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  1. #1
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    Specialized 142+ rear hub

    I just ordered a 2011 Specialized Epic 29er Expert EVO R and understand that the stock Formula hub is not very good (poor engagement and heavy). I intend to build up a race wheelset and use the stock one for training. Here's where the problem comes in. Since Specialized uses their own 142+ which places the cassette 2mm farther out on the hub, I don't want to adjust the rear der. when I switch back and forth. Has anyone withe the new Epic come up with a solution to this? Can you space the cassette farther out on an aftermarket hub to match the 142+? The only soution that I can come up with is to spring for the high end Rovals which I really don't want to do since I am a bigger guy and am worried about durability. They are also a lot of $$$

    Thanks in advance for the advice,
    Jeff
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  2. #2
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    you cant space out the cassette - the lock ring will not catch
    might want to change the hub in the stock wheelset
    or buy a better training set if you are a big guy it is only a matter of time before you taco the front wheel
    sorry to be a downer
    SJ
    I am slow therefore I am

  3. #3
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    I am/had the same issue. My race wheels are a set of I9 ultra lights, so I ended up ordering a set of the Roval Control SL carbon wheels.

    I bought I9s 142+ adapter for the ultra lishts, but like you stated it was a pain to adjust the rear derailleur and rear brake.
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  4. #4
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    still waiting on my 135 carbon rovals
    already have a 142 adapter for them
    my other rims are 19 classics with alpine 3 spokes and flow rims
    heavy but bullet proof
    I also like to just toss on a different set of wheels and go

    SJ
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  5. #5
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    Sorry to threadjack but all this talk about the stock wheelset being soft has me a little concerned!

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by abbeytrails
    All this talk about the stock wheelset being soft has me a little concerned!

    Yeah same here

    I was hoping to get away with the stock wheelset for one season, then upgrade next year when there are more options for 142. With all the talk about these wheels being heavy, weak, and having poor engagement, I'm starting to rethink that strategy.

    Does anyone want to buy a stock wheelset...REAL CHEAP???
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    I have a 29er comp and plan on using the stock set up. I even have a spare rear hub (thanks Slowerjoe) in the event of rear hub problems. I would love a sweet $400.00 rear hub but not in the cards at this time. Any way Specialized tec department told me the stock rear hub is made by Joy-tech. If you look at Halo hubs they look the same as well. Specialized clams a 10 degree engagement on the stock hub and that is what I have been riding so the stock hub should serve me fine if it proves to be durable. I have been trying to find a upgrade to the freehub on the stock hub but no luck so far. Hopefully more manufactures will come out with a 12x142+ . Now if the snow would just melt outside my door I could ride my bike instead of just talk about it

  8. #8
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    I am not a wheel expert but I would think the stock wheel should provide at lease some level of longevity. I have very few miles on my stock epic 29er wheels but when I first got the bike I re-tensioned the front wheel and on the rear I removed each nipple and lubed the threads then basically rebuilt it. My stock spoke tension was very low and I am sure if I rode the wheels that way I would experience problems after only a few hundred miles. Also if you look at the link below the Halo hubs look just like the Specialized stock 12x142+ hubs and they give simple directions on how to lube the freehub. May help the hub last a bit longer.

    http://www.halorims.com/halo-halorims_techinfo.php

  9. #9
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    Lots of talk about the stock wheels and hubs that come on the Specialized epic 29er. I believe all the models except the S-works is equiped with the same set up. I am not a expert but I think if your spokes are correctly tensioned and relieved the hoops and spokes should give resonalbe service. (don’t trust the factory build) The rear hub may need more attention in order to get good longjevity out of it. I took it apart and this is what I found

    This is what the axel looks like. It spins on two cartrige bearings


    This is the freehub end with the cartridge bearing removed



    I had to made a special tool to remove the freehub. This is what it looks like. It has 15 pts of engagement



    The hub only has two pawls or what ever they are called. They are easely removed and could be replaced




    The freehub runs on 27 little individual ball bearings towards the center of the hub and 25 to the outside


    The hub is easy to get apart to repalce the cartridge bearings. The freehub ball bearings are ease as well but you do need to get/make the correct tool. Once again I am no expert but if anyone wants this rear hub to last I would think it need to be kept clean and well lubed. Thanks again SlowerJoe for the spare. Hope I don’t need it but it is nice to have.




    If any one know of a way to upgrade this freehub please let me know. I did not remove the freehub from the hub as I do not have the corect allen. It takes a large allen from the non drive side I believe.

    Sweet……….


  10. #10
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    I'm converting a Hope II hub for the 142+ through axle. I'm told this is going to work, but can't say if it is or not. I have some doubts from some photos I have seen.

  11. #11
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    Just got my Epic. The rear hub is crap. I was planning on building a set of race wheels as well. I may just order a second DT 240 rear hub and rebuild the rear wheel of the stock set with that instead of trying to screw around with derailleur and brake adjustments all the time. I'd love a set of carbon Rovals to race on, but I just spent all my money on the bike. No more for $1500 wheels... shame
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  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by jrob1775
    I just ordered a 2011 Specialized Epic 29er Expert EVO R and understand that the stock Formula hub is not very good (poor engagement and heavy). I intend to build up a race wheelset and use the stock one for training. Here's where the problem comes in. Since Specialized uses their own 142+ which places the cassette 2mm farther out on the hub, I don't want to adjust the rear der. when I switch back and forth. Has anyone withe the new Epic come up with a solution to this? Can you space the cassette farther out on an aftermarket hub to match the 142+? The only soution that I can come up with is to spring for the high end Rovals which I really don't want to do since I am a bigger guy and am worried about durability. They are also a lot of $$$

    Thanks in advance for the advice,
    Jeff

    I'm leaning towards Industry Nine. From what I read they are incredible wheels and have all kinds of color options. Does anyone have any expirience with Industry Nine?

    J.
    Specialized BG FIT Master Technician

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lafawnduh
    I had to made a special tool to remove the freehub.
    I have a Specialized Hi Lo rear hub on my Stumpjumper (see here). Apart from the axle (mine it's QR) it looks very similar to yours. After 100 miles the freewheel developed a clunking sound, so I'd like to disassemble it and see what's going on. What's the tool you made to remove the freehub? Any idea about the noise I'm hearing? Thank you.

  14. #14
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    I had to turn this tool down and remove two of the teeth. I did it by hand on a belt sander. Good luck!

    http://cgi.ebay.com/PARK-FR-8-BMX-Fr...item2eaf072676

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    Quote Originally Posted by jrob1775
    I'm leaning towards Industry Nine. From what I read they are incredible wheels and have all kinds of color options. Does anyone have any expirience with Industry Nine?

    J.
    I just got a set of wheels from Project 321 (front wheel is a Lefty hub) - the rear wheel uses a custom shell but the internals are industry nine. The engagement is instant, so it gets a big thumbs up from me. Only potential downside is how loud they are - definitely no stealth mode on the trail if you are coasting. I don't have any meaningful ride time on them yet and I certainly can't give any long term durability report, but the hubs themselves are beautiful

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lafawnduh
    I had to turn this tool down and remove two of the teeth. I did it by hand on a belt sander. Good luck!

    http://cgi.ebay.com/PARK-FR-8-BMX-Fr...item2eaf072676
    Uhm... I guess I'll take the wheel to a mechanic

    Thank you

  17. #17
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    As already stated, the stock hub is junk, engagement is terrible.

    It blows my mind that Specialized would spec $4,000 plus bikes with such a crappy hub.

    I'm looking to build up some race rims as well, I don't have the money for the Rovals so I'm interested here feedback about other options.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by dpastore22
    It blows my mind that Specialized would spec $4,000 plus bikes with such a crappy hub.
    I'm actually not surprised. All the big manufacturers do it. Save money in places that people don't notice until they've purchased the bike and ridden it a bunch of times so you can put shinier things in places where they do. Look at the drivetrain on the Expert 29ers... X0 rear mech and crank x7 front mech, and x9 shifter, with an XT cassette.
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  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by PAmtbiker
    I'm actually not surprised. All the big manufacturers do it. Save money in places that people don't notice until they've purchased the bike and ridden it a bunch of times so you can put shinier things in places where they do. Look at the drivetrain on the Expert 29ers... X0 rear mech and crank x7 front mech, and x9 shifter, with an XT cassette.
    I totally understand trying to meet certain price points, but as you pointed some of these parts make no sense!

    The KMC chain is junk, I litterally blew 2 links on it after my 3rd ride. The crank on all the Epic 29ers including the Sworks looks low budget and as I mentioned the hub engagnement sux.

    The worst part is, I LOVE my Carbon Comp. The brain is amazing!!! I would've spent more money for upgrades in these areas, but there really not there with the Expert model.

    Just my 2 cents! back to hub options

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by PAmtbiker
    I'm actually not surprised. All the big manufacturers do it. Save money in places that people don't notice until they've purchased the bike and ridden it a bunch of times so you can put shinier things in places where they do. Look at the drivetrain on the Expert 29ers... X0 rear mech and crank x7 front mech, and x9 shifter, with an XT cassette.
    Actually, if it were an XT cassette, that would be OK. The one spec'd on the website is the HG81, which best as I can tell is an SLX-grade cassette. That said, upgrading any one of those parts isn't too expensive. And honestly, they all perform reasonably well. Whereas, having the stock rear hub be such a low quality component is really not acceptable since having the rear hub fail doesn't just mean buying a new rear hub, but having the entire rear wheel rebuilt as well.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by TurnerConvert
    Actually, if it were an XT cassette, that would be OK. The one spec'd on the website is the HG81, which best as I can tell is an SLX-grade cassette. That said, upgrading any one of those parts isn't too expensive. And honestly, they all perform reasonably well. Whereas, having the stock rear hub be such a low quality component is really not acceptable since having the rear hub fail doesn't just mean buying a new rear hub, but having the entire rear wheel rebuilt as well.
    True... but since most of us who want race wheels can't afford the rovals, I think a lot of people are going to end up ditching the stock hub and rebuilding with another 142x12 hub so we don't have to deal with adjustments every time we swap wheels.

    On another note, someone should start collecting the hubs when people pull them off then send a shipping crate full of them back to specialized... it would be kinda funny...
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  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by PAmtbiker
    True... but since most of us who want race wheels can't afford the rovals, I think a lot of people are going to end up ditching the stock hub and rebuilding with another 142x12 hub so we don't have to deal with adjustments every time we swap wheels.

    On another note, someone should start collecting the hubs when people pull them off then send a shipping crate full of them back to specialized... it would be kinda funny...
    Just what I was thinking! They may get the point.?

  23. #23
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    To all of you that are complaining about less than optimal parts coming on your bike, remember that it's ALL ABOUT PRICE POINT. I can see it from both ends since I own an Expert EVO R 29er and am a Specialized dealer. I got my bike today and just finished taking off the parts that I am not going to use:
    wheels
    cassette
    seatpost
    saddle
    stem
    These will all be replaced with lighter parts and the ones I like and trust and will give me the best performace, durability, and weight. Specialized could have put better parts on their Expert level bikes, but the price would go up. Then customers would complain about high MSRP. Remember, This is not just a Specialized thing either. I had a $5700.00 Cervelo that came with a $300.00 wheel set. In today's market, product manufacturers are picking the best parts for a given price point. If you want all the best parts them spring for the S-Works, but don't complain about the high price tag. Remember, you get what you pay for.
    Specialized BG FIT Master Technician

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by jrob1775
    If you want all the best parts them spring for the S-Works, but don't complain about the high price tag. Remember, you get what you pay for.
    If you get the 26" 2011 S-Works Epic then you still have to replace the wheels, even with the high price tag.

    Sworks Epics in Action
    .

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by WR304
    If you get the 26" 2011 S-Works Epic then you still have to replace the wheels, even with the high price tag.

    Sworks Epics in Action
    .
    I'm not sure what your point is. You are quoting a conversation about Stumpjumper FSR not EPIC. The wheels that come on the S-Works Epic are incredible whhels! Unfortunately, I.m nt sure they would hold up in the long run under my 200 lbs. I ended up going for Industry Nine XC29 wheels. They should hold up as a dual purpose race/training wheel and give me great performance. Plus the will have a huge bling factor!
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  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by jrob1775
    I'm not sure what your point is. You are quoting a conversation about Stumpjumper FSR not EPIC. The wheels that come on the S-Works Epic are incredible whhels! Unfortunately, I.m nt sure they would hold up in the long run under my 200 lbs. I ended up going for Industry Nine XC29 wheels. They should hold up as a dual purpose race/training wheel and give me great performance. Plus the will have a huge bling factor!
    Sorry, the post was #29 from this thread discussing the wheels of the 2011 26" S-Works Epic.

    Sworks Epics in Action

    The point being that the wheels on the 2011 26" S-Works Epic aren't top of the range. They feature alloy Roval rims instead of the carbon fibre Roval rims. The alloy Roval wheels on the 2011 26" S-Works Epic also weigh more than the alloy Roval Control SL wheels which came on the 2009 and 2010 26" S-Works Epic.

    If you truly want the lightest top of the range 26" Roval carbon fibre wheels for your 2011 26" S-Works Epic then you have to buy them seperately because they're not standard.

    http://www.specialized.com/us/en/bc/...jsp?spid=57939

    .

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by WR304
    Sorry, the post was #29 from this thread discussing the wheels of the 2011 26" S-Works Epic.

    Sworks Epics in Action

    The point being that the wheels on the 2011 26" S-Works Epic aren't top of the range. They feature alloy Roval rims instead of the carbon fibre Roval rims. The alloy Roval wheels on the 2011 26" S-Works Epic also weigh more than the alloy Roval Control SL wheels which came on the 2009 and 2010 26" S-Works Epic.

    If you truly want the lightest top of the range 26" Roval carbon fibre wheels for your 2011 26" S-Works Epic then you have to buy them seperately because they're not standard.

    http://www.specialized.com/us/en/bc/...jsp?spid=57939

    .
    Good point, but the "get what you pay for" still holds true. If the Rovals with carbon rims were on the bike, then the price would be higher. You see it many times in the idustry that bikes are down speced from the previous year. This is so there is not as much sticker shock when you see the prices on the new model. Some times inflation climbs quicker than what the product managers think the market will bear. That is when you see down specs. It does not mean you are getting less value. Margins on any retail product have to be at a certain level for a business to sustain itself. If you want to complain about prices, then complain about the economy in general. Just don't do it on a mountain bike forum.
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  28. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by jrob1775
    Good point, but the "get what you pay for" still holds true. If the Rovals with carbon rims were on the bike, then the price would be higher. You see it many times in the idustry that bikes are down speced from the previous year. This is so there is not as much sticker shock when you see the prices on the new model. Some times inflation climbs quicker than what the product managers think the market will bear. That is when you see down specs. It does not mean you are getting less value. Margins on any retail product have to be at a certain level for a business to sustain itself. If you want to complain about prices, then complain about the economy in general. Just don't do it on a mountain bike forum.
    I agree with that. I was just pointing out that even the 2011 S-Works bikes aren't immune from cost cutting as they don't necessarily have the best parts as standard.

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by herothedog
    I'm converting a Hope II hub for the 142+ through axle. I'm told this is going to work, but can't say if it is or not. I have some doubts from some photos I have seen.
    Don't confuse the nomenclature. You're converting a Hope II hub for the X-12 142 through axle. Hope doesn't build a 142+ compatible hub. The "+" being the differentiation here.

    As for the corner cutting on Specialized's part, I have the Epic S-Works 29er and they advertise it as having XX chainrings. It doesn't.

    As for the carbon wheels. I'm not worried about them holding up under me and I'm a 200+ lber.

    Specialized definitely needs to step up with an EL level wheel like they specced on the Marathon 29er last year with the DT compatible hub and the "+" spacing.

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by goneskiian
    As for the corner cutting on Specialized's part, I have the Epic S-Works 29er and they advertise it as having XX chainrings. It doesn't.
    Yes on specialized.com it does say that in the "features" but then again it doesn't in the "technical specifications" and the picture of the bike.

    Can't hurt to call specialized and say something about it.

  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by GTR2ebike
    Yes on specialized.com it does say that in the "features" but then again it doesn't in the "technical specifications" and the picture of the bike.

    Can't hurt to call specialized and say something about it.
    Yup. Just pointing it out as an example that they even cost cut on their S-Works models. Granted, SRAM doesn't make a XX chain ring set in the ratio that's been specced for the S-Works 29er.

  32. #32
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    Yeah, the S-Works are still cutting corners since the frameset comes with the stock "HI-Lo" rear hub. According to my digital scale it weighs 364 grams and has shotty engagement.

  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lafawnduh
    Lots of talk about the stock wheels and hubs that come on the Specialized epic 29er. I believe all the models except the S-works is equiped with the same set up. I am not a expert but I think if your spokes are correctly tensioned and relieved the hoops and spokes should give resonalbe service. (don’t trust the factory build) The rear hub may need more attention in order to get good longjevity out of it. I took it apart and this is what I found

    This is what the axel looks like. It spins on two cartrige bearings
    Once you removed the two 17mm lock nuts on the freehub side, did you have to tap or hammer the axle out? Or remove another locking nut somewhere?

    I can remove the two locknuts on the free hub side but the axle won't come out. I have lightly tapped on the axel but don't want to start hammering unless I am sure there are no other lock nuts to be removed.

    Thanks!!!
    Last edited by bikeguy0; 03-06-2011 at 06:58 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by erichwic
    Yeah, the S-Works are still cutting corners since the frameset comes with the stock "HI-Lo" rear hub. According to my digital scale it weighs 364 grams and has shotty engagement.
    Non of the S-Works Epics come with the Joytech hub. If it's either the 26 with the Alloy rimed roval wheel or the 29 with carbon wheel they both have the guts of the DT star ratchet hubs like the 240.

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    bikeguyO, I used a wooden mallet to tap the drive side after the nuts are removed. I believe you are doing it correct, you just need to hit it harder. The drive side bearing is more difficult. Let me know if you need help with that one. I don’t know the recommended way to remove it but what I did was quite simple. When you have the bearings out pull off the seals and re-grease. The stock grease looked very weak.

  36. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by dpastore22
    The crank on all the Epic 29ers including the Sworks looks low budget and as I mentioned the hub engagnement sux.
    No the crank is the S-Works OS carbon crank. I don't believe anyone thinks this is a low budget crank...

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    I built up a set of XTR hubs for my epic (142+rear) on Stans Crest Rims. I may be looking to sell them though because I want black nipples and these guys have red ones, (petty I know). They have been great and a def improvement over the Epic Expert 29er stock build! Let me know if anyone is interested!

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    Quote Originally Posted by matt3542
    I built up a set of XTR hubs for my epic (142+rear) on Stans Crest Rims. I may be looking to sell them though because I want black nipples and these guys have red ones, (petty I know). They have been great and a def improvement over the Epic Expert 29er stock build! Let me know if anyone is interested!
    matt3542 I'd be interested in those wheels. What do you think you want for them? How many miles so far?

  39. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by jrob1775
    Yeah same here

    I was hoping to get away with the stock wheelset for one season, then upgrade next year when there are more options for 142. With all the talk about these wheels being heavy, weak, and having poor engagement, I'm starting to rethink that strategy.

    Does anyone want to buy a stock wheelset...REAL CHEAP???
    See below for my experience with the stock hubs. I pretty much only rode gravel roads for the first two months I had the bike because the trails were all snowed in. After a couple of "real" rides, the engagement got even worse than stock (hard to imagine, I know), but only on an intermittent basis. After a couple more rides, there were some funny sounds coming from the rear hub. Took the cassette off and a few large pieces dropped to the floor and a whole lot of ball bearings fell out. Massive disappointment! I as already planning to get new wheels to remedy the engagement issue, but I was shocked to find the thing fell apart within a few hundred miles of easy riding.

    I replaced mine with Industry 9s with Arch rims. Love'em!! Highly recommend them! And they fit on easily, just a minor adjustment to the derailleur and I've been pedaling happily ever since.

    I decided to go with I9s (standard 12x142 instead of Specialized's proprietary 142+) instead of Roval Carbons so I don't feel locked into Specialized for my next bike. I really, really like my Specialized Epic Expert 29er, but it's probably not the last bike I will ever buy. The next bike could very well be a Specialized, but maybe not. I decided I9s were more portable to the next bike. The I9s are very modular and configurable, so I see them as an investment that will last for many years, from one bike to the next.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Specialized 142+ rear hub-specialized-rear-hub-breakage-105_6241-cropped-resized.jpg  

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    Anyone know if there is a way to convert the stock 142+ wheel back to a normal 135 rear hub?

    Like many others, I replaced my Specialized wheels and now they are just sitting around. They probably have very little resale, so it would be great if I could at least convert is an use the wheels on my singlespeed or something.
    [

  41. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by KonaSS
    Anyone know if there is a way to convert the stock 142+ wheel back to a normal 135 rear hub?

    Like many others, I replaced my Specialized wheels and now they are just sitting around. They probably have very little resale, so it would be great if I could at least convert is an use the wheels on my singlespeed or something.
    No there is not. The "+" means the hub shell is wider than a standard hub. I'm thinking of gutting my 142+ hub and making it into a wind chime or something...
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  42. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by MultiRider
    See below for my experience with the stock hubs. I pretty much only rode gravel roads for the first two months I had the bike because the trails were all snowed in. After a couple of "real" rides, the engagement got even worse than stock (hard to imagine, I know), but only on an intermittent basis. After a couple more rides, there were some funny sounds coming from the rear hub. Took the cassette off and a few large pieces dropped to the floor and a whole lot of ball bearings fell out. Massive disappointment! I as already planning to get new wheels to remedy the engagement issue, but I was shocked to find the thing fell apart within a few hundred miles of easy riding.

    I replaced mine with Industry 9s with Arch rims. Love'em!! Highly recommend them! And they fit on easily, just a minor adjustment to the derailleur and I've been pedaling happily ever since.

    I decided to go with I9s (standard 12x142 instead of Specialized's proprietary 142+) instead of Roval Carbons so I don't feel locked into Specialized for my next bike. I really, really like my Specialized Epic Expert 29er, but it's probably not the last bike I will ever buy. The next bike could very well be a Specialized, but maybe not. I decided I9s were more portable to the next bike. The I9s are very modular and configurable, so I see them as an investment that will last for many years, from one bike to the next.

    IIRC, the 142+ only affects the spacing of the hub flanges, but not the axle width. 142 and 142+ are the same width as far as the frame is concerned. Correct me if I am wrong, but a quick measuring will bear that out.
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  43. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by mtroy
    IIRC, the 142+ only affects the spacing of the hub flanges, but not the axle width. 142 and 142+ are the same width as far as the frame is concerned. Correct me if I am wrong, but a quick measuring will bear that out.
    Yes, and the spacing of the hub flanges (i.e. outer diameter of the hubs excluding axle) are the same between 135 and 142. The axles are 3.5mm wider (each side) between 135 and 142. 142+ moves the flanges another 2mm further out, but keeps the 142mm spacing...

  44. #44
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    So does this mean that we can use any wheelset as long as it supports 142?

  45. #45
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    Would be nice to get a running list of companies that makes a hub or an adapter that works on these frames....I know I'm in the market for a wheelset. So far, I think King, DT Swiss, Hope and Good 'Oll Hi-Lo crapola is all I am aware of

  46. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by xmangox
    So does this mean that we can use any wheelset as long as it supports 142?
    Yes.

    The "+" is something Specialized added. Does it actually make the wheel stiffer? Probably. Can you feel the difference when riding? Probably not.

    Quote Originally Posted by abbeytrails
    Would be nice to get a running list of companies that makes a hub or an adapter that works on these frames....I know I'm in the market for a wheelset. So far, I think King, DT Swiss, Hope and Good 'Oll Hi-Lo crapola is all I am aware of
    http://www.syntace.com/index.cfm?pid=1&pk=1314

    Scroll down for a list of compatible hubs.

  47. #47
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    So just recapping

    If you buy a std 142 hub for the Epic 29er it just means a slight adjustment in Brake caliper and mech?

    the 142+ hub will not work on any other 142 framed bike - or is it just a case of adjusting the caliper and mech the other way?

    I havent even taken delivery of my epic yet! but wondering how long the hub/wheels will last...

  48. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by NZRob
    So just recapping

    If you buy a std 142 hub for the Epic 29er it just means a slight adjustment in Brake caliper and mech?

    the 142+ hub will not work on any other 142 framed bike - or is it just a case of adjusting the caliper and mech the other way?

    I havent even taken delivery of my epic yet! but wondering how long the hub/wheels will last...
    sort off - the cluster moves outboard by 2mm, but the brake rotor stays the same. Any 142 wheel will fit a 142+ wheel, but as you say the derailleur requires adjustment by 2mm..

  49. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by skiwi
    sort off - the cluster moves outboard by 2mm, but the brake rotor stays the same. Any 142 wheel will fit a 142+ wheel, but as you say the derailleur requires adjustment by 2mm..
    So will the Roval Control SL carbon 142x12 29er wheels fit on a non Specialized bike that uses 142 rear hub?
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  50. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by arashi
    So will the Roval Control SL carbon 142x12 29er wheels fit on a non Specialized bike that uses 142 rear hub?
    Correct - any of the Spec 142 (X-12) wheels will work in a 142 frame. The 142+wheels though won't. These are specific to the Spec bikes with 142+ frames (S-Works at this time).

  51. #51
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    hhmm glad i went with the expert epic evo 26, seems to have a red alloy driver so i guess it's a dt driver. I switched to an xt cassette recently but i realized that the 17 tooth cog is still a single gear, and notches the driver pretty good,probabely when used with the 26. I was wondering if the xtr cassette has the 17 on a spider,or a built in spacer with splines.edit , just looked it up the 17 is the 7th cog from the top ,on the xtr it would still be a single gear, it would be cool if it had a built in spacer or at least double width splines,it's sort of a drag to hold the cassette and knock the gear counter clockwise to unlock it from the driver,kind of shabby, and on a really strong heavy rider(not me) it could eventually be a problem. A ramped ti 17 with a built in spacer,could be just the splines, would be soooo trick.Action tec are you listening? .
    Last edited by herbn; 04-23-2011 at 03:12 PM.

  52. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by NZRob
    So just recapping

    If you buy a std 142 hub for the Epic 29er it just means a slight adjustment in Brake caliper and mech?

    the 142+ hub will not work on any other 142 framed bike - or is it just a case of adjusting the caliper and mech the other way?

    I havent even taken delivery of my epic yet! but wondering how long the hub/wheels will last...
    Yes, a picture is shown at the top of this thread:
    142+ Explained Graphically

  53. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by skiwi
    Correct - any of the Spec 142 (X-12) wheels will work in a 142 frame. The 142+wheels though won't. These are specific to the Spec bikes with 142+ frames (S-Works at this time).
    Are you sure? I would think the 142+ wheel would work with any 142 (X-12) frame. I thought it was just the wheel that was special in that the flange spacing was a bit wider.

  54. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by goneskiian
    Are you sure? I would think the 142+ wheel would work with any 142 (X-12) frame. I thought it was just the wheel that was special in that the flange spacing was a bit wider.
    What he said ^^

    The dropout widths for 142 and 142+ are the same. Why wouldn't theSpecialized wheel fit another frame?

  55. #55
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    They're the same end to end, but the end cap on the drive side is shorter. The smallest cog on the cassette will most likely rub the seatstay/dropout area. Check the pic again.

  56. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by jathanas
    What he said ^^

    The dropout widths for 142 and 142+ are the same. Why wouldn't the Specialized wheel fit another frame?
    No, the cluster moves another 2mm further out, while the overall width of the axle stays at 142mm. You might get lucky in some frames, but I wouldn't count on it.

    So any 142 wheel with fit a Spec 142+ frame, but you need to adjust the rear derailleur for that extra 2mm, but the 142+ Roval Control SL wheels [are not sure to] won't work with a standard 142 frame.

  57. #57
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    Thanks for the clarification.

    So, the cluster moves out 2mm on the 142+hub which means that the cassette might not clear the seat stay / chain stay on a non-Epic 29er?

    Cheers, J

    Quote Originally Posted by skiwi
    No, the cluster moves another 2mm further out, while the overall width of the axle stays at 142mm. You might get lucky in some frames, but I wouldn't count on it.

    So any 142 wheel with fit a Spec 142+ frame, but you need to adjust the rear derailleur for that extra 2mm, but the 142+ Roval Control SL wheels [are not sure to] won't work with a standard 142 frame.

  58. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by jathanas
    Thanks for the clarification.

    So, the cluster moves out 2mm on the 142+hub which means that the cassette might not clear the seat stay / chain stay on a non-Epic 29er?

    Cheers, J
    correct.

  59. #59
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    Freehub service

    So it has easily accessible cartridge bearings (which don't need maintenance, save occasionally to replace one) on the axle, but the freehub turns on loose bearings which need regular maintenance, but which can only be accessed w/ a homemade tool?

    I'm curious, has anyone taken the hub into a shop for service? Do they open it up with a sanded down BMX freewheel tool and regrease?

    I have ~400 mi on mine and while the axle turns smoothly and silently, the freehub sounds like gravel and has some play. Would like to make the best of a bad situation. Thanks.

  60. #60
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    can someone help me with the bearing numbers in the Roval SL wheels???

    The front bearings are very small and I could read the what they are....THX

    The rear bearing I could read....but is there a PDF for these HUBS ???

    THANKS.....LC

  61. #61
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    [QUOTE=Lafawnduh;7685165]I had to turn this tool down and remove two of the teeth. I did it by hand on a belt sander. Good luck!

    Lafawnduh, I have the hilo 142+ hub. The freebody has a lot of play in it since purchase and I've been trying to service it (specialized have no stock and no clue). Can I ask how you got the freehub apart? Does that cone that holds the cartridge bearing merely screw off with the special tool you made? I've tried screwing mine off to no avail and dont want to bust it. thanks

  62. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by twenty6black View Post
    can someone help me with the bearing numbers in the Roval SL wheels???

    The front bearings are very small and I could read the what they are....THX

    The rear bearing I could read....but is there a PDF for these HUBS ???

    THANKS.....LC
    2011 Roval Control SL 135mm & 142+ Spacing
    FRONT BEARING RIGHT BRG 6704 20X27X4 ENDURO BEARING
    FRONT BEARING LEFT BRG 6704 20X27X4 ENDURO BEARING
    REAR BEARING RIGHT BRG 6902 15x28x7 ENDURO BEARING
    REAR BEARING LEFT BRG 6902 15x28x7 ENDURO BEARING
    FREEHUB 9/10 SPD 15MM AXLE DT SWISS 240 POWERED

    135mm Spacing
    REAR SPOKE-DRIVE SIDE SPK DT REVOLUTION 2.0X1.5MM 14G 300MM BLK STRAIGHT PULL HEAD
    REAR SPOKE-DRIVE SIDE SPK DT AEROLITE 300MM RED STRAIGHT PULL HEAD
    REAR SPOKE-NON DRIVE SIDE SPK DT REVOLUTION 2.0X1.5MM 14G 302MM BLK STRAIGHT PULL HEAD
    REAR SPOKE-NON DRIVE SIDE SPK DT AEROLITE 302MM RED STRAIGHT PULL HEAD

    142+ Spacing
    REAR SPOKE-DRIVE SIDE SPK DT REVOLUTION 2.0X1.5MM 14G 300MM BLK STRAIGHT PULL HEAD
    REAR SPOKE-DRIVE SIDE SPK DT AEROLITE 300MM RED STRAIGHT PULL HEAD
    REAR SPOKE-NON DRIVE SIDE SPK DT REVOLUTION 2.0X1.5MM 14G 302MM BLK STRAIGHT PULL HEAD
    REAR SPOKE-NON DRIVE SIDE SPK DT AEROLITE 302MM RED STRAIGHT PULL HEAD


    FRONT SPOKE-RIGHT SPK DT REVOLUTION 2.0X1.5MM 14G 289MM BLK STRAIGHT PULL HEAD
    FRONT SPOKE-RIGHT SPK DT AEROLITE 289MM RED STRAIGHT PULL HEAD
    FRONT SPOKE-LEFT SPK DT REVOLUTION 2.0X1.5MM 14G 299MM BLK STRAIGHT PULL HEAD
    FRONT SPOKE-LEFT SPK DT AEROLITE 299MM RED STRAIGHT PULL HEAD
    just ride... who cares how big your wheels are

  63. #63
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    24hrsordie....THANKS.

    I have some issue with the drag of the these hubs....the rear especially - free hub is tight, bearings in the hub are TIGHT....front bearings feel okay - but not as nice as the enduro zero bearings.

    Same with the BB - 6806 - I think....they are well sealed and dont want to spin free.

    Thx again...LC

  64. #64
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    Just built up a set of Stans ZTR Arch rims laced to Hope Pro II's- bummer is that the 142 adapter for the rear is backordered by several weeks! Ugh. Will be riding these on my Epic Carbon Comp 29er.

    Anyone want to buy my stock wheelset?

  65. #65
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    2012 Epic 29er hubs

    So, just finished reading this thread to try to get some insight into the wheel situation with the 2012 Epic. I plan on swapping out the stock wheels with my I9s upon delivery of the bike, which is in a couple of weeks. I just ordered the I9 142mm axle kit so I should be good to go. I've used these wheels on few different bikes with all types of forks (QR, 15mm, 20mm). That's one great thing about the I9 wheels.

    Now I want to take the stock wheels and use them on another project. The 2012 Roval Controls are now spec'ed with DT Swiss hubs. Can this rear hub be converted to a 135mm QR?

  66. #66
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    Does anyone know the stock weight of the wheel set that comes on the 29er comp?

  67. #67
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    For a 2012? 2100 Grams give or a take a few

    Front is 985
    Rear is 1515 with cassette, I just found somewhere online that says the cassette is 395 grams so 1120 grams if that's right.
    2105 total.

  68. #68
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    Do you think other makers will come out with a 142+ size hub om 2012?

  69. #69
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    Do you think other makers will come out with a 142+ size hub om 2012?

    No, everyone else is going to a 142 period. No plus. Yeti, Banshee, Salsa, Transition...

  70. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by skiwi View Post
    Yes, and the spacing of the hub flanges (i.e. outer diameter of the hubs excluding axle) are the same between 135 and 142. The axles are 3.5mm wider (each side) between 135 and 142. 142+ moves the flanges another 2mm further out, but keeps the 142mm spacing...
    So basically the 142+ lets them build up a wheel with a bit less dish? But a regular 142 spec'ed hub would work properly, just the flanges would be closer together?

    And you'd just have to mess with your rear derailleur limits?
    Last edited by rufus; 10-10-2011 at 05:41 PM.

  71. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by rufus View Post
    So basically the 142+ lets them build up a wheel with a bit less dish? But a regular 142 spec'ed hub would work properly, just the flanges would be closer together?

    And you'd just have to mess with your rear derailleur limits?
    Correct. You should be easily able to adjust your derailleur between the 142 and 142+. I don't even adjust the limit screws, just the index adjustment.

  72. #72
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    So if I were to buy a Stump FSR Comp 29er with the 142+, but wanted to use my Stan's Arch/Hope wheelset on it instead, my resale options for the stock Stumpy wheelset are limited to practically none. Anyone with a frame that will accept the 142+ wheels(Specialized) already has a similar wheelset, stock.

  73. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by rufus View Post
    So if I were to buy a Stump FSR Comp 29er with the 142+, but wanted to use my Stan's Arch/Hope wheelset on it instead, my resale options for the stock Stumpy wheelset are limited to practically none. Anyone with a frame that will accept the 142+ wheels(Specialized) already has a similar wheelset, stock.
    The wheelset will only work on frames designed for 142+. That is the party line. Actually the wheelset will work on any frame that it fits. The extra 2mm that the cluster has moved to the right can probably be accommodated in most frames designed for 142.

  74. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by bikeguy0 View Post
    Once you removed the two 17mm lock nuts on the freehub side, did you have to tap or hammer the axle out? Or remove another locking nut somewhere?

    I can remove the two locknuts on the free hub side but the axle won't come out. I have lightly tapped on the axel but don't want to start hammering unless I am sure there are no other lock nuts to be removed.

    Thanks!!!
    I started hammering after removing the two 17mm lock nuts but I couldn´t take out the hole axle, only 2 inches and stopped because the rest didn't go out by hand and was afraid of breaking the screw.

    The disc side cup can be removed with a 17mm spanner as the hub lock nuts.

    The bearings are 15x26x07 2rs on the hub side and 6902 2rs 15x28x7 on the disc side. The hub is on service...

    Regards.
    Last edited by Ziurpe; 03-16-2012 at 12:41 AM.

  75. #75
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    Does Specialized have any plans to work out the kinks on this 12mmx142mm Hi Lo Disc? Are those receiving warranty replacements seeing improvement on the replaced hubs? I noticed crappy engagement and poor rotation in the freehub after a few rides on my 2012 Stumpy FSR Comp 26er. I brought it in to my dealer after about 200miles and they said it was likely wear and tear but Specialized would take care if me if I felt it was an issue. I'm definitely going to ask them to take care of it but I don't know what other than possibly getting the higher end up would do other than hit the reset button the eventual fail of a weak freehub.

  76. #76
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    Mine is in the shop right now. I have had the bike for one month (200 miles). I've only washed the bike once. At 100 miles, the rumble started in the read hub and I noticed that the cassette wiggles side to side when I spin the rear wheel. I took the axle out and checked the bearings. They felt good. The problem is in the freewheel assembly itself. I didn't have the two pronged tool to disassemble it so I carefully removed the seal and lubed it with a light oil. I reassembled the hub and it did sound better. After two more rides, the noise is back louder than ever. I took it to the shop. The first mechanic told me that they have had issues and that they would warranty the wheel. Then I got a call saying that because it hadn't failed, Specialized wanted them to inspect it before they would replace it. The second mechanic said that the bearings in the freewheel part showed signs of wear and that wear isn't warranted. I reminded him that the bike is one month old and that his observation was BS. He then said that since it hasn't failed, there is nothing they can do for me. I will pick it up tomorrow. So now, I guess I will be waiting for it to fail, and hopefully soon.

  77. #77
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    I can attest to the fact that the wheels/rear hub are shotty, but hey, maybe it's the way that I ride. My 2011 rear wheel and hub are shot, yet I can't afford the wheel set that I want, so if anyone has a really good deal on the stock rear wheel and hub, let me know. I already replaced the front wheel. Thanks.

  78. #78
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    The rear hub went out on my brand new (50 miles) Stumpy FSR Comp. Specialized told my LBS to replace it with a DT Swiss under warranty. It was annoying to not have the bike for a week but the upgrade made it tolerable.

    Now to deal with the Avid vibrating brakes from hell...

  79. #79
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    2012 Epic Comp with grinding free spin

    Looks like I am in the same boat. 110 miles on two month old $3000+ bike and grinding free spin. I took everything apart until I got to the seal. I could not figure how to get it off without tearing it. So I stopped and took it to the shop. The shop called yesterday saying that Specialized has approved a hub upgrade. The level they approved was the SRAM X9. After reading, this hub is heavier and not a significant upgrade. The shop agreed that I can pay the difference for any hub I like. I am going for the Hope Pro 2 Evo 12x142mm, 32 hole (blue, cause I can). The shop will bill Specialized for the lacing of my current wheel. The question I have is about the spokes. Will new spokes be required? Flange spacing on HiLo equal to Hope Pro 2?

    Thanks for info….

  80. #80
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    Anyone know how long this is covered under warranty ?
    2012 Specialized StumpJumper HT Comp 29

  81. #81
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    I plan on buying a stock crest wheelset with ZTR hubs for my 2012 Stumpjumper Expert Carbon Evo. SInce it's 135, I plan on buying the convertion: 12x142mm. Do you guys think that this will work with slight adjustment on the rear derrailleur?

    Please advice. Thanks!

  82. #82
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    No it will not work. That spacing is eye to eye of the end caps. You will have 3.5mm gaps on each side. You would need a hub/end cap conversion kit...like Hope has.
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  83. #83
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    I'm sorry...I misread...yes that will work if your bike has 142 dropouts and a 12mm thru axle.
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  84. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mayor69PRS View Post
    I'm sorry...I misread...yes that will work if your bike has 142 dropouts and a 12mm thru axle.
    Thank you. According to Specialized site, I do have it: Roval Traverse 142+, 12mm thru-axle.

  85. #85
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    so it sounds like I'm having the same issue as lots of others here. knocking in the rear hub. do I understand correctly that there's no way to adjust the cone here, and that the problem is in the freewheel? any hot tips on what to say to speee shall eyes duh when I call them? btw, bike is a 2012 stumpy fsr 29er comp with the hi-lo rear hub. what a POS. not only did they spec a proprietary hub, but a low quality, out-of-tolerance, heavy, lousy engaging, weak hub.

  86. #86
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    same problem here with a 2012 elite. except my LBS specialized dealer didn't know how to remove the inner axle? what ever that is. i know the basics but am not totally bike savy. it's been a week and nothing heard back from them yet. hopefully specialize will warranty it. my bike's a little over 2 months old.

  87. #87
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    I should mention that I called the shop. Specialized just sent them a bag of freehub bodies. Buddy at the shop suggested that I tighten the lock rings only if there was obvious slop in the axle... Pretty sure my issues is in the freehub body.

  88. #88
    just ride
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    I'll just talk to spesh about this wheelset...

  89. #89
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    My LBS are upgrading my shot Camber Comp 29 HILO hub to a Hope Pro 2 Evo 142 for an up charge of £50.00

    What do you reckon?

  90. #90
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    Great hubs! They are the only hubs I have been using for the past 2 years on all my bikes. Great bang for the buck, easy to maintain, etc. I have personally used the 12x142 on my rip9. Great increases in stiffness, and quality hub. You should be happy.
    www.wnymba.org
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  91. #91
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    That's great!
    I have about an inch of lateral play in my rear wheel, so I hope to notice a huge difference.

    Thanks.

  92. #92
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    LBS replaced my freehub and haven't had problems since. that said, engagement still sucks.

  93. #93
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    I've only had my stumpy evo for a couple of months and the rear hub sounds like it's grinding sand already. Might have to give the shop a call to see if they can do anything about it.

    Bit disappointing spending that amount of money, i've only had to rebuild my 2007 stumpjumper DT rear hub once!

  94. #94
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    After 2 rides in my new stumpy elite, I can hear the sand grinding noise at the rear hub... Was already warned by my lbs when I bought the bike. They told me to ride it first and bring it in for replacement once it happens...

  95. #95
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    Hi guys, I picked up a Stumpy fsr evo (2013) a little over 2 weeks ago and have been monitoring the potential hub issues after reading the history on spec's hubs. This bike claims it has "New Specialized disc, 4x sealed cartridge bearings" so I don't know if it's any better or not than the old Hi-lo. Time will tell. I don't hear any noise yet, but am noticing a tad bit of lateral play. Can this hub be tightened like the older QR hubs I am more familiar with?

  96. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by bad andy View Post
    Hi guys, I picked up a Stumpy fsr evo (2013) a little over 2 weeks ago and have been monitoring the potential hub issues after reading the history on spec's hubs. This bike claims it has "New Specialized disc, 4x sealed cartridge bearings" so I don't know if it's any better or not than the old Hi-lo. Time will tell. I don't hear any noise yet, but am noticing a tad bit of lateral play. Can this hub be tightened like the older QR hubs I am more familiar with?
    I think on the website and in marketing materials they wanted to highlight that they fixed the hub problem, which is why they are saying "NEW" hub blah blah. That said, it's possible on an early release 2013 bike, you're still getting the junky 2012 hub.
    I would take it back to the shop and create as much fuss as necessary to get them to replace the freehub body, which is what my shop did for me. they should know about the problem by now. tell them you read about it on the internetz.

  97. #97
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    New hub, old hub

    I guess it's progress that they have finally gone to a four bearing hub. If it's typical, there will be two bearings on the free hub and two more on the wheel hub. I've always been dubious about splitting the hub in two like that, as the weight load ends up in the middle of the axle where it's bendy and one bearing does most of the work. But it makes things easy to take apart and service and you can use a star wheel ratchet. It's two more bearings but the free hub can be lighter. The overall cost difference looks negligible so why it took so long is a mystery.

    There was no good reason that the 'old' hub couldn't have been a non issue. Having only two pawls that weren't opposite just puts nasty loads on the shell and bearings. One more would have made it twice as sturdy. I know that it's too much to ask, but a shim adjustment could have made it possible to eliminate some of the wacky bearing play, at the expense of assemblers having to have skill - and the possibility of someone leaving it out and having a fixie.

    Mine made the usual death rattles as soon as whatever grease they used fell out. I read a post about using chainsaw bar oil as a lubricant as it is tacky and stays put. I removed the drive side end cap [17mm] and dribbled some bar oil in past the seal, with the wheel at an angle, and rotated the free hub until the rattle just went away. You have to fill the end cavity up to where the axle comes out and turn it for a while to get it in there, but it's easy. Mop up the excess. What's in there stays in there, and engagement is unaffected.

    Now it sounds like a normal freehub. Still a weak and wobbly affair, but now I can disregard it until it breaks. Most of these free hubs get replaced because they sound wretched, and the new ones aren't any better after a while, so this may be a simpler solution for the noise at least.

  98. #98
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    Sorry if this has been covered already, but I did not see it. I keep hearing that if you go from 142+ to 142 you need to make a RD and brake adjustment. Everything I've seen as far as specs puts the brake rotor in the exact same place on the 142+ and 142 hubs. So, why do you need a brake adjustment when you switch one for the other? Sorry, I'm new to the 142 thing...and disc brakes for that matter...my last MTB was a Klein Pinnacle full rigid with cantis.

  99. #99
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    As far as I know, the brake rotor is in the same location on both 142 and 142+. The difference is the drive side (the location of the cassette) is moved further away from the brake side on the 142+ to make the spokes on the drive side, the same angle as the non-drive side. If you switch from 142+ to 142, the high and low adjustment on the derailer need to be adjusted to the new location. Then the cable will need to be adjusted as well.

  100. #100
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fnpig View Post
    As far as I know, the brake rotor is in the same location on both 142 and 142+. The difference is the drive side (the location of the cassette) is moved further away from the brake side on the 142+ to make the spokes on the drive side, the same angle as the non-drive side. If you switch from 142+ to 142, the high and low adjustment on the derailer need to be adjusted to the new location. Then the cable will need to be adjusted as well.
    That is.

    2mm is the difference between 142 and 142+

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