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  1. #1
    Baby Bear is in the house
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    Budget EBB frames? (e.g. Raleigh XXIX)

    I've done a limited search of currently available off-the-shelf SS bikes that are in the "fairly affordable" bracket, and noticed only the Raleigh XXIX sports an EBB. As my search was "limited," I could have overlooked other options.

    Are there any other stock SS frames/bikes in this price range (sub $800?) that feature EBBs?

    Raleigh XXIX owners, how are your EBBs holding up?
    Better to have and not need it, than to need it and not have it.

  2. #2
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    Carver 96er frames are only $399. I "think" that you can actually fit a 650b rear wheel in them.

  3. #3
    what nice teeth you have
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    Jenson was selling Zion 660 ebb's for a while. At first they were $250 for the frame then went down to <$150. As of now they are not selling them but you might to keep an eye out.

  4. #4
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    The 2008 GT Peace 9r has an Ebb, mine has held up fine.

  5. #5
    You know, for kids
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    OS Blackbuck

    osbikes.com


    There's only one size, though. 18.5"
    disclaimer: I sell and repair bicycles

  6. #6
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    Soul Cycles Hooligan (26") and Dillenger (29")
    http://ridesoul.com/

  7. #7
    i call it a kaiser blade
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    i have a zion 29er ebb frame.

    it was only 120 bucks.

    it's a good bike, i just don't have a need for it rignt now.

  8. #8
    I have red hair
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    My raleigh has held up just fine. For the money, it's hard to beat.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by eat_dirt
    i have a zion 29er ebb frame.

    it was only 120 bucks.

    it's a good bike, i just don't have a need for it rignt now.
    You trying to sell it? If so, what size? PM me if its 19" or 21"

  10. #10
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    My Raleigh XXIX has held up for me for over a season. No problems or slippage with it at all. For that money, can't beat it.

  11. #11
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    I was wondering what the advantage of an EBB was? I tried to stay away from it when I was shopping for a SS due to some of the people complaining about slipping/creaking.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by p nut
    I was wondering what the advantage of an EBB was? I tried to stay away from it when I was shopping for a SS due to some of the people complaining about slipping/creaking.
    not that I'm an expert... but it seems to be a "pick your poison" scenario, particularly if you want to run disc brakes.

    I went with an EBB because I found a frame I liked at a price I liked that came with an EBB

    Paragon style sliding dropouts look good too, although I have witnessed those dropouts creaking, and similar dropouts slipping - so they are not immune to the problems that you describe.

    I had a Surly non disc frame with horizontal dropouts, alignment was a problem even without disc brakes - when I took the wheel out, fixed a flat, put the wheel back in, the brakes were often mis-aligned with the rim by enough that I either had to adjust the wheel or brake - doubly frustrating as much of my riding is in the dark.

    To be fair, I have had good luck with mine. It doesn't seem to slip - or not enough to cause problems anyway - and so far my "creaky EBB" problems have turned out to be caused by something other than the EBB creaking.

  13. #13
    Baby Bear is in the house
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    Quote Originally Posted by madcap
    OS Blackbuck

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    There's only one size, though. 18.5"
    Thanks for the input, but that's a little too out of my price range.
    (and the only available size is too big for me)
    Better to have and not need it, than to need it and not have it.

  14. #14
    Baby Bear is in the house
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    Quote Originally Posted by r1Gel
    I've done a limited search of currently available off-the-shelf SS bikes that are in the "fairly affordable" bracket, and noticed only the Raleigh XXIX sports an EBB. As my search was "limited," I could have overlooked other options.

    Are there any other stock SS frames/bikes in this price range (sub $800?) that feature EBBs?

    Raleigh XXIX owners, how are your EBBs holding up?
    Thanks for all the input so far.

    Glad to hear that the "budget" EBBs aren't as problematic as the general impression of EBBs as a whole are.

    Forgot to mention that I prefer steel over alu.

    Thanks again (keep the suggestions coming!).
    Better to have and not need it, than to need it and not have it.

  15. #15
    Baby Bear is in the house
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    Quote Originally Posted by grundy
    Soul Cycles Hooligan (26") and Dillenger (29")
    http://ridesoul.com/
    Easton (and the price) is nice, but I prefer steel.

    Thanks for the suggestion
    Better to have and not need it, than to need it and not have it.

  16. #16
    Baby Bear is in the house
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    Quote Originally Posted by kbollox
    The 2008 GT Peace 9r has an Ebb, mine has held up fine.
    I wonder why they ditched the EBB for 2009...
    Better to have and not need it, than to need it and not have it.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by r1Gel
    I wonder why they ditched the EBB for 2009...
    Most likely cheaper to make the frame: standard geared BB shell, no EBB insert, simple rear dropouts

  18. #18
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    FYI, My Peace 9r frame is for sale on the bay. Large size.

  19. #19
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    About 1800 miles on my xxix so far and not a single problem with the ebb... would highly recommend!
    Attached Images Attached Images

  20. #20
    808+909 = Party Good Time
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    Quote Originally Posted by r1Gel
    I wonder why they ditched the EBB for 2009...
    I think it was more to do with weight than anything...

    My 2008 EBB works a treat, I actually prefer it to be honest over track ends.

  21. #21
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    got my xxix as soon as they were released, had an order in with my raleigh rep early on, never had a single issue with the EBB i ride it year round in chicago and have full submerged the bottom bracket a number of times as well riding in creeks and the what not

    last spring i pulled the ebb assembly out to clean it up and all was good

    bike has been worth every penny

  22. #22
    HTFU!
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    +1 for Soul Cycles

    I also picked up a Soul Cycles (www.ridesoul.com) frame, the "Hooligan" with an EBB. I am very pleased with this frame (and my build, if I do say so myself). I did hear some creeking on an early ride and upon close inspection of the EBB realized that there is a canal area for the two locking screws. I had pushed my EBB out of alignment in order to match up with my cog. DOH! Rookie move. When I realized what I had done, I simply realigned the EBB, adjusted the cog spacing and no more creaking. Now when I change cogs I am careful to loosen the screws enough to rotate the EBB in order to tighten/loosen the chain, bot NOT to slide the EBB from side to side. I have been on three good rides since and the only noise is coming from my slightly bent front rotor. Oh well, the wheel still spins so ride on!
    I no longer deserve a signature.

  23. #23
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    My XXIX EBB has been trouble free. It is great and really helps when you need to adjust the pedals for techie areas IMHO. You can easily raise or lower the cranks to fit the trails that you are riding; high for tech, low for carving.

  24. #24
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    I just recently purchased a leftover 2007 xxix and love it!.....sold my santa cruz superlight FS to go singlespeed to check out all the excitement. I couldnt believe how much easier it was to ride than my Superlight, I dont have to mess with gears before climbs or anything else, I just go ride, climbs awesome and no probs with the EBB at all.

  25. #25
    Witty McWitterson
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    Singular cycles comes with a phil wood ebb. Retail on the frame/fork/ebb is going to be $465. I'll have 29'ers[swift, gryphon], 26"[Hummingbird] and monster cross[Peregrine].
    Just a regular guy.

  26. #26
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    A used GF Rig can be found well under your price range.

  27. #27
    Back of the pack fat guy
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    Just ordered a Hooligan. Wasn't looking for AL, but Easton Elite Race? For that price? And an EBB? Easy decision. Thanks to whomever posted the link to Soul Cycles.

    Now, if I could just get those damn weasels back in their cages and the voices to stop talking to me, I'd be good.

  28. #28
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    Upset

    Last edited by metrotuned; 04-21-2009 at 07:39 PM. Reason: posted double
    Lead actor Will of the Sun, Author Platform Pedal Shootout 820K views

  29. #29
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    Hope Phil Wood & Co. EBB Anodized Blue

    Somewhat of a gorilla in size but not so much in laying down the attack, the Raleigh XXIX eccentric bottom bracket shell does go from round to oblong as in the pair of set screws need to be very tight against the EBB or they'll relieve themselves halfway through a ride (on an aftermarket Phil relieved aluminum EBB).



    It's not 100% but a pre-ride tightening prevents any wobble or play during rides. For what's it's worth, the XXIX complete bike can be found used for $400 and is a solid deal. Carry a mini-tool or just the allen on your rides for that extra insurance.
    Lead actor Will of the Sun, Author Platform Pedal Shootout 820K views

  30. #30
    Daryl
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    illnacord,
    How is that Phil BB compared to the Raleigh stocker? Also, are you on the stock fork?

  31. #31
    Witty McWitterson
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    all right old post - gotta adjust price here - that was introductory. Price now is $590 with all the same benefits.
    Just a regular guy.

  32. #32
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    I ride a Dialled bikes Love Hate with the Phil Wood ebb and mine has been trouble free for the eight months i have had it.I dont think it has had a dry ride yet as the UK has had a fairly hard winter and the bike gets about 12 hours use a week of road.

  33. #33
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    Sorry,OFF road.

  34. #34
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    I have a 29er iro model 19.
    it has a ebb and was only $350 for a complete without brakes
    you can get a frame for $150
    Budget EBB frames? (e.g. Raleigh XXIX)-cimg3443.jpg

  35. #35
    T Smee
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    Not sure if it has been mentioned, but if you plan to run a suspension fork at some point, the Raleigh's geo is not corrected for the longer A-C length. Otherwise, no big deal.

    I had a Zion 737ebb and now just built up an IRO Model 19. Hopefully i'll get to ride it for the first time tomorrow after work

  36. #36
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    Haro Mary SS

    I love my Haro Mary SS, it has an EBB and the ride it great.

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by mtsmith
    Not sure if it has been mentioned, but if you plan to run a suspension fork at some point, the Raleigh's geo is not corrected for the longer A-C length.
    Actually, That was true with the first 3 years, but beginning in '09, they now have a longer suspension corrected fork.

    In addition, the '10 model now sports a "pinch bolt" EBB instead of the "set screw" type.

  38. #38
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    A few years ago, a friend in Oregon found a builder around Bend I think, who would put an EBB in an old steel frame. My friend had it done to a GT frame. Turned out very nice. I don't remember the builder, but it might be worth a search.

    urmb

  39. #39
    Birdman aka JMJ
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    Quote Originally Posted by urmb
    A few years ago, a friend in Oregon found a builder around Bend I think, who would put an EBB in an old steel frame. My friend had it done to a GT frame. Turned out very nice. I don't remember the builder, but it might be worth a search.

    urmb
    Vulture Cycles?

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  40. #40
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    dlongto: The Phil EBB or the bottom bracket? I have both in use. The fork is not stock (I have the stock fork in storage, the unicrown is heavy and dull for my personal taste) . It's a Geekhouse custom steel New England segmented rigid fork with stock geometry specifications.
    Lead actor Will of the Sun, Author Platform Pedal Shootout 820K views

  41. #41
    Harmonius Wrench
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    Originally Posted by mtsmith
    Not sure if it has been mentioned, but if you plan to run a suspension fork at some point, the Raleigh's geo is not corrected for the longer A-C length.



    Quote Originally Posted by arphaxhad
    Actually, That was true with the first 3 years, but beginning in '09, they now have a longer suspension corrected fork.

    In addition, the '10 model now sports a "pinch bolt" EBB instead of the "set screw" type.
    Wow! This has been perpetuated for far too long. It simply is bad knowledge.

    The only thing that has changed significantly about the Raleigh XXIX and XXIX+G frames since day one is a slight increase in seat tube lengths which was rolled in starting in the 2008 model year. That and the split shell EBB for 2010

    That's it.

    The only difference between a XXIX from 2007 and an XXIX from any other year are those two things. Angles of the frames are identical to the degree.

    Raleigh choose to put a short axle to crown fork on the early XXIX's and now use the same geometry frame with a longer axle to crown fork. (I measured a 2010 model XXIX fork at 490mm just the other day in the shop I work at)

    That's it. Simple.

    You could take a 2007 XXIX fork, install it on a 2010 XXIX frame and have the same performance as a 2007 XXIX with a longer seat tube and a split shell EBB instead of a pinch bolt one.

    And the XXIX+G is also the same geometry. Only the forks have changed!

    Raleigh made zero change to accomodate the forks that have been used on these bikes. They simply just keep cranking out the same frame for both models with the minor changes outlined here.
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  42. #42
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    Hey Guitar Ted,

    I have a 2009 (Cindy Brady Blue) Raleigh XXIX with the longer fork. The Raleigh website and brochures say of the '09 XXIX: "In keeping things simple we improved the XXIX with a new look, an alloy cog, and suspension corrected fork." I am new to SS bikes and have never owned a suspended bike. Are you saying that a fork is not truly "suspension corrected" unless the frame geometry is also changed to accommodate the longer fork? (Not griping, I just don't know the terminology that well). BTW, I love my XXIX and am currently blissfully ignorant of anything more complicated than my fully rigid singlespeed.
    Miles on the trail are a very effective filter for the objectionable particles of the mainstream.

  43. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Guitar Ted
    [/I]Only the forks have changed!
    That was the only thing I was attempting to say with my post. I did not state categorically that they had made any other changes to the geometry specifically to accommodate a suspension fork. And in retrospect, I am sorry if that was the implication. I certainly never intended to lead anybody astray. I guess I just don't understand how they could keep the HTA at 71 degrees while using a longer A-C fork without the frame being slightly different.

    Thanks as always for your input

    J

  44. #44
    Harmonius Wrench
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    Guys:

    Don't mean to be a meany.

    Just trying to clear that up, as it gets real confusing to a lot of folks when it is really quite simple.

    All I am saying is that Raliegh used different forks on the same basic frame since 2007. The different forks are shorter, or longer in axle to crown measurement.

    As far as "suspension correction" goes, in a historical sense, this means that the frame geometry has been tweaked from that of a rigid model to accomodate a suspension fork, or a rigid fork that mimics the axle to crown measurement of a suspension fork.

    In the case of the XXIX and XXIX+G, Raleigh did not make the frame suspension corrected. But in their defense, you have to come to realize that in 2005-2006, when this bike was in development, there was no "set" or agreed upon geometry for a rigid 29"er.

    So, in a "classic" sense, you would necessarily be making something suspension corrected because you already have an established rigid geometry across the board that companies are using. (For example, late 80's early 90's "NORBA" geometry, back when all bikes were rigid. )

    Neither the 29"er genre' as a whole, nor Raleigh had any such thing in 2006. So when Raleigh says "suspension corrected" it is sort of a meaningless term. Rather, they should have made a different frame for the XXIX+G and said that , "This maintains the same angles and geometry as our XXIX rigid bike".

    Or they should have said, "Our XXIX+G with a suspension fork slackens out the angles of our XXIX geometry and makes for a more stable, fast downhilling ride."

    But they didn't do that.

    And that's why is gets so dang cofrusticating!

    I should also add that by making the rigid forks longer in 2009/10 they are making both the XXIX and +G models ride similarly.
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  45. #45
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    I am sporting the 2007 XXIX and so far the ebb is doing fairly well! Then only thing I have an issue with is making sure the EBB is tight after making adjustments to everything ( i'm kinda picky on chain slack though). Other than that, no issues to speak of and is a great asset for a sub-800 SS.

  46. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by BassBikerD
    I am sporting the 2007 XXIX and so far the ebb is doing fairly well! Then only thing I have an issue with is making sure the EBB is tight after making adjustments to everything ( i'm kinda picky on chain slack though). Other than that, no issues to speak of and is a great asset for a sub-800 SS.
    How slack exactly do you run your chain? I use 1/4 up/down on my XXIX but sometimes on the trail it sounds like it is binding a little.

  47. #47
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    I have been riding the 2007 XXIX since January of '07, and I did have a few issues with the EBB moving once in a while. Creaks were not as much a problem as chain tension, after a few rides, getting a little slack. I finally pulled it, cleaned it well with alcohol, and reinstalled with some assembly paste (used for carbon-fiber bars and stems, etc...) and it hasn't budged. I absolutely love this bike - it's really all I ride anymore. I've been riding MTB since the late 70's and this is one of the best bikes I have ever owned, and I have dropped as much as $7k on a FS bike... Changed the bars, stem, seatpost (weakest part of the bike, IMO) tires, and cranks as things wore out I have upgraded. Frame has a nice feel and I like the way it rides.
    R.I.P. Corky 10/97-4/09
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  48. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by ATBScott
    I absolutely love this bike - it's really all I ride anymore. I've been riding MTB since the late 70's and this is one of the best bikes I have ever owned... Frame has a nice feel and I like the way it rides.
    I so envy you about that feeling. I'm riding a bike that is almost okay, but wish a could tweak a few things. I sure would be happier if I would just shut up and ride.

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