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  1. #1
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    Bonking ... not feelin' well The Captain S-Works tubeless mode=problem?

    Hello,
    I have a pair of The Captain S-Works mounted in a Mavic Crossmax XL wheels. I have tested them for 30 miles with tubes and then Iíve decided to go tubeless. The problems began.
    I installed 4oz of Magik Seal in each tire but they are losing a lot of air. I have only done more or less 8 miles with the Magik Seal installed. After a close look done after I can see a lot of Magik Seal leaking form a lot of very small holes in the sides of the tires. Looks like snake bites.
    Those any one had this problem and solved it?
    Iím starting to think that Iíve made a terrible mistake going tubeless and even worst buying the The Captain. They roll fast and have a very good grip but they are becoming a pain in the a$$ to go tubeless and those thin walls are scaring me a lot.
    Help please!

    Best regrads.

  2. #2
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    although it might be expensive, you can try throwing on a ust specific tire (like a kenda nev) and see if that one works. Havent used any 2bliss tires yet, so I couldn't tell ya

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by XMAN
    After a close look done after I can see a lot of Magik Seal leaking form a lot of very small holes in the sides of the tires. Looks like snake bites.
    Looks like defective tires to me... Both front and rear, same thing?
    "Lots of very small holes..." like a hundred or like 5 or 6?
    ZT
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  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zen_Turtle
    Looks like defective tires to me... Both front and rear, same thing?
    "Lots of very small holes..." like a hundred or like 5 or 6?
    ZT
    Like less then 10 in the front tire and 4 or 5 in the rear tire. I think they are a lot because they are new tires and didn't run them in a "aggressive" environment in the 30 miles that I've done with them, but using tubes. I've done the same track several times using Roll-X tires with tubes and didn't had any problem.
    But isn't the Magik Seal supposed to seal those snake bite like holes? the stuff is just leaking like water.

    I don't think that is a 2Bliss problem but a The Captain problem.

  5. #5
    Just Wanna Ride!
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    Tires are probably fine. When installing you need to go by the video on the Stans web site. If you will lay the wheels flat on each side on the 5 gal buckets like in the video, then sealant will seal all those tiny holes. Once this is done, you may want to throw in a bit more sealant to be sure you have enough to seal punctures on the trail.

    When the tire spins with sealant in there coats the backside of the tread, but doesn't get much sealant on the sidewalls.

    Happens on alot of standard tires that are run tubeless. Gotta seal the holes and then all should be well for the life of the tire. The shake and let stand section is about 2/3 of the way through, but you should watch entire video - good tips.

    http://www.notubes.com/movieinstall.php
    Last edited by NCtrailX; 12-22-2007 at 03:07 PM.

  6. #6
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    I will take out the wheels of the bike and do "The shake and let stand" than check with some soap and water to see if every thing is sealed.
    I thought it would be much easier since the tyre and wheel are tubeless I didn't expect the small side holes after such a small rune.

  7. #7
    Just Wanna Ride!
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    The 2Bliss tires from Specialized are actually 'tubeless ready' tires and require sealant. The bead of the tire is a UST design, but the tire casing is a standard casing. The idea is that the weight on this tire will be much lighter, and most folks are running sealant in their UST tires anyway.

    Several companies have come out with similar tire setup and all require sealant.

    Good luck with the tires!!

  8. #8
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    Try some Stans Sealant 3-4oz if ya want...better than the stuff Specialized makes (IMO)
    If the tires don't seal then you can get a full refund as per Specialized!!!
    I hope this works out for you!!!
    02' is when I went tubeless, and that was the last time I flatted *knocks on wood*
    Keep us posted?

  9. #9
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    I don't know Magic seal, I hope it is not the sealant from Specialized, because this doesn't work apparantly. I just directly started with Stans, and there where also a couple of little holes, but they sealed quite fast. I have been running them like this now already 3 months and they work as a charm.

  10. #10
    The Other Dude
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    I had the same thing happen with my Captain S-Works tires, i had a bunch of little hole leaking from my sidewalls when they were brand new (must have REALLY thin sidewalls!) i usually one run 1 scoop of stans per tire and i am fine, but i had to put another half scoop in each tires, then spin them sideways for a bit, not i have not problems, they are all sealed up, i am running the captains on my Roval XC's and my Mavic SLR's.....i had to do the same with both.
    Sponsors: Specialized, Honey Stinger, The Hive, Twenty6, 661, Elka Suspension, www.Chainsmokeracing.net

  11. #11
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    Today I tested both tires with some soap and water to see where it was leaking and is like jut8 is saying is a bunch of very small holes on the side of the tire. Hundreds of them. Because the Magik Seal is made to handle large holes it cannot handle this very small holes.
    Wednesday Iím going to my LBS to see what they can do to solve the problem. Probably Iíll return the tires although I like the way they roll and grip when is needed but they shouldn't do this they are tubeless!!! And very expensive!!!

    With all of this I'm not going to ride all this days. I have more tires but I don't want to take the Captains out to show to the guys in the LBS the way they leak.

    By the way jut8 Iím new to tubeless (this was the first try) but what I have read is that you have to refill the tires with stans after several months, is that true?

  12. #12
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    I ran mine 2bliss for a day and didn't care for it. It was the same way with my captains. I ended up putting tubes in.

  13. #13
    The Other Dude
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    I have heard that also, but i swap my tires around alot, so i put new stuff in everytime i swap them. On one of my older bikes i have had the same stans in there for over a year with my hutchinson spiders.....no issues yet, but i probably should change it just to be safe.

    Just incase you dont already know this trick, when your putting the tires on, put soapy water on the bead, they snap right into place! Good luck and keep us updated.
    Sponsors: Specialized, Honey Stinger, The Hive, Twenty6, 661, Elka Suspension, www.Chainsmokeracing.net

  14. #14
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    Do the holes look like a striation pattern along the sidewalls? That could be from running too low of a tire pressure and sealants tend to seal that up. As for the Specialized sealant, it's great punctures (quite a bit better than Stan's) and isn't affected by CO2 cartridge use. However, I've had problems with a Captain and an Eskar on my Crossmax SL UST rims and holding air overnight. The Captain would lose almost all its air during the ride, while the Eskar isn't anywhere as bad. Strangely, the best combination I've had so far is a Specialized Chunder that was on the front with Stan's, and then got moved to the back using the Specialized Airlock sealant. Where the Stan's sealant would seep out through punctures it has "sealed", the Airlock stuff doesn't seep at all. Also, with Stan's you have to rotate the puncture to the bottom no matter what size it is and wait for the sealant to plug it; but Airlock is so thick that it sticks to the tire wall and just blows out through the hole immediately as it's right there. Very cool stuff. If they could get the stupid bead to seal better it wouldn't be such a problem. I lose around 8psi overnight with straight Airlock, whereas the other tire might lose 2psi with the Stan's/Airlock combo.
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  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Student Driver
    Do the holes look like a striation pattern along the sidewalls? That could be from running too low of a tire pressure and sealants tend to seal that up.....
    Yes the holes do look like a striation pattern but I have been running the tires with 40 PSI and I tested with soap and water with 60 PSI. I can see the sealant coming out from some of the holes but there are a lot of them.
    The sealant seems to be working because I had a normal hole in one of the tires and it sealed that out.

    My big question is are not the tires Tubeless? So they should not leak air from the sidewalls!

  16. #16
    Just Wanna Ride!
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    As noted above the tires are not true UST tires. A UST tire is designed to hold air without sealant. The casing is tougher, but the tires are considerably heavier.

    A 'tubeless ready' tire like the 2Bliss tires from Specialized (and the new tires from Bontrager, Hutchinson, and others) use a standard casing and require sealant. UST bead with standard casing. These are a great alternative to converting tires since the bead is more durable than a conventional tire.

  17. #17
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    just put stans in them.

    The Specialized sealent sucks. Had leakage in my captains and had to pump them up every ride. I put in some stans and now they are perfect. as good as any ust tire.

    So in summary. The Captains Rock, and the Sealent blows.
    Visiting St george/Hurricane? Stay at my vacation rental. Discounts for MTB's

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  18. #18
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    Yeah, the tubeless ready stuff is probably how many vendors are planning to go and it does work pretty well. But, being tubeless 'ready' means that it will not hold air for very long on its own.

    For me, the Captains are awful and the Specialized sealant is a work in progress. Maybe if the Captains get a 2.2 with appropriately enlarged knobs I will try them again.
    1997 Specialized Stumpy Pro
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  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by XMAN
    Yes the holes do look like a striation pattern but I have been running the tires with 40 PSI and I tested with soap and water with 60 PSI. I can see the sealant coming out from some of the holes but there are a lot of them.
    The sealant seems to be working because I had a normal hole in one of the tires and it sealed that out.

    My big question is are not the tires Tubeless? So they should not leak air from the sidewalls!
    Oh, and when you started at 40psi, you might have dropped quite a bit in pressure and the tire would have squirmed/flexed a great deal causing that. I've had it happen with a Chunder and some other tires even when they weren't tubeless. Stan's worked well enough with the pattern, but dried out really quickly and it has to slosh up the walls of the tire to seal it. Specialized Airlock is more like a hair gel and sticks to everything, so it should just seal it on its own.

    I don't know why Airlock will not seal the tire during mounting like Stan's does, but I wonder if it has something to do with its viscosity. What's cool with my Chunder is the Stan's stuff I used make the tire airtight (well, as good as it can get) and Airlock doesn't seep out or make those stupid balls of latex when hit with too much cold CO2. I will probably look at some of this homebrew stuff when I get a chance.
    1997 Specialized Stumpy Pro
    1998 Specialized Allez Epic
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  20. #20
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    I haven't used tubeless since I tested a set back when they first came out - never had to use any sealant... Mavic ones with the ceramic sidewalls... they are still sitting out in my garage.

  21. #21
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    The boss had issues with the spec. air lock sealant and sent it back to his rep. There was no way it was going to seal and the parts he had where brand new (tire rim, sealant) he has since switched back to stans in the same rim/tire setup and had no issues.

  22. #22
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    I was looking into the Specialized.com to get some more information about The Captains S-Works and they don't have information saying that they are 2Bliss! But mine have the 2Bliss symbol.
    Probably the S-Works now are not 2Bliss because of the problems that I'm having. Is it possible?
    Last edited by XMAN; 12-25-2007 at 04:35 PM.

  23. #23
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    No!!!!!!!!!!

    Just put Stans in them and quit making it harder then it has to be. They work fine, and have a Tubeless bead.
    Visiting St george/Hurricane? Stay at my vacation rental. Discounts for MTB's

    http://www.vrbo.com/392904

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  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pedalfaraway
    Just put Stans in them and quit making it harder then it has to be. They work fine, and have a Tubeless bead.
    Ok, ok I'm going to try the Stans.

    I will post some more information after the test. Probably friday I'll put the Stans and test it during the weekend.

  25. #25
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    Standard Specialized tires

    FWIW, I've been running standard (as in non- 2bliss) Specialized tires for the past 2 years with Stan's solutions with NO problems. I have a pair of FastTrak LK Pros on my race wheels and have not had any flats or leaks. The are on Stans 355 rims.

    I also have a pair of Resolution Pro tires on Mavic 717 rims with a Stans rim strip. No leaks, no problems.

    Specialized tires are the best ones I've found for using a standard tire and converting it to tubeless. Less expensive and lighter than UST.

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