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  1. #1
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    inbred 29 SS vs KM

    Yes, I searched. Found a lot of info, much of which i already know. Now, I'm looking for opinions....

    Which of these frames to build up? I intend to stay fully rigid, SS, mostly parts-bin build with new wheels/tires. I'm in a weird place, bike-wise, but here's the pros/cons as I see it:

    KM:
    +++ Comes with matching fork, can buy it at the lbs, I like the bent seat-tube/431mm chainstays for a shorter wheelbase and (presumably) agile handling (1degree steeper head angle, too)---i suspect that it'll take fatter tires than the inbred

    Inbred SS
    +++ Cheaper, no derailer cable bosses to look funny while empty, b!tchin wishbone rear end, i like the white paintjob

    Basically, the geometry is probably the biggest deal here. They both have the same build requirements, so it's not like there's any considerations as to what parts on-hand will fit. Weight isn't a big consideration, either, but I think the KM has got to be heavier. (Probably not by much.) I like to buy from my LBS when I can, so i don't feel like a ****** when i stop in on some bike I never bought from them...

    Biggest question, perhaps, is: will 14mm of chainstay make that big of a difference? And, if so, which would be preferable? FWIW, i live in NJ, my trails tend to be sorta flat, often rooty, sometimes sandy. I'm a fat guy and would get either frame in the 18" size....

    Thanks!
    -rob

  2. #2
    SS in CO
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    I rode a geared Inbred for about 2 years and really loved it. rode real nice (both rigid and w/suspension) and felt quick. there seemed to be plenty of room for tires in the back as long as you had the stays slid out. I rode the crap out of that bike until the frame broke.

    last year I basically stole a KM from a bike swap meet and rode it for a good couple of months. it was set up pretty close to my Inbred w/the exception of the rim brakes, grip shifters and different handlebars. it was rigid. I liked it, but not as much as my Inbred. I felt like it was a little more sluggish in the turning category. granted, I only owned it for a few months and rode it mostly on the street for fun...I did hit the trails a handful of times, but not ever more than just the easy local trails.

    if you get the Inbred, get the On-One fork as well...I hear that makes the Inbred handle even better.

    J.
    are you a bike shop owner? or a custom builder? I want to talk to you about your website

  3. #3
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    I might grab the same On One SS only frame and carbon fork to build up a leftovers parts bin bike too. I'd also be interested in hearing comparisons.

  4. #4
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    I've not ridden a 29 Inbred, but I've got a 26" version. Nice finish and quality, especially at the price (I think I paid $250 shipped years ago). Good tire clearance and I do like the geo. One nit-pick is the stupid rear brake mounts. Since they put it between the chain/seat stays, you have to use hydro brakes (BB7's will work with some MacGuyvering, but I couldn't get it set up right). Other than that, I think it's a great bang/buck.

    Surly is a good frame as well. Slightly more XC than Inbred, but about the same. Heftier frame, which could be a good thing.

    My opinion is, I'd get the Inbred solely based on cost. You can get a frame + On One carbon fork for less than the KM frameset. With that said, I would personally wait for the Surly Krampus and build that up.

  5. #5
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    Funny, I got flamed and neg rep'ed for asking the same question about a year ago.
    I went with the Inbred and haven't looked back. I liked that first Inbred so much that I immediately sold my X-Caliber and built up another rigid geared Inbred, then a front suspension geared Inbred, then a drop bar monstercross Inbred.
    If you're building a larger frame up, the BB7 problem can be solved using a hex bolt for the cable bolt. Otherwise, using a 180 rear disk solves it as well.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by surreal View Post
    Inbred SS
    +++ Cheaper, no derailer cable bosses to look funny while empty, b!tchin wishbone rear end,
    I read somewhere the wishbone rear end on Inbred isn't for big boys. I'd considered between the two as well, and though Inbred is cheaper, it would be in $400 range with a fork, and like you said, KM is readily available from my LBS, so I'm currently leaning towards KM (currently on 2010 Kona Unit, considering either 2012 Unit or KM frame build up).
    Ghisallo Wheels

    I'm really good looking.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slash5 View Post
    Funny, I got flamed and neg rep'ed for asking the same question about a year ago.
    I went with the Inbred and haven't looked back. I liked that first Inbred so much that I immediately sold my X-Caliber and built up another rigid geared Inbred, then a front suspension geared Inbred, then a drop bar monstercross Inbred.
    If you're building a larger frame up, the BB7 problem can be solved using a hex bolt for the cable bolt. Otherwise, using a 180 rear disk solves it as well.
    Which frames do you have? Do you happen to know if an 18" frame can except a 160 BB7 rotor?

  8. #8
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    Jabberwocky.
    Pedal through it!

  9. #9
    CB2
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    I don't have any experience with the Inbred, but I loved my KM. I equated it's handling to a Camaro (or your sister); a little loose, a little unrefined, and fun to throw around.

  10. #10
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    Love my SS white inbred. I've used it with a 80mm pushed fox rlt 29 and black ops carbon fork and feels great with both. I use elixir cr's 180/180 and it's never failed me.

  11. #11
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    I love the KM for eastern PA singletrack (probably similar to what you've got in Jersey) but suspect either would serve you well.

    I've heard *great* things about the jabberwocky - looked like vassago was out of commission for a while but glad to see their site is back up. My friend went from a KM (which he sold to me) to a jabber and absolutely loves it. It has a lower BB and longer chainstays than the Karate Monkey, which gives a very stable ride but makes clearing obstacles a bit tougher. This is great for him (he lives a couple miles from white clay creek) but would cause some problems for my normal riding.
    Yeah I only carry cans cause I'm a weight weenie.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by SS Hack View Post
    Which frames do you have? Do you happen to know if an 18" frame can except a 160 BB7 rotor?
    It's a 19.5 SS LTD. The cable pinch bolt is very close - I'd recommend the 180 or another brake.
    I'll post a picture later.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slash5 View Post
    It's a 19.5 SS LTD. The cable pinch bolt is very close - I'd recommend the 180 or another brake.
    I'll post a picture later.
    Thanks, so the 180 is no problem?

  14. #14
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    ...or go with hydros of any size. I still used a 160mm BB7, and it was a minor inconvenience on my 16" Inbred.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by SS Hack View Post
    Thanks, so the 180 is no problem?
    Haven't done it myself but see this thread.
    BB7 rear won't fit my Inbred 29er swapout

    Search here sucks but try a Google with "bb7 site:http://forums.mtbr.com/one"
    A few other threads there.

  16. #16
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    I dont have any experience with the KM but I can tell you that I have been thouroughly pleased with my Inbred. I am using Marta SL brakes and had to take a little material off of the rear slider to get it to work.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails inbred 29 SS vs KM-inbredii.jpg  


  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slash5 View Post
    Funny, I got flamed and neg rep'ed for asking the same question about a year ago....
    I've found that, on virtually ALL online forums, piles of ppl anxiously await the chance to flame ppl for asking questions that they feel are redundant. Never mind that these responses
    are far more redundant and banal than virtually any other cloned question/thread; they do it anyway. That's why I do a search first, and preemptively mention that search before I ask a question. It placates most of them, but it is tedious and kind of annoying in and of itself. (Really, if one hates seeing the same question more than once, one might wanna avoid online forums entirely....OR maybe just don't click on threads that look like something you've seen before, right?)

    Regardless, thanks for your advice/input on the Inbred. Muchly appreciated.

  18. #18
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    Thank you, everyone, for your well-considered responses. As of right now, I'm leaning towards the KM b/c I'm thinking the lbs needs my cash and probably deserves it more. OTOH, the Inbred certainly has more fans here, and that is most likely deserved. (I'd counted out the Jabberwocky, as I'd thought that Vassago had gone the way of the buffalo, but I'll look into it...)

    rob

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by surreal View Post
    Thank you, everyone, for your well-considered responses. As of right now, I'm leaning towards the KM b/c I'm thinking the lbs needs my cash and probably deserves it more. OTOH, the Inbred certainly has more fans here, and that is most likely deserved. (I'd counted out the Jabberwocky, as I'd thought that Vassago had gone the way of the buffalo, but I'll look into it...)

    rob
    oooh, the Jabber. The new Vassago has gotten some folks interested again, including myself. I'm actually wrapping up a nos Jabber as we speak. Since I dumped it (like a lot of us did), I've tried a few frames, including the Inbred, and Niner, but I still kept thinking about it each time I went out on another frame. In other words, lots of us have regretted letting it go in the first place. I figured this new Jabber will do for now until the new frames roll out and I figure out which one I want to go with. Who knows, maybe a new jabber design will show up soon like the new Bander. In any case, since you mentioned it, definitely give Vassago a look. So far, the new reps have been great.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by goldenaustin View Post
    oooh, the Jabber. The new Vassago has gotten some folks interested again, including myself. I'm actually wrapping up a nos Jabber as we speak. Since I dumped it (like a lot of us did), I've tried a few frames, including the Inbred, and Niner, but I still kept thinking about it each time I went out on another frame. In other words, lots of us have regretted letting it go in the first place. I figured this new Jabber will do for now until the new frames roll out and I figure out which one I want to go with. Who knows, maybe a new jabber design will show up soon like the new Bander. In any case, since you mentioned it, definitely give Vassago a look. So far, the new reps have been great.
    Why dump a frame because the company went under anyway? They seemed to make some good frames, it's great they're back on track.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by SS Hack View Post
    Why dump a frame because the company went under anyway? They seemed to make some good frames, it's great they're back on track.
    it was probably a rhetorical question, but I'll answer anyway.... combination of things, mainly 1) financial reasons (house purchase), 2) trimming the herd (see #1), 3) no more company means no more warranty, which means no riding (see #1 and #2). Take my word, I would still have the frame otherwise, and "gsteitz", would be riding something crappy instead. haha.

    ...and yes they do make good frames, and geometry seems to be a big plus for a lot of folks.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by goldenaustin View Post
    ...
    ...and yes they do make good frames, and geometry seems to be a big plus for a lot of folks.
    I've yet to try the geometry of the jabberwocky, but I think it presents an interesting case on paper. They took a different approach by going long and low, and i think that'd address some of the things about past 29ers that I never warmed up to.

    And, being that they've got tan framesets on special at the vassago site for @$400***EDIT: $400 is frame-only; $550 for the F/F (which is an OK deal, but not exactly "in the thick of the price battle"*** , it puts them right in the thick of the price battle. Sure, it'd be cheaper to go on-one SS with a project2 fork, but only @$100 once you factor in shipping... And, sure, my LBS gives me a nice discount, but the $475 full retail for the KM, it won't beat the jabber on price, either...(My discount ain't that good, and if it were, it would sorta negate the "feel good about supporting the lbs" argument..)

    Hmmmm
    Last edited by surreal; 11-17-2012 at 06:15 AM.

  23. #23
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    Don't hold the Jabber back based on how the geometry looks on paper. I ride some fairly rocky single track here in central Texas and this bike by no means holds me back. It just works.
    Pedal through it!

  24. #24
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    I had a Jabber for a season and I personally didn't like it. Long and low is definitely what it felt like. It was like riding a canoe. Big negative for me was on the climbs. Longer CS meant you had to shift your weight way back to get some bite.

    But many others really like that geo, so it just depends on your riding style.

    BTW, bicycleoutfittersindy has the KM frame set for ~$400 ($475 + 15% off coupon). Maybe your lbs can match.

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by phsycle View Post
    I had a Jabber for a season and I personally didn't like it. Long and low is definitely what it felt like. It was like riding a canoe. Big negative for me was on the climbs. Longer CS meant you had to shift your weight way back to get some bite.

    But many others really like that geo, so it just depends on your riding style.

    BTW, bicycleoutfittersindy has the KM frame set for ~$400 ($475 + 15% off coupon). Maybe your lbs can match.
    You mean it didn't ride like a steel hardtail?


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