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  1. #1
    bog
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    2013 Specialized Enduro Carbon Frameset - $4000?? WTH!

    This is getting out of control. $4000 should buy a nice bike and not just a frameset! I realize that this is the top end frame and that there are cheaper options but we're talking about Chinese or Taiwanese made frames here. Haven't we gone way past the point of affordability for any person with a decent job?
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    The carbon frame-set is made in Taiwan where their currency keeps going up in value. And as our dollar keeps decreasing... well you get the point. I don't like it either but a lot of people have forgotten how much cheaper Specialized bikes were than other manufacturers; now they are bringing their prices up in line with other companies.

    Hell, I remember when the Demo 8 frame was $2200 retail. Much lower than any other company. Now its $2700, in line with all the other manufacturers.
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  3. #3
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    Not sure where you got your pricing, but the Sworks enduro frameset is $3,300 and includes the CCDB Air, command post, rear axle, and headset w/bearings.

    The carbon SB66 with Fox RP23 shock only is priced at $3,000. Pricey, yeah but not really that out of line with everyone else.

    My 2013 sworks enduro frame will be here early October.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by aappling72 View Post
    Not sure where you got your pricing, but the Sworks enduro frameset is $3,300 and includes the CCDB Air, command post, rear axle, and headset w/bearings.

    The carbon SB66 with Fox RP23 shock only is priced at $3,000. Pricey, yeah but not really that out of line with everyone else.

    My 2013 sworks enduro frame will be here early October.
    It is $4000 for the frame alone per specialized-

    Specialized Bicycle Components

    Complete S-works bike is $10,000

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by forceyoda View Post
    It is $4000 for the frame alone per specialized-

    Specialized Bicycle Components

    Complete S-works bike is $10,000
    Thats weird. I mis-typed, I paid $3,500 plus tax for the sworks enduro Already paid in full and that was why specialized told the dealer I bought it from when I paid. I was right there when he was on the phone. I wonder if it changed or purchases going forward, or if it is a typo? Wow!

  6. #6
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    They probably decided they did not want to sell a frame alone and instead push people to the complete bikes.

    Trek was asking close to 4000 for their frames last year but this year they are not listed.

    A $4,000 frame is bad but i think the s-works complete is a complete ripoff. Even paying full retail for everything you you would not hit $10,000.

  7. #7
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    I think its bull ****. Show me another industry that with the same price increases through out the recession.

    Its seems like the industry wants to keep less people riding their better bikes.

    Couldn't they sell more frames and probably reduce production costs by offering a more reasonable price. Especially on the second or third production runs. Economy of scale?

    It seems like they would rather just match the other guys high end price.

    Rant off


    Who offers the most reasonable upper end carbon frames? FS and HT
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  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by 2bfluid View Post
    Who offers the most reasonable upper end carbon frames? FS and HT
    Probably the Ibis if you want a close apples to apples comparison to the S-works.


    66 carbon $3000
    Ibis Mojo HD $2499
    Intense Carbine $2579
    Nomad Carbon $2800
    Pivot 5.7 carbon $2800
    Transition Covert Carbon- TBD but surely less than $4000
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  9. #9
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    Thx Frc

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  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by 2bfluid View Post

    Its seems like the industry wants to keep less people riding their better bikes.

    Couldn't they sell more frames and probably reduce production costs by offering a more reasonable price.
    Well if everybody could get a S Works then exactly how special would it be then?

    Perhaps Chevrolet will mass produce the Corvette ZR1 so there is so many of them on the market the price will go from $112,000.00 to something more reasonable so I can buy one.

    What your definition of a reasonable price and what someone else's is can be subjective.

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  11. #11
    The Original Suspect
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    Quote Originally Posted by HAL 9000 View Post
    Well if everybody could get a S Works then exactly how special would it be then?


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  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by forceyoda View Post
    Probably the Ibis if you want a close apples to apples comparison to the S-works.


    66 carbon $3000
    Ibis Mojo HD $2499
    Intense Carbine $2579
    Nomad Carbon $2800
    Pivot 5.7 carbon $2800
    Transition Covert Carbon- TBD but surely less than $4000
    Complete Trek Remedy 9.8 w XT level components and reverb stealth $5200
    I was recently in the market for a new frame to replace my 2005 Enduro. I wound up getting the Mojo HD for $2400. But to be fair, I had to pay an extra $400 for the dropper post. Which brings the frame to $2800. Which is still over a grand less than MSRP for the Enduro.

    I've been in the Specialized family for 12 years, and still have a Demo 8, and I was skeptical about ditching the Horst Link... but I gotta say... the Mojo rides beautifully!
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    No evo version?

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    Quote Originally Posted by 2bfluid View Post
    I think its bull ****. Show me another industry that with the same price increases through out the recession.

    Its seems like the industry wants to keep less people riding their better bikes.

    Couldn't they sell more frames and probably reduce production costs by offering a more reasonable price. Especially on the second or third production runs. Economy of scale?
    Very high demand for their bikes. For the past 2 years they have been selling out their top end bikes, they don't even sit around long enough to see the markdowns. PLus it has a CCDB air on the rear, not some mast produced Fox shock that they can get for nothing. The Nomad C is $2900, if you added the CCDB air it would raise the price to around $3400. The only bikes you see sitting around at the end of the year are their lower end models which have been marked down by $1,000.

    Complete Nomad C is $10,100, more than Specialized.

    As long as people rush out to buy, they will keep the price high. Once sells slow up they will have to drop the price.

    But there is also inflation and the dollar losing value. Prices went up about 10% this year, well inflation is increasing around 15% every year for the past 2 years. Mcdonalds has increased pricing on their meals almost by 50 cents, which is about an 8% increase. Bubble gum companies in the past year have decreased the size of their pieces by almost 20%.

    We can guess all we want, but costs continue to go up and prices have gone up with all companies. And as long as demand is high, it won't change.
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  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by camarosam View Post

    As long as people rush out to buy, they will keep the price high.
    it's called exclusivity.

    Specialized was sold out of small 2012 s works epics by January of this year and all s works epics by April

    Want a McLaren S Works Venge? no dice unless you wanted to pay full pop $18K and had a good rapport with your local Specialized shop.

    By keeping the production numbers low you keep exclusivity high.

    look on eBay at what 2011 S Works epics are going for...they keep their value due to their exclusivity.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by 2bfluid View Post
    I think its bull ****. Show me another industry that with the same price increases through out the recession.
    What's the deadline? I need a few hours to put together what will surely be at least a 20+ page document.

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    I think a lot of people have forgotten the concept of supply and demand. Its not like this air, water or milk were talking about here. Hey, I want a new bike this year and don't like the prices either but as a damn good coach says..."It is what it is".

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    There's definitely some sticker shock for both the frame and bike.

    I like the Sworks enduro a lot. But I don't want a command post, and can you even sell one - I mean who buys ten Spec dropper?

    It's not a sweetheart deal, but maybe the handling is there. If so then worth the dough.

    Bike prices in general are out of control. What's funny is when I was a teen racing I used to hate that only the fat old guys who couldn't ride for shiz had the super dope bikes.

    Chances are the only ones that get sold are to kooks that can't jump.

    .... And no one will ever know how it rides...
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  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by forceyoda View Post
    Probably the Ibis if you want a close apples to apples comparison to the S-works.


    66 carbon $3000
    Ibis Mojo HD $2499
    Intense Carbine $2579
    Nomad Carbon $2800
    Pivot 5.7 carbon $2800
    Transition Covert Carbon- TBD but surely less than $4000
    Complete Trek Remedy 9.8 w XT level components and reverb stealth $5200

    I'm sure these bikes would compare better to the Expert level Specialized bikes. The S-Works bikes use different carbon layup. They are definitely not mass produced. Bottom line, if you don't like the price, don't buy it.
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  20. #20
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    Evo is on uk site, change location

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    Quote Originally Posted by Grizzy View Post
    Chances are the only ones that get sold are to kooks that can't jump.

    .... And no one will ever know how it rides...
    Well, I pre-ordered mine last week and I can guarantee that it will see plenty of air time and hard riding. Just because people can afford it doesn't mean we all sit at country clubs and sip on fine wine!

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grizzy View Post
    I like the Sworks enduro a lot. But I don't want a command post, and can you even sell one - I mean who buys ten Spec dropper?
    I don't understand why the Command Post isn't more popular. I love mine.

    The S works is a nice looking bike. It will be interesting to see how many people jump all over 1x11.

  23. #23
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    Im putting 1x11 on my stumpy evo forsure, and either going to build up the sworks enduro frame or just buy the whole bike, was ok with spending about 7500 but now that its 10,000 thats kind of crazy lol!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by bismirle View Post
    I don't understand why the Command Post isn't more popular. I love mine.

    The S works is a nice looking bike. It will be interesting to see how many people jump all over 1x11.
    I've had my command post blacklite for two months now, works great. No complaints.
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  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by camarosam View Post
    PLus it has a CCDB air on the rear, not some mast produced Fox shock that they can get for nothing. The Nomad C is $2900, if you added the CCDB air it would raise the price to around $3400.
    I'm sure if they're making enough CCDB's for Specialized, they must be mass producing those, as well.
    And they're not $500 more than the Fox shocks - retail pricing is about $200 difference.
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    Quote Originally Posted by dbabuser View Post
    I'm sure if they're making enough CCDB's for Specialized, they must be mass producing those, as well.
    And they're not $500 more than the Fox shocks - retail pricing is about $200 difference.
    True, but Fox probably sells 10 times as many shocks as Cane Creek, thats the mass production I'm talking about. They are selling so many that they can give Bike manufacturers lower prices that will make up in quantity. On the other hand I'm pretty sure Cane Creek worked out a deal with Specialized, but still no where at the price level they can get the Fox shocks for. So $500 is a bit liberal on my part, but you don't kow how much they are buying the Cane Creek shocks for as apposed to Fox. And how much lost they are covering to make up in sales.
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  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doedrums View Post
    I'm sure these bikes would compare better to the Expert level Specialized bikes. The S-Works bikes use different carbon layup. They are definitely not mass produced. Bottom line, if you don't like the price, don't buy it.
    Not quite, check the site the sworks and expert have the same frame. Also another point is the 4000 dollar enduro is not even full carbon but many of its competitors are for $1000 less.

  28. #28
    bog
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    Quote Originally Posted by vikingboy View Post
    Evo is on uk site, change location
    I look at English speaking sites only (Can & US).

    If I'm not mistaken that's the old EVO.
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  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by forceyoda View Post
    Not quite, check the site the sworks and expert have the same frame. Also another point is the 4000 dollar enduro is not even full carbon but many of its competitors are for $1000 less.
    Your point is? Specialized sells a handfull of S-Works bikes each year. They are not bread and butter models. All the griping about prices is silly. Do you complain because Chevy sells a $100k Corvette on the same lot as a $14k Sonic? If you don't like it, buy something else. It won't make a difference. All the S-Works bikes will sell out for 2013, just like 2012.
    Last edited by Doedrums; 09-02-2012 at 07:19 PM.
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  30. #30
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    I think 2012 prices were great, and those were still ridiculously expensive but very competitive. I will probably buy a 2012 enduro evo and that will be it for the rest of my life...mtbs are going the way of the auto industry. Soon there will be a cash for clunkers MTB style lol
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  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by dbabuser View Post
    I'm sure if they're making enough CCDB's for Specialized, they must be mass producing those, as well.
    The CCDB is still assembled by hand in Fletcher, North Carolina. If you haven't had the opportunity to try one out yet, put it on your to do list, they're very impressive pieces of equipment.

  32. #32
    bog
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doedrums View Post
    Uh, yes quite. Specialized sells a handfull of S-Works bikes each year. They are not bread and butter models. All the griping about prices is silly. Do you complain because Chevy sells a $100k Corvette on the same lot as a $14k Sonic? If you don't like it, buy something else. It won't make a difference. All the S-Works bikes will sell out for 2013, just like 2012.
    I think you're missing the point of the thread. Nobody is comparing an S-Works frame to a low end Specialized bike. The point is that the cost is very, very high when what you're getting is basically a mildly revised Enduro Carbon frame with a different paint job and it still has an aluminum back end. Believe what you want but there is nothing all that special about this frame compared to others that are much cheaper.

    It's not like Specialized is even offering an option to this frameset. Buy our complete bike or that's it is the message so it chases people away from the brand over to other brands that offer very similar performance for better value.

    BTW, a $100k Corvette is special in many, many ways when compared to other cars in GM's lineup, even the standard Corvette so you're not even talking apples to apples in this argument.
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  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by bog View Post
    I think you're missing the point of the thread. Nobody is comparing an S-Works frame to a low end Specialized bike. The point is that the cost is very, very high when what you're getting is basically a mildly revised Enduro Carbon frame with a different paint job and it still has an aluminum back end. Believe what you want but there is nothing all that special about this frame compared to others that are much cheaper.

    It's not like Specialized is even offering an option to this frameset. Buy our complete bike or that's it is the message so it chases people away from the brand over to other brands that offer very similar performance for better value.

    BTW, a $100k Corvette is special in many, many ways when compared to other cars in GM's lineup, even the standard Corvette so you're not even talking apples to apples in this argument.
    I get the point of this thread. Gripe for the sake of griping. All of the top end bikes from every major company out there are super expensive but sell in very limited numbers. Does it really make a difference to anyone but a bunch of bike nerds on the internet? Not really. The majority of bikes sold are less than $1000 so what happens at the top of the market makes no difference in the grand scheme. The average schmoe thinks we are idiots for spending 3 grand on a bike. Heck, they think $500 is crazy. Much less buying a bare frame and "building" a bike. The folks buying this stuff are in the minority. Be glad that there are enough folks that want the "best" so the tech trickles down to the lower models in a few years. Makes the reasonably priced bikes better.
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  34. #34
    bog
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    I'm one of those folks that want the best and normally I can afford it but there is a limit. I've spent much of my career in the R&D and manufacturing industry (including contract work in the bike industry) so I have a very good idea what things cost. When someone comes out with a $4000 frame that costs a fraction of that to manufacture overseas it doesn't add up anymore whether or not they sell out the limited number that they produce.
    This generally isn't a site for the average Joe who wants a cheap bike from Walmart or an entry level bike from their LBS. Most of us are avid cyclists with way too much money spent on our hobby. Specialized should know that this has gotten out of reach of most of the avid mountain bikers and is out of line with the rest of the industry. That's what this thread is about.
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  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by bog View Post
    I'm one of those folks that want the best and normally I can afford it but there is a limit. I've spent much of my career in the R&D and manufacturing industry (including contract work in the bike industry) so I have a very good idea what things cost. When someone comes out with a $4000 frame that costs a fraction of that to manufacture overseas it doesn't add up anymore whether or not they sell out the limited number that they produce.
    This generally isn't a site for the average Joe who wants a cheap bike from Walmart or an entry level bike from their LBS. Most of us are avid cyclists with way too much money spent on our hobby. Specialized should know that this has gotten out of reach of most of the avid mountain bikers and is out of line with the rest of the industry. That's what this thread is about.
    How dare they build something that is out of your price range!! The nerve! Again, compare how many bikes are sold in a year and their pricepoints. Spesh is no different than any other mainstream manufacturer. So what if they have an ultra expensive line? They sell out so somebody is buying them. It seems that people forget that bike companies are a business and are ultimately in it to make money. At the end of the day, profit lets you keep the lights on and hopefully develop new product. I hope they contimue to sell $10k bikes to anyone willing to pony up the cash.

    BTW, is Giant out of touch because they sell a $9k Anthem X Advanced 29er?
    Last edited by Doedrums; 09-02-2012 at 08:19 PM.
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  36. #36
    bog
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    Your reading comprehension is awful ... again. I never said that this frame is over the limit that I can afford and if you kept reading you would have figured out that it is the value of the frame that all of us find ridiculous. Missed the point again but that's to be expected given your track record.
    If you think that these really expensive frames and bikes are a drop in the bucket and contribute more than a minute amount to Specialized's bottom line you have some thinking to do.
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