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  1. #1
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    Surly Disc Trucker 650b conversion?

    I have a question. I have seen old road/touring 700c bikes converted to 650b. I have also seen 26" MTB converted to 650b. In the case of Disc Trucker which frame will be better for conversion, the 26" or 700c wheel version?
    Till now I have only seen 26" LHT (with or without discs) converted to 650b.




  2. #2
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    Putting 650b wheels on the 700c Trucker would lower the already low BB height. One of the reasons I converted my 26" Trucker to 650b was to raise the BB.

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    This is a good reason, thank you. Although most road bikes, that have been converted to 650b, have low BB.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saddle Up View Post
    Putting 650b wheels on the 700c Trucker would lower the already low BB height. One of the reasons I converted my 26" Trucker to 650b was to raise the BB.
    Really?

    This would be true if you kept to the same sized tires but most folks exchange skinny 700s for fat 650s to keep the overall tire circumference the same. Since the tire bulge is lower in the fork and frame you can normally clear fatter tires than what you could running full size wheels.

    700x23 = 26x2.1 as far as circumference is concerned, not sure how it breaks down with 650B.

    Dig around in the monstercross thread in the 29er forum. There are a ton of 650 converted cross and touring bikes in order to squeeze 40+mm rubber into frames designed for smaller tires.

  5. #5
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    The 700c LHT has clearance for fatties, no need to convert to 650b to install 40+mm tires when the bike already has clearance for 700x 45. 42mm 650b tires will be smaller than 700c 42-45mm tires. Does anyone actually use 700 x 23 tires on a LHT?

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    With the rim brake LHTs, 700c frames are much harder to convert because the brakes won't reach low enough whereas the brakes on the 26" frames can adjust enough to reach. Obviously that's not a problem for Disc Truckers. But BB sure would low.
    Surly Cross Check: fat tire roadie
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  7. #7
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    Why would you want to convert a Disc Trucker to 650B? The reason people do it with road bikes is to be able to fit fatter tires but the Trucker has plenty of room for fat tires. There are also a lot more rim and tire choices for 700c or 26. It's fun to experiment with Surly frames because they are so versatile, but I can't really see a good reason for this particular experiment.

    Based on my rough calculations I figure the fattest 650B road tire will drop the 700C Trucker to about the height it would be with the smallest of 700C tires (23-25c). That doesn't seem like a good idea. If anyone has actual measurements of the outer diameter of some 650B road tires, that might help.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by selin View Post
    I've never considered a Surly to be anything other than utilitarian, until now. That is a very beautiful bike. Surly are you listening? Please don't use any more brown or puke green.
    A garage full of steel frames means happiness.

  9. #9
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    Yes you can put 45 wide tiers at 700 wheels but what about mudguards and toe overlapping (for 56-58 frame).
    Also a bike with 650b will be a bit more agile.

  10. #10
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    I have 700/42s and 55mm Velo Orange fenders on a 56 frame and the only toe overlap I have is where they put the holes for the rear fender strut. Still, it's not a real problem.


  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thor29 View Post
    Why would you want to convert a Disc Trucker to 650B? The reason people do it with road bikes is to be able to fit fatter tires but the Trucker has plenty of room for fat tires. There are also a lot more rim and tire choices for 700c or 26. It's fun to experiment with Surly frames because they are so versatile, but I can't really see a good reason for this particular experiment.

    Based on my rough calculations I figure the fattest 650B road tire will drop the 700C Trucker to about the height it would be with the smallest of 700C tires (23-25c). That doesn't seem like a good idea. If anyone has actual measurements of the outer diameter of some 650B road tires, that might help.
    Well, if you believe Jan Heine, Grant Peterson, and guys like that, 650b hits a sweet spot for speed and comfort that neither 26" nor 700c can match. Even though there's less choice for rims and tires, the rims and tires that are available are very good. I could certainly see that someone who's "b-curious" might prefer to experiment on their LHT instead of buying a whole new bike. There aren't very many production 650b roadbikes anyway. None of them are designed for disc brakes, so the DT does fill a niche as one of the very few options for an affordable (read: not custom) 650b-friendly roadbike with disc brakes. Actually, I think it sounds quite attractive to have the option of running some nice high volume, low rolling resistance 650b tires, like a Grand Bois Hetre, for around town and on club rides and such and be able to swap in sturdy 26" wheels with bullet-proof tires for touring and commuting. Makes a lot of sense for someone without the storage space for multiple bikes.
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  12. #12
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    Why convert a 26" LHT to 650b? Because they don't make a 700c version smaller than 56cm for starters. I know they have clearance for fat tires but the reality for me is that the bike rides best with tires in the 1.50-1.75" range, it's what the bike was designed around. 650b x 1.50" tires give me a taller tire without having the volume of a fat 26" tire.

    26" 2.1 Nevegal

    Surly Long haul Trucker by SaddleUpBike, on Flickr

    26" 1.95 Nevegal

    Long Haul Trucker by SaddleUpBike, on Flickr

    650b 2.1 Nevegal

    650b LHT by SaddleUpBike, on Flickr

    650b 1.5 Conti Tour Ride

    650b Long Haul Trucker by SaddleUpBike, on Flickr

  13. #13
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    "bolandjd" +1

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    SaddleUp I saw your bike at flickr first, and it was one of them that made me think about 26" DT (I know yours is the non disc). It is like having many bikes. Although I prefer the disc version for the easy wheel change.

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    Thats a sick bike. Best of luck with it.

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    Surly Disc Trucker 650b conversion?

    Any updates to this project?

    I'm considering building a 650b Soma Double Cross, or Surly Straggler. Hadn't considered the LHT until now, but it seems like an option.

    E

  17. #17
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    Surly Disc Trucker 650b conversion?

    Love it!



    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

  18. #18
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    Richard - That is a sweet bike! How do like the mustache bars?
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  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by bolandjd View Post
    Richard - That is a sweet bike! How do like the mustache bars?
    I am just loving the moustache bars! I am a fan of dropbars (at the right height) but for function and form the moustache bars are hard to beat! More hand positions and good control.

  20. #20
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    Surly Disc Trucker 650b conversion?

    Quote Originally Posted by Espresso_ View Post
    Any updates to this project?

    I'm considering building a 650b Soma Double Cross, or Surly Straggler. Hadn't considered the LHT until now, but it seems like an option.

    E
    Went for the Soma Double Cross in the end. Stan's Flow 650b and Grand Bois Hetres.



    E

  21. #21
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  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Espresso_ View Post
    Went for the Soma Double Cross in the end. Stan's Flow 650b and Grand Bois Hetres.



    E

    I really like the way this bike looks. Very Nice.
    "You don't need a lighter bike, you need bigger muscles"

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Espresso_ View Post
    Any updates to this project?

    I'm considering building a 650b Soma Double Cross, or Surly Straggler. Hadn't considered the LHT until now, but it seems like an option.

    E
    I thought Surly was making a 650B Straggler for 2015. Straggler 650b | Bikes | Surly Bikes
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  24. #24
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    All good expeditions should be simple in concept, difficult in their execution and satisfying to remember--Alastair Humphreys

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    Quote Originally Posted by Richard View Post
    Love it!
    Richard, wondering if you could post the tire clearance. I'm assuming those are either Grand Bois Hetre or Soma 42mm tires? Looking to do the same on my wife's Trucker.

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saddle Up View Post

    650b 2.1 Nevegal

    650b LHT by SaddleUpBike, on Flickr
    What was the clearance like with the 2.1 Nev's?

  27. #27
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    Not quite enough, particularly out back. 1-2 mm at the chain stays. The 2.1"s were one of a few 650b tires readily available at the time. The wheels came off of my Troll. I mounted them to the LHT to check fitment of the canti brakes.

  28. #28
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    Surly "Disc Trucker" with 650B Tire. by Circles Japan, on Flickr

    Surly "Disc Trucker" with 650B Tire. by Circles Japan, on Flickr

    Debating hard right now on if I want a 26 or 700 or . . .

  29. #29
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    700c to 650b with 2.25 tires?

    Sorta resurrecting an old thread here. I had always thought that the 26" DT was the best option for converting to a 650b but then was thinking today, could a 700c DT with 650b wheels fit a 2.25 tire? I know people have done conversions on Vayas and seem to like them. The appeal of doing a conversion on a DT is that it has bigger clearance. I know folks have fit 2.00 tires in a DT. Anyone have any thoughts or better yet, experience with such a conversion?

    Thanks?
    All good expeditions should be simple in concept, difficult in their execution and satisfying to remember--Alastair Humphreys

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by dfltroll View Post
    Sorta resurrecting an old thread here. I had always thought that the 26" DT was the best option for converting to a 650b but then was thinking today, could a 700c DT with 650b wheels fit a 2.25 tire? I know people have done conversions on Vayas and seem to like them. The appeal of doing a conversion on a DT is that it has bigger clearance. I know folks have fit 2.00 tires in a DT. Anyone have any thoughts or better yet, experience with such a conversion?

    Thanks?
    The 700c Trucker already has a really low BB. Putting on 650b wheels would make it even lower, possibly dangerously low. My LHT maxes out at 45mm with a 700c tire, so I'm skeptical there's clearance for a 2.25 650b. Maybe on the fork. Eyeballing the rear, however, I think you'd rub on the chainstays. But now I'm curious; I'll have to bust out the calipers and check it out.
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    Quote Originally Posted by bolandjd View Post
    The 700c Trucker already has a really low BB. Putting on 650b wheels would make it even lower, possibly dangerously low. My LHT maxes out at 45mm with a 700c tire, so I'm skeptical there's clearance for a 2.25 650b. Maybe on the fork. Eyeballing the rear, however, I think you'd rub on the chainstays. But now I'm curious; I'll have to bust out the calipers and check it out.
    I doubt BB height would be dangerous. When you look at the outside measurement of a 650B wheel on wide/high tyres it's not that far from a 700c with slimmer tyres.

    Of course, that's assuming it fits...

    E

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    Quote Originally Posted by Saddle Up View Post
    Why convert a 26" LHT to 650b? Because they don't make a 700c version smaller than 56cm for starters. I know they have clearance for fat tires but the reality for me is that the bike rides best with tires in the 1.50-1.75" range, it's what the bike was designed around. 650b x 1.50" tires give me a taller tire without having the volume of a fat 26" tire.

    26" 2.1 Nevegal

    Surly Long haul Trucker by SaddleUpBike, on Flickr

    26" 1.95 Nevegal

    Long Haul Trucker by SaddleUpBike, on Flickr

    650b 2.1 Nevegal

    650b LHT by SaddleUpBike, on Flickr

    650b 1.5 Conti Tour Ride

    650b Long Haul Trucker by SaddleUpBike, on Flickr
    What size bike is that? Actually, what are the sizes on all pictures in this thread?

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    I posted my question in a separate thread, but maybe I will get more response if I post here. With folks discussing how big of rubber fits Trucker, I was wondering if anyone tried 26" 2.1 in 700c Disk Trucker fork? Will that work?

    I looked though the tread and I have seen some pictures of DT with 650B 2.1 rubber, but it appears that those are smaller DT with 26" forks? I am not sure.

    I would really appreciate feedback!

    P.S. Here is the original thread:

    Disk Trucker 700c fork: will 26" 2.1 work?

  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hyloba View Post
    What size bike is that? Actually, what are the sizes on all pictures in this thread?
    Sorry didn't see this until now. My bike is a 52cm.

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    dammit. i gonna have to thin the herd and make room for his and hers disc truckers... visions of bike tours dancing thru my head....
    In a world full of people, only some want to ride. Isn't that crazy?
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  36. #36
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    Anyone done a B+ conversion on 700C Disc Trucker? Fat is good but fatter is better.
    A garage full of steel frames means happiness.

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by CS2 View Post
    Anyone done a B+ conversion on 700C Disc Trucker? Fat is good but fatter is better.
    I don't know if there would be enough lateral clearance in the 700C DT, especially for a plus tire on 35-50mm rims. The new Schwalbe 27.5x2.8 G-One gravel tire would be perfect for such a project, though. The 27.5x2.8 Super Moto-X is also available, but heavier.

    I really want a 650B plus drop bar gravel/all road bike as my next ride. A Straggler/Space Horse Disc/Vaya with lateral clearance for the plus tires would be perfect with a lighter gravel tire like the G-One.

  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by PDKL45 View Post
    I don't know if there would be enough lateral clearance in the 700C DT, especially for a plus tire on 35-50mm rims. The new Schwalbe 27.5x2.8 G-One gravel tire would be perfect for such a project, though. The 27.5x2.8 Super Moto-X is also available, but heavier.

    I really want a 650B plus drop bar gravel/all road bike as my next ride. A Straggler/Space Horse Disc/Vaya with lateral clearance for the plus tires would be perfect with a lighter gravel tire like the G-One.
    Agreed, what about the 2017 Salsa Fargo? I believe there is a B+ version.
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  39. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by CS2 View Post
    Agreed, what about the 2017 Salsa Fargo? I believe there is a B+ version.
    There is. I made this list in another thread, hoping that people would help add to it, but drop bar geometry 27.5+ bikes are a niche within a niche at the moment, the only real one out there is probably the Rawland Ulv.

    This is what I have so far:

    Bombtrack Beyond+ (Hacked with short stem etc)
    Rawland Ulv
    Intec M5 (Questionable: Unsure of lateral clearance)
    Salsa Fargo (this is more of a drop bar MTB)
    Surly Ogre (with uncut steerer tube and very short stem)
    Velo Orange Piolet

    Sorry to derail the thread with the 650B+ stuff! Something like a 27.5x2.0 Big Ben would fit in a 700C DT quite well I think, and you probably wouldn't see terrible BB drop.
    Last edited by PDKL45; 10-03-2016 at 07:22 PM.

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    Resurrecting a resurrection;

    Much of this is about 26", but I have a 700c Disc Trucker, and want to get as fat as possible. I can get 2.1 in front without any issue at all.

    What is the widest 27.5 tire people have been able to fit on a 700c trucker? Seems like some have squeezed 700x2.1 back there, or 700x47. This makes me think I could get 27.5x2.25 or more (2.5?), as the width is lower in the frame.

    Also considering throwing on an ECR fork, and making it a monster cross-trail-tour bike thing with some woodchippers, unless Crust bikes ever comes out with their bar. I know this will change the ride characteristics a bit, but I think it could be a bike packing dream come true with all that gearing.

    Before I spend money on the wheel, I want some hard data. Who has had success with this conversion without a sacrifice to BB height? Rim width and tire sizes and brands are greatly appreciated.

  41. #41
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    I have not tried it, and I was banging on about 27.5+ above--it was my enthusiastic idea of the week--but I recently saw the Schwalbe G-One Speed 27.5x2.35 tire (Schwalbe G-One Speed - Schwalbe Professional Bike Tires).

    I currently ride a Specialized AWOL and I am quite keen on the idea of putting a fairly supple fat road tire like the G-One Speed on it (it's a 500 gram tire) because there's a BB drop of only about 4mm, basically like going to a 700x32c tire from where I am now.

    I know that 27.5x2.35 knobbies fit the AWOL frame, so with the fatties fit fine philosophy, I would suspect that the relatively smooth G-One Speed would fit a 700C Trucker.

    Please post pics if you make a conversion.

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    The A-C measurement on an ECR fork is 78mm longer than the Trucker fork. That's going to change the handling characteristics more than just a little bit. Not compatible at all.

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    Dear Surly, Please make this actually possible. It would be fun. That's all. Thanks. #surlybikes @intergalacticsurlybikes #disctrucker #27.5+ #fat #needmore by pavementgraveldirt, on Flickr

    Unfortunately it isn't even close to fitting. I WANT THIS BIKE. I would even settle for a 27.5x2.35.

    Flat top tube. Disc. Drop Bar. Touring Geometry.

  44. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by rusheleven View Post
    Dear Surly, Please make this actually possible. It would be fun. That's all. Thanks. #surlybikes @intergalacticsurlybikes #disctrucker #27.5+ #fat #needmore by pavementgraveldirt, on Flickr

    Unfortunately it isn't even close to fitting. I WANT THIS BIKE. I would even settle for a 27.5x2.35.

    Flat top tube. Disc. Drop Bar. Touring Geometry.
    That is beautiful. Bonus points if they called it the "Lot Lizard".
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  45. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by rusheleven View Post
    Dear Surly, Please make this actually possible. It would be fun. That's all. Thanks. #surlybikes @intergalacticsurlybikes #disctrucker #27.5+ #fat #needmore by pavementgraveldirt, on Flickr

    Unfortunately it isn't even close to fitting. I WANT THIS BIKE. I would even settle for a 27.5x2.35.

    Flat top tube. Disc. Drop Bar. Touring Geometry.
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------

    what about a 2.35 big apple? or something with a ballonish shape?
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    I kinda doubt it. The red trucker with the wood chippers I put up earlier had 2.1 and they look like they are stacked full. Probably not enough clearance to run through some mud puddles with that as it is.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rusheleven View Post
    Dear Surly, Please make this actually possible. It would be fun. That's all. Thanks. #surlybikes @intergalacticsurlybikes #disctrucker #27.5+ #fat #needmore by pavementgraveldirt, on Flickr

    Unfortunately it isn't even close to fitting. I WANT THIS BIKE. I would even settle for a 27.5x2.35.

    Flat top tube. Disc. Drop Bar. Touring Geometry.
    Hi,

    Has anyone tried 26x2.8 (WTB Rangers)?

    Thanks,
    Fede
    Cycling in developing countries, making & printing portraits for those families who've NONE. www.theironlyportrait.com

  48. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheirOnlyPortrait View Post
    Hi,

    Has anyone tried 26x2.8 (WTB Rangers)?

    Thanks,
    Fede
    I suspect the limitation there would be lateral clearance, as you would probably struggle to gain clearance for the sidewalls, even if the diameter was acceptable.

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    Thread resurrection part 3!

    Currently consolidating the fleet and quite keen on converting my 26" LHT to 650b.

    Question for Saddle Up. What are the brakes you are using on your bike. Are they Shimano Cantis? Trawling around I see Tektro CR 720's work on the back and Oryx also work. Just wondering what else may have relevant adjustment.

    Cheers

    Chris

  50. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by EssexBoyUK View Post
    Thread resurrection part 3!

    Currently consolidating the fleet and quite keen on converting my 26" LHT to 650b.

    Question for Saddle Up. What are the brakes you are using on your bike. Are they Shimano Cantis? Trawling around I see Tektro CR 720's work on the back and Oryx also work. Just wondering what else may have relevant adjustment.

    Cheers

    Chris
    Sorry dude, I'm really late to the party. I'll just leave this here for future reference.


    650b Long Haul Trucker
    by SaddleUpBike, on Flickr


    650b Long Haul Trucker
    by SaddleUpBike, on Flickr


    650b Long Haul Trucker
    by SaddleUpBike, on Flickr

  51. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saddle Up View Post
    Sorry dude, I'm really late to the party. I'll just leave this here for future reference.


    650b Long Haul Trucker
    by SaddleUpBike, on Flickr


    650b Long Haul Trucker
    by SaddleUpBike, on Flickr


    650b Long Haul Trucker
    by SaddleUpBike, on Flickr
    No worries. Thanks for getting in touch. Found an old set of Oryx Canti's in the back of the shed so will be using them. Look like they will be fine.
    Wheels build and everything cleaned and regreased so building up during the week and hopefully rolling by the weekend. Will put up a few photos and observations when I'm done.

  52. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by EssexBoyUK View Post
    No worries. Thanks for getting in touch. Found an old set of Oryx Canti's in the back of the shed so will be using them. Look like they will be fine.
    Wheels build and everything cleaned and regreased so building up during the week and hopefully rolling by the weekend. Will put up a few photos and observations when I'm done.
    If you have a flat bar or can use long-pull road brakes (i.e. Cane Creek), then you can use Paul Motolite's as well.

  53. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by 2:01 View Post
    If you have a flat bar or can use long-pull road brakes (i.e. Cane Creek), then you can use Paul Motolite's as well.
    Yes know about Motolites but 'm currently refreshing and.consolidating the fleet and trying to save for a new machine also so not keen on paying 200+ for a set of brakes!

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    650b conversion complete. Pick Up Trucker completely stripped, cleaned and rebuilt with new drivetrain and cables. 26" heavy duty touring wheels and Marathon Mondial tyres replaced with Piacenti Brevet rims and Panaracer Gravel King Slicks 650b x 38mm. Rim and tyre change has knocked off 600g from EACH WHEEL plus now tubeless so even more weight lost from lack of tubes. Only had a brief ride round the block. The handling feels the same but obviously a big difference with the reduction in weight on the wheels. Dry weather in the next couple of days so will be using o the commute and will get some serious miles in on Wednesday night.
    Apart from the wheels and new fenders the only real change has been to swap out my beloved Paul Neo Retros to a set of Tektro Oryx as they have the correct pad adjustment for the wheel size change. Went with 650bx38 but I reckon 650bx42 would fit with the fenders. I have WTB Byways on my commuter at the moment and these do fit the LHT frame but no room for fenders.
    Because of the weight change I cannot really make a reasonable comparison going from 26" and 650b but does feel much, much quicker. I do have a 700cc LHT also but compared to the smaller wheel size for me its always felt a bit sluggish even with a lighter wheel set.

    The before - heavy duty high mileage commuter, load hauler, errand runner 26".
    Surly Disc Trucker 650b conversion?-001.jpg

    The after - 650b Rando dream machine

    Surly Disc Trucker 650b conversion?-img_20180310_152757-002-.jpg

  55. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by EssexBoyUK View Post
    650b conversion complete. Pick Up Trucker completely stripped, cleaned and rebuilt with new drivetrain and cables. 26" heavy duty touring wheels and Marathon Mondial tyres replaced with Piacenti Brevet rims and Panaracer Gravel King Slicks 650b x 38mm. Rim and tyre change has knocked off 600g from EACH WHEEL plus now tubeless so even more weight lost from lack of tubes. Only had a brief ride round the block. The handling feels the same but obviously a big difference with the reduction in weight on the wheels. Dry weather in the next couple of days so will be using o the commute and will get some serious miles in on Wednesday night.
    Apart from the wheels and new fenders the only real change has been to swap out my beloved Paul Neo Retros to a set of Tektro Oryx as they have the correct pad adjustment for the wheel size change. Went with 650bx38 but I reckon 650bx42 would fit with the fenders. I have WTB Byways on my commuter at the moment and these do fit the LHT frame but no room for fenders.
    Because of the weight change I cannot really make a reasonable comparison going from 26" and 650b but does feel much, much quicker. I do have a 700cc LHT also but compared to the smaller wheel size for me its always felt a bit sluggish even with a lighter wheel set.

    The before - heavy duty high mileage commuter, load hauler, errand runner 26".
    Click image for larger version. 

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    The after - 650b Rando dream machine

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    Very nice.

    What size frame is your LHT?

  56. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by ColonelSanders View Post
    Very nice.

    What size frame is your LHT?
    Thanks Colonel. Frame is 58cm. This is very much my tinkering bike and by far the one with the most mileage. Been flat bar, moustache bar before settling with On One Midge flared drops. Ran single speed, Alfine IGH, touring triple with bar end shifters and now simple 1x9 with a down tube shifter. And finally a wheel size change!
    Been my daily commuter, tourer, shopper and ridden two brevet series on it (that's 200,300,400,and 600km rides in one season) Hopefully will be taking part on a 1,000km brevet ride on it later this year.

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    Update on the conversion. I've been riding to work for a couple of days now and think I can make a few more meaningful observations. I also have a 700cc Trucker so can compare 650b on a 26" frame vs 700cc.

    26" vs 650b

    Ok so I went from 26" heavy duty touring rims and tyres (Rigida Sputnik and Marathon Mondial 26x2") to a set of Pacenti Brevet rims and Panaracer Gravel King Slicks 650bx38 tubeless. Weight loss of around 1.5kg. Hubs are the same on both wheel sets and are Shimano LX rear and XT dynamo front. Not flash but reliable and last a long time.
    I've read on Velo Orange blog that difference in wheel size for this combo is about 5mm so bb is raised slightly. I would say handling remains more or less the same. Slightly more twitchy but LHT handling is like steering a pleasure boat anyway so no major biggy. This could be down to the slight raise of bb or the lighter wheels. Just can't tell for sure.
    Speed has increased significantly by around 10-12 kph on the flat. This again is down to wheel weight loss.

    650b (on 26" frame) vs 700cc frame
    Wheel set on both is probably a weight difference of 200g and both run tubeless so can make a reasonable comparison. I've ridden these back to back so I can compare how they both feel.
    700cc feels sluggish compared to 650b. Wheels spin up more slowly and climbing feels like it takes significantly more effort. Speed on 700cc is lower by around 4-5kph. When I first went in to this I had the view that the acceleration and maintaining speed thing between the two was a load of bollocks but it actually does seem to be true. The 26" frame with smaller wheels does feel like it gives a more peppy ride.
    For me other main advantages are that zero toe overlap is maintained on 26" (for the record frame is a 58 and have shoe size of US 12) and also a large water bottle (800ml clean canteen style) still fits in the cage underneath the down tube. On the 700cc I can only fit a small bottle.

    Overall it's a winner so far. The only downside for me is the difference in braking performance between Paul Neo Retros and the newly fitted Tektro Oryx. Also if I can get significant increase in performance with a LHT, what would it feel like to ride a lighter frame?? (shall I be the first person in the world to own a Pack Rat??)

    Cheers
    Chris

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    Nice work EssexBoyUK.

  59. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saddle Up View Post
    Nice work EssexBoyUK.
    Thanks mate. Partly your fault I went in this direction but glad I id so far. The bike really does perform well with the added comfort the LHT brings.
    How do you find the Shimano Cantis? Do they work ok for you? Might be the way I have them set up but the Oryx are pretty sh*t.

    Cheers
    Chris

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    First ride proper on the 650b Rando Trucker with 100km after work last night. Totally sold on the 650b concept. Wheels spin up nicely and Trucker performs very well with the lighter wheels. My 700cc LHT feels a bit sluggish in comparison. Have to say however that its still a Trucker and still has the stiff long back end so is a cruiser not a sprinter. Was thinking how a lighter, more flexible frame with shorter chain stays might feel. I think I'm possibly the first person in the world who may be coming Pack Rat curious.

  61. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by EssexBoyUK View Post
    First ride proper on the 650b Rando Trucker with 100km after work last night. Totally sold on the 650b concept. Wheels spin up nicely and Trucker performs very well with the lighter wheels. My 700cc LHT feels a bit sluggish in comparison. Have to say however that its still a Trucker and still has the stiff long back end so is a cruiser not a sprinter. Was thinking how a lighter, more flexible frame with shorter chain stays might feel. I think I'm possibly the first person in the world who may be coming Pack Rat curious.
    I've ridden two 200ks on my 26" Disc Trucker, so you're not alone!

  62. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by EssexBoyUK View Post
    First ride proper on the 650b Rando Trucker with 100km after work last night. Totally sold on the 650b concept. Wheels spin up nicely and Trucker performs very well with the lighter wheels. My 700cc LHT feels a bit sluggish in comparison. Have to say however that its still a Trucker and still has the stiff long back end so is a cruiser not a sprinter. Was thinking how a lighter, more flexible frame with shorter chain stays might feel. I think I'm possibly the first person in the world who may be coming Pack Rat curious.
    I'm the second.


    Back on b
    by SaddleUpBike, on Flickr

  63. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saddle Up View Post
    I'm the second.


    Back on b
    by SaddleUpBike, on Flickr
    Like your style mate. Been in touch with the UK distributor about Pack Rat today. Larger sizes never made it over here and apparently there's only one 58cm frame left in the US also. Maybe Surly did a first short run knowing the MS was on its way to see how things went.

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