Winter Boot setup?

[daveIT]

What combos work for you guys? I'll be switching to flats since there is no way I can keep my feet warm enough with clipless.

[aka bubba]

I am using the Kona Jack Schit Platforms with a pair of Sorrel Boots that are a size larger. Inside of that I use a pair of Felt liners (Tip from one the Mountaineering guys) and my socks consist of an inner layer is Polypropylene with an outer light weight wool sock. Think circulation and not insulation!

[Shadowed Man]

Pretty much any pedal that has a large platfom area, with good spikes work great. If you can afford the upper end Lake winter boots you will not get cold, even into the single and below digits. I can wear one thick heavy wool sock and my feet are toasty to the below zero temperatures. They are top shelf boots that will last a long time. I really could not afford them, but bit the bullet. Very, very happy for that indebtedness.

[anthony.delorenzo]

Bunny boots with Helly Hansen socks (the navy blue poly-wool ones). Above -10 C the bunnies may be too warm but, unlike Sorels, it doesn't matter if your feet sweat or even get wet for that matter. IMHO, the HH socks are the only true socks on the planet, all others are but pale imitations.

Depends also on your riding distance and conditions. For my typical short winter rides commuting to work and around town, I find I can wear my everyday leather boots (Blundstones) for up to half an hour even at -30C and below with the HH socks. (Keeping in mind that Yukon have very dry winters. Moisture changes everything.)

Going out on trails it's almost always the bunny boots. You can't be too careful with your toes, lest they end up in a glass of whiskey up in Dawson City.

[awinterbiker]

You can go clipless and keep your feet warm. Like some said you can shell out good money for some Lakes but they are not completely waterproof and from what I've heard if you have large and or wide feet they don't work. Have heard rumors about Lake making them in bigger sizes.

Barring that you can make your own clipless winter boots by attaching cleats to the bottom. I've seen and heard of a few homemade winter riding boots. I made some with NEOS overboots last year and love them. I did attach a rigid platform with the cleat so to make a stiff boot which is important to me.

For years before that I used a strap on clipless system. Using something called transition pedals made for triathletes to slip over running shoes. Really liked them and loved that I could use almost any type of footwear with clipless, from running shoes to hiking boots, to big winter boots. It did call for some home made adjustments. You could make your own pair with any sort of rigid platform and heavy duty velcro strapping from a fabric store. The first pair I made out of aluminum plate. Only limit is your imagination. With strap on it was easy to put screws through the bottom for crampons too. The ones I use come off and on in seconds and secure well. I think I bought the last pair of those transition pedals I could find via the internet last year but again making your own is no big deal.

Before that it was powerstraps. They make longer ones for use with boots. I can't imagine riding summer or winter without being attached to the bike and losing that extra muscle power and control. t

[jeff1962]

Last year I rode with hiking boots ,heavy socks and pedals with oversized straps,(paramount cycles has them).This year I put CB mallet C's on both my bikes and plan to purchase some lakes come winter.If anyone is interested in buying the straps with pedals I will make you a great deal,as they are just sitting in the garage now,just drop me a line.

[aka bubba]

For those of you looking into getting the Lake Shoe’s. Universal Cycle has them on closeout for $100. Unfortunately it is only on a few selected sizes.

[rio]

pedals and a decent set of hiking boots and a set of Neos over boots. I found the Neos over at 6th Ave. Outfitters. This is the best combo for me I also use smart wool socks.
The Neos; well this was the best winter upgrade for me after my Sumo Snaux byke !

[qayaq_alaska]

Call them and advocate (tell them!) to make the uppers with 'breath-able fabric'...Gore Immersion Tech Fabric would work fine with proper reinforcements.

ml

[Bearbait]

Good point Martin.. that would be nice, even though the gore-tex pores would not breath anyway at real cold temps.

I had thought of taking the sissors and sewing machine to a pair once and replace the uppers with Scholer sof shell fabric

[qayaq_alaska]

they are very waterproof...but that works two ways...even with vbl socks I've got like a 1/2 cup of water in the overboot after a hard day of cranking...not good at all...a disaster actually! Could solve the problem with vbl pants but I really dislike them...rolling the upper down helps but that's problematic.

I like the soft-shell option.

I will be calling them and would like to hear more comments that I can forward on to their development office.



ml

Originally Posted by Bearbait

Good point Martin.. that would be nice, even though the gore-tex pores would not breath anyway at real cold temps.

I had thought of taking the sissors and sewing machine to a pair once and replace the uppers with Scholer sof shell fabric

[71 10-7]

I was thinking about trying the NEOS Voyager (non-insulated) with a plastic mountaineering inner boot for very cold temps (-20) and a hiking boot for more moderate temps. Do any of you hardcore Alaskan winter bikers see any problems with this set up? Also, are any of you using the Voyager model and if so your feedback would be mucho appreciated.

[awinterbiker]

Just got this on the Icebike Mailing List.

From Bikeman: Salvation fo the Wide-of-Foot

Yes we can do a pre-order on these. I just called Lake and it looks like
they are about 6-8 weeks out on the delivery. Also they went up in price
again. They have a suggested retail of $289.95 this year up from $269.95
last year. I'm guessing we will be selling them around the $210.00 price.
If you would like to place a back order give a call and ask for Davis or
myself, Wally.

Thanks,
Wally Wallace

wally@bikeman.com
www.bikeman.com
www.rackbarn.com
www.slidefast.com
1-800-BIKEMAN

[qayaq_alaska]

so r u saying that the Lake Winter Boots come in widths...? hmmm,

The pair of Lake's that I have are built on a really narrow last (Euro?) and that is big limitation on the boot...too narrow for my foot and a couple layers of sock...even oversized! I use them down to ~0dF.

==================

BACK TO THE NEOS:

Problem I have with Neos and soft soled inner boots are fatigue in the foot without a hard sole to support me. IMAO the best winter boots for the 'real' cold are the Lobbens but the soft sole and foot fatigue on long hauls is a killer for me...not to mention they are felt and get soaked inside the Neos outer.

I'm cutting up a couple pair of Neos this winter and experimenting with some breathable fabric for the upper....ankle and above.

++++++++++

Best boot I have in the mix right now is an old (circa 80's) pair of Solomon, 3M insulated, light hiking boots...all greased up and with a tight fitting pair of gaiters, they are getting me through about anything...the sole is just barely stiff enough when using a flat bmx-style pedal.

Anyone know of current equivalents?




There's my six cents...

Martin

Originally Posted by awinterbiker

Just got this on the Icebike Mailing List.

From Bikeman: Salvation fo the Wide-of-Foot

Yes we can do a pre-order on these. I just called Lake and it looks like
they are about 6-8 weeks out on the delivery. Also they went up in price
again. They have a suggested retail of $289.95 this year up from $269.95
last year. I'm guessing we will be selling them around the $210.00 price.
If you would like to place a back order give a call and ask for Davis or
myself, Wally.

Thanks,
Wally Wallace

wally@bikeman.com
www.bikeman.com
www.rackbarn.com
www.slidefast.com
1-800-BIKEMAN

[mikesee]

Originally Posted by daveIT

What combos work for you guys? I'll be switching to flats since there is no way I can keep my feet warm enough with clipless.

Why can't you keep your feet warm enough with clipless?

There are lots of reasons why they may *not* work for you, I'm just curious what process you used to determine that.

Give details, please, and maybe we can figure it out...

MC

[awinterbiker]

Martin - I once tried on a pair of Lakes two sizes over my normal shoe size; couldn't even get my foot into the boot and my feet are only a little on the wide side. Apparently they've heard complaints about this for years and are coming out with wider sized boots.

As to the NEOS and breathablility. As others have mentioned, at temps well below freezing breathable fabrics don't work that well. I've seen frost build up on the outside of breathable fleece jackets in temps of -20F to -40F but assumed that was because enough heat was being produced by the upper body to force at least some moisture through the fabric. I can't see my feet-lower legs producing enough heat to instigate that process. I'm a world class sweathog and always get a little moisture build up inside my NEOS but not enough to cause problems. You mentioned using vbl socks and having problems, how 'bout neoprene or some other sort of waterproof sock? I didn't know vbl socks allowed sweat-moisture to escape.

I bought some oversized Answer Kasmirs and with toe warmers used them down to 15F. Without the warmers they are good to 20F with a combo of wicking socks inside of neoprene socks. At 15F I could feel the sides of my feet getting cool. Performance had a hell of a sale on their neoprene overboots a while back and I got a big pair that fit over the Kasmirs. I hope with the toe warmers and the overboots (and maybe the thinsulate toe warmers mentioned below) this will work down to zero F at least. I'll test them this winter and report.

I used to get 3M thinsulate at fabric stores and play with it. I sewed up some toe warmers that work well and have made little booties out of it and have also used it for insoles. Still have a stash, which is good 'cause I can't find it locally anymore. t

[Bearbait]

Originally Posted by 71 10-7

I was thinking about trying the NEOS Voyager (non-insulated) with a plastic mountaineering inner boot for very cold temps (-20) and a hiking boot for more moderate temps. Do any of you hardcore Alaskan winter bikers see any problems with this set up? Also, are any of you using the Voyager model and if so your feedback would be mucho appreciated.

I had problems with this setup not being warm enough, I was using the stock liner from my inverno's but maybe due to the lack of support from the NEOS it wasnt warm enough and you still need to use a VBL anyway. It needed more insulation on the bottom. But go for it and try it, its a logical setup.
my 2c

[71 10-7]

Thanks for the reply, I'll have to do some tinkering this winter and see what works.

[timroz]

How about insulated Neos over cycling shoes. Do they get "sloppy" feeling when walking? Do the Neos fit tight enough? It seems like a good layering setup to be able to run too big regular cycling shoes if it's above -10 or so and throw the insulated Neos on below that. But then you are carrying 2.5 lbs of Neos around.