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Thread: Shockwiz

  1. #601
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    SW always wants u to make it softer from my experience. I had to increase pressure 10psi because i feel my bike rides better at 25-30% sag versus SW's 35%. SW is a good tool to get you in the ballpark butnl u need to fine tune it yourself. I had originally thought the SW was going to do that for me but ive learned that it cant. The lower pressure caused me to hang up too often on square edges and increasing the pressure helped with that and pedal strikes. In the end im back to what i had originally. Its still a good tool to get you really close.

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  2. #602
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    I guess it might be bike specific then as the Stats page shows my dynamic sag at 26% when pedaling. It pretty much shows the same thing on the home page if I just sit down on the bike.
    Here's the Stat page after the end of my ride that included a somewhat smooth fire road, uphill section with roots and rocks, back down that ugly rock infested section for high speed compression purposes, followed by our flow trail to catch some air or big jumps.Shockwiz-end-ride-home-stats.jpg
    2015 Santa Cruz Bronson
    Only major components that are still stock on my bike, the Reverb dropper and SLX brakes.

  3. #603
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    Quote Originally Posted by jacksonlui View Post
    SW always wants u to make it softer from my experience. I had to increase pressure 10psi because i feel my bike rides better at 25-30% sag versus SW's 35%. SW is a good tool to get you in the ballpark butnl u need to fine tune it yourself. I had originally thought the SW was going to do that for me but ive learned that it cant. The lower pressure caused me to hang up too often on square edges and increasing the pressure helped with that and pedal strikes. In the end im back to what i had originally. Its still a good tool to get you really close.

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    If we choose to ignore the Shockwiz's recommendation for air pressure, are the remaining suggestions still valid? I assume so but want to make sure.

  4. #604
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    I'd imagine everything will scale but im not exactly sure

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  5. #605
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    This may have been asked before but i dont feel like sorting through 600 or so posts.

    Im thinking of buying a shockwiz but dont have the time or patience to spend hours messing around with it trying to make sense of the data it records. How steep of a learning curve is there and how much time do you need to get it to work and make changes to your suspension?

    Is it something just for tech savy gearheads?

    Thanks in advance...

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  6. #606
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    Quote Originally Posted by dmo View Post
    This may have been asked before but i dont feel like sorting through 600 or so posts.

    Im thinking of buying a shockwiz but dont have the time or patience to spend hours messing around with it trying to make sense of the data it records. How steep of a learning curve is there and how much time do you need to get it to work and make changes to your suspension?

    Is it something just for tech savy gearheads?

    Thanks in advance...

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    It's dirt simple if you understand suspension setup in general. I just got one and in two rides already have my rear shock at a tune score of 96. But know I'm not new to suspension tuning exactly and had already made changes to my DVO Topaz that my feel for tuning said I needed. The Shockwiz just agreed after I finally got one and used it. 4.5 miles of varying terrain, fire road climb, rooted/rocky uphill and back down, then a flow trail with jumps. That's all it took to get my tune at 100% confidence and there's a chance I could have ridden even less and still got suggestions at 100% confidence. So, it boils down to, if it says adjust your suspension's ramp or high speed compression, would you know what they're suggesting? If so, it's pretty darn simple to follow.
    2015 Santa Cruz Bronson
    Only major components that are still stock on my bike, the Reverb dropper and SLX brakes.

  7. #607
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    Quote Originally Posted by IRBent View Post
    It's dirt simple if you understand suspension setup in general. I just got one and in two rides already have my rear shock at a tune score of 96. But know I'm not new to suspension tuning exactly and had already made changes to my DVO Topaz that my feel for tuning said I needed. The Shockwiz just agreed after I finally got one and used it. 4.5 miles of varying terrain, fire road climb, rooted/rocky uphill and back down, then a flow trail with jumps. That's all it took to get my tune at 100% confidence and there's a chance I could have ridden even less and still got suggestions at 100% confidence. So, it boils down to, if it says adjust your suspension's ramp or high speed compression, would you know what they're suggesting? If so, it's pretty darn simple to follow.
    Ok. I can deal with that.

    How reliable is it, does it break?
    Do you need to spend alot of time setting it up or calibrating it?

    Thanks again

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  8. #608
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    Quote Originally Posted by dmo View Post
    Ok. I can deal with that.

    How reliable is it, does it break?
    Do you need to spend alot of time setting it up or calibrating it?

    Thanks again

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    I think it's very sturdy so long as you strap it to your bike with decent zip ties. As for calibration, it does take a bit of patience until you understand the process. You let all the air out of your fork/shock then follow the instructions where you cycle the suspension through it's full travel a few times. You also have to hold it at full extension so it can detect zero travel. Then do the same for completely compressed which isn't too bad since there's no pressure in your fork/shock. The one thing it doesn't explain that's crucial. The cal wizard will tell you to pump you fork/shock up to recommended pressure. If you do that on a fork or shock that has a negative chamber and don't go through the small incremental adds of air and cycle the fork or shock to equalize the positive and negative chambers, the calibration will be all jacked up. I tried to make certain my fully extended my pressure read as close to 0psi as possible. Otherwize any positive or negative pressure in the suspension system when setting the zero travel mark would cause minor error in the calibration. By doing so I can sit on my bike and the Shockwiz read 25-26% sag and my o-ring will measure exactly that. You should find some pressure changes to take place though during your ride. Say you start out with 200psi in your shock. As it heats up due to heavy use the pressure could climb a few psi. Or set it up outside where you plan to ride and then bring it indoors and the pressure could drop a few psi as the air cools inside. If you take the leap I'm sure folks here will be glad to help you out if you run into something you don't understand. Quarq/Shockwiz have videos on YouTube that show you how to calibrate it.

    https://www.youtube.com/user/QuarqTechnology
    2015 Santa Cruz Bronson
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  9. #609
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    Quote Originally Posted by IRBent View Post
    ...I tried to make certain my fully extended my pressure read as close to 0psi as possible. Otherwize any positive or negative pressure in the suspension system when setting the zero travel mark would cause minor error in the calibration...
    I don't understand that. I would think you could have any pressure in the fork so long as you could reach both extremes of travel.
    Do the math.

  10. #610
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    Where is the best place to rent a Shockwiz?
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  11. #611
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lone Rager View Post
    I don't understand that. I would think you could have any pressure in the fork so long as you could reach both extremes of travel.
    You may be dead right. Fully extended to fully compressed lets the Shockwiz calculate your compression ratio. But I couldn't help but wonder if when you press the okay button while fully extended if it didn't also tell the Shockwiz that the pressure inside equals zero travel and zero psi. I've read numerous complaints that the pressure shown on the Shockwiz doesn't match that of the user's shock pump. Mine on the other hand is within 1psi most of the time. So either my Lezyne Digital gauge is on the same plane as the pressure transducer used in the Shockwiz, or my zero setting may have made the difference. I was just thinking, no air inside and fully extended means zero, not +/-1psi.
    2015 Santa Cruz Bronson
    Only major components that are still stock on my bike, the Reverb dropper and SLX brakes.

  12. #612
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lone Rager View Post
    I don't understand that. I would think you could have any pressure in the fork so long as you could reach both extremes of travel.
    you can. I fact if you have a fork with a coil negative spring you have to leave 30psi in it our it's impossible to top it out.

  13. #613
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    Quote Originally Posted by alexbn921 View Post
    you can. I fact if you have a fork with a coil negative spring you have to leave 30psi in it our it's impossible to top it out.
    Ingenious. I bet Quarq states if you have a coil spring the Shockwiz won't work. But I'd imagine if you knew the coil on the negative side pushed upwards at 30psi, balancing that out with positive pressure could trick the Shockwiz.
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  14. #614
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    If the oring says 30%, it doesn't necessarily mean the SW will report 30% depending on the leverage curve of the bike right?

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  15. #615
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    Anyone bought Shockwiz from bikeinn.com? Price damn good, legit?


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  16. #616
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    Quote Originally Posted by IRBent View Post
    Ingenious. I bet Quarq states if you have a coil spring the Shockwiz won't work. But I'd imagine if you knew the coil on the negative side pushed upwards at 30psi, balancing that out with positive pressure could trick the Shockwiz.
    I don't think that's true. The shockwiz only uses pressure to determine where the shock/fork is in its travel. You could do the same with a linear transducer, which is what most data acquisition systems use. As long as there's nothing that messes with the pressure as a function of travel or speed (e.g. MRP ramp control) then it should be fine. A negative spring doesn't.
    Do the math.

  17. #617
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    Anyone know if they ever go on sale? I tried a jenson coupon but it wouldn't apply

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  18. #618
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    Quote Originally Posted by dmo View Post
    Anyone know if they ever go on sale? I tried a jenson coupon but it wouldn't apply

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    Sometimes you can get them from a site wide sale. I got one like that for 10% off over the fourth from worldwide.

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  19. #619
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    Quote Originally Posted by jacksonlui View Post
    If the oring says 30%, it doesn't necessarily mean the SW will report 30% depending on the leverage curve of the bike right?

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    Nope, the pressure at a given travel% is independent of the leverage curve of the bike. If the air chamber has a volume of 500 at full extension, it will have a volume of 250 at 50% travel, with a resultant doubling of the pressure compared to the pressure at full extension (this is oversimplified since the air chamber doesn't go to zero at bottom out, but you get the idea). The leverage curve of the bike will affect how much force it takes to get to 30% travel, but it won't change the pressure in the air chamber at 30% travel.

    To answer your question, yes, if the O-ring says 30%, the shockwiz should be reading 30%. If not, the compression ratio calibration is off.

  20. #620
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    Quote Originally Posted by IRBent View Post
    Ingenious. I bet Quarq states if you have a coil spring the Shockwiz won't work. But I'd imagine if you knew the coil on the negative side pushed upwards at 30psi, balancing that out with positive pressure could trick the Shockwiz.
    The negative spring doesn't factor into the compression ratio, but is impossible to compress without some help. 30 psi on an older fox 34 seem perfect. Since it only cares about how much you compressed the air, the starting psi doesn't matter.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lone Rager View Post
    I don't think that's true. The shockwiz only uses pressure to determine where the shock/fork is in its travel. You could do the same with a linear transducer, which is what most data acquisition systems use. As long as there's nothing that messes with the pressure as a function of travel or speed (e.g. MRP ramp control) then it should be fine. A negative spring doesn't.
    This. It's only concerned with the starting and ending volume of the fork or shock.
    On forks with an air negative you need to have them balanced with the air in the main chamber. I find that close to zero works pretty good. Anything under 30 should work too, as long as you can full compress and extend the fork.

  21. #621
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    Quote Originally Posted by jacksonlui View Post
    If the oring says 30%, it doesn't necessarily mean the SW will report 30% depending on the leverage curve of the bike right?

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    Yes and no.
    Forks always or something is wrong.
    Shocks can have different leverage ratios depending on travel. For example if you have a 2-2.5 then in the beginning the shock will move 1 for every 2 of wheel travel. The end will be 1 to 2.5.
    Some like a DW link bike will move the shock more then settle down in the sag zone.
    So rear shock sag does not equal rear wheel sag, but it is close. Unless it's off by a large amount (5-10%) I wouldn't worry about it.

  22. #622
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    Quote Originally Posted by alexbn921 View Post
    Yes and no.
    Forks always or something is wrong.
    Shocks can have different leverage ratios depending on travel. For example if you have a 2-2.5 then in the beginning the shock will move 1 for every 2 of wheel travel. The end will be 1 to 2.5.
    Some like a DW link bike will move the shock more then settle down in the sag zone.
    So rear shock sag does not equal rear wheel sag, but it is close. Unless it's off by a large amount (5-10%) I wouldn't worry about it.
    But the %sag as measured on the shock O-ring should still match the number on the Shockwiz, even if it's not an exact linear relationship with the distance the wheel has actually traveled, correct?

  23. #623
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sid Duffman View Post
    But the %sag as measured on the shock O-ring should still match the number on the Shockwiz, even if it's not an exact linear relationship with the distance the wheel has actually traveled, correct?
    In my opinion, yes. The Shockwiz has no input for suspension linkage design and don't distinguish between shocks with linkage vs forks with linear travel. All it knows it fully extended pressures vs fully compressed. It then calculates your sag based on those two points alone. At 50% travel, per the O-ring on the shock or fork, the pressure should double. Then at 75% it should double pressure again. Nothing more than Boyle's gas law reversed engineered to give you travel/sag.
    2015 Santa Cruz Bronson
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  24. #624
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sid Duffman View Post
    But the %sag as measured on the shock O-ring should still match the number on the Shockwiz, even if it's not an exact linear relationship with the distance the wheel has actually traveled, correct?
    Yes your right.

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    Here is my conundrum. in playful and balanced I get green on air pressure air spring and rebound but consistently get a big fat red on HS compression on the left side of the slider(make softer) even though it is in the fully open position. Low speed compression green and bottom out is yellow(remove resistance)
    Shock is a fox X2. Any suggestions as to what I should try
    thanks

  26. #626
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    Quote Originally Posted by mtb4190 View Post
    Here is my conundrum. in playful and balanced I get green on air pressure air spring and rebound but consistently get a big fat red on HS compression on the left side of the slider(make softer) even though it is in the fully open position. Low speed compression green and bottom out is yellow(remove resistance)
    Shock is a fox X2. Any suggestions as to what I should try
    thanks
    Sounds like you're probably a bit lighter than the shock tune was designed for. Before I got a Shockwiz my gut said I was in the same boat based on feel. I went with a lighter weight oil, or a lower viscosity oil. I rode with the Shockwiz and it agreed with me, giving me all green on the top 3 items and all yellows on the bottom 3, high/low speed compression and bottom out resistance. Unlike the Fox X2, my DVO Topaz allows me to adjust the pressure on the oil bladder system. I dropped 5psi out of it and everything moved into the green BUT low speed compression. It's still in the yellow for now. Bottom line, I'm not real familiar with the X2 but it sounds like you may need to adjust your compression shim stack to get a lower amount of resistance on the oil flow.
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  27. #627
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    Quote Originally Posted by mtb4190 View Post
    Here is my conundrum. in playful and balanced I get green on air pressure air spring and rebound but consistently get a big fat red on HS compression on the left side of the slider(make softer) even though it is in the fully open position. Low speed compression green and bottom out is yellow(remove resistance)
    Shock is a fox X2. Any suggestions as to what I should try
    thanks
    Could try with one less spacer. That's just a crap shoot though. It won't directly affect it but might soften it up enough to get it where it wants it.

    If the bike feels good to you though I don't know if I would stress about it.

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  28. #628
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    Quote Originally Posted by tuckerjt07 View Post
    Could try with one less spacer. That's just a crap shoot though. It won't directly affect it but might soften it up enough to get it where it wants it.

    If the bike feels good to you though I don't know if I would stress about it.

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    I agree with the idea, if it feels good to you. Yeah, I'd love to have a test score of 100 with 100% confidence, but I'm smart enough to know that those numbers would only be good for that very same trail I tested on with outside temps pretty much the same. Conditions don't stay the same and I'm not going to test tune my suspension before every ride. I'm really happy with my score of 96 at 100% confidence right now and if taking a few psi out of my air can doesn't do, I'll settle on close enough.
    2015 Santa Cruz Bronson
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  29. #629
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    Quote Originally Posted by tuckerjt07 View Post
    Could try with one less spacer. That's just a crap shoot though. It won't directly affect it but might soften it up enough to get it where it wants it.

    If the bike feels good to you though I don't know if I would stress about it.

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    Na not stressing at all I just dont understand why it would be in the red. In theory the X2 should have ample adjustment and if anything the shock feels like it could do with a little more support. I might try adding a little more LS compression damping
    Thanks for the reply

  30. #630
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    Quote Originally Posted by mtb4190 View Post
    Na not stressing at all I just dont understand why it would be in the red. In theory the X2 should have ample adjustment and if anything the shock feels like it could do with a little more support. I might try adding a little more LS compression damping
    Thanks for the reply
    High speed in the red to me screams the shock is not active enough. A softer shock moves faster. How's your sag? Do you use all of your travel now? If sag and overall travel is decent, I'd might be more inclined to add a tuning band on the positive then lower the air pressure. High speed compression has to be affected by air pressure to some extent. Lowering the pressure should allow things to move faster which could improve high speed compression results. Adding another spacer would help make up the pressure loss and prevent bottoming out. You could try both scenarios, adding air and removing a spacer as previously suggested, then right the opposite and see which works out best. I'm in the same boat but with low speed compression in the yellow and my adjustment wide open. I plan on dropping a few psi and seeing how the Shockwiz reacts on low speed compression and hope that it doesn't kill any of the other settings that are all in the green.
    Quote Originally Posted by mtb4190 View Post
    Na not stressing at all I just dont understand why it would be in the red. In theory the X2 should have ample adjustment and if anything the shock feels like it could do with a little more support. I might try adding a little more LS compression damping
    Thanks for the reply
    2015 Santa Cruz Bronson
    Only major components that are still stock on my bike, the Reverb dropper and SLX brakes.

  31. #631
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    Quote Originally Posted by IRBent View Post
    High speed in the red to me screams the shock is not active enough. A softer shock moves faster. How's your sag? Do you use all of your travel now? If sag and overall travel is decent, I'd might be more inclined to add a tuning band on the positive then lower the air pressure. High speed compression has to be affected by air pressure to some extent. Lowering the pressure should allow things to move faster which could improve high speed compression results. Adding another spacer would help make up the pressure loss and prevent bottoming out. You could try both scenarios, adding air and removing a spacer as previously suggested, then right the opposite and see which works out best. I'm in the same boat but with low speed compression in the yellow and my adjustment wide open. I plan on dropping a few psi and seeing how the Shockwiz reacts on low speed compression and hope that it doesn't kill any of the other settings that are all in the green.
    That could work as well. X2 is tricky without knowing the details. Some configurations allow for quite a few spacers, while others, 200x57, only allow two.

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    Thanks guys that gives some direction. I will start playing around with bands. Sag is currently at 33%. dynanamic sag generally around 35-36%. seems to be using all the travel going by the O ring on the shaft but big hit or whatever it is called is on zero

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    This last stretch of posts hones in on a great topic: High Speed Compression Suggestions, and how compression interacts with air spring rate.

    I'll offer this up: if everything is looking good and the Tuning Scores are in the 90's I tend to disregard High Speed Compression Suggestions that are only 5% deviation from 'OK'. (Just to note - I don't typically strive for a Score of 100). When the Shockwiz suggests making HSC softer - typically the rider isn't using full travel. These seem to go hand-in-hand. But why didn't the rider use full travel?

    Shockwiz is only part of the overall information the tuner should consider. Imagine the complexity in the program related to distinguishing between a HSC issue and an Air Spring Ramp issue. That could be very nuanced. Then realize the Shockwiz doesn't know if the trail conditions for that Tuning Session actually demanded full travel.

    In concept a tuner can use a combination of baseline air pressure, ramp, and compression damping to help control compression scenarios. I'm not an Engineer, nor do I want to quibble with one, but the big difference is that a spring stores energy (and returns it), while the damper absorbs the energy. Pulling all information from the rider, tire pressure, Shockwiz, and understanding the demands of the trail should factor in to how you approach minor deviations from 'OK' in the HSC settings.

  34. #634
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    Quote Originally Posted by oldranger View Post
    This last stretch of posts hones in on a great topic: High Speed Compression Suggestions, and how compression interacts with air spring rate.

    I'll offer this up: if everything is looking good and the Tuning Scores are in the 90's I tend to disregard High Speed Compression Suggestions that are only 5% deviation from 'OK'. (Just to note - I don't typically strive for a Score of 100). When the Shockwiz suggests making HSC softer - typically the rider isn't using full travel. These seem to go hand-in-hand. But why didn't the rider use full travel?

    Shockwiz is only part of the overall information the tuner should consider. Imagine the complexity in the program related to distinguishing between a HSC issue and an Air Spring Ramp issue. That could be very nuanced. Then realize the Shockwiz doesn't know if the trail conditions for that Tuning Session actually demanded full travel.

    In concept a tuner can use a combination of baseline air pressure, ramp, and compression damping to help control compression scenarios. I'm not an Engineer, nor do I want to quibble with one, but the big difference is that a spring stores energy (and returns it), while the damper absorbs the energy. Pulling all information from the rider, tire pressure, Shockwiz, and understanding the demands of the trail should factor in to how you approach minor deviations from 'OK' in the HSC settings.
    Very well put and I whole heatedly agree.
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  35. #635
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    Quote Originally Posted by oldranger View Post
    This last stretch of posts hones in on a great topic: High Speed Compression Suggestions, and how compression interacts with air spring rate.

    I'll offer this up: if everything is looking good and the Tuning Scores are in the 90's I tend to disregard High Speed Compression Suggestions that are only 5% deviation from 'OK'. (Just to note - I don't typically strive for a Score of 100). When the Shockwiz suggests making HSC softer - typically the rider isn't using full travel. These seem to go hand-in-hand. But why didn't the rider use full travel?

    Shockwiz is only part of the overall information the tuner should consider. Imagine the complexity in the program related to distinguishing between a HSC issue and an Air Spring Ramp issue. That could be very nuanced. Then realize the Shockwiz doesn't know if the trail conditions for that Tuning Session actually demanded full travel.

    In concept a tuner can use a combination of baseline air pressure, ramp, and compression damping to help control compression scenarios. I'm not an Engineer, nor do I want to quibble with one, but the big difference is that a spring stores energy (and returns it), while the damper absorbs the energy. Pulling all information from the rider, tire pressure, Shockwiz, and understanding the demands of the trail should factor in to how you approach minor deviations from 'OK' in the HSC settings.
    I'm glad to hear that others are having the same issues with HSC.

    I have Avalanche suspension and Shockwiz really doesn't like Craig's HSC choices, front and rear. Shockwiz will be in the red for HSC telling me to soften it, then I will hit a great 5' drop, and it puts me right back in to the green. The thing is that I only do 1-2 drops maybe every other ride.

  36. #636
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    My issue isn't with HSC as it's in the green with everything else. My LSC is saying to make it softer. Heck, the shock already feels great so if I can't get everything into the green, I'll happily settle for a tune score of 96 with the LSC in the yellow.
    2015 Santa Cruz Bronson
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  37. #637
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    It does that to me as well. Like you I don't worry about it. Once I know the shock is performing correctly. It's all about feel and personal preference. The shockwiz was never meant to remove the human element only the mechanical.
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  38. #638
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    You see my issue is that if I didn't have the shock whiz I would be adding more compression. probably 2 clicks of LSC and at least one of HSC but with HSC already in the red and LSC in yellow it makes me think I am on the wrong path to getting the feel I am looking for. You know super plush but with good support and able to take the big drops

  39. #639
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    Quote Originally Posted by IRBent View Post
    My issue isn't with HSC as it's in the green with everything else. My LSC is saying to make it softer. Heck, the shock already feels great so if I can't get everything into the green, I'll happily settle for a tune score of 96 with the LSC in the yellow.
    Quote Originally Posted by mtb4190 View Post
    You see my issue is that if I didn't have the shock whiz I would be adding more compression. probably 2 clicks of LSC and at least one of HSC but with HSC already in the red and LSC in yellow it makes me think I am on the wrong path to getting the feel I am looking for. You know super plush but with good support and able to take the big drops
    If those affe the type rides you are doing when you tune your shock. SW should definitely get you in the ball park. The rest is going to be personal preference.
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  40. #640
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    ^^^^

    Not sure why it double quoted but my reply was @ mtb1940.
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    This weekends riding will be totally different terrain ie lots of roots but not so many large hits so I probably wont change too much for that but I will get back to this forum after further experimentation.cheers

  42. #642
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    Hi guys, I've been trying to tune my fox float 36 rc2 180mm fork but have experience quite a bit of issues. First of is the calibration wizard which fails but suggests that the compression ratio is between 5.6-5.9. I emailed SRAM and they said that this seems wrong and that I should measure the actual travel on the fork. I did and it actually seemed correct so I ran with that.

    On the trail shockwiz keeps telling me to remove air and make HSC softer, after reading this thread I guess that's due to me not using the full travel. Alas on the flow trail I'm riding this isn't possible. Is there a way to get around this setting? Maybe by decreasing the CR so that it thinks I'm using the full travel when I'm not?

    Last question concerns setting the baseline air pressure. The calibration wizard suggests to fully extend the fork but since it has a negative air pressure chamber the fork sits a bit in the travel. If I use the calibration wizard to set the baseline air I get something like 8% sag which from the manual is wrong. Kind of confusing why the calibration wizard tells you to fully extend the fork when measuring the baseline air pressure.

  43. #643
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    Quote Originally Posted by tkaszuba View Post
    Hi guys, I've been trying to tune my fox float 36 rc2 180mm fork but have experience quite a bit of issues. First of is the calibration wizard which fails but suggests that the compression ratio is between 5.6-5.9. I emailed SRAM and they said that this seems wrong and that I should measure the actual travel on the fork. I did and it actually seemed correct so I ran with that.

    On the trail shockwiz keeps telling me to remove air and make HSC softer, after reading this thread I guess that's due to me not using the full travel. Alas on the flow trail I'm riding this isn't possible. Is there a way to get around this setting? Maybe by decreasing the CR so that it thinks I'm using the full travel when I'm not?

    Last question concerns setting the baseline air pressure. The calibration wizard suggests to fully extend the fork but since it has a negative air pressure chamber the fork sits a bit in the travel. If I use the calibration wizard to set the baseline air I get something like 8% sag which from the manual is wrong. Kind of confusing why the calibration wizard tells you to fully extend the fork when measuring the baseline air pressure.
    Based on your negative air chamber comment, try this. When you first start calibration, let the air out then cycle the fork nice and slow several times to let the negative air pressure bleed into the positive chamber, then let it out through the Shockwiz. This might help with the negative chamber causing the suck down sag. Also when it asks you to pump it up to manufacturer's recommended pressure, go at it maybe 10-20psi at a time then cycle the fork the let the negative and positive chambers equalize.
    2015 Santa Cruz Bronson
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  44. #644
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    If your compression ratio is off, Nothing will work! If you have a coil negative spring you need to leave 30 psi in the main chamber to help you compress the coil. And friend to help hold the fork at full top/bottom.

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    Ok, I tried as suggested but that didn't change anything. Maybe I rephrase the question. Can the shock travel show more than 0% when the fork is at rest (because of the negative air chamber) or should I reset it to zero?

    I couldn't find this information in the manual.

    Shockwiz-img_5502.jpg

  46. #646
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    Quote Originally Posted by tkaszuba View Post
    Ok, I tried as suggested but that didn't change anything. Maybe I rephrase the question. Can the shock travel show more than 0% when the fork is at rest (because of the negative air chamber) or should I reset it to zero?

    I couldn't find this information in the manual.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    The manual plainly states that any shock travel greater than +/- 3% means something went wrong in the calibration process.

    Shockwiz-travel-error.jpg
    2015 Santa Cruz Bronson
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  47. #647
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    Yes, I saw that and in the calibration step it shows 0% with a base pressure of 70 psi (since it's fully extended manually by me when taking this measurement) but when I get back to the home screen it shows 6-7% with the correct pressure of 74 psi.

  48. #648
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    Quote Originally Posted by tkaszuba View Post
    Yes, I saw that and in the calibration step it shows 0% with a base pressure of 70 psi (since it's fully extended manually by me when taking this measurement) but when I get back to the home screen it shows 6-7% with the correct pressure of 74 psi.
    And thats correct. 74psi divided by that the 6% factor brings it back to 70psi. I.e. 74/1.06

  49. #649
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    Quote Originally Posted by lucifuge View Post
    And thats correct. 74psi divided by that the 6% factor brings it back to 70psi. I.e. 74/1.06
    Where's this 1.06 factor coming from?
    2015 Santa Cruz Bronson
    Only major components that are still stock on my bike, the Reverb dropper and SLX brakes.

  50. #650
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    Quote Originally Posted by IRBent View Post
    Where's this 1.06 factor coming from?
    70psi = 100%
    74psi = 106% (we were provided with 6%)

    106% corresponds to a factor of 1.06

  51. #651
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    Quote Originally Posted by lucifuge View Post
    70psi = 100%
    74psi = 106% (we were provided with 6%)

    106% corresponds to a factor of 1.06
    I understand the math. But where does the Shockwiz say you get a 6% variation?
    2015 Santa Cruz Bronson
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  52. #652
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    It's like I get 72psi on my Lyrik and that' s at 12% natural sag.
    So 72psi/1.12 = 64 psi which is correct at the shock pump with 0 sag

  53. #653
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    Quote Originally Posted by IRBent View Post
    I understand the math. But where does the Shockwiz say you get a 6% variation?
    No, re-read that guys response. He provided the 6%

  54. #654
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    Awesome, thanks for this info. Not sure why SRAM doesn't include this in the manual.

    Now getting back to measuring the compression ratio, I guess when you measure the travel used you need to take this initial sag into consideration as well? The thing is when you do it the old fashioned way you don't. I'm guessing that shockwiz uses that 1.06 factor to adjust the travel used so that it's inline with manual measurements?


    Quote Originally Posted by lucifuge View Post
    And thats correct. 74psi divided by that the 6% factor brings it back to 70psi. I.e. 74/1.06

  55. #655
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    I've used my shockwiz to tune my first bike over the course of a month or so. I'm happy with the unit. I'm now on to my second bike. I wanted to share some of my experience with this unit. First off, the default fox suggested settings for my fork and shock on the first bike were pretty much spot on for the "balanced" tune. I did maybe 1-2 clicks here and there to get as close to perfect as it would tell me over the course of many runs. However, in case people want to try and get crazy and try to get 100% on your tune, just forget about that. I'm a bit of a perfectionist so I rode a dozen or two times on each, fork/shock, to measure and tune. What I found is that even without changing a single thing (except start new session on shockwiz) and riding the same trail, it would suggest slightly different things each time. If you get just a yellow, what I would call a "suggestion", in the tuning, take it with a grain of salt. It's very likely to be different if you rode the trail again. I found eventually, if I just kept resetting the shockwiz and riding the same trail I eventually would hit 100% tune by chance! I don't think this is any kind of downside to the unit at all. It makes perfect sense that no two runs are going to be exactly the same. What it does seem to mean though, is that when you get into the yellow zone with the suggestions you're really getting into a very subjective and unrepeatable area. There is not much need to try and get 100%, don't waste your time... or just keep riding until you get it if it makes you feel better

  56. #656
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    Quote Originally Posted by SonomaBiker View Post
    I've used my shockwiz to tune my first bike over the course of a month or so. I'm happy with the unit. I'm now on to my second bike. I wanted to share some of my experience with this unit. First off, the default fox suggested settings for my fork and shock on the first bike were pretty much spot on for the "balanced" tune. I did maybe 1-2 clicks here and there to get as close to perfect as it would tell me over the course of many runs. However, in case people want to try and get crazy and try to get 100% on your tune, just forget about that. I'm a bit of a perfectionist so I rode a dozen or two times on each, fork/shock, to measure and tune. What I found is that even without changing a single thing (except start new session on shockwiz) and riding the same trail, it would suggest slightly different things each time. If you get just a yellow, what I would call a "suggestion", in the tuning, take it with a grain of salt. It's very likely to be different if you rode the trail again. I found eventually, if I just kept resetting the shockwiz and riding the same trail I eventually would hit 100% tune by chance! I don't think this is any kind of downside to the unit at all. It makes perfect sense that no two runs are going to be exactly the same. What it does seem to mean though, is that when you get into the yellow zone with the suggestions you're really getting into a very subjective and unrepeatable area. There is not much need to try and get 100%, don't waste your time... or just keep riding until you get it if it makes you feel better
    Perfect summation. So, were you seeing a tune score of 96 often and without any changes it finally blipped up to 100% on that one perfect ride? I had 2 out of 4 rides clock in at 96 and was very happy with the feel. One more tweak and bam, 80. But that 80 didn't feel any worse than the two 96 scores. I'm just about ready to move to the fork but I want to test the settings that gave me the higher score another time or two first.
    2015 Santa Cruz Bronson
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  57. #657
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    Quote Originally Posted by IRBent View Post
    Perfect summation. So, were you seeing a tune score of 96 often and without any changes it finally blipped up to 100% on that one perfect ride? I had 2 out of 4 rides clock in at 96 and was very happy with the feel. One more tweak and bam, 80. But that 80 didn't feel any worse than the two 96 scores. I'm just about ready to move to the fork but I want to test the settings that gave me the higher score another time or two first.
    Yes, exactly, the scores were always very close to perfect, but not quite. I kept having a couple of things come up yellow and kept adjusting. After a while I realized I kept adjusting things one way and then back again based on what it was saying.... so I then just kept everything the same to see if it would repeat the same, and it didn't. However, it did always come back very close to perfect, except for one or two rides, which in all fairness I did ride slightly differently on.

  58. #658
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    Quote Originally Posted by SonomaBiker View Post
    Yes, exactly, the scores were always very close to perfect, but not quite. I kept having a couple of things come up yellow and kept adjusting. After a while I realized I kept adjusting things one way and then back again based on what it was saying.... so I then just kept everything the same to see if it would repeat the same, and it didn't. However, it did always come back very close to perfect, except for one or two rides, which in all fairness I did ride slightly differently on.
    I had two rides clock in at 96 with 100% confidence. It was only after I tried to eek out that last 4 points that all hell broke loose. I'm well satisfied with the feel at 96. For that matter I was pretty darn happy with the 92 I got based in gut instinct and feel obtained on my first Shockwiz run. I'm a tweaker so I just couldn't let it lie. Between my personal experience and what you've shared, I'll be happy if I can repeat those 96 scores.
    2015 Santa Cruz Bronson
    Only major components that are still stock on my bike, the Reverb dropper and SLX brakes.

  59. #659
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    On my formula thirtyfive fork I got 96 with 100% confidence but then went further down the trail that had loose rocks and it went down to 82. From there I realised that it's impossible to have the fork tuned for everything and it's better to pick the section of trail that matters the most to your riding.

  60. #660
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    Is it possible to pause a session so you can just analyse the sections of trail that matter to you?

  61. #661
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    I do this by taking a screenshot of my phone of the different shockwiz pages and review them later.

  62. #662
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    Yes, you can turn off bluetooth.

    Quote Originally Posted by onzadog View Post
    Is it possible to pause a session so you can just analyse the sections of trail that matter to you?

  63. #663
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    Won't it just upload all the data once it comes on again?

  64. #664
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    Since it's streaming data as it comes I doubt that the device stores the data if it can't connect to the phone but maybe somebody can correct this.

    Quote Originally Posted by onzadog View Post
    Won't it just upload all the data once it comes on again?

  65. #665
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    Not got mine yet so I'm just going off what I've heard from others, but I thought you didn't need to take the phone riding with you. You could download the data at the end of the day and run the analysis.

  66. #666
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    Quote Originally Posted by onzadog View Post
    Not got mine yet so I'm just going off what I've heard from others, but I thought you didn't need to take the phone riding with you. You could download the data at the end of the day and run the analysis.
    That's absolutely correct.
    The device works independently without a phone.
    The phone is only necessary to display the results.
    Pausing therefore is not possible.

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  67. #667
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    Quote Originally Posted by tkaszuba View Post
    On my formula thirtyfive fork I got 96 with 100% confidence but then went further down the trail that had loose rocks and it went down to 82. From there I realised that it's impossible to have the fork tuned for everything and it's better to pick the section of trail that matters the most to your riding.
    I'm sure that's the case too. The section of trail I picked starts out with a long and pretty smooth fire road climb where the data is useless. I break off the road for a slow more technical rocky uphill section and eventually turn around to bomb back down that same section. By then the Shockwiz is pretty happy but asking for jumps. Once back down to the fire road another flow trail is ahead with the jumps it's asking for. I've done screenshots throughout the ride and watched the score and confidence levels both climb and the detections and suggestions go from bad to all green. I'd imagine if I kept on riding smooth trails thereafter my score would slide since my suspension wouldn't be working the full gamut.
    2015 Santa Cruz Bronson
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  68. #668
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    Shockwiz-screensh-fox-x2.jpg
    Had a bit of stiction in one of the pivots. Got that sorted and HSC went to green.Felt a lot better

  69. #669
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    Just updated Shockwiz to firmware 4.0.0.

    Does anyone know what is changed in this (presumably major) firmware release?

  70. #670
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    As did I and wondering the same.

  71. #671
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    And there is nothing to be found on their website that discusses firmware history and changes. Looking through the software after updating yesterday, I saw nothing different. Although I'm not sure that it had anything to do with the update but I was able to find and connect to my Shockwiz much easier and quicker. Usually it's an ordeal that requires me to kill the app a time or two and wait minutes while watching the red LED blink before my software finds my unit.
    2015 Santa Cruz Bronson
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  72. #672
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    Anyone have trouble with droid phones? sees the shockwiz but won't stay connected.

  73. #673
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    Is the Shockwiz worth it if I dont have the top of the line suspension with high/low speed adjustments? I'm trying to get the most out of what I have but am wondering if it wouldn't be money well spent towards upgrading the suspension itself first?

    I'm referring to 2016 Stumpjumper 29 with FOX FLOAT Performance DPS rear and FOX 34 Plus Performance front.

  74. #674
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    Does a compression ratio of 2.0 sound low for a 150mm Pike with a Luftkappe and no tokens? It measured dynamic sag at 26% which is maybe slightly low but I don't think to far off.

    Unfortunately I only have the unit until tomorrow and that's for sorting the shock but I'd like to know!

  75. #675
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    I'm not 100% sure on how the ratio is figured but I do know that as I increased tokens in my fork the compression ratio increased as well. I'd venture to guess that since you have no tokens in there then 2.0 probably isn't low. When I make adjustments to mine, I typically will go through the calibration process twice to confirm the compression ratio is the same both times and it always seems to be.

  76. #676
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    Quote Originally Posted by fathomer View Post
    Does a compression ratio of 2.0 sound low for a 150mm Pike with a Luftkappe and no tokens? It measured dynamic sag at 26% which is maybe slightly low but I don't think to far off.

    Unfortunately I only have the unit until tomorrow and that's for sorting the shock but I'd like to know!
    2.0 seems low but not unreasonable. I would redo your calibration with a friend to help full extend and compress the fork. Also you need to make sure your negative camber is empty along with your main camber.
    Stock 150mm 27.5 pike was 2.6.

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