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  1. #1
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    2014 Epic Expert World Cup - Mini Review

    This is my first Epic and although I only have about 50 miles on it, I am really loving it. I went back and forth on which Epic to get this year but decided on the Expert WC and I am really happy I did. Having 1x11 and a frame built around that was a selling point for me. I am coming off of an Anthem 29 with 100mm of travel and I do not miss the 5mm at all and really love the suspension tuning on the WC for my do-it-all bike.

    I am still getting the bike dialed in and will change out bars and stem once I decide the fit I need. (I will go with Specialized carbon flat or mini rise model.)

    The only thing I do not love is the brakes, but I am going to stick with them. They are not bad but I miss the XTR's that I had on my last bike.

    Changes from stock:

    ESI grips (stock ones felt terrible in my opinion)
    Organic brake pads (suppose to be more quiet)
    Syntace 90mm stem (I am 5'11" and on a Large frame)
    XTR pedals
    Ground Control (2.3 / 2.1 control version for winter riding/training)
    Tubeless / Stan's

    With the heavier tires and aluminium bars/post it is at 24 lbs even.

    2014 Epic Expert World Cup - Mini Review-i-kxtsctw-x2.jpg

  2. #2
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    Nice! I just picked up an Epic Marathon (didn't want to spend the $$$ on the s-works because I change bikes often).

    This is my 3rd Epic. I must say the new Epic is great! It's funny I also try to go bigger suspension bikes but always come back to a more racer geo and suspension.

    I may try a 120 fork just to compare (I get bored easy).

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    Daniel- that is a killer ride!

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    Congrats on the new WC. My riding partner has same bike and is really loving it. He does get some noise and shutter on the brakes though. I am hoping to step up before race season. I was concerned about the brakes; I currently have Formula R1's. The guys at my LBS said the maguras on the expert work better and are quieter with better rotors. Maybe someone else can chime in here who has changed the rotors.

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    Thanks guys!

    I would also be curious if anyone has tried other rotors with better success.

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    My buddy replaced his stock rotor and pads. He went with the rt86 ice tech rotors. He has been happy with the brakes since. He says they have good stopping power and they are super quiet now. Before, he was getting a lot of noise and vibration. After swapping out the rotors, he inspected the stockers and found that 2 of the tangs that go from the pad surface area to the center where it mounts were cracked.

  7. #7
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    funny you say that, I tried a bike that had MT6 calipers with ice-tech rotors and it was night and day as fa as bite and lack of noise/vibration compared to the SL rotors. +1 for ice-tech

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    Thanks for the replies and feedback. I will give the Shimano rotors a shot!

  9. #9
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    Hi Daniel - I'm contemplating getting this bike too. However I'm intending to compete in Ironbike this year in Italy (::: IronBike :::) and I'm a little concerned if 95 mm travel front & rear would be ok? What are your thoughts?

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    Hey there Hatone,

    I am not familiar with IronBike but if you are set on an Epic and are asking if 95mm vs 100mm will make a difference then I would say no. I have been on 100mm bikes for the past 5 years or so (Anthem 26, Anthem 29, now Epic WC) and in terms of travel, I do not miss the 5mm at all. Maybe a longer travel bike would be better for the event? I am not sure. I have ridden longer travel bikes and always come back to the shorter travel, more efficient bikes.

    Thanks and best of luck!
    Daniel

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by DanielM3 View Post
    Hey there Hatone,

    I am not familiar with IronBike but if you are set on an Epic and are asking if 95mm vs 100mm will make a difference then I would say no. I have been on 100mm bikes for the past 5 years or so (Anthem 26, Anthem 29, now Epic WC) and in terms of travel, I do not miss the 5mm at all. Maybe a longer travel bike would be better for the event? I am not sure. I have ridden longer travel bikes and always come back to the shorter travel, more efficient bikes.

    Thanks and best of luck!
    Daniel
    Thanks - I've too ordered one. I'm 5ft 10'' and went with a Medium. Sat on a medium Epic - it felt good, not too stretched out or cramped. Might bumped up the stem to 100 mm from 90 mm later down the line, should hit the sweet spot.

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    It is worth noting, if you are between sizings (i.e. M and L) it is generally safer to go with the high end of the manufacturer's frame size recommendation (i.e. you're 5ft 10'' which is the max medium recommendation). I found it still allowed good saddle movement, forwards and backwards. Furthermore it allows you to extend your stem if required. On the plus side a medium is smaller than large so will be easier to move around when the trails get steep and rough, and lighter too.

    So to summarise, a 5ft 10'' rider would fit nicely on a medium with a 100 mm than a large with 100 mm stem as standard on Epics.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by wsmc42 View Post
    My buddy replaced his stock rotor and pads. He went with the rt86 ice tech rotors. He has been happy with the brakes since. He says they have good stopping power and they are super quiet now. Before, he was getting a lot of noise and vibration. After swapping out the rotors, he inspected the stockers and found that 2 of the tangs that go from the pad surface area to the center where it mounts were cracked.
    What type of pads did you buddy choose? I can't find Shimano pads to be compatible with Magura.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by frafoss View Post
    What type of pads did you buddy choose? I can't find Shimano pads to be compatible with Magura.
    I don't know for sure. Either Magura pads in an endurance compound or Koolstop pads in an endurance compound. FWIW, I just bought the same bike and put the RT86 ice tech rotors on immediately. I still have stock pads in it. The braking is solid with good feel at the lever and absolutely no noise or shutter. They don't have as much initial bite as the Formulas on my old bike, but so far they feel plenty good for xc stuff. My LBS says only drawback with the stock pads is they wear quickly compared to the endurance pads.

  15. #15
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    Just the 180 and 160 Shimano rotors needed? No adapters or anything? I may try the same on mine.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DanielM3 View Post
    Just the 180 and 160 Shimano rotors needed? No adapters or anything? I may try the same on mine.
    If that matches the size rotors that came on your bike, that is all you need.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by wsmc42 View Post
    I don't know for sure. Either Magura pads in an endurance compound or Koolstop pads in an endurance compound. FWIW, I just bought the same bike and put the RT86 ice tech rotors on immediately. I still have stock pads in it. The braking is solid with good feel at the lever and absolutely no noise or shutter. They don't have as much initial bite as the Formulas on my old bike, but so far they feel plenty good for xc stuff. My LBS says only drawback with the stock pads is they wear quickly compared to the endurance pads.
    Thanks!!!

  18. #18
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    So I took my Epic Expert WC out for it's maiden voyage yesterday - in stock form. Aside from taking the bumps much better than my HT, this bike just felt like it had less rolling resistance and more controlled mid-corner handling rather than an on/off switch on the HT. Overall, I felt more confident descending and over the rooty stuff. With all the settings in the middle, I found the front a little soft and the rear a little too stiff. Will make adjustments for next ride. Also, I did the brake-bed in procedure during the week. I did about 40 of the 18mph stops. During my ride, I could tell they were really starting to break-in. I did notice a little howl from the brakes towards the end of the ride, but no gobbling. I don't mind a little howl as long as there is no gobbling/vibration. I find the howl to be equivalent to a rear brake light on a car to let riders behind me know I am braking. Guess we'll see how the brakes go during my next ride. Everything else performed nicely. It definitely just wants to go fast.
    Enjoy the ride!

  19. #19
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    2014 Epic Expert World Cup - Mini Review-img_2501.jpg
    2014 Epic Expert World Cup - Mini Review-img_2497.jpg

    I've had my WC expert for about a weekend a half. I've got 3 rides on it so far, one being an xc race. So far, I'm really loving it. I am coming from a 2012 epic expert and the WC does all the things I wanted my '12 to do. Biggest improvement has to be the brains. The front end feel is excellent. The bike is more nimble and very responsive. With more saddle time, I'm sure I will get even more comfortable on it.

    The bike is a medium and weighed in at 24lbs 1 oz on the shop scale in stock form with tubes and plastic pedals. I used the home bathroom scale method and got 24.0 lbs. I immediately swapped some parts: 3T 100mm stem, Enve carbon bar, XX1 grip shifter with ESI grips, EC70 carbon seat post, Romin EVO saddle Ti rails, 30 T Wolftooth chainring, Roval SL wheels, Shimano RT 86 brake rotors, Fast Trak rear tire, XTR pedals,2- Zee side loader bottle cages, and added 3M clear protector for cable rub, on top tube and at chain stay near chainring. Using the home scale method, it is right at 23.0. I will stop by the shop and have them check on the fish hook scale. I expected it to be a little lighter, but 23.0 is still pretty light for non S Works FS.

  20. #20
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    Anyone know the weight difference between the Epic Expert and the Epic Expert WC? I am torn between the two and not sure which one to get!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by wsmc42 View Post
    Click image for larger version. 

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    I've had my WC expert for about a weekend a half. I've got 3 rides on it so far, one being an xc race. So far, I'm really loving it. I am coming from a 2012 epic expert and the WC does all the things I wanted my '12 to do. Biggest improvement has to be the brains. The front end feel is excellent. The bike is more nimble and very responsive. With more saddle time, I'm sure I will get even more comfortable on it.

    The bike is a medium and weighed in at 24lbs 1 oz on the shop scale in stock form with tubes and plastic pedals. I used the home bathroom scale method and got 24.0 lbs. I immediately swapped some parts: 3T 100mm stem, Enve carbon bar, XX1 grip shifter with ESI grips, EC70 carbon seat post, Romin EVO saddle Ti rails, 30 T Wolftooth chainring, Roval SL wheels, Shimano RT 86 brake rotors, Fast Trak rear tire, XTR pedals,2- Zee side loader bottle cages, and added 3M clear protector for cable rub, on top tube and at chain stay near chainring. Using the home scale method, it is right at 23.0. I will stop by the shop and have them check on the fish hook scale. I expected it to be a little lighter, but 23.0 is still pretty light for non S Works FS.
    That is good. Guess I don't have it too bad with mine weighing 23lbs. 1oz. without having to invest in the SL wheelset.
    MCH Co-Captain

  22. #22
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    Re: 2014 Epic Expert World Cup - Mini Review

    Quote Originally Posted by RCMTB View Post
    So I took my Epic Expert WC out for it's maiden voyage yesterday - in stock form. Aside from taking the bumps much better than my HT, this bike just felt like it had less rolling resistance and more controlled mid-corner handling rather than an on/off switch on the HT. Overall, I felt more confident descending and over the rooty stuff. With all the settings in the middle, I found the front a little soft and the rear a little too stiff. Will make adjustments for next ride. Also, I did the brake-bed in procedure during the week. I did about 40 of the 18mph stops. During my ride, I could tell they were really starting to break-in. I did notice a little howl from the brakes towards the end of the ride, but no gobbling. I don't mind a little howl as long as there is no gobbling/vibration. I find the howl to be equivalent to a rear brake light on a car to let riders behind me know I am braking. Guess we'll see how the brakes go during my next ride. Everything else performed nicely. It definitely just wants to go fast.
    Edit: It wasn't totally stock cause I went tubeless from the beginning.

    Sent from my HTCONE using Tapatalk
    Enjoy the ride!

  23. #23
    amd
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    2014 Epic Expert World Cup - Mini Review-image.jpg


    Large expert World Cup. 23.7 lbs out of the box (without pedals).

    Items I added:

    Syntace 110mm stem
    S-works carbon bar
    S-works carbon seatpost
    Romin pro saddle
    Fast trak control 2.2 in front, 2.0 in rear
    ESI grips
    Quarq 34t crankset
    Tubeless
    Xtr pedals
    2 specialized side load water bottles
    Multi tool mounted by the shock
    Garmin heads up mount

    Took the weight down to an even 23lbs. Pretty stoked!

  24. #24
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    Re: 2014 Epic Expert World Cup - Mini Review

    Quote Originally Posted by amd View Post
    Click image for larger version. 

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    Large expert World Cup. 23.7 lbs out of the box (without pedals).

    Items I added:

    Syntace 110mm stem
    S-works carbon bar
    S-works carbon seatpost
    Romin pro saddle
    Fast trak control 2.2 in front, 2.0 in rear
    ESI grips
    Quarq 34t crankset
    Tubeless
    Xtr pedals
    2 specialized side load water bottles
    Multi tool mounted by the shock
    Garmin heads up mount

    Took the weight down to an even 23lbs. Pretty stoked!
    Is that the 2014 S-Works road seat post?

    I'm thinking that S-Works seat post or a Ritchey Superlogic Carbon in UD finish for mine. I'm happy with my stem, but may go to a Syntace Vector handlebar and cut to 720mm.

    Sent from my HTCONE using Tapatalk
    Enjoy the ride!

  25. #25
    amd
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    No it's probably a 2012? Maybe '11? It's 230g, not exactly feather light. Was thinkng about a kcnc ti post at around 160g...

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    Quote Originally Posted by erichwic View Post
    That is good. Guess I don't have it too bad with mine weighing 23lbs. 1oz. without having to invest in the SL wheelset.
    Scales are kinda like dynos in motorsports, one to the next can give different numbers. Best to compare where you started and where you end up on the same scale. Right around 23 lbs seems to be a realistic spot to end up with these expert world cups. My riding partner did different upgrades than me and he is right in the same ballpark.

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by wsmc42 View Post
    Scales are kinda like dynos in motorsports, one to the next can give different numbers. Best to compare where you started and where you end up on the same scale. Right around 23 lbs seems to be a realistic spot to end up with these expert world cups. My riding partner did different upgrades than me and he is right in the same ballpark.
    To be honest, I couldn't care less right now. I've had the bike since early December and have exactly zero miles on it so dropping a few ounces doesn't help my repair stand that it's still hanging in. I'm so over this long winter here in the northeast. Bring on spring!
    MCH Co-Captain

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    Re: 2014 Epic Expert World Cup - Mini Review

    Quote Originally Posted by erichwic View Post
    To be honest, I couldn't care less right now. I've had the bike since early December and have exactly zero miles on it so dropping a few ounces doesn't help my repair stand that it's still hanging in. I'm so over this long winter here in the northeast. Bring on spring!
    Agreed...#tiredofsnowandcoldweather
    Enjoy the ride!

  29. #29
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    China carbon seat post=180 g, 35 USD ;-)

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    Quick question about tire pressure setup. On my HT I run low pressure ~23/21psi rr/fr, tubeless for normal/dry conditions in Washington DC area singletrack ~145lbs in weight. As a starting point for the EEWC, I'm at 29/27psi rr/fr tubeless. For dual suspension bikes is it normal to ride with more tire pressure since the suspension soaks up the bumps?

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  31. #31
    amd
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    I don't. I run the same in a ht and my wc fs. I'm looking for traction more than anything, so especially in the front, I want all I can get. In fact I'm 160 and ran 22.5/23.5 fr/rr in a dry 6 hour race Saturday. Worked out very well.

  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fureak View Post
    Anyone know the weight difference between the Epic Expert and the Epic Expert WC? I am torn between the two and not sure which one to get!!
    my 2014 epic expert large was 24.08 before I installed the pedals. This included the swat multi tool, cages and chain tool, also includes tubeless tires, roman eve pro saddle and thompson elite setback post. did not include and garmin stuff or spare tube, inflator in swat box. I chose the non wc because i thought it may be more better if i do some 100 mile events. I may need the 2x10 when the wheels are falling off. I rode the WC expert and it felt and looked like a ferrari!
    Epic Flash Boris F65X + road bikes

  33. #33
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    with all the mods you have done you should get a scale. My park tool scale mounts on the stand and it's pretty cool to see what difference every change does or does not make to weight.
    Quote Originally Posted by wsmc42 View Post
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    I've had my WC expert for about a weekend a half. I've got 3 rides on it so far, one being an xc race. So far, I'm really loving it. I am coming from a 2012 epic expert and the WC does all the things I wanted my '12 to do. Biggest improvement has to be the brains. The front end feel is excellent. The bike is more nimble and very responsive. With more saddle time, I'm sure I will get even more comfortable on it.

    The bike is a medium and weighed in at 24lbs 1 oz on the shop scale in stock form with tubes and plastic pedals. I used the home bathroom scale method and got 24.0 lbs. I immediately swapped some parts: 3T 100mm stem, Enve carbon bar, XX1 grip shifter with ESI grips, EC70 carbon seat post, Romin EVO saddle Ti rails, 30 T Wolftooth chainring, Roval SL wheels, Shimano RT 86 brake rotors, Fast Trak rear tire, XTR pedals,2- Zee side loader bottle cages, and added 3M clear protector for cable rub, on top tube and at chain stay near chainring. Using the home scale method, it is right at 23.0. I will stop by the shop and have them check on the fish hook scale. I expected it to be a little lighter, but 23.0 is still pretty light for non S Works FS.
    Epic Flash Boris F65X + road bikes

  34. #34
    amd
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    Quote Originally Posted by donn12 View Post
    my 2014 epic expert large was 24.08 before I installed the pedals. This included the swat multi tool, cages and chain tool, also includes tubeless tires, roman eve pro saddle and thompson elite setback post. did not include and garmin stuff or spare tube, inflator in swat box. I chose the non wc because i thought it may be more better if i do some 100 mile events. I may need the 2x10 when the wheels are falling off. I rode the WC expert and it felt and looked like a ferrari!


    Given that, the WC is lighter. I have a similar setup and mine was lighter than 24 in the WC version by probably .6 lbs.

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by amd View Post
    Given that, the WC is lighter. I have a similar setup and mine was lighter than 24 in the WC version by probably .6 lbs.
    I'm sure my scale vs your scale don't match up. There can be a big difference between scales, especially with the angles necessary to hang these frames. I am pretty sure there is a bigger difference than .6 between the two bikes. From all that I have read the difference is more like 1.5lbs. The WC has a lighter carbon frame material, a carbon rear triangle and the 1x11 setup vs 2x10. In addition, unless you add it the WC doesn't have any of the swat stuff.
    I bought a fancy road bike and liked the one that was .7 lbs much more than the lighter bike so I have not really worried about weight since. I am 190lbs pretty fast on the road bike and unless you were doing 10k of climbing I am convinced that a pound or so doesn't matter at all.

    Over on the weight weenie forum if anyone posts anything other than bare frames with rear derailier hanger and WITHOUT seat post collar they get
    BLASTED!!
    Epic Flash Boris F65X + road bikes

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    Re: 2014 Epic Expert World Cup - Mini Review

    Quote Originally Posted by amd View Post
    I don't. I run the same in a ht and my wc fs. I'm looking for traction more than anything, so especially in the front, I want all I can get. In fact I'm 160 and ran 22.5/23.5 fr/rr in a dry 6 hour race Saturday. Worked out very well.
    Thanks for feedback. I will go lower on psi for next ride.
    Enjoy the ride!

  37. #37
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    Re: 2014 Epic Expert World Cup - Mini Review

    Quote Originally Posted by Fureak View Post
    Anyone know the weight difference between the Epic Expert and the Epic Expert WC? I am torn between the two and not sure which one to get!!
    Different head tube angle, different carbon, epic expert rear triangle is all aluminum, 5mm less travel in WC, WC does not come with SWAT stuff. And WC does not come with a front derailleur mount only a 1xX can be used on WC.
    Last edited by RCMTB; 03-29-2014 at 04:39 AM.
    Enjoy the ride!

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    Re: 2014 Epic Expert World Cup - Mini Review

    Quote Originally Posted by Fureak View Post
    Anyone know the weight difference between the Epic Expert and the Epic Expert WC? I am torn between the two and not sure which one to get!!
    Probably not much of a difference in weight.
    Enjoy the ride!

  39. #39
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    I had a good look at a '14 Epic Expert and an '14 S-Works at a race yesterday. They look great and the SWAT looks well integrated. Hard to tell what real weight difference there was between them and my '11 SW without a scale. I'd be surprised if the '14 SW wasn't lighter and the Expert a little heavier than my bike.

    Didn't help the riders though ;-)

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    I've finally gotten a few rides in and today I decided to run the bike a little softer in the rear and lower tire pressure all around. The bike was awesome and just came alive. I think with the settings down the middle it was a little too stiff for the trail I ride.





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  41. #41
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    I just put together my '14 Epic Expert and out of the box it weighed 25lb13oz with no pedals. after going tubeless and changing to xx cassette, shifters, rear-d, chain, RF-next bars and putting time pedals on it it now weighs 24.0 on the same scale. I did the same "which bike to buy, WC or NonWC debate". But I ride longer races and after talking to our rep I chose the 2x10 with extra travel even though its heavier. After one ride I can tell it's more maneuverable then my niner Air9 RDO was and downhills WAY better! Although I'm going to miss climbing on a 19lb bike!

  42. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by RCMTB View Post
    Different head tube angle, different carbon, epic expert rear triangle is all aluminum, 5mm less travel in WC, WC does not come with SWAT stuff. And WC does not come with a front derailleur mount only a 1xX can be used on WC.
    .....and chainstays are 10mm shorter.
    2016 Yeti SB4.5c
    2014 S-Works Epic WC

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    Re: 2014 Epic Expert World Cup - Mini Review

    Quote Originally Posted by EPICYZ View Post
    .....and chainstays are 10mm shorter.
    Yep, forgot that one...

    I really like this bike. Just starting to get my fitness back from last Fall and am starting to pr various sections of my favorite trail compared to my HT 29er. Climbing is real close, seems faster when descending, but not by a lot over the HT. Thinking maybe I should have gone with an S-Works HT 29er instead since I don't have back issues. I'll see where I am this Fall and see if I go with carbon HT next for next year.

    Also, I ordered a weight scale so should have some weight information soon.
    Enjoy the ride!

  44. #44
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    I have about thirty hours on my Epic Expert WC and it has transformed my riding. Granted, I came off a 2014 Enduro Expert 29 SE, but I haven't climbed like this since I was in my twenties. My riding buddies are playing catch-up and are amazed at how I am crushing them up the climbs and still burning them on the descents. My Enduro was only 29 lbs, and it had 2 x 10, but after riding this Epic, the Enduro rode like a pig. I have all the benefits of the short chain stays on the Epic WC, without the heft and squirrelly slow speed handling of the Enduro. This is a fun bike! I had XX1 on one of my previous bikes and did not like it, but on this lightweight rocket it is perfect. So far I have made the following changes from stock, 2.3 Ground Control fr, 2.0 Captain rr (both tubeless), Thomson 100mm x 10 degree rise stem, Easton EC70 720 mm flat bar, ESI Chunky grips, Easton EC90 Zero seat post, Romin Expert Evo saddle, two Carbon rib cages, S.W.A.T. Multi tool, XTR 970 pedals, Raceface crank boots, and Garmin Edge mount. This bike now weighs 24 lbs even ready to ride. I got it down to 23 lbs even with the stock tires, but they were a little scary for the trails I ride. I always wondered why there were so many Epics on the trails here in Colorado, now I know why!
    Attachment 890768

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