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  1. #1
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    SJ Wheel Set/ upgrade possible.

    I have a 2010 Stumpjumper FSR and I am curious as to the quality of the DT Swiss 420 Wheels that come with them? I am not necessarily new to MTB but this is the first bike I have cared to upgrade. I am curious if the DT Swiss wheels are very good? Also are the Mavic Crosstrail Disc Going to be an upgrade if I go with them. I have heard numerous people say that Wheels are the single best upgrade you can get for a bike..... What should I look for?

    Thanks

  2. #2
    fool goin up, joker down
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    I've also got a Stumpy, an when I get the money Im goin for a set of Mavic 817's with Hope Pro II's. After a good bit of digging around these fourms, and some research of my own, it seems to be a pretty kickass wheelset. For us to help out though whats a general price range??
    Mamma speed I'm back!!!

  3. #3
    The Unaffiliated
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    How heavy are you? And how hard do you ride?

    For example, I weigh 200lbs and ride my Enduro hard. I have the OEM DT 440 rims, which are a bit heavier than yours. My rims have held up well, no dents, but the spokes where too light and I wrecked out my rear wheel pretty fast. With a 160lb rider, wouldnt have been a problem.

  4. #4
    wafflemaster
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    Offhand, using the noggin but w/o looking at any specs, I'd say the 420 & the crossland are equivalent quality & weight.
    wafflemaster!

  5. #5
    wafflemaster
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    er, crosstrail
    wafflemaster!

  6. #6
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    Ok. Im not going to say money isn't a problem (wish i could say that) Looking to spend under $500 for a set of wheels. I appreciate what i am hearing from you guys... I am not UNHAPPY with my wheels really, i have just heard alot of people saying what a better wheel can do for a bike. I am thinking about entering a race here in a few months Just for fun, knowing I am not going to win but I would sure love to do decent in it. If you need to know I weigh 180 and so probably 190 in gear.

    My wheels seem noisy too... i used to own an older epic (never paid attention to what wheels were on it) but they weren't loud like these are... It almost sounds as if the spokes are loose but i have checked them an they are all tight. The wheel hasn't bent on me and I have no real reason to upgrade other than I CAN and I heard it makes a world of difference if you get the right wheels.

    Thanks
    Jeff

  7. #7
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    I have a 2010 SJ FSR with the 420's and I think they suck. They are very flexy. I have never ridden really high dollar wheels so I can't compare them, but I can feel the flex in the rear wheel when cornering. Not as bad in the front but the rear sux, and I've also broken 3 spokes in less than a year. The hubs are fine, I have 0 complaints. Actually I love the DT Swiss RWS axle on the front. I read somewhere that the problem is the spokes. If you or someone you know can relace them with quality spokes and nipples they might be good wheels. When I get a new wheelset this summer I am going to use the 420's to practice wheel building.

  8. #8
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    Anyone know what the DT 420's weigh? I am thinking this is going to be my next upgrade to my bike so Im trying to do what research i can. I would hate to buy something and it end up being just like the wheels i have already... I can't find much info on the DT Swiss 420's. I don't ride hard but I do like to ride one to two times a week. just singletrack..

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by oldsman71442
    My wheels seem noisy too... i used to own an older epic (never paid attention to what wheels were on it) but they weren't loud like these are... It almost sounds as if the spokes are loose but i have checked them an they are all tight. The wheel hasn't bent on me and I have no real reason to upgrade other than I CAN and I heard it makes a world of difference if you get the right wheels.
    I don't know anything about the stock wheels on your bike, but it might be interesting for you to take the wheels off, remove the tires and weigh them. It's pretty easy to get weights for new wheelsets here on the forums, and since you aren't complaining about the rear hub, I'm assuming you are only worried about saving weight. The NoTubes ZTR wheels are good options, for approximately $500. However, in my experience, unless you can save a pretty substantial amount of weight, I personally doubt you are really going to notice that much of a difference. I think you would be amazed at the difference that different tires can make - something with significantly less rolling resistance has much the same effect as dropping weight off of your wheelset.

    Another option might be to have your LBS tune the wheels on your bike now. They might all be tight, but they might be below the recommended tension.

    Most of the time I see people raving about new wheels making a big difference it is either using a really lightweight rim (which you should probably be careful about using) or using a set of carbon wheels which are incredibly expensive. If the wheels on your bike really are that heavy, then it will be a good upgrade.

  10. #10
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    I have a 10 stumpy fsr. Ride it fairly aggressively and kept tweaking the 420s finally to full taco. I got the Roval AL Traverse for $500 at spec because I didn't want to spend a lot. Maybe about 70 hours of beatings on heavy trails and they are still true.

    For a quick economic economical solution I highly recommend them.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by oldsman71442
    Anyone know what the DT 420's weigh? I am thinking this is going to be my next upgrade to my bike so Im trying to do what research i can. I would hate to buy something and it end up being just like the wheels i have already... I can't find much info on the DT Swiss 420's. I don't ride hard but I do like to ride one to two times a week. just singletrack..
    I recently switched tires and was curious about the weight of the SJ FSR wheels as well.
    I have a 2010 SJ FSR Elite so it has those DT Swiss X420SL rims and the Specialized HiLo Front Hub and Shimano 525 rear hub.
    These are the weights without rotors, no tubes and tires, and the rim straps installed.

    Front Wheel 824 Grams
    Front Skewer 52 Grams
    Rear Wheel 1099 Grams
    Rear Skewer 65 Grams

    Total Weight with Skewers 2040 Grams
    Wheelset Weight without Skewers 1923 Grams

    You could probably dig around and figure out the weight of just the rim by finding the rear hub weight and the spokes and nipples weights.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by sirridealot
    I have a 10 stumpy fsr. Ride it fairly aggressively and kept tweaking the 420s finally to full taco. I got the Roval AL Traverse for $500 at spec because I didn't want to spend a lot. Maybe about 70 hours of beatings on heavy trails and they are still true.

    For a quick economic economical solution I highly recommend them.
    Traverse maybe a little too much for Stumpy unless you do big drops/jumps. I would instead look at Control Trail AL myself, as this is what's speced on higher end Stumpys. I am getting mine as soon as I stop working 60 hr weeks I don't even have time to stop by my LBS to order them.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by daniyarm
    Traverse maybe a little too much for Stumpy unless you do big drops/jumps. I would instead look at Control Trail AL myself, as this is what's speced on higher end Stumpys. I am getting mine as soon as I stop working 60 hr weeks I don't even have time to stop by my LBS to order them.
    Exactly!

  14. #14
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    Well I almost pooped my pants when I looked up the Control Trail Wheels I didn't realize I was looking at the SL Version which was 1500 vs the AL which is more affordable. I will do some more research on these wheels thank you.

    Jeff

  15. #15
    West Chester, PA
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    Quote Originally Posted by eighty
    I recently switched tires and was curious about the weight of the SJ FSR wheels as well.
    I have a 2010 SJ FSR Elite so it has those DT Swiss X420SL rims and the Specialized HiLo Front Hub and Shimano 525 rear hub.
    These are the weights without rotors, no tubes and tires, and the rim straps installed.

    Front Wheel 824 Grams
    Front Skewer 52 Grams
    Rear Wheel 1099 Grams
    Rear Skewer 65 Grams

    Total Weight with Skewers 2040 Grams
    Wheelset Weight without Skewers 1923 Grams
    Here you go - a 300 gram drop in weight, nice strong double wall rims and easy tubeless set-up. For $500.

    http://www.notubes.com/product_info....roducts_id/537

  16. #16
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    Thanks guys keep the suggestions coming.... I am reading about the easton Havocs Anyone got any experience with them. I know they won't drop much weight but are there other benifits to them? I like to make informed decisions on purchasing. Thanks

    Jeff

  17. #17
    Go SOLAR...
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    It's not that the wheels are bad...it's just that they are made by a machine instead of by hand. If you were to take the same wheel and have it built it would be far stronger than they are stock.
    Handbuilt wheels are far superior to any stock wheel.
    Go Solar...

  18. #18
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    Im liking all this info that i am getting.. Thanks guys...So Stay away from the easton havoc? Also Will most manufactures tell you if they are hand built wheels? I am doing some research on the Royal Control AL Wheels

  19. #19
    Go SOLAR...
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    All Roval wheels are hand built...guaranteed.
    Go Solar...

  20. #20
    namagomi
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    Sell the front wheel. At 28h it will probably be done the first jump or drop you land hard. Get a hope-hoop or similar - $150, swap the rear-rim get new spokes with your chosen rim ex500 en521 are good choices for me. Under $250... prolly.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by furball
    er, crosstrail
    +1 for crosstrail. Even better for the 2011 model. I have the 2010s and I'm just under 200 lbs. and they are mad stiff and they can be beat on pretty hard and stay true. For $500 they can't be beat.

    As for the stock 420sl wheels that come on stumpys. They would be just fine if they spec'd them with at least a DT comp or super comp spoke. They use bottom line champion spokes which in my experience create uber flex in the wheels and will not stay true at all. I got to the point where I was having to true my wheelset every 2-3 rides and the spoke pinging noise when riding....don't even get me started. Best bet is to ditch the 420s and pick up something else.

    You can save the 420s so they can be sold with the bike at a later date. Or...if you keep your bikes for awhile then sell them off or use them on a hardtail that only sees light work path and pavement riding.

  22. #22
    West Chester, PA
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    Quote Originally Posted by electrik
    Sell the front wheel. At 28h it will probably be done the first jump or drop you land hard. Get a hope-hoop or similar - $150, swap the rear-rim get new spokes with your chosen rim ex500 en521 are good choices for me. Under $250... prolly.

    The DT rims are not that poor in and of themselves. The problem is the non-butted thin spokes and 28 spoke front wheel they use to try to minimize the heft of the cheap hubs. Combine those issues with a really sloppy machine build and you have problems.

    The specialized front hub is pretty well made and the large end caps actually do work to an extent. Its a little heavy but not rediculously so. If it was 32 hole it would be reusable.

    The shimano rear hub you're telling him to keep is the worst part of the equation. Really heavy and loose ball bearings. The rear rim could be made into a decent wheel with a lighter hub, correct spokes for the application and careful tensioning.

  23. #23
    namagomi
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    Quote Originally Posted by 92gli
    The DT rims are not that poor in and of themselves. The problem is the non-butted thin spokes and 28 spoke front wheel they use to try to minimize the heft of the cheap hubs. Combine those issues with a really sloppy machine build and you have problems.

    The specialized front hub is pretty well made and the large end caps actually do work to an extent. Its a little heavy but not rediculously so. If it was 32 hole it would be reusable.

    The shimano rear hub you're telling him to keep is the worst part of the equation. Really heavy and loose ball bearings. The rear rim could be made into a decent wheel with a lighter hub, correct spokes for the application and careful tensioning.
    Oh, didn't know he had the comp, the other levels come with a dt-swiss 370 rear hub. The 420sl rims are fine, my 32H rear took a lot of abuse... but at 28h it is too weak for "trail" riding IMO... even with the double butted spokes the rim offers less strength due to it's narrowish profile.

    Yes, it was a waste of money that wheel, stuck with a 28H disc rim now... maybe i will relace it for a commuter.

  24. #24
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    Yeah, the higher end models (my '10 Expert) come with DT Swiss Competition 1.8/1.6mm stainless spokes and a DT Swiss 330SL rear hub w/ alloy freehub.

    Not the greatest wheels, the machine build is pretty crappy. I tensioned the wheels up quite a bit and they've been reliable for me (even the 28 front).

    Not to say I won't eventually upgrade them.
    2014 Tallboy 2

  25. #25
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    That rear hub is a pos. I have had a lot and worked on a lot of specialized bikes over the years and it's typical that the rear hub that they spec on comps and below (sometimes on higher end bikes as well) are for naught. It's most likely the source of the sound you're hearing- open it up, repack the bearings and see if that cleans it up- if you've been riding it hard, you'll need to check the cones as well- if they're grooved or pitted, you may as well just replace that hub. I definitely would not recommend building around it.

    I agree with others' assessments of the spokes/ rims. The rims are not horrible- not the best, but not bad. The front hub isn't bad either, but they use very low end spokes, and both wheels are machine built. If they weren't tensioned and trued after purchase, they will typically go out of true pretty regularly. You could get some Hope hubs and rebuild those wheels with some good spokes and keep the rims and you'd probably shave some decent weight and have a much sturdier wheelset. Maybe go tubeless while you're at it if you're not already.

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