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  1. #301
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gritter View Post
    An LBS is good for one thing: ripping off people who don't know much about bikes, or don't have time to wait for shipping. That's their clientele. If I ever met a decent LBS, I'm sure I would feel differently. Anyways . . .
    I've got to admit I've not had much luck with them.
    First my wheels were built with the rims in opposing directions so the stickers are opposed ie. I think Dyad on the front left and one the right rear and Velocity visa versa.
    When I took my frame in for the headset, they lost the covers on the brake bosses and the wedge in the rear dropouts to stop clinching of the dropouts.
    WTF has the headset installation got to do with these bits so that they had to be removed (and then subsequently lost)?
    No more work for them nor buying anything off their shelves.
    We wont talk about missing nipples off the spare spokes or the small scratches on the frame. Despite giving them the Rohloff manual the hubs oiler which is supposed to be in line with the tube valve, wasnt.
    Oh and the barbag adapter was placed at the bottom of the steerer so if the bars were allowed to turn around far enough, the adapter would strike the top bar.
    Cest' la Vie?

  2. #302
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    Quote Originally Posted by hunter006 View Post
    Hi rifraf,
    I was wondering - what's the clearance between the BBB XL Fuel Tanks cage mounted on the downtube and the front tire when you put a 1.5L PET bottle in there?
    OK, I thought I had the answer to your question when my lovely Landlady brought home a bottle of coke knowing I wanted to do some measuring.
    Unfortunatley it turned out to be 1.25 liter. Anyway just so you know I havnt forgotten, heres a taster of the answer - not definitive by any means but at least you know I'm looking. The 1.25L bottle doesnt have a nice fit down at the bottom as its loose.
    This bad boy is made for a fatter bottom but would stay put by virtue of the top clamp.
    On the 1.25 bottle there is approx 3cm (call it 28mm to be sure).
    I know the pic looks shorter but what can I do with optical illusions. When I lay the tape flat it looks about 29mm hence my call of 28mm short of buying some verniers.
    Now I'm going to have to go and buy some rum to go with this coke before it goes off.
    You guys are costing me money
    Ogre Build Thread-dsc05795.jpgOgre Build Thread-dsc05797.jpg

  3. #303
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    what size if your Ogre rif?

    got my cascadias today and wouldn't you know it, after a ride home up here in Ipswich in the freezing rain with NO fenders, i decided to put them on this evening. probably just as much mucking around as with the SKS ones, i'm pretty happy with them.
    photos to follow tomorrow
    i'm keen to take a look at one of those BBB cages. currently i have a tool bottle on my bottom cage but i can easily go back to a small saddle bag for my spare tube, patches, tool etc.

  4. #304
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    Hi Steve,
    its a 20 and I'm of two minds as to it being too big.
    I've got to lay it right over on its side to get my leg over the bar in order to get on the saddle.
    I'll make my mind up after having ridden it for a couple of weeks.
    It might just be the big wheels intimidating me after riding 20 inch 406 wheels for the last 17 years.
    Cant wait for your pics.
    Apparently local prices for the XL Fuel Tanks are very close but the LBS here whom I was told stocked them doesn't get my money due to poor service and not sticking to previously quoted items. No worries. I got mine via charliethebikemonger.com and it took a fortnight to get to WA. East coast I'd bet would be quicker.

  5. #305
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    Quote Originally Posted by rifraf View Post
    I got mine [BBB XL Fuel Cage] via charliethebikemonger.com
    That's where I got mine as well. +1 for recommending charliethebikemonger!

    That sucks to hear about your woes at your LBS, but I can't say that I'm surprised. Just imagine if Porsche mechanics only made $8 an hour - they'd probably lose parts and scratch stuff too.

    These bicycle "mechanics" are working on HIGH-END bikes, with low-end wages. It's a messed up situation.

    The last time I got a bike from the LBS was some 15 years ago - I watched the dumb kid slip his wrench, rounding out my bolt, and scratching my brand new bike. I promptly invested a small fortune in my own specialty bicycle tools and never had a problem since.

    Later, I went to another LBS to ask for a box for shipping a frame I sold on eBay. He told me he had no boxes at all. I asked when he would be getting some in, he told me, "never". I'm guessing eBay and other internet sites are his competition, so he took it out on me.

    Quote Originally Posted by rifraf View Post
    Looking good, rifraf! I use a 40 oz Klean Kanteen wide-mouth flask in my BBB XL Fuelcage, with a neoprene cover to keep things from being scratched and holding things tight. It's been working great so far.

  6. #306
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gritter View Post
    Just imagine if Porsche mechanics only made $8 an hour - they'd probably lose parts and scratch stuff too.
    I guarantee rifraf's local bike guys make more than $8 per hour. Probably closer to $22 plus commission. Minimum wage here is actually a wage.

  7. #307
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gritter View Post
    Looking good, rifraf! I use a 40 oz Klean Kanteen wide-mouth flask in my BBB XL Fuelcage, with a neoprene cover to keep things from being scratched and holding things tight. It's been working great so far.
    Hi Gritter,
    got a link?
    I just ordered 2 of these:
    Nalgene 48-Ounce Silo Tritan Wide Mouth Water Bottle (Blue) : Amazon.com : Sports & Outdoors
    which I hope work ok. I've been told they do but I'd have to remove the top clamp of the Fuel Tank. Apparantly they stay put even on harsh gravel roads - we'll see I guess.
    It was a fellow tourist that told me and not a shop so I'm confident they are right.

    Hunter I went to the shop in search of a 1.5 liter but my local supermarket only has 1.25 or 2.00 liters. I'll have to get back to you on that when I find out more.
    In the mean time I've ordered a couple of Nalgene bottles for myself after having them recommended highly.

  8. #308
    "Ride Lots" Eddy Merckx
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    Quote Originally Posted by HelmutHerr View Post
    Probably closer to $22 plus commission.
    I highly doubt this....no way mechanics are making $45k/year plus commission!
    "Big Gulps huh?...Allllriggghhht....Welp, See ya later!"

  9. #309
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    Quote Originally Posted by kkjellquist View Post
    I highly doubt this....no way mechanics are making $45k/year plus commission!
    Pretty sure you'll find supermarket workers in Perth are sitting on around $20p/h.
    Its an expensive place to live. I dont know anything about commission but do know the wages seem to be higher than I thought they would be.
    Its very hard to retain staff as many people throw in the towel to try to get into the mining industry where wages make what used to be average into chump change.
    Check out: Minimum Wage in Australia - MyWage.org.au
    The minimum Aussie wage is around $16 an hour and you'd be pushed to find anyone willing to work for it. They also get a lot of different loadings and allowances as well as overtime rates. There has been around three quarters of a million New Zealanders jumping the ditch over here because their wages and conditions are crap by comparison.

  10. #310
    "Ride Lots" Eddy Merckx
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    Quote Originally Posted by rifraf View Post
    Pretty sure you'll find supermarket workers in Perth are sitting on around $20p/h.
    Its an expensive place to live. I dont know anything about commission but do know the wages seem to be higher than I thought they would be.
    Its very hard to retain staff as many people throw in the towel to try to get into the mining industry where wages make what used to be average into chump change.
    My bad...didn't realize we are talking about Australia...no mechanics in my neck of the woods are making that.
    "Big Gulps huh?...Allllriggghhht....Welp, See ya later!"

  11. #311
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    Quote Originally Posted by kkjellquist View Post
    My bad...didn't realize we are talking about Australia...no mechanics in my neck of the woods are making that.
    Its all good.
    The wages are relative to the cost of living. Theres certainly plenty of homeless to show not everyones on the gravy train.

  12. #312
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    Quote Originally Posted by kkjellquist View Post
    My bad...didn't realize we are talking about Australia.
    I probably should have mentioned that. The downside is that bikes are crazy expensive here.

  13. #313
    Unhinged Aussie on a 29er
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    Quote Originally Posted by rifraf View Post
    OK, I thought I had the answer to your question when my lovely Landlady brought home a bottle of coke knowing I wanted to do some measuring.
    Unfortunatley it turned out to be 1.25 liter. Anyway just so you know I havnt forgotten, heres a taster of the answer - not definitive by any means but at least you know I'm looking. The 1.25L bottle doesnt have a nice fit down at the bottom as its loose.
    This bad boy is made for a fatter bottom but would stay put by virtue of the top clamp.
    On the 1.25 bottle there is approx 3cm (call it 28mm to be sure).
    I know the pic looks shorter but what can I do with optical illusions. When I lay the tape flat it looks about 29mm hence my call of 28mm short of buying some verniers.
    Now I'm going to have to go and buy some rum to go with this coke before it goes off.
    You guys are costing me money
    Thanks for doing that. I think there's only one way I'll find out if it will work or not, but clearly from your photo it'll be really, really close. I think it'll strike the fender on my setup, but there's lots of clearance between the tire and the fender so I might be able to do some trickery there.

    Time to go see what else I need to buy... I did wear out another bottom bracket...

  14. #314
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    Quote Originally Posted by rifraf View Post
    Hi Gritter,
    got a link?
    Oh, for the 40 oz Klean Kanteen wide-mouth Stainless Steel flasks? I just got mine on Amazon here: I got the loop cap, and non-insulated 40 ounce version.

    Then, I just grabbed a neoprene "sock" for some insulation, but mostly so the stainless steel wouldn't scrape against the aluminum BBB XL FuelCage. It makes it a tight fit, but without the upper retaining hook, it's been more than super-secure. I have to remove and re-holster the bottle deliberately and slowly. I like it. The neoprene sock is no longer listed on Amazon, but they're mostly very similar. It was THIS ONE though.

    It does slightly bend the BBB XL FuelCage slightly outward when mounted, though. I'd say the FuelCage opens up about 15mm.

    About 97mm (3-13/16") diameter with the 3mm thick (compressible) neoprene, and 92.3mm (3-5/8") diameter without the neoprene.

  15. #315
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    Ogre Build Thread-dsc05804.jpgOgre Build Thread-dsc05800.jpg
    Quote Originally Posted by hunter006 View Post
    Thanks for doing that. I think there's only one way I'll find out if it will work or not, but clearly from your photo it'll be really, really close. I think it'll strike the fender on my setup, but there's lots of clearance between the tire and the fender so I might be able to do some trickery there.

    Time to go see what else I need to buy... I did wear out another bottom bracket...
    Blimmin hard holding the camera and the tape measure at the same time.
    I found water at a supermarket in 1.5 liter. The measurement is worse in that its likely 27mm. Not sure if the top is fatter or if my measurements getting more accurate in the slightly better light.

  16. #316
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    Ogre Build Thread-dsc05798.jpgOgre Build Thread-dsc05799.jpgOgre Build Thread-dsc05802.jpgOgre Build Thread-dsc05803.jpgBit of motivation today.
    I got the chain on as well as the brakes installed and working.
    They'll no doubt need some fine tuning but the great thing is they work and stop the bike.
    How do I know? Cause I used a spanner to get the IGH into low gear and went round and round our small back section on the bike for its first ride.
    Still cant get off the s*#t eating grin off my face.
    The Ogre is very stable at slow speed compared to my Moulton and a very different ride.
    After being initially worried about the 20" frame size and thinking it maybe too big, I'm pleased to be comfortable on it and assured its fine for my size.
    I also adjusted the angle of the Brooks Flyer Special after chucking on my tool bag to the back of it.
    The Thomson seatpost makes this easy as there is a gauge with numbers (degrees?) up by the adjustment area, so you can see how much angle you've changed.
    Bit small for my poor eyes but I can make out the lines which is all I need.
    Saddle angle adjustment was after the pics if you think its still a little upward looking.
    Oh and the Ogre is nice and warty now that I've filled in all the fork holes with stainless steel allen key head bolts.
    I added a tugnut and managed to work out the OEM2 plate bolt adjustment.
    In in all a proactive day I reckon.

  17. #317
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    not to be a party pooper, but a fistful of straight up seatpost w/ brooks and a 50mm? stem...
    looks like that bike is too large....
    i'm riding a 20" with a 90mm stem and 8" of post and was worried about it being too big for me for awhile....

  18. #318
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    Quote Originally Posted by johnny the boy View Post
    not to be a party pooper, but a fistful of straight up seatpost w/ brooks and a 50mm? stem...
    looks like that bike is too large....
    i'm riding a 20" with a 90mm stem and 8" of post and was worried about it being too big for me for awhile....
    Johnny you could be right but thats not the advice you offered in the thread I started asking for advice on sizing.
    Help - need a favor from an Ogre Owner with a camera and a few minutes to spare
    If the bike was intended for getting air or hard core mountain biking I'd have definitely gone with the 18" frame.
    This bike is mainly for touring albeit lots of unsealed roads and singletrack. As I can only stable one bike in my accommodation it also has to be commuter and shopping trolly.
    My last tour was in across Australia from East to West on road. It showed up my small wheeled bikes deficiencies in its inability to carry enough water and tow a trailer off road.
    I'm hopeful this frame may be up to the job.
    If not, I'll consider my options.

  19. #319
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    if that's the case, then your seat height can't be accurate in the above pics.....
    you should be around 76cm or so saddle height from center of bb given your 34" inseam...
    that saddle can't be that high in the above pics.....

  20. #320
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    Quote Originally Posted by johnny the boy View Post
    if that's the case, then your seat height can't be accurate in the above pics.....
    you should be around 76cm or so saddle height from center of bb given your 34" inseam...
    that saddle can't be that high in the above pics.....
    Its after midnight here so I dont want to wake the household going out to the shed.
    I spotted in that linked above thread:
    Quote Originally Posted by rifraf View Post
    I did another measurement from my bottom bracket spindle to the top of my seat
    and got 73cm.
    Its definitely big but I couldnt find anything but conflicting advice from forums and bikeshops.
    It was a throw of the dice and it is what it is.
    I'll have a squiz with a tape measure in the morning and report back
    Currently being pretty chunky and overweight it unfortunately wouldnt surprise me to learn I've the missing 3cm build up of lard on my butt.

  21. #321
    dying hurts.
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    if you have a 73cm seat height...it's way too low for someone with a 34" inseam.
    lift the seat to 75cm and see how it feels...try 76cm..see how that feels...
    from the other thread, at 5'11" with a 34" inseam, you made the right choice with the 20" frame...
    but looking at that above ogre, i never would have guessed someone of your proportions rode it.....
    i think a >70mm stem and a 76cm seat height or so would make you much happier....
    again, this is based on your proportions if you're 5'11" w/ 34" inseam...

  22. #322
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    You might have missed my additional comments added to my above post.
    Definitely 5' 11" and I checked my inseam in that thread by putting a book between my legs with my back against the wall ( I got approx 87.5cm which is 34").
    I get my seat height by putting my heel on the pedal in its 6 O'clock position and pulling the seat as high into my rear as possible. This means I have a small bend at the pedal strokes full extension which is what everything I've read tells me is correct.
    I only had me to do the book measurement so maybe I need to get some assistance trying for a second reading to see if its a shorter inseam than I thought.

    Thanks for all your replies - I'll update as I know more. I'll definitely know about the seat height tomorrow. I'll even try to raise it a bit and see if I can do it with out reaching lockout of my knee at six o'clock.

  23. #323
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    i found when fitting my ogre (18", i'm 5'8", 31" inseem) i kept having to bring my seat up just a bit more for a few days until i finally found the sweet spot.
    I agree though with the bit about wanting a larger frame for commuting/touring duties, which is what my ogre is for.
    Both my Krampus and dedicated roadie are much smaller, more compact frames, but they suits what they are intended for.
    for the record i also run a brooks but i have a 80mm stem. the on-one mary bars pretty much put your hands inline with the steerer tube.

  24. #324
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    Quote Originally Posted by rifraf View Post
    Thanks for all your replies - I'll update as I know more. I'll definitely know about the seat height tomorrow. I'll even try to raise it a bit and see if I can do it with out reaching lockout of my knee at six o'clock.
    Name:  DSC05808.JPG
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    Turns out the post had slipped some.
    When I remeasured the post having redone my heel on pedal and lift saddle to tonsils methodology I found the "Thomson Masterpiece" logo is clearly exposed as opposed to the "on" being buried in the frame as per last pic.
    I've gone for an extra 5mm from what I thought I should and a spin around the section doesnt tell me anything is glaringly wrong.
    I looked at 10mm extra but my knee felt seriously locked and so I dropped down a fraction.
    I now have 10.5 centimeters from the tape measure hitting the front allen key head bolt of the seatpost to the top of the seatpost collar of the frame.

    I've someone coming round to help set up my Rohloff gearchange tomorrow so if its not tipping down with rain (which its looking like) I'll get in a longer ride and can leave some impressions. The biggest impression I'm left with riding around the section is that perched on the Ogre, it seems like a long way to fall so best I dont.
    I'll try for another pubic bone height measurement with someone else using the pen to see if my book marking on the wall (solo) was accurate.
    Last edited by rifraf; 05-25-2013 at 05:57 AM. Reason: pic added

  25. #325
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    Quote Originally Posted by rifraf View Post
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    The biggest impression I'm left with riding around the section is that perched on the Ogre, it seems like a long way to fall so best I dont.
    .
    Haha I had the same impression while on single track the other day. Love the bike. Have big apples on the way for commuting during the week. Now i need to get some cleaning supplies and maintenance supplies for it.

    Thinking about going 1x9 eventually, not sure though. I don't see many excursions on the bike in the near future but who knows

  26. #326
    Unhinged Aussie on a 29er
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    Hahaha... yeah, it's a pretty tall bike, I had similar impressions, but still felt the top tube could be a shade higher & still be comfortable (Kurt Refsnider's 2011 Ride the Divide bike was a custom El Mariachi with a repositioned top tube, to have a larger main triangle at the expense of decreased standover height). I find myself pedaling through corners everywhere without worrying about clipping a pedal on the ground. In the lowest pedal position there's still 5" clearance on my setup... with somewhat narrow pedals it's pretty hard to smack my foot in to the ground.

  27. #327
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    Well its a whisker before 5pm (Sat) and we started on the bike late morning.
    We redid my cabling and added the Rohloff cables. We stuffed an inners length and I can report that a standard gear cable inner appears to be a decent swap. I say standard.... it was an old stock shimano one I managed to find with what appears like a black coating on most of it - no its not rust. Hidden in the depths of my Carry Freedom Y-frame trailer box where I keep things like spares I'm not sure are any good.

    My friend reckons my wheels need to go back to a wheel-builder due to not enough tension on them (he has a meter) and apparently the Rohloff wheel needs particularly high tension on the spokes. God it never ends.......

    Got some oil in the hub, chain retensioned and Oem2 plate moved around so the black external mech box is closer to the 6 O'clock mark. Stem is now torqued up to the right tightness. Grips installed.
    Found the Sram gripshift grips in the trailer looking for a cable.
    Tire pressure checked and set to 30 psi by his floor pump but I want to recheck the pressure as it feels higher.

    High volume tires can be hard on rims I've read, especially older style rims with narrowish inner profile.
    I think the Dyads are 22mm from memory and I've read of them splitting with the Big Apples at 50psi.
    The day flew.
    His impressions of the bike is the cockpit is way too cramped for him whilst I like the fact I'm not too bent forward. I have a bad back and prefer a more upright position.
    We're around the same height within an inch.

  28. #328
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    Hi Gritter,

    Apologies for the delay in responding...I guess I unsubscribed from this post at some point. You have probably already solved your problems at this point so FWIW:

    The sides are 22 inches high. The side panels are split roughly in the middle if I need/want to run it w/lower walls.

    The AL stock is 2" on a side. I just did some fairly accurate measurements of the fittings on the trailer and transferred it to the stock. I thought about tying the walls in to the hoops but didn't see the benefit and it would have been a hassle as you point out.

    Laughing...frankly I don't know how it came out looking square...most stuff I build looks like its out of the Beverly Hillbillies.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gritter View Post
    Nice! Are those sidewalls two feet high? Can you offer any advice on lining up the holes in the wheel hoops for the side panels?

    I tried measuring the holes for the deck, but was off a couple millimeters, and now I'm trying to figure out a better way to line up the holes for the sides. I need a template. Surly sells a template for the fenders and spoke covers, for fifty bucks... I can't figure out how to get measurements from those curved surfaces. I could place the hoops next to the side-panels and "eyeball" it, since the holes don't go all the way through, but there's got to be a better way.

    What size angle stock did you use on the corners? Did you drill the holes, and how did you line them up so well? The top of your trailer looks perfectly square and precise.

    The mighty Ogre was born to pull this trailer.

  29. #329
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    here is a few picks of my ogre its my all around do anything bike and im really loving it so far whether im hitting some off road trail or just cruising around my neighborhood. the list of upgrades includes an xt 2x10 drivetrain , a set of stans flow ex rims wrapped with some Schwalbe Hans Dampf tires and laced to hope pro 2 evo hubs.new specialized grips, also added a set of straitline defacto pedals and some lights front and rear for the night rides. still have some more things i would like to add later on down the road. right now i have my eyes set on a bob trailer so i can start doing some small bike packing trips cant wait.



    surly karate monkey
    surly ogre

  30. #330
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    It's interesting how different the small and large frames look. Mine looks like a 26" in perspective, and that one's like a monster truck!

  31. #331
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    I was just thinking the same thing. Mine looks so different lol, still a damn nice looking bike though! And a 2x10 is on my list also. Still not sure of what wheels I want but I can't afford anything anytime soon anyways

  32. #332
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    Also worth noting the Hans Dampfs are big tires! I have them on my trail bike. So that'll add to the monster truck appearance. Great tires they are, but awfully aggressive for any on-road use!

    Thinking about a pair of Smart Sams for mine - they look like they'd roll well and still take some off-roading too.

  33. #333
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    the tires are a little aggressive for the road but i dont do alot of road riding.
    mainly just to get to one of the closer hike and bike trails by my house or an occasional run to the store and sometimes i ride the road when it has rained and the trails are to wet to ride. for being a rather aggressive tire they actually ride fairly nice on the road. im sure they will wear rather fast if you rode them on the road everyday but for what little i actually do they have been holding up rather well so far.
    surly karate monkey
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  34. #334
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    It was a nice day for a late afternoon ride so I trawled my neighborhood on my Ogre, taking in some sea water views complete with briney odour in the very still air. Slowed for a look at the boats at the local marina and stopped at a monument for a breather and to appreciate the changing light and coming of night.
    Ogre Build Thread-picture-009.jpgOgre Build Thread-picture-022.jpgOgre Build Thread-picture-011.jpgOgre Build Thread-picture-016.jpg

    I've got some 60mm wide Gilles Berthoud polished stainless steel fenders to put on.
    First I've got to get some custom cutting and welding of a Velo Orange Pass Hunter stainless flat mini flat rack to go above the front wheel.
    VO Pass Hunter Front Rack, Stainless Steel - Racks & Decaleurs - Accessories

    The VO rack modification has to come first as it has a strut/stay that goes through the fork crown. The threaded stay end that goes through the crown is what holds the front fender in place.

    It has two other stays that attach to the V-brake bosses.
    These are positioned OK for the Ogre but the crown stay needs to be relocated in a higher position than its in.
    The challange will be to find a local machine shop with the suitable skills to do a "nice" job of it (as I'm a fussy so and so).

    Heres a pic showing the rack supported approximately in position by some paper in front and the two stays sitting on the brake bosses


    Heres a pic of the rack supported in the too high position by the fork crown stay.



    This one show just how much height needs to be dropped


    In this one the rack is sitting on the bosses and paper on tire support.
    you can see the crown hole and the stay that ideally would be going through it.
    That stay will have to be cut and welded into the higher position.

  35. #335
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    How's the Rohloff roll?

  36. #336
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    just a few quick and dirty pics of my Ogre.

    Note i took all the decals off and put the pacer ones on, much nicer font i think. I did that on my Krampus too, only in black, very understated








  37. #337
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    Quote Originally Posted by HelmutHerr View Post
    How's the Rohloff roll?
    Rohloff is rolling fine.
    Its taking some getting used to as its no where near as crisp a shift as I'm used to with the Dualdrive of the Moulton.
    As I'm so used to riding 20' (406) wheels, the 700c's with the big 2.35 tyres seem heavy and ponderous albeit very plush and comfy.
    I find 30psi seems ample and I'm very impressed with the ride of the Big Apples and think the comfort factor is worth the extra effort needed to make them roll.
    Yesterdays ride saw my brake adjustment pan out for the better with no rubbing noises now, but my new tail light seems to have bitten the dust on its first outing and I've a clicking coming through my left pedal it seems which I'll have to find its source and rectify.
    How you getting on with that Alfine? Still enjoying? I wont be going away from hub gears as I'm sold on that low maintenance. I seem to have to take the Moulton in to the shop at least once a year to get the rear derailleur hanger bent back into position due to inadvertent knocks.


    Quote Originally Posted by SteveJfromtheSwitch View Post
    just a few quick and dirty pics of my Ogre.

    Note i took all the decals off and put the pacer ones on, much nicer font i think. I did that on my Krampus too, only in black, very understated
    Steve that bike just keeps looking better and better every time you throw up a pic.
    The new decals look the biz and I really like how your SLX crankset complements the polished "Hoff" hub.
    I use those same XT pedals on the Moulton and for the Ogre I went with the 780's which have clip ins on only one side and flat on the other. I find I dont like being clipped in on technical terrain. Keep remembering my busted ribs from my last fall where I couldn't un-clip in time to put my feet down. Man those fractured rib brought tears to my eyes even when I passed wind.
    Great pedals though (both types) as I love the comfort of the wide platform.
    I'm looking forward to my mini rack and fenders which is when I'll be mounting my Edelux headlight to take advantage of the disk Son28.
    Might take me a few weeks as I'm just about to move houses.

  38. #338
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    thanks mate
    Yes i was deciding between the XT trail pedals and the ones you have. i wanted to try these, i'll probably try them on my krampus to see how i like them, might leave them there and get your pedals. i commute on this alot and like not having to think what side to clip into when stopped at lights.
    I'm also noticing the weight and drag of the Ogre. Last month i've had to commute on my roadie, lightweight, skinny tyres. going back to the heavy Ogre, fat tyres, now dynamo hub & rohloff i'm noticing it. I've just gotten soft, i need to get my fitness up and drop a few kg and all would be good. i'm liking it though, just taking some getting used to. i find the lower gears, ie 7 and belowj a bit off putting, with the whirring and feel i get through the pedals, they just feel "slow", but i'm sure after a few thousand K's on the hub it will loosen up some,
    just gotta take a teaspoon in my coffee and.......well you know the rest

  39. #339
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    Have any of you had these problems with your ogre?

    This is from universal cycles site.


    Universal Cycles -- Surly Ogre Frameset - Black


    "
    Customer Reviews

    Create your own review!

    It rides nice. The bottom bracket shell was very scratched up from poor packing, and there was a lot of rust on and in this frame and fork. Like it had been sitting in a damp warehouse by the sea for many decades. I'm comparing this to a new Surly frame I bought three years prior, which had a much nicer fit and finish.

    This frame needed chasing of the BB threads, whereas my earlier new Surly frame was pristine and needed no chasing. There was rust under the gusset at the downtube/headtube junction, and this area was also bare metal - they didn't try to get any powder coating in there. It's like someone just didn't care. There was surface rust in the brake boss's threads as well.

    I got this frame to run racks and fenders and pull a trailer and run an internal geared hub all at once, but found this to be not as easy to do as advertised. Even though there are extra threaded eyelets everywhere, there's really not a lot of accessories that work with the way they're positioned. I ran into a lot of issues with rear racks obstructing the fender eyelets and vice-versa. My trailer nuts don't work with my chain-tuggs.

    The suspension corrected fork is really long, and makes most front racks sit way too high above the wheel. This is also an issue with fenders, but surly has a blog post that guides you for modifying/customizing some planet bike cascadia fenders to work (probably your only option for fenders with this frame).

    This long fork flexes more than any of my other (5) rigid, steel forks, probably because it's slightly longer. With perfect disc pad alignment, it'll ping the disc as I ride from lateral flexing of the fork's legs.

    The stickers were much harder to remove than my previous new Surly frame, hinting they might have been on there longer and it had been sitting a while before I received it.

    I can see how Surly's quality has diminished in the last three years, and I'm less impressed now. This is the last Surly Frame I'll buy, but I will use it, and do. I ride it a lot. It actually sees more miles than anything else, for some reason. It's just comfortable to ride.

    It's good, it does what it was made to do, I was just bummed about the surface rusting and the lack of paint in the headtube gusset (with rust) and the poor threads that were built up with enough rust to make the threads nasty.

    Would Buy Again: No
    Would Recommend: No

    Reviewed on: May 06, 2013
    Reviewed by: Daniel W., Ohio"

  40. #340
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    I dont think a fair review.

    Surly tell you to face the BB and head tube for bearing and any threads with paint on/in them are going to need chasing.

    My bike had something in the brake boss bolts but I'm not convinced it was rust.
    Appeared more to me like some kind of thread locker which had dried and turned to powder.

    They also recommend treating your frame before assembly - I think linseed oil was mentioned so you know its a potential but treatable issue.

    Knowing which racks in particular didnt work would have been informative but the review is as guilty as it claims Surly is. There is a multitude of racks and fenders out there. Reading the threads and posts in here would surely be a great place to start looking for compatible ones. This is how I discovered my Tubus ones would fit and so make a purchase decision.

    As for fenders, the same as above. I stepping into the unknown with Gilles Berthoud stainless ones but am confident that with some forethought and perhaps some minor customisation I can get them to fit well without poor aesthetics. There is actually a pic of an Ogre with some stainless fenders, so I know its not beyond the realm of possibility.
    Surly has instructions for fitting Cascadia fenders - I mean how much hand holding do you want? Should Surly ride your bike for you as well?

    Having read of rust issues and poor paint in Surlys in other forums from way back, I was prepared. As for the sticker issue, most peoples complaint is they fall off too easy, yet heres someone not happy that they wont fall off? Hmmmmm

    Trailer nut issues? Buy yourself a dremel if your trailer nuts need some more space.
    Theres no shortage of meat you could carve away on Surly Tuggnuts without affecting their bottle opening abilities. Again, no mention about which in particular chain tugs are in use on the bike in question.

    Surely all these issues have been put to bed in the Surly section of this forum.
    I havnt ridden my bike enough yet to have a valid opinion on fork flex and can agree that the frame packaging isnt quite down pat with regards bottom bracket tube potentially getting marked in transit - the rest of the frame packaging was fantastic.
    The green and black seem to me to be pretty easy colours to both match and touch up.

    If you want the perfect frames, I suggest deep pockets and a trip to Co-motion cycles where your hand will be held throughout the entire process. Do be aware you'll be paying around 4-5 times as much.Co-Motion Divide Rohloff

    Course, before you splash out, I'll refer you to the Co-motion Divide thread where an owner compares his frame to a Fargo and posts:

    "I just didn't notice an $1800 difference in ride quality. But it is a beautiful well-thought-out USA made custom frame with a lifetime warranty made by some really nice folks in Oregon and for a lot of people who can afford it, that means a lot. I paid extra to add two sets of eyelets: one for a Topeak Road Morph pump under the TT and another set on the fork for my OMM rack which makes for an incredibly stable and strong rack. "

    LOL - get that? Didnt notice an $1800.00 difference in ride quality.
    Think I'll be sticking with my $535.00 Ogre frame but I'll think about what I can do in the way of upgrades to the frame for $1800.
    I reckon you could buy a fair amount of genuine Surly handholding for that kind of moolah

  41. #341
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    Heres a mock up of my front stainless Gilles Berthoud 60mm fender:







    It looks like I might get to keep my Nagleen 1.5 bottle on the underneath of the downtube.
    Theres not a lot of room but I think theres enough - woo hoo

    I'm still awaiting some stainless hardware so this isnt a final fit.

  42. #342
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    Hello Ogres,

    Please excuse the noob-ness of these questions, but I'm currently building my first bike and am still trying to figure out a few of the technical bits.

    I purchased a 22" Ogre frameset last month and have most of the details worked out except for the chainset. The BB stuff is doing my head in.

    I'm interested in using FSA's F. Gimondi Single Speed Chainset, mostly because it's pretty, but I'm unsure about chainline / chain ring clearance related measurements.

    Surly's specs say it has chainring clearance 26/36/46t.
    (I'm not sure exactly what that means or how to figure that into the equation.)
    The F.Gimondi I am looking at has a 48t sprocket.

    I'm wanting to build the rear wheel with an Alfine 11 Speed which, I've read somewhere, can achieve a ~47.5mm chainline with a reversed Nexus cog (I have read somewhere).

    The FSA recommends a 110mm JIS BB. FSA says the F.Gimondi has a chainline of 45mm (so assuming that's with the 110mm BB).

    If I were to use a 115mm BB would that then place the Gimondi at a 47.5mm chainline?

    If you know how the chainring clearance fits in, is the Gimondi a viable choice for me?

    Thanks you for absolutely any help any of you can be here,
    Brian

  43. #343
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    Quote Originally Posted by brainp View Post
    Hello Ogres,
    The F.Gimondi I am looking at has a 48t sprocket.
    Thanks you for absolutely any help any of you can be here,
    Brian
    Woah,
    What size sprocket? 48T?
    Seems awfully high sounding?
    According to Sheldon Browns gear calculator,
    Sheldon Brown's Bicycle Gear Calculator
    if your using a 48T front ring and a 23 rear sprocket (available Harris Cyclery) Then your gear inches range from 27.9 - 114.
    I assumed 170mm cranks and Ogres wheel standard of 29 inch.

    To give some perspective my Rohloff Ogre uses 29' rims, 170mm cranks, 34T front and 16T rear to offer me 17.2 - 90.4 gear inches.
    Were it within warranty I'd like even slightly lower to match my other bike (16.9) and I never use the highest gears except on very steep downward grades where to be honest I prefer to coast anyway.

    Your going to be pushing your bike up stuff most of us would be riding with those ratios (IMHO) and I doubt with the Ogres heft, you'll be utilising 114inches except verticle drops whilst rushing to meet your maker.


    I'm tired tonight and probably missing something in your post BrainP, but if you have a 45mm chainline with a 110mm BB, when you add 5mm to your chainline by using a 115mm BB then your going to end up with a 50mm chainline.
    I think you either need a 113mm BB
    Shimano UN-73 Bottom Bracket > Components > Drivetrain > Bottom Brackets | Jenson USA Online Bike Shop
    or make up the 2.5mm your concerned about with spacers.
    Maybe something like:
    Wheels MFG W M Chainring Spacers 1 2mm 5 Pieces | eBay

    I'm thinking 113mm bottom bracket would be my call (if thats the correct fitting one for your cranks) bringing you to a 48mm chainline which is within half a millimeter.
    Hope this helps

  44. #344
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    I had a hell of a time finding them, but finally found an outfit that could provide me with some stainless couplers to provide me with a satisfactory spacing between my fork crown and front fender.
    I wasnt quite satisfied with the two 18mm zinc plated ones I initially found in which the above posting of mine shows a mock up of my front end.
    When I added into the mix dropping a tyre size from 2.35 Big Apples to 2.00 Supremes, the gap between the fender and tyre became more pronounced.
    I got some 25mm SS couplers, swapping them from the zinc plated ones for an improved fender line and hopefully rust free (marine quality) fitting of my polished SS Gilles Berthoud fenders.
    Sorry for anyone not familiar with the term couplers. They are just long nuts or connectors depending on your vernacular
    (like 5 Pack M6 X 18 A2 Stainless Threaded BAR HEX ROD Stud Connector DIN 6334 | eBay)

    To fit the rear fender I'm waiting on a package from the UK with some bracketry ie.
    http://www.sjscycles.co.uk/sks-stain...each-prod4388/
    http://www.sjscycles.co.uk/sks-stain...clip-prod8042/

    I've nearly replaced all nut n bolts with marine grade stainless steel in an attempt to keep rust at bay and making swapping out fittings like racks and fenders as painless as possible.

  45. #345
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    Sounds cool! Post some pictures when you have it completed.

  46. #346
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    Surly arnt keen on stands and utilising a Rohloff disk hub means I cant use my favorite
    Welcome to Greenfield Industries, Inc. - Freeport, New York - Quality U.S.A. Die Caster
    as the disk mount is in the way.
    I've just ordered a click-stand:
    Click-Stand The Only Portable Folding Bicycle Kickstand!
    which are like a blind-mans cane or late model tent pole with an elastic center.
    I decided on the Max 6 segment which I understand is an easy fit into my Ortlieb handlebar bag.
    I'll give my impressions when it arrives but lots of cycle tourists swear by them so I thought I'd give one a whirl.
    Bit of a review here: Bicycle Click-Stand Clicks with Me « Palm Beach Bike Tours

    I also ordered another item to add to my Ogres pannier bags which is a Primus Omnifuel stove which I can fit to my current Trangia 27-8 to add multi-fuel burning versatility to an already great little cooking unit.
    Primus OmniLite Ti with 350 ml fuel bottle :: All Stoves :: Stoves :: Cooking :: Moontrail
    Trangia Kk - Trangia Stoves 27 Series UL HA

    The Ogres nearly complete and I can hear the "call of the wild".
    Last edited by rifraf; 08-23-2013 at 11:18 AM. Reason: stove link added

  47. #347
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    Quote Originally Posted by rifraf View Post
    Woah, What size sprocket? 48T? Seems awfully high sounding? According to Sheldon Browns gear calculator Sheldon Brown's Bicycle Gear Calculator if your using a 48T front ring and a 23 rear sprocket (available Harris Cyclery) Then your gear inches range from 27.9 - 114. I assumed 170mm cranks and Ogres wheel standard of 29 inch.

    To give some perspective my Rohloff Ogre uses 29' rims, 170mm cranks, 34T front and 16T rear to offer me 17.2 - 90.4 gear inches. Were it within warranty I'd like even slightly lower to match my other bike (16.9) and I never use the highest gears except on very steep downward grades where to be honest I prefer to coast anyway.

    Your going to be pushing your bike up stuff most of us would be riding with those ratios (IMHO) and I doubt with the Ogres heft, you'll be utilising 114inches except verticle drops whilst rushing to meet your maker.

    I'm tired tonight and probably missing something in your post BrainP, but if you have a 45mm chainline with a 110mm BB, when you add 5mm to your chainline by using a 115mm BB then your going to end up with a 50mm chainline. I think you either need a 113mm BB or make up the 2.5mm your concerned about with spacers.

    I'm thinking 113mm bottom bracket would be my call (if thats the correct fitting one for your cranks) bringing you to a 48mm chain line which is within half a millimeter.
    Hope this helps
    Thanks for all the advice and links rifraf. I got the bike on the road last weekend. I ended up using a 118mm bb spindle (because 115mm were impossible to find in the UK) and got a chain line really close to what I was wanting. (110mm spindle = 45mm chain line, 118mm spindle = 49mm chain line, the length is divided by two as the difference is sticking out both sides of the bb). The Nexus cog reversed gave me a 48-ish mm chain line. It looks perfect from the rear and no noise or grinding with that discrepancy. The 48t chainring, however, only had about 1-2mm of clearance from the chain stay so I decided to downsize to a 42t (with 23 in the rear and 175mm crank arms and Schwalbe 29x2.0 Big Bens) which gives me a perfect gear range (28 - 114 inches) for my riding (mostly road touring in Scotland). It's basically the same as a road triple with 50/39/30 up front and 12-27 in the back.

    Anyway, the 42t gives me a comfortable amount of space from the chain stay.

    I still have a bit of work to get it ready for any touring (mudguards, racks, lighting, etc.) but it is already the most comfortable, balanced and responsive cycle I've ever ridden. This one's going to be around for a while.

  48. #348
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    Quote Originally Posted by brainp View Post
    Thanks for all the advice and links rifraf. I got the bike on the road last weekend. I ended up using a 118mm bb spindle (because 115mm were impossible to find in the UK) and got a chain line really close to what I was wanting. (110mm spindle = 45mm chain line, 118mm spindle = 49mm chain line, the length is divided by two as the difference is sticking out both sides of the bb). The Nexus cog reversed gave me a 48-ish mm chain line. It looks perfect from the rear and no noise or grinding with that discrepancy. The 48t chainring, however, only had about 1-2mm of clearance from the chain stay so I decided to downsize to a 42t (with 23 in the rear and 175mm crank arms and Schwalbe 29x2.0 Big Bens) which gives me a perfect gear range (28 - 114 inches) for my riding (mostly road touring in Scotland). It's basically the same as a road triple with 50/39/30 up front and 12-27 in the back.

    Anyway, the 42t gives me a comfortable amount of space from the chain stay.

    I still have a bit of work to get it ready for any touring (mudguards, racks, lighting, etc.) but it is already the most comfortable, balanced and responsive cycle I've ever ridden. This one's going to be around for a while.
    Hah - knew I was missing something with regards the BB length.
    Usually late at night here in Aussie when I get on the net so often too tired to think straight.
    Glad I didnt put you crook.
    I used a crankset from the UK company Thorn of Thorn Nomad fame.
    They advised me on which BB for Rohloff so I didnt have to put too much thought into it.
    Lucky for me as if I'd relied on the same logic I offered you, I'd be up for another one.
    Anyway my 113mm suited my cranks utilising the middle chainring space with a 34T (also Thorn and reversible) with my "Hoff" rear ring of 16T.
    I have old knees and like my low gearing as I'm too lazy to get off the bike to push up hills.
    I offered that Jensonusa link as they seemed an excellent price for the UN73 BB which I think is a top Shimano model for square tapered BB.
    I'd like a couple of spares for myself.
    I wish I needed something else from them or I cant justify the expensive postage from the States.
    Soon be buying from them another Dyad rim for an Extra-wheel trailer so plan to grab a couple of BB's then if they are still cheap and in stock.
    I bought my frame/rims from them and was very happy with their service.
    I notice the price seems to have gone up by $40 since I bought the frame

  49. #349
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    Folks,
    I am having a hard time adjusting the front BB7 brake with 180mm rotor, it rubs badly even with all the adjustments, so I need help to check if I am using correct IS adapter on my Surly Ogre, I am using IS 20mm from the BB7 kit, seems like this is standard one for the 180mm but am I wrong? Rub is so much that I feel that perhaps, I picked up a wrong IS adapter for the standard Ogre fork? Please advise, trying to finish my build this long weekend but this rubbing issue is just tough, it rubs even when both pad adjusters are backed out. I centered and re-centered several times to no success using this method here Avid BB7 mini resource - How to set up the Avid BB7

  50. #350
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    A few pic from Down Under are over due to bump this thread I reckon.
    Finally got my rear fender on.
    The fitting isnt complete yet as I'm awaiting my Mondials to arrive from Germany.
    I will likely use the Mondials to complete my visual "line" to get a equal gap as possible between my tire and fender.
    Not happy with the two SKS stainless brackets so will either replace these with the next size down or rethink the method of attachment.
    Still looking for someone who can do a good job of stainless welding so I can get my Velo Orange front rack fitted above my Tubus Nova low rider.








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