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  1. #1
    hispanic mechanic
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    Jones H-bar vs. WTB DirtDrops?

    Once again, I'm planning the build on a new bike. Has anyone used both the Jones bar as well as the DirtDrop? Anyone care to compare/contrast? Preferences?
    I'm leaning towards the Jones, partly because it seems like a good idea, partly due to the fact that he seems like a good guy, and I like to help out good guys.
    T.I.A.,

    The Los

    BTW, in case anyone's wondering why, all of the sudden, I'm capitalizing things, it's 'cause I just found the shift button
    Actually, I read a few other posts in all lower case, and found them kinda hard to read. Hmmmmm, maybe all those English teachers were right after all...
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  2. #2
    Nouveau Retrogrouch SuperModerator
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    Quote Originally Posted by sslos
    Once again, I'm planning the build on a new bike. Has anyone used both the Jones bar as well as the DirtDrop? Anyone care to compare/contrast? Preferences?
    I'm leaning towards the Jones, partly because it seems like a good idea, partly due to the fact that he seems like a good guy, and I like to help out good guys.
    T.I.A.,

    The Los
    I have used both. Much prefer the drop bars. They suit my riding style much better. The Jones bars are much better than straight bars for me, just not as good as drops.
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  3. #3
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    Jones for me

    I find the H bar much more comfortable for a bigger person. The Dirt Drops are good but just a bit narrow, I'm 6'2" and 265lbs.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by sslos
    Once again, I'm planning the build on a new bike. Has anyone used both the Jones bar as well as the DirtDrop? Anyone care to compare/contrast? Preferences?
    I'm leaning towards the Jones, partly because it seems like a good idea, partly due to the fact that he seems like a good guy, and I like to help out good guys.
    T.I.A.,

    The Los

    BTW, in case anyone's wondering why, all of the sudden, I'm capitalizing things, it's 'cause I just found the shift button
    Actually, I read a few other posts in all lower case, and found them kinda hard to read. Hmmmmm, maybe all those English teachers were right after all...
    The WTB's are nice but I prefer the Jones bars. The option of different hand positions, being able to use a regular brake lever and not having to have an ugly tall stem (or headtube 12" long)

    I loved the WTB's on a Cyclo-cross bike, but for MTB's I think the Jones is the way to go.

    Just my $0.02

    SSP
    "Put any one on one of these singlespeed bikes and they could not help but have fun"
    -
    Otis Guy talking about klunkers c1976

  5. #5
    mtbr member
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    I like the Jones bar more than the WTB Drops, but it's a personal thing.

    The area between my thumbs and index fingers get all painful when using drops (road or dirt) and roadie brake levers. It's just something about the motion and/or position of roadie levers and drops that cause pain in that area.

    In addition, I like the Jones more because of the multiple hand positions. I couldn't get comfy with other positions on the WTB's except for the main drop hand position. The hoods are hard to ride because of the angles compared to roadie drops.

    Like I said, this is just my personal experience and it's subjective and specific to my hands and their comfort. There are other riders out there who love the WTB's, like the Shiggster for example.

    SSP said it, you can run any kind of mtn brake lever with the Jones, including hydraulic disc levers. On the WTB's, I was limited to road levers (I ran the levers that had enough pull for V's).

    I've ridden many types of bars in my 10+ years of riding and I have to say that the Jones are my favorite to date. I like these so much, that I am thinking about mounting on my road bike aswell.
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  6. #6
    Recovering couch patato
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    I'm fascinated with those Jones bars. Question to Jones bar owners : what does it do with your required stem length over a regular flatbar? It seems your hands are neared to your seat with Jones bars. Thanks in advance!

    J
    Klok - XC - Skate - Ski

  7. #7
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    Most people I know using them have added 10 to 20mm to there usual stem length.

    In the same way as you use a long stem on your KM because of the sweep on your bars.

    P::..

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by nightfire
    Most people I know using them have added 10 to 20mm to there usual stem length.

    In the same way as you use a long stem on your KM because of the sweep on your bars.

    P::..

    Yep went from a 110mm stem with the flat bars to a 130mm with the Jones Bars

    SSP
    "Put any one on one of these singlespeed bikes and they could not help but have fun"
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    Otis Guy talking about klunkers c1976

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by sslos
    Once again, I'm planning the build on a new bike. Has anyone used both the Jones bar as well as the DirtDrop? Anyone care to compare/contrast? Preferences?
    I'm leaning towards the Jones, partly because it seems like a good idea, partly due to the fact that he seems like a good guy, and I like to help out good guys.
    Don't leave Salsa Bell Lap bars out of the question here. I use my Bell Laps like a crack baby head.

    Ihave them on my mountain bike now, and also on my Surly Pacer. Wide, nice flares, and they are just nicely comfortable. Oh, and they're less expensive too!

  10. #10
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    Jones!

    I'm quite happy to say I can now comment on the Jones bars from 1st hand experience. I've spent 17 years being dissatisfied with all manner of handlebars, and when I first saw the Jones I began to suspect that my woes were over. I've now owned an H-bar for all of 5 days thanks to an unreasonably generious birthday gift from my wife.

    Anyway, the Jones bars feel alot like a WTB drop, IMO. It's just a heck of a lot easier to get them in the ideal position without assorted trickery. I had been running a riser bar with a 120mm 6 deg. stem on my Karate Monkey. I swapped that for a 135mm 6 deg with the Jones bar and the position seems spot on.

    The "main" gripping position feels like the WTB bar, as I said, and it puts your upper body in a similar position to how a lot of people seem to set up a riser bar.

    If you grab a little farther forward--at the "T" on each side it feels a lot like grabbing the brake hoods on a road bike. I find myself using this grip for out-of-the-saddle climbing.

    I've also found at least 3 other distinct hand positons that I can shift around to on smooth flat sections of trail or road so I can ward of numb hands much longer than with other bars.

    If you order some from Jeff he sends you a couple of pages of pictures of the bars in action that will give you some ideas about set up, gripping options, etc.

    Best. $170 my wife ever spent, as far as I'm concerned. If they were cheaper, I'd be ordering another set for my road bike. . .

  11. #11
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    Second vote for the Salsas

    Quote Originally Posted by ernesto_from_Wisconsin
    Don't leave Salsa Bell Lap bars out of the question here. I use my Bell Laps like a crack baby head.

    Ihave them on my mountain bike now, and also on my Surly Pacer. Wide, nice flares, and they are just nicely comfortable. Oh, and they're less expensive too!
    I had a set on my cross bike and loved them, I will probably have a pair on my 29er depending if Brant ever gets my WTB's back

    The Jones are great on bikes not built for drop bars (Eg regular MTBs) and you can use std. MTB brake levers.

    If you are getting a custom frame done, the builder can raise the front end up to allow you to run a drop-bar with out resorting to 40deg+ stems

    My Matt Chester will stay with the Jones Bars, but the Ferrous 29er will be drop specific bike for "epic" rides.

    Horses for courses

    SSP
    "Put any one on one of these singlespeed bikes and they could not help but have fun"
    -
    Otis Guy talking about klunkers c1976

  12. #12
    giddy up!
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    Yo....

    ....I still have that set of Jones H-bars in steel if you want to borrow them for a bit to get a feel for them. If you've never ridden dirt drops I have a set of them you could BORROW:-) for a while too.

    For all around off road fun, I think I prefered the H-bar.

    Are we still thinking seven?


    Quote Originally Posted by sslos
    Once again, I'm planning the build on a new bike. Has anyone used both the Jones bar as well as the DirtDrop? Anyone care to compare/contrast? Preferences?
    I'm leaning towards the Jones, partly because it seems like a good idea, partly due to the fact that he seems like a good guy, and I like to help out good guys.
    T.I.A.,

    The Los

    BTW, in case anyone's wondering why, all of the sudden, I'm capitalizing things, it's 'cause I just found the shift button
    Actually, I read a few other posts in all lower case, and found them kinda hard to read. Hmmmmm, maybe all those English teachers were right after all...
    www.thepathbikeshop.com

  13. #13
    mtbr member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cloxxki
    ...Question to Jones bar owners : what does it do with your required stem length over a regular flatbar?...
    You need to mount a longer stem to compensate for the 45deg sweeps that brings your hands closer to your body if using a normal stem.

    The longer stems puts your hands back where there would be if you were riding a regular bar. I find the front just was easy to lift for hops and small drops (1 footers or less)

    I went from a 110mm to a 135mm stem and it feels great. Here's a pic (WARNING: Gearie bike shown!).

    These bars have improved my bike's handling. I have better control, especially in slow techinial sections. It's easier to rock the bike side to side with the sweep handlebar positions. This makes it easier to say, do a trackstand, for me at least.

    On a humorous note, you WILL get a lot of questions about these bars on the trail and at the shop. I've become known as the rider with those "weird" bars. The gamut has been from "man these feel so natural" to "I wouldn't ride those if I were you, they look dangerous". The dangerous comment always makes me laugh.
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    Last edited by dirtpaws; 07-23-2004 at 01:25 PM. Reason: Added another pic
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  14. #14
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    missing some information and a thought.

    Wow! Those H bars seem awefully cool, but I simply have never heard of or seen the other bars being mentioned here... Does anyone have pictures or links to them?

    on the thought note... I wondered if the H bar could be made in the opposite direction, it'd look more like bull horns then. But, I'd think then you'd be pushed to actually run shorter stem lengths which in turn should slow your steering down and prevent up-hill wandering. It seems like most people don't have that problem on their bikes, but like I said this was just thinking out loud.

    T.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by sengert
    Wow! Those H bars seem awefully cool, but I simply have never heard of or seen the other bars being mentioned here... Does anyone have pictures or links to them?...
    Did someone say pictures?:





    As for the Jones, front end wandering is non existence. It my have to do with my setup. I do ride a Psylo and crank it down to 80mm when climbing. I keep it at 100mm other wise. I'll try climbing in 100mm and let you know if it wanders then.

    The Jones Bars come in three designs. The simplest is the one I have in the pic posted in my other post. The next ones have a straight extension in the front for a another hand position. The last ones have a curve to the extensions. Check out Jeff's site for pics.

    One thing to note to is how your like your bars set up in relation to your seat height? With the Jones, its easy to set them to be seat level if you don't like riding with your bars too low. The WTB's are really meant to be ridden lower than seat level and it's going to be a chore find a stem that rise it as high as seat level.
    Last edited by dirtpaws; 07-23-2004 at 12:44 PM. Reason: added more pics
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  16. #16
    Nouveau Retrogrouch SuperModerator
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    Quote Originally Posted by ernesto_from_Wisconsin
    Don't leave Salsa Bell Lap bars out of the question here. I use my Bell Laps like a crack baby head.

    I have them on my mountain bike now, and also on my Surly Pacer. Wide, nice flares, and they are just nicely comfortable. Oh, and they're less expensive too!
    I used to use the Bell Laps on my road bike and "Adventure Bike". The ergo shape makes my hands go numb so both bikes now have WTB drops.

    My take on the Jones bars is they are great if you are coming from straight bars. If you are experienced with drops in the dirt the WTBs are better.
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  17. #17
    Nouveau Retrogrouch SuperModerator
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    Quote Originally Posted by sengert
    Wow! Those H bars seem awefully cool, but I simply have never heard of or seen the other bars being mentioned here... Does anyone have pictures or links to them?

    on the thought note... I wondered if the H bar could be made in the opposite direction, it'd look more like bull horns then. But, I'd think then you'd be pushed to actually run shorter stem lengths which in turn should slow your steering down and prevent up-hill wandering. It seems like most people don't have that problem on their bikes, but like I said this was just thinking out loud.

    T.
    As long as your hands are in the same place there is no change in the steering. It does not matter how the position is achieved - long stem, back sweep bar; medium stem, straight bar; short stem, forward reach bar - all the same in the end.
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  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by sslos
    Once again, I'm planning the build on a new bikel...
    Speaking of which, did you the Jones "One" or the Seven frame? Did you make up to Medford for a test ride with Jeff?
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  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by shiggy©®™
    As long as your hands are in the same place there is no change in the steering. It does not matter how the position is achieved - long stem, back sweep bar; medium stem, straight bar; short stem, forward reach bar - all the same in the end.
    Shiggy,

    I'm having trouble agreeing with that on one ground in particular, the stem length makes a longer or shorter moment arm (physics speak, not knowing you or how much you know). Basically a longer stem requires less force to turn the fork and a shorter stem requires more... granted we're talking pretty small diffferences here, but noticeabl to the human hands, especially as you get tired or as the ground rises up!

    The only thing I could think would be different is perhaps that it's all cummalitive, stem + handlebar lengths... you know now that I'm talking it through that has to be! On the road one of the excercises I learned in order to turn around and check cars/riders behind me without wandering out into the lane is to move one hand in toward the stem and then rotate around to the other side (looking over the free hand/shoulder)... this method is naturally more stable. So, there! HA! I proved myself wrong!!! *shaking head*

    So, in the end all that really maters is hand distance from the center of the steering tube, the degree of bend so your wrists/hands are comfy, and the rise so your back and butt are comfy... anything else?

    Thanks for listening!
    T.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by sengert
    ...So, in the end all that really maters is hand distance from the center of the steering tube, the degree of bend so your wrists/hands are comfy, and the rise so your back and butt are comfy... anything else?
    Shoot Jeff an email. He's a super nice guy and seems to like talking about bikes as much as next guy here on mtbr.
    Ask what his thoughts are on the subject at hand, I am sure he has it figured out and you'll get the skinny straight from the horse's mouth.

    You can get his email from his site: www.jonesbikes.com

    - Dirtpaws
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  21. #21
    Nouveau Retrogrouch SuperModerator
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    Quote Originally Posted by sengert
    Shiggy,

    I'm having trouble agreeing with that on one ground in particular, the stem length makes a longer or shorter moment arm (physics speak, not knowing you or how much you know). Basically a longer stem requires less force to turn the fork and a shorter stem requires more... granted we're talking pretty small diffferences here, but noticeabl to the human hands, especially as you get tired or as the ground rises up!

    The only thing I could think would be different is perhaps that it's all cummalitive, stem + handlebar lengths... you know now that I'm talking it through that has to be! On the road one of the excercises I learned in order to turn around and check cars/riders behind me without wandering out into the lane is to move one hand in toward the stem and then rotate around to the other side (looking over the free hand/shoulder)... this method is naturally more stable. So, there! HA! I proved myself wrong!!! *shaking head*

    So, in the end all that really maters is hand distance from the center of the steering tube, the degree of bend so your wrists/hands are comfy, and the rise so your back and butt are comfy... anything else?

    Thanks for listening!
    T.
    The effective moment arm length is the straight line distance from the center of the steerer tube to the hands regardless of the shape of the stem and bars.

    This is also why those "L" and "Z" shaped crankarms that claim to increase power are just heavier. You have to measure straight from the BB to the pedal, not along the length and shape of the arm.
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  22. #22
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    Hey that's a handy informative diagram. Excellent.
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  23. #23
    SSped
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    I am still looking

    I have been really looking for a set of WTB bars for a few months now with out any luck. So once again I ask" Is anyone willing to part ways with a set of WTB drop Bars." The Gunnar should be here in a month to put them on.

    Thanks
    SSped

  24. #24
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    Email me your return address on Tuesday morning Alex. Then it will be fresh in my mind and we'll get them back to you.

    Anyhow, I can't believe we've got this far down the page without mentioning moustache bars - which I see as a much closer comparison to Jones bars.

    I'm LOVING mine, though I am working on a "3pc welded bar" as well.

    Me and my flying moustache in a great UK summer race.
    http://www.bikemagic.com/ephotos/SSMM04/DSC_5286.JPG

  25. #25
    artistic...
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    Quote Originally Posted by brant@on-one.co.uk
    Email me your return address on Tuesday morning Alex. Then it will be fresh in my mind and we'll get them back to you.

    Anyhow, I can't believe we've got this far down the page without mentioning moustache bars - which I see as a much closer comparison to Jones bars.

    I'm LOVING mine, though I am working on a "3pc welded bar" as well.

    Me and my flying moustache in a great UK summer race.
    http://www.bikemagic.com/ephotos/SSMM04/DSC_5286.JPG
    ultegra (probably) shifters make the best argument ever for a singlespeed. yuk! what if they work and i'm full of?
    want: Ibis ti handlebar. suntour 31.8 front derr. bottom pull

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