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Thread: Broken XO Crank

  1. #1
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    Broken XO Crank

    Broke my drive side crank arm today doing some groomed drops at Duthie Hill in WA. Weird that they list them in their free ride category
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Broken XO Crank-highres_191459552.jpeg  


  2. #2
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    Bring it to the shop and have it warrantied. That should be covered.

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    Could you do me a huge favor, and make a bunch of close up pics, before you send it for warranty?

    I would be very interested in this.

    Cheers

    Magura

    EDIT: And of the pedal insert as well, pretty please.
    Last edited by Mr.Magura; 01-01-2013 at 03:05 PM.

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    I'll take some more pics tomorrow. I'm sure it will (should) be covered, the cranks are less than a year old. The damage was all at once, I landed a clean drop onto an easy transition with my right foot back and the cranks parallel to the ground and the insert just popped right through the crank arm. It felt like I broke my peddle spindle. I was really surprised to see that the crank arm had exploded, and thankful that it didn't happen back country!

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by wipp View Post
    I'll take some more pics tomorrow. I'm sure it will (should) be covered, the cranks are less than a year old. The damage was all at once, I landed a clean drop onto an easy transition with my right foot back and the cranks parallel to the ground and the insert just popped right through the crank arm. It felt like I broke my peddle spindle. I was really surprised to see that the crank arm had exploded, and thankful that it didn't happen back country!
    Thanks Wipp.

    That sounds a lot like a manufacturing defect for sure.


    Magura

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    Hope this gets handled. My X0 cranks are doing great so far. Had them over a year now.

    Sent from my Desire HD using Tapatalk 2

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    One more pic

    Here's one more pic. I spoke with SRAM and they are going to replace the part, they were very cool and fast to respond. I'll be swapping back to forged aluminum for my future cranksets, I ride too much back country to risk another failure.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Broken XO Crank-photo.jpg  

    Last edited by wipp; 01-02-2013 at 05:25 PM. Reason: Picture added

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    Ha I've been waiting 2 1/2 weeks on my X0 shifters. Glad this worked out for you man. Lame when something spendy does that, hope it doesn't occur again. That really does seem unusual.

    Consider ordering some crankskins, you seem to ride hard and it looks like your shoes scratched up your cranks real nicely. I know my five ten freeriders were doing that to my X0 cranks and now it isn't an issue. Crank boots by race face are also nice. The bottom of my crank struck a rock, so I got them after that and it has since helped. I don't subscribe to full on skins, I even saw a bike wrapped in helicopter tape once. My bike is proudly scratched, but like your chainstay, I think it is one of those places worth protecting. Keeps it fresh,

    or something.

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    Last edited by ehigh; 01-02-2013 at 07:52 PM.

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    No more pretty parts for me. Keepin' it simple, forged and reasonably cheap to replace. XT/X9 from now on with a little CC bling here and there for color and spice.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by wipp View Post
    No more pretty parts for me. Keepin' it simple, forged and reasonably cheap to replace. XT/X9 from now on with a little CC bling here and there for color and spice.
    Thanks for the pic

    To quit on some of the strongest cranks out there (strength to weight ratio), due to one failure, is a shame if you ask me.....


    Magura

  11. #11
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    Right foot back, landing a groomed jump and the pedal tears out in a downward and inward direction and the crank ends up looking like a car drove onto it. Not saying the crank is unbreakable, but that looks like the crank was driven into something large, hard and muddy, like a log taking out the pedal and the crank. Or maybe a car drove onto it?

    Landing a smooth and simple jump and destroying a top of the food chain crank which you now get replaced and will never use again for fear - I call BS. Smells to high heaven. Just saying.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ridnparadise View Post
    Right foot back, landing a groomed jump and the pedal tears out in a downward and inward direction and the crank ends up looking like a car drove onto it. Not saying the crank is unbreakable, but that looks like the crank was driven into something large, hard and muddy, like a log taking out the pedal and the crank. Or maybe a car drove onto it?

    Landing a smooth and simple jump and destroying a top of the food chain crank which you now get replaced and will never use again for fear - I call BS. Smells to high heaven. Just saying.
    How about you put your tinfoil hat back on, and get back in the cave?


    Magura

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    Incidents like this truly are few and far between.

    Sent from my Desire HD using Tapatalk 2

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    Quote Originally Posted by ehigh View Post
    Incidents like this truly are few and far between.

    Sent from my Desire HD using Tapatalk 2
    Yeah, that's why I've been so interested in it.
    I suspected galvanic corrosion, but that does not seem to be the case.

    It must be a simple void in the layup.


    Magura

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    Out of curiosity, how many cranks how often would you estimate a crank fails because of galvanic corrosion? bike parts, in general-really.

    It still is surprising this happened. OP, if you're going to part out your X0 cranks-let me know; but seriously that doesn't happen twice. I got my X0 drivetrain in July of 2011 and I've beat the high hell out of my cranks and I know a number of other riders with them too. I'd recommend Saint if you were really concerned. X0 usually doesn't do this.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by ehigh View Post
    Out of curiosity, how many cranks how often would you estimate a crank fails because of galvanic corrosion? bike parts, in general-really.
    I'd guesstimate quite a few products suffers this type of failures.
    Often the issue is not even considered, and the end user also often does his part to make the issue worse.
    Currently there is a thread about failing carbon rims here on MTBR.
    I am 99.8% sure that they fail cause people use aluminum nipples.
    Once the nipple head corrodes, at some point the load per mm2 is exceeded.

    I have made carbon cranks in the past (like 15 years ago). Those cranks died a couple of years ago due to galvanic corrosion, since back then I didn't know I had to take that into account.
    Ibis had some Mojo frames loose the nut rivets lately, for the very same reason.

    More on the matter :

    MIL-STD-889B

    Magura

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    I'm all for great CS, but the guy puts **** all over the crank, won't use it again and manages to break it in a way that should not be even slightly possible. No tinfoil hat and no cave - it sounds like ********.

    If you think the XO crank is really that piss-poor Mr Mag, then please enlighten us so we can all avoid buying the product ever. Looks like at least 5 layers of composite have been torn open on the crank - all from landing a smooth jump??? If that's the risk you really take buying the crank, then I may be on the OP's side. Right now I am on SRAM's side, but if they are selling a product with such a manufacturing fault and you can identify that from the pics, then that is negligence and good customer service would be a product recall.

    Sorry for any interest taken.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ridnparadise View Post
    I'm all for great CS, but the guy puts **** all over the crank, won't use it again and manages to break it in a way that should not be even slightly possible. No tinfoil hat and no cave - it sounds like ********.

    If you think the XO crank is really that piss-poor Mr Mag, then please enlighten us so we can all avoid buying the product ever. Looks like at least 5 layers of composite have been torn open on the crank - all from landing a smooth jump??? If that's the risk you really take buying the crank, then I may be on the OP's side. Right now I am on SRAM's side, but if they are selling a product with such a manufacturing fault and you can identify that from the pics, then that is negligence and good customer service would be a product recall.

    Sorry for any interest taken.
    Try some comprehension classes

    Based on wild guessing, you accuse the OP of lying, and thus fraud for asking for a warranty replacement.
    Unless you have exact knowledge of the OP not telling the truth, those are pretty far out accusations.

    I have as far as I can see, not said anything about the crank in question, be that positive or negative, besides that I found it interesting to see the broken part close up, and that it must have been a manufacturing defect, for things to go that bad under normal circumstances.
    There are thousands of those cranks out there, so if they failed left and right, I'm sure we would have heard of it.

    If there is a defect in the layup, composites fails, that's pretty common knowledge, and a common failure mode. This happens to any manufacturer, and that's about all there is to it.
    This goes for just about any high performance part, as the room for minor manufacturing defects gets smaller.


    Magura

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.Magura View Post
    Try some comprehension classes

    Based on wild guessing, you accuse the OP of lying, and thus fraud for asking for a warranty replacement.
    Unless you have exact knowledge of the OP not telling the truth, those are pretty far out accusations.

    I have as far as I can see, not said anything about the crank in question, be that positive or negative, besides that I found it interesting to see the broken part close up, and that it must have been a manufacturing defect, for things to go that bad under normal circumstances.
    There are thousands of those cranks out there, so if they failed left and right, I'm sure we would have heard of it.

    If there is a defect in the layup, composites fails, that's pretty common knowledge, and a common failure mode. This happens to any manufacturer, and that's about all there is to it.
    This goes for just about any high performance part, as the room for minor manufacturing defects gets smaller.


    Magura
    Don't treat me like an idiot Magura. It does not help. Carbon layup is not some hit or miss process. If you are saying a pedal spindle tearing out under normal riding circumstances is a fault that can happen to any carbon manufacturer, I disagree. It's like saying a car's fuel tank rupturing in a 40kph rear end impact is an acceptable manufacturing fault, or like giving the wrong dose of a drug and hurting a patient is acceptable as long as it only happens occasionally.

    You seem to be very comfortable that a top of the line part could fail due to chance in the manufacturing process. Having minor cracks appear in a composite layup is possible where the effects of prolonged use accentuate stresses in one area in a way that may not show during testing. This is different. What's your personal issue here - is the OP your mate?

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    Personally I think the cranks failed from taking occasional peddle strikes in rock gardens and technical sections. There are a few blemishes on the bottom side of the crank arm but I think that the combination of peddle strikes and a slight flaw in manufacturing probably led to a stress fracture that I didn't catch or could see durring normal maintenance.

    I also suspect that because they were run on a hardtail vs a FS bike, whatever flaw they had or that was put upon them by yours truly in the course of normal (re: aggressive) riding in our local bike park accelerated the cranks demise.

    Long story short: I was stunned at first that they broke, I've always had very good luck with SRAM parts. SRAM came through right away with a fix (thank you) and my Yelli Screamy is now happily running forged aluminum cranks again. In retrospect I think running carbon cranks was a total weight weenie move on my part when I know that through a year of aggressive riding my cranks are usually full of battle scars from rock and peddle strikes. I'n my eyes, it's just not a good application for carbon. If I were to run them again I would definitely grab some of those rubber crank boots from RaceFace and protect them with some helo tape.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ridnparadise View Post
    Don't treat me like an idiot Magura. It does not help. Carbon layup is not some hit or miss process. If you are saying a pedal spindle tearing out under normal riding circumstances is a fault that can happen to any carbon manufacturer, I disagree. It's like saying a car's fuel tank rupturing in a 40kph rear end impact is an acceptable manufacturing fault, or like giving the wrong dose of a drug and hurting a patient is acceptable as long as it only happens occasionally.

    You seem to be very comfortable that a top of the line part could fail due to chance in the manufacturing process. Having minor cracks appear in a composite layup is possible where the effects of prolonged use accentuate stresses in one area in a way that may not show during testing. This is different. What's your personal issue here - is the OP your mate?
    Carbon layup is a manual process, so yes, errors do occur, just like they do in hospitals, where again it's a human factor.
    I happen to both engineer and manufacture composite parts. Even the parts we X-ray can have hidden flaws.

    As for the rest, look up some composite engineering basics.

    My personal issue is the brain dead accusations (based on nothing but wild guessing and a general wish to discredit other people), that some idiot has to put forward, every single time somebody posts about broken parts.
    In this case that idiot was you.
    It's getting old.......


    Magura

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    Quote Originally Posted by wipp View Post
    Personally I think the cranks failed from taking occasional peddle strikes in rock gardens and technical sections. There are a few blemishes on the bottom side of the crank arm but I think that the combination of peddle strikes and a slight flaw in manufacturing probably led to a stress fracture that I didn't catch or could see durring normal maintenance.

    I also suspect that because they were run on a hardtail vs a FS bike, whatever flaw they had or that was put upon them by yours truly in the course of normal (re: aggressive) riding in our local bike park accelerated the cranks demise.

    Long story short: I was stunned at first that they broke, I've always had very good luck with SRAM parts. SRAM came through right away with a fix (thank you) and my Yelli Screamy is now happily running forged aluminum cranks again. In retrospect I think running carbon cranks was a total weight weenie move on my part when I know that through a year of aggressive riding my cranks are usually full of battle scars from rock and peddle strikes. I'n my eyes, it's just not a good application for carbon. If I were to run them again I would definitely grab some of those rubber crank boots from RaceFace and protect them with some helo tape.
    It's a pity you live on the wrong side of the pond.
    I'd sure have found it interesting to figure this out, but that's hard to do when I can't get the part.

    Pedal strikes could be part of the reason, but they really don't look all that beat up?


    Magura

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    My X0 carbon cranks have taken a lot of jaw clenching strikes on some rock gardens but I don't worry about them.

  25. #25
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    Pardon the interruption........ What's the rusty red stuff on your bash ring?

  26. #26
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    I've seen 2 sets of these break locally (all the DH ones), and there is a pic in pinkbikes broken parts photos this month of another broken set. I think they should be fine for XC/Trail but using them for DH doesn't seem to be the best idea...

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    I was wondering about that too. There were a lot of downed trees across the trail that day and I think a trail crew was tagging downed trees that were to be cut. That's my story and I'm sticking with it.

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    in Leicestershire, United Kingdom - photo by Big-daves-remedy - Pinkbike

    Looks a little different but close enough. I think the biggest problem is that SRAM rates these as "Downhill" and they're not. They really need a XO level downhill/enduro/free-ride aluminum crank that can take multiple high impact hits and uses the same splined system for multiple or single ring set-ups.

  29. #29
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    Interesting.

    Good luck with your replacement cranks.

  30. #30
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    I too am a composites specialist and the first photo in this thread is very telling. Like Mr.Magura I like to figure out why a failure occurs.

    At the failure point there is de-lamination which indicates layup voids and or material contamination. With these items made in a fast pace work shop I can see shortcuts being made at several levels.

    On the second photo at entry #7, the pedal insert completely separated from the composite. Mr.Magura may be correct, galvanic reaction - the aluminum corrodes due to an electrical current between the aluminum and carbon. This breaks the bond between the two. I don't see any measures to insulate the carbon from the aluminum.

    The photo in #28 looks the same - complete insert separation.

    No aircraft quality work on this stuff!

    Wipp you are correct, pre-impacts would weaken and compromise the part before the big impact and it's demise. Especially upon water ingress in the pedal insert area.

    You are lucky you physically came out without a scratch.

    These products are more than strong enough for downhill, but cannot take the kind of repeated strikes that aluminum can.

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    Just sent a set back for a different faliure, I had the non drive side crank crack and seperate all around the alloy insert that connects to the axle (through bb). 95kg rider on a hardtail, hopefully will be sorted through warrenty quickly. Cranks are 2 months old.

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    95K + hardtail seems to be the the magic formula for those cranks!

    Quote Originally Posted by thrower78 View Post
    Just sent a set back for a different faliure, I had the non drive side crank crack and seperate all around the alloy insert that connects to the axle (through bb). 95kg rider on a hardtail, hopefully will be sorted through warrenty quickly. Cranks are 2 months old.

  33. #33
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    Broken XO Crank

    I STRONGLY advise not to purchase . See the reviews on chain reaction
    SRAM X01 11 Speed Crankset | Chain Reaction Cycles


    UPDATE AND EDIT:
    I emailed SRAM and got an instant response that they would be in touch with CRC regarding my issue. AMAZING SRAM CUSTOMER SERIVCE.

    Also had a further response from CRC, saying that as a 'gesture of good will' they will give me vouchers to the value of the chainring. AMAZING CHAINREACTION CUSTOMER SERIVCE (just took them a while to come around to my predicament).
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Broken XO Crank-screen-shot-2014-07-03-21.19.54.jpg  

    Broken XO Crank-screen-shot-2014-07-03-21.19.46.jpg  

    Last edited by deanopatoni; 07-04-2014 at 12:52 PM.

  34. #34
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    It says "11 speed crankset". Does it really matter how many speeds are on the rear if it has 1 speed up front that you plan to use on a 1x10?

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    Broken XO Crank

    Incredible. First time seeing this thread. I didn't know this was a problem with the SRAM carbon crank.

    gnar, you can use this crank for whatever. Doesn't have to be 1x11. In fact, this crank is the same exact crank that SRAM has been using for years on their 2x10 X0 systems. Even the XX1 crank is the same exact thing (this also includes the SRAM 2200 crank that comes on Specialized bikes). Exact same crank every time, just different paint job.

    I've had 3 of these cranks now on a variety of bikes. I've never had one break on me and I live in a very rocky area. I always use the Race Face crank boots. Always. I usually have to put new ones on halfway through the season as I eventually tear right through them with multiple pedal strikes. I also weigh 225lbs. I'm hard on my equipment. I guess I'll consider myself lucky from now on as these cranks have been perfect for me thus far.

  36. #36
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    I think it's important to note that broken carbon is increasingly less common as time goes by. They would not spec downbill and AM bikes with carbon now if it wasn't tough. Bike companies put their reputation on the line for it.
    My buddy's aluminum Yeti frame crack near the bottom bracket recently. No wrecks or anything. Just cracked. So all material can fail.

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    I know this is a older thread but thought I would add a little to it.
    I broke these XO cranks 2 weeks ago.
    They are 2 years old and I have ridden them about once a week.
    I have them on a fully rigid Black Cat 29er.
    It turns out my right heel wore through the carbon so thin that it caused them to snap.
    This was during a short track race in Portland. I am lucky because 4 days prior I had been riding Tiger Mtn near Seattle and if they had snapped on one of the DH sections I may not be typing this.
    XO by gearlessinseattle, on Flickr

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    ^ That sucks, man. Glad you're okay. I imagine these cranks take more of a beating on a fully rigid bike like this.

  39. #39
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    O Snap!

    Do you have a pic of the non drive side arm? Is it worn like the DS arm? I'm just curious to see how worn the crank arm is. I have an XX1 crank and my shoes do rub the arms.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LARRYJO View Post
    I know this is a older thread but thought I would add a little to it.
    I broke these XO cranks 2 weeks ago.
    They are 2 years old and I have ridden them about once a week.
    I have them on a fully rigid Black Cat 29er.
    It turns out my right heel wore through the carbon so thin that it caused them to snap.
    This was during a short track race in Portland. I am lucky because 4 days prior I had been riding Tiger Mtn near Seattle and if they had snapped on one of the DH sections I may not be typing this.
    XO by gearlessinseattle, on Flickr
    Hi would you be interested in selling the left crank arm?

  41. #41
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    Amazing failures. Seriously, SRAM? I thought these cranks were awesome until I recently discovered that the pedal insert on drive side XX1 crank is loose. Not riding the bike until I get the crank replaced - but really lost confidence in SRAM carbon cranks.

  42. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.Magura View Post
    Yeah, that's why I've been so interested in it.
    I suspected galvanic corrosion, but that does not seem to be the case.

    It must be a simple void in the layup.


    Magura
    Galvanic corrosion would never result in this kind of failure. I'm steering more towards bad layup...
    "The ONLY person who needs to race.....is the entrant"

  43. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by GnarBrahWyo View Post
    I think it's important to note that broken carbon is increasingly less common as time goes by. They would not spec downbill and AM bikes with carbon now if it wasn't tough. Bike companies put their reputation on the line for it.
    My buddy's aluminum Yeti frame crack near the bottom bracket recently. No wrecks or anything. Just cracked. So all material can fail.

    I have never seen an early 90's XT or XTR crank cracked. BITD, only a few light Al cranks cracked: Grafton, Topline, Kooka. The Shimano stuff was always and still is rock solid. I won't be buying anymore SRAM carbon cranks.

  44. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by klasse View Post
    I have never seen an early 90's XT or XTR crank cracked. BITD, only a few light Al cranks cracked: Grafton, Topline, Kooka. The Shimano stuff was always and still is rock solid. I won't be buying anymore SRAM carbon cranks.
    I've seen plenty of aluminum cranks, frames, chainstays bars etc. that have cracked. Buddy of mine rides downhill and has cracked numerous aluminum components too. Don't buy if you don't want to but the pros wouldn't rock carbon and it wouldn't be sold on top spec bikes if ithey were made out of glass.

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    Quote Originally Posted by GnarBrahWyo View Post
    I've seen plenty of aluminum cranks, frames, chainstays bars etc. that have cracked. Buddy of mine rides downhill and has cracked numerous aluminum components too. Don't buy if you don't want to but the pros wouldn't rock carbon and it wouldn't be sold on top spec bikes if ithey were made out of glass.
    Please show me a cracked XTR, XT or even LX crank from the early 90's. We'll wait.

  46. #46
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    Holy smokes, I have these on both my bikes. Never even thought about it being a weak point. Dayum!

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