub. i think i'll have a closer look at the damage to see if it is likely to compromise the weld that it is rubbing on. if only cosmetic, i am not going to worry about it.

    btw, i saw your bike in the other thread. is that a 2x xt crank you have there, running it single ring in the big ring position? if so, wouldn't that crank setup have a chainline >50mm?
    Yup, it's the xt double chainring. I believe it's still the same position as the small chainring when I removed the big chainring.

    The rubbing is slight but it's there. It's stripping the gold ti colour off the chain! Haha!

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by kenny78 View Post
    Yup, it's the xt double chainring. I believe it's still the same position as the small chainring when I removed the big chainring.
    i believe that the small ring on the double xt crank is 64mm BCD. is that what you are using? i don't think i've seen someone go 1x that way before.

    however, your photo looks like the big ring bolts are used, so maybe you are using the big ring position. if that's the case, you probably find it doesn't run too well in the bigger end of the cassette, as the chain is at a pretty big angle. it might be a good idea to put some spacers (dunno, maybe 2 or 3mm?) between the chainring and crank, spacing the ring in a touch, which might very slightly reduce the rubbing on your stay too.

  20. #20
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    actually, it's pretty comfy all the way to the biggest cog, it doesn't go off angle too much. it's the chain rub that's annoying me to bits! so my solution, i go 8 speed. =\

    but yes, u r right, the inner chainring (24t) is 64bcd.

    spacers bet chainring and crank? u mean adding spacers for the chainring bolts?

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by kenny78 View Post

    spacers bet chainring and crank? u mean adding spacers for the chainring bolts?
    yes, spacers between the crank and chainring, with the chainring bolts going through the spacers.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by sclyde2 View Post
    yes, spacers between the crank and chainring, with the chainring bolts going through the spacers.
    Ahhh, problem is I'm using e13 bolts and the length is too short for me to add any spacers

  23. #23
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    could the chain rub be caused by the lockring not tightened to 40nm?

    i don't have a torque wrench currently, so it's just guesstimation.

    how tight is tight, the lockring being 40nm and stem bolts just need 5nm. =\

    experts, for your comments please.

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by *MoonDogg* View Post
    I put a washer in there as a temporary solution.
    Seems like a similar problem with quite a few V3.
    On my 09 (older boxy stays) and '10 (newer hydroformed satys) they were close but no rub. But I wouldn't be surprise with dropout alignment being a little off.. Have seen on quite a few frames.

    Had this rub issue with my old ML and did the washer thing. Never have an issue doing that for the entire time using that frame till it was sold. Havent seen anyone putting forth more permanent solutions so far.

    Also on the newer hydroform stays-- they tend to "spring" in a little more than old ones when wheel is off and makes the rear a tad flexier in combo with the seat stay at the "U" area as again this part has quite a fair bit less material -to save weight. Not a biggie but overall that's why I prefer the older design.

  25. #25
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    Ok, solved it with a spacer, doesn't rub the chainstay anymore!

    Thanks to everyone with the advices!

    El Guapo V3 - chain rubbing chainstay-image.jpg

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