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  1. #1
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    official xfusion rl2 fork service and tuning thread

    Hi, i am starting a thread to consolidate service and tuning info from this thread: X-Fusion Slant Anyone? Almost everything you need to know for home service and a starting point for tuning, if you are so inclined. Should be good for all current xfusion rl2 forks. Mine is a 160 mm Sweep.

    What you will need besides basic sockets/wrenches/hammer (i assune everyone has those)

    park spa-2 pin spanner

    28 mm socket, must be 6 point and ground flat like so for max engagement on top cap:official xfusion rl2 fork service and tuning thread-unnamed-47-.jpg

    Piece of plastic pipe or long socket for reinstalling damper shaft

    soft blow hammer

    buzzys slick honey grease, its the best. or rock n roll super slick

    torco rsf lite

    torco rsf medium

    Oil measuring device

    New oil seals (if necessary)

    new o-ring and quad-ring kit from xfusion (if necessary)

    Oil bucket

    Disassembly:

    1. Remove fork from bike and place in stand at 45 degrees with lowers pinting up. Remove air cap and depressurize. Remove rebound knob official xfusion rl2 fork service and tuning thread-unnamed-27-.jpg

    2. remove footnuts with sockets. Exposed end of damper shaft: official xfusion rl2 fork service and tuning thread-unnamed-28-.jpg

    3. Use a 4 mm socket placed on the end of the rebound shaft where tehre are hex flats. carefully pound on this with a hammer to unseat the shaft from the lowers. Nice and straight so that rod doesnt bend.
    official xfusion rl2 fork service and tuning thread-unnamed-30-.jpg DO NOt use the footnuts to drive out the shafts like on other forks, the nuts are too soft teh threads will strip.

    4. Heres the spring shaft end. You can pound on this directly with teh hammer to disengage it. official xfusion rl2 fork service and tuning thread-unnamed-31-.jpg
    then carefully pull the lowers off the uppers and drain all the oil.

    5. If its time for air spring service, unthread the air spring baseplate from the left leg using the pin spanner. Then carefully pull out the air piston assembly while holding the air valve open.
    official xfusion rl2 fork service and tuning thread-unnamed-32-.jpg
    official xfusion rl2 fork service and tuning thread-unnamed-34-.jpgofficial xfusion rl2 fork service and tuning thread-unnamed-35-.jpg

    6.If its time to change the damping oil or you want to revalve it; Rotate fork so upright. Remove the lockout switch with allen key. Unthread the damper side top cap and pull it up just half an inch or so until you can see the oil level. Turn fork upside down and drain the oil, while cycling teh rebound shaft to get it all out. Then carefully pull the damper up out of the leg. drain any excess oil, again while cycling teh shaft.
    official xfusion rl2 fork service and tuning thread-unnamed-36-.jpgofficial xfusion rl2 fork service and tuning thread-unnamed-37-.jpgofficial xfusion rl2 fork service and tuning thread-unnamed-38-.jpgofficial xfusion rl2 fork service and tuning thread-unnamed-40-.jpg

    My next post: Tuning and reassembly
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  2. #2
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    rl2 service, continued

    7. Pic of damper:Name:  IMG_2469.jpg
Views: 15727
Size:  31.0 KB
    some people including myself fell that the rl2 forks are a little too firm on small/stutter bumps. Someone on the slant thread mentioned taht removing the mid-valve would alleviate that. Or rearranging its shims. To get to it:

    8. See the wrench flats on this pic on teh end of the oil tube below the upper part? Using a wrench on those, unthread the oil tube from the upper part. Youll need to hold onto teh upper end with teh 28 mm socket.
    official xfusion rl2 fork service and tuning thread-unnamed-42-.jpg
    official xfusion rl2 fork service and tuning thread-unnamed-43-.jpg

    9. Now the mid-valve is exposed. Its the cup on the lower end of the base valve with thr ing of holes. Unthread this from the valve, its tough it has no wrench flats try sticky rubebr gloves or pliers with rubber in between.
    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	unnamed (43).jpg 
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ID:	889750official xfusion rl2 fork service and tuning thread-unnamed-44-.jpg

    If you look inside teh back of this cup, you can see the low/mid speed shim stack held in by an allen screw,
    official xfusion rl2 fork service and tuning thread-unnamed-45-.jpgofficial xfusion rl2 fork service and tuning thread-unnamed-24-.jpg

    the dimensions of the stock shims in the sweep are as follows, starting with the face shim closest to the piston:

    10 mm x .15 mm
    8 mm x .1 mm
    (4) 5 mm x .2 mm

    All have 3m ID.

    I dunno if other rl2 forks have the same, or differing, shim stacks.

    Ive run teh fork for the last few weeks with the entire piston removed. feels reaaly good, super plush almost coil-like. It is a tad divey on teh steeps. Today i put the assembly back in, but put one of the small pivot shims between the 10 and 8 mm shims to maybe increase low-speed sensitivity but still have some support a tad deeper in. I may also try switching out the face shim to one thats .1mm thick to soften it more. that is, if I can find one it seems like 3mm ID shims are not commonplace.
    I wont make any recommendations as I am not experienced with shim valving, I am going off some suggestions by a helpful fellow on that other thread. If any experienced shim tuners want to chime in here, including that gentleman, feel free!

    here is a pic of the high-speed shim stack, which i didnt feel the need to mess with. It also is the blow-off for when the fork is locked out
    official xfusion rl2 fork service and tuning thread-unnamed-46-.jpg

    At the otehr end of teh damper is the wrench flats to unscrew the rebound seal head so you can get to teh rebound piston. I diddnt take that apart beacuse wasnt necessary but it seems like if any orings or seals down tehre need replacing it seems pretty straightforward. Probly wont have to worry about that for a long time.

    next post: reassembly
    Last edited by dwyooaj; 04-30-2014 at 11:33 PM.
    '14 rocky mountain altitude, rally edition
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    #7 "someone on the slant thread mentioned that removing it would alleviate that". What is "it"? I will follow this thread. I to believe that my Velvet is too firm on stutter bumps.

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    10. reassemble the damper: grease (and replace if necessary) the oring that seals the oil tube to the upper part, and screw it back together. I guess try to get it as tight as it was before.

    11. Grease (and replace if necessary) the large oring that seals the damper to the stanchion wall. Carefully push the damper back down into the stanchion, but not all the way yet leave some room to add oil.

    12. slowly add 70 ml of torco rsf light a bit at a time, while cycling the rebound shaft up and down to suck the oil in (make sure lockout is off and rebound adjustment is full open) when full, make sure the shaft is fully extended, then thread on the top cap and tighten to 60 in pounds. Reinstall the lockout lever.
    Rotate the uppers so 45 degrees and lower end points up.

    13. Pour 5 cc's of rsf medium into teh air chamber. this is not in xfusions rl2 service video, however my fork had it in tehre from the factory. Also the vengeance video showed it. so i assume its supposed to go in this fork too? You can also do this at the end instead by unscrewing the top cap.

    14.Grease (and replace if necessary) the quad ring on the air piston. While holding the air valve open, carefully push the air piston assembly back in. and tighten the cap with the spanner till you hear a click.official xfusion rl2 fork service and tuning thread-unnamed-48-.jpgofficial xfusion rl2 fork service and tuning thread-unnamed-49-.jpg

    15. Clean out the lowers with a bottlebrush or thin dowel and rag. make sure the bottom-out bumpers are in tehre proper place. clean the stanchions.Pour a bit of oil on the foam rings and liberally grease the oil seals and bushings with slick honey. Slide the lowers back on the uppers halfway.

    16. Pour 15 cc's of torco rsf medium into the bottom of each leg, through the shaft holes. then while holding the air valve open, completely compress the fork. Push on the shaft ends a bit to release any air pressure in the lowers. switch on the lockout.

    17. Now the tricky part, reseating the damper shaft. Xfusion for some reason wont sell the special tool that threads into it to pull it back on. Its a wierd size you cant find at the hardware store. Xfusion says an "older" sram chainring nut will work to thread on and pull it through, but good luck finding one. However, i found a workaround. Find a piece of plastic pipe (or a long socket if you dont mind scratching the paint) of the right size and shape that fits around the end of the shaft without touching it and contacts the bottom of the lowers around teh shaft nice and evenly. i found this at a hardware store:
    official xfusion rl2 fork service and tuning thread-unnamed-50-.jpg
    Now you can pound on that with a hammer, basically driving the lowers back onto around the shaft, until enough threads show that you can pull it the rest of the way through with the foot nut. Again, remember to have the lockout switched on while doing this.

    18. Reseat the spring shaft, if not enough threads show to grab with the nut pump a few psi into teh air chamber to push the shaft end through (but dont let the fork extend yet) then thread on the foot nut and tighten it to pull the shaft completely through. if the shaft spins you can hold it still with a hex key in the bottom.

    19.Torque the foot nuts to 60 in pounds. Reinstall the rebound knob, reset the adjustment, pump the fork back up and youre done!
    Last edited by dwyooaj; 05-21-2016 at 08:38 AM.
    '14 rocky mountain altitude, rally edition
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  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tim22 View Post
    #7 "someone on the slant thread mentioned that removing it would alleviate that". What is "it"? I will follow this thread. I to believe that my Velvet is too firm on stutter bumps.
    Reread that part, i edited it.
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  6. #6
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    #17. Per advice in the Slant thread, get a second damper nut and cut it in half. The short nut has threads all the way to the bottom, so you can use it to pull the damper out. It will botton out on the top of the nut, but enough threads will show allowing you to put the uncut nut on it. This method has worked great for me.

    Ps, nice write-up.

  7. #7
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    Cool, thanks dbug! i forgot about that. Funny i called xfusion once to order a spare foot nut and they talked me out of it for some reason. i shouldve insisted. Might call again and order one.
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  8. #8
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    Awesome thread! Thanks for doing it. One recommendation for an edit would be to add "annotate current settings, open rebound all the way, and lockout the fork". I know you mention this in later steps but its probsbly more helpful in step 1. When I get around to it ill upload some pics of servicing the DLA version as the air valve is on the lower right leg.

  9. #9
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    Dbug

    Can you post a pic of the modified footnut? I'm trying to wrap my head around why a half nut works better than a full nut.

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    Great post... Thanks man!
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  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ramjm_2000 View Post
    Dbug

    Can you post a pic of the modified footnut? I'm trying to wrap my head around why a half nut works better than a full nut.
    Its cut in half lengthwise, not crosswise. Its because the threads dont go all the way to the end, cutting or grinding off that end down to where the threads are means it can engage the shaft thread easily even if only a small amount of teh shaft sticks out.
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  12. #12
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    Subscribing. This is a wonderful post and write up.

    Quote Originally Posted by dwyooaj View Post
    Its cut in half lengthwise, not crosswise. Its because the threads dont go all the way to the end, cutting or grinding off that end down to where the threads are means it can engage the shaft thread easily even if only a small amount of teh shaft sticks out.
    Essentially removing the material between the end of the nut and where the threads start?... So the nut will immediately grab and doesn't need a certain amount of shaft/rod sticking through the lower?

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by dwyooaj View Post
    Its cut in half lengthwise, not crosswise. Its because the threads dont go all the way to the end, cutting or grinding off that end down to where the threads are means it can engage the shaft thread easily even if only a small amount of teh shaft sticks out.
    Got it. Essentially getting rid of the dead space on the nut.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ramjm_2000 View Post
    Awesome thread! Thanks for doing it. One recommendation for an edit would be to add "annotate current settings, open rebound all the way, and lockout the fork". I know you mention this in later steps but its probsbly more helpful in step 1. When I get around to it ill upload some pics of servicing the DLA version as the air valve is on the lower right leg.
    there are some steps when you dont want the damper locked out, such as when unseating the shaft or compressing the fork completely before reseating the shafts. You only need to lock it when reseating the shaft.
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  15. #15
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    Cool thanks for the clarification. I could have sworn the XF travel redux video (as well as during my last Velvet service) had me lockout during unseating.

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    Good thing some-one finally disassembled the RL2 damper, but actually, I'm pretty sure that the 3mm shims aren't the mid-valve, but a additional linear tune for the basevalve.

    Traditionally you need to look for a midvalve on back-end of the rebound piston.

  17. #17
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    Great write up I could have used this when my 2 month old Trace RL2 damper disassembled itself and Xfusion told me they dont warranty their products purchased from an online retailer
    It might get a little steep from here

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    Quote Originally Posted by two-one View Post
    Good thing some-one finally disassembled the RL2 damper, but actually, I'm pretty sure that the 3mm shims aren't the mid-valve, but a additional linear tune for the basevalve.

    Traditionally you need to look for a midvalve on back-end of the rebound piston.
    I know what a traditional mid-valve is, but in the "xfusion slant anyone" thread, it was posted by someone who does suspension service that this piston is what xfusion calls their "mid-valve", and there is not a traditional midvalve on the rebound piston. But youre right, in effect this valve is an additional tune for the basevalve.
    I didnt look at my rebound piston, but from a pic someone else posted it doesnt look like theres a midvalve on tehre... but i could be wrong.

    Underscores the reason i started this thread. dont get me wrong i am a big fan of xfusions products; however compared to rockshox, which has complete service instructions and detailed parts diagrams, xfusions site is sorely lacking in this department
    Last edited by dwyooaj; 05-02-2014 at 08:33 AM.
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  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by thecrackerasscracker View Post
    Great write up I could have used this when my 2 month old Trace RL2 damper disassembled itself and Xfusion told me they dont warranty their products purchased from an online retailer
    .which retailer was it?
    Last edited by dwyooaj; 05-02-2014 at 08:32 AM.
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  20. #20
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    Awesome. Thanks for the directions. I'm anxiously awaiting my 140mm trace for my Nimble 9.

  21. #21
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    Well ive ridden it a few times with the midvalve reinstalled but teh shimstack altered (i put one of the small pivot shims between the 10 mm face shim and the 8 mm support shim). It feels just about what mullen thought, about 25% of teh way between stock and midvalve removed. I think replacing teh face shim with a .1 mm shim will be the way to go. unfortunately I have to have that size custom made, I have requests out to a few machine shops for pricing, heard back from one but they have a $150 minimum order. Im waiting to hear from a local guy to see what he can do. Does anyone else wnat any? Illreport back.
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  22. #22
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    Sure. I'll take one for if/when I open mine up. Depending on cost though

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    Is the mid valve the only tunable shim stack? Or is the base valve able to be adjusted as well?

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    I think the mid-valve is the only adjust for teh base valve; after I took off teh mid-valve and looked down the circuit it looked like a straight shot to teh port that can be closed by the lockout switch.. tehre is also a high-speed circuit with some bigger shims, I didnt tear it apart that far. You can see it in my pic #20. Those look like standard msizes I think thats what xfusion cutom-tunes if you want them to. But i could be wrong as to the exact names/functions of these stacks.
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    If anyones ineterested I talked to a guy who can make me .1mm 3 mm ID 10 mm OD shims to replace the .15 mm stock face shim. Basically cost is about $50 for 1 shim, but like $6o or so for 10, the cost is mostly in the setup. So let me know ASAP if you want one and ill have them made and well split the total cost. id like to order them tomorrow because im going to be out of town camping next week. caveat: the stock shim measurements posted here are from my sweep, and I suspect its the same for the slant and the trace but dont know for sure. the 32 mm forks may have a different sized shimstack.
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  26. #26
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    I'd be in for 1.

  27. #27
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    I really think you should look for the tuning possibilities in reducing the stack preload on the "high speed stack" for a plusher ride over rough terrain.
    Is it so difficult to disassemble?

  28. #28
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    I took out the damper and the "midvalve" "cap" thing and noticed that there were only 3 shims of 3 different sizes arranged in a conical stack. I wonder why in the pics there were 5. I rearranged the shims so that the smallest shim sat in between the two larger shims - hopefully to achieve better small bump compliance while not completely losing the mid-valve effect.
    Anyway, testing around the block, I felt as if the fork were slightly more plush. Real trail testing tomorrow.

    Anyway, some tips:
    1. Use the right tools - I tried a socket and it almost mangled the top cap (those things are on TIGHT). Got these from lunar bikes and they're perfect.


    2. You can do the tuning mod without taking the fork completely apart. Just remove all air, unscrew the damper top cap, compress fork and lift the damper until you can access the wrench flats on the main tube. Some oil spillage is possible though. Then you can unscrew the top half of the damper assembly.
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    Cobym, which fork do you have? Mine is a sweep it would be interesting to know how the shim configurations differ for the various rl2 forks. If your big shim is 10 mm and the middle one is 8 it should have the same effects as my stack. i also put one of teh small pivot shims between the 10 and 8 mm shims but would like it a tad softer so want to try the thinner face shim too.

    1.Was your socket end ground flat? Mine was and it worked fine. The lunar tools are also a great way to go.

    2. Great idea!
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  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by two-one View Post
    I really think you should look for the tuning possibilities in reducing the stack preload on the "high speed stack" for a plusher ride over rough terrain.
    Is it so difficult to disassemble?
    Might try that down the road, looks like i would have to get some very flat wrenches to get at some of the wrench flats, but shouldnt bee too difficult. that stack looks like a straight stack of 4 -6 shims, might be interesting to change that to a taperd stack. And since those are likely standard sizes would be cheap to mes with. If anyone has any advice on specific mods to that stack that would be great. But IMO the fork feels really good on rougher terrain with bigger chunk/hits, its the small-bump sensitivity i need to open up. However softening up the big stack might help with fast sharp stutter bumps.
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    I'd be in for 1.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dwyooaj View Post
    Might try that down the road, looks like i would have to get some very flat wrenches to get at some of the wrench flats, but shouldnt bee too difficult. that stack looks like a straight stack of 4 -6 shims, might be interesting to change that to a taperd stack. And since those are likely standard sizes would be cheap to mes with. If anyone has any advice on specific mods to that stack that would be great. But IMO the fork feels really good on rougher terrain with bigger chunk/hits, its the small-bump sensitivity i need to open up. However softening up the big stack might help with fast sharp stutter bumps.
    Would cone wrenches be thin enough?

    Just picked my fork up today. It's sitting in my trunk right now while I'm at work. Driving me nuts I can't play with it.

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    i think a cone wrench would work. If i remember correctly its 12 mm, i have some cone wrenches but theyre bigger.
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  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ramjm_2000 View Post
    Dbug

    Can you post a pic of the modified footnut? I'm trying to wrap my head around why a half nut works better than a full nut.
    You guys figured it out with words, but a picture is worth a thousand of them. So here you go
    This was my original footnut. You can see the silver area on the piece on the right, that's where the threads stripped when I tried threading it on like I've done with all Fox and RS forks I've had.
    official xfusion rl2 fork service and tuning thread-img_2688.jpg

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    Well so far there are 5 takers for the shims. I called the guy back today and left a message, im sure ill talk to him in the near future and order a small batch, maybe ten or a dozen in case anyone else chimes or i want to keep a few spares. Ill update on this thread with price and ETA.
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    sounds good. I might actually be in for a second for my Velvet (vs. My sweep)

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by dwyooaj View Post
    Cobym, which fork do you have? Mine is a sweep it would be interesting to know how the shim configurations differ for the various rl2 forks. If your big shim is 10 mm and the middle one is 8 it should have the same effects as my stack. i also put one of teh small pivot shims between the 10 and 8 mm shims but would like it a tad softer so want to try the thinner face shim too.
    1.Was your socket end ground flat? Mine was and it worked fine. The lunar tools are also a great way to go.

    2. Great idea!
    I have the sweep.
    Socket was a bad 12pt unground one, but which worked on my fox 34. The xfusion caps are thin and soft. Good thing I stopped after one try.

    Anyway, I tried the small shim sandwich which you mention on a real trail today. It feels plusher with better small bump sensitivity, but only very slightly. The mid valve is still very much present, which is good (one of the reasons I bought the fork and sold the divey fox 34). I'll probably try it with the cap removed just to see how it is without.
    FYI, I refilled the cart with golden Spectro 5wt which should be same or close to stock. Should I go with a lighter oil?
    The sweep fork doesn't feel bad, but it's just that my other bike has a coil marz 55 rc3ti. Hard to beat a coil in terms of plushness and it's maybe the reason I'm unconsciously looking for that coil feel. Attainable? Or am I just fooling myself.
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    Quote Originally Posted by cobym2 View Post
    FYI, I refilled the cart with golden Spectro 5wt which should be same or close to stock. Should I go with a lighter oil?

    The sweep fork doesn't feel bad, but it's just that my other bike has a coil marz 55 rc3ti. Hard to beat a coil in terms of plushness and it's maybe the reason I'm unconsciously looking for that coil feel. Attainable? Or am I just fooling myself.
    the cst value of 5w spectro fork oil is 21.7, the stock oil is 14.5. Thats significantly thicker. Unless you used the "cartridge fork fluid" whic is 16.2, close enough.

    yeah, thats where im at. Ive only ran coil forks before and thats what im used to, so trying to do what i can to get more suppleness out of this air fork. Everyone who says air forks feel as good as coil these days is just high (especially your Zoke!). But with rear shocks, its getting pretty close.
    '14 rocky mountain altitude, rally edition
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  39. #39
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    Coby, do you want one of the thinner shims?
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  40. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by dwyooaj View Post
    the cst value of 5w spectro fork oil is 21.7, the stock oil is 14.5. Thats significantly thicker. Unless you used the "cartridge fork fluid" whic is 16.2, close enough.

    .
    Aha. So that's why. I have a bottle of 2.5 wt coming so I'll try that first.
    SCB Nomad, SCB 5010v2, Turner RFX, Voodoo D-jab 650B, Voodoo Wazoo CX/commuter
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    Just so im not leavin y'all hanging, i called the guy whos gonna make the shims the other day and left a message but havent heard back yet. Tomorrow morning im leaving for a 4 day camping trip out of cellphone range. so, hopefully ill talk to him when i get back and get these going.
    '14 rocky mountain altitude, rally edition
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  42. #42
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    Dwyooaj, Thanks, but Im ok. I have a couple of shims from an old old shock that I can probably play with.
    SCB Nomad, SCB 5010v2, Turner RFX, Voodoo D-jab 650B, Voodoo Wazoo CX/commuter
    ...so far...

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    Sounds good.

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    Anyone know if there is a way to change the lockout? It's just not a feature I'll ever use unless it can be modified to be a diffrent compression/platform setting.

  45. #45
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    Yes. Mine is the medium compression setting (and is still too firm for my liking). What they changed to get there? No clue.

    "You can make a soft lock out (still not descendable) , or make the lock out function a medium compression setting (descendable), or also adjusting the mid valve if you feel the fork dives to much in corners (also depends on your weight)"

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    Quote Originally Posted by hokiebrett View Post
    Yes. Mine is the medium compression setting (and is still too firm for my liking). What they changed to get there? No clue.

    "You can make a soft lock out (still not descendable) , or make the lock out function a medium compression setting (descendable), or also adjusting the mid valve if you feel the fork dives to much in corners (also depends on your weight)"
    That straight from xfusion? Any idea how to modify the lockout? I'd be interested in making it a medium compression setting.

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    Straight from them. No clue what they did.

  48. #48
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    Gotta give thanks where all can see,
    I modified my slant by removing the entire shim stack, thanks to dwyooja's great clear photos on the disassembled fork, + my added 2.5 wt oil.
    Went on a ride yesterday where the trail has rock gardens; sever breaking bumps; & steep drops as well, the fork works superbly for me compared to stock form, better than any fork I've used to date! Thanks again dwyooja for taking the time to get inside this fork & posting your findings & thoughts...

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    Kneecap, Good to know. Whats your weight, if you dont mind?

    Quote Originally Posted by kneecap View Post
    Gotta give thanks where all can see,
    I modified my slant by removing the entire shim stack, thanks to dwyooja's great clear photos on the disassembled fork, + my added 2.5 wt oil.
    Went on a ride yesterday where the trail has rock gardens; sever breaking bumps; & steep drops as well, the fork works superbly for me compared to stock form, better than any fork I've used to date! Thanks again dwyooja for taking the time to get inside this fork & posting your findings & thoughts...
    SCB Nomad, SCB 5010v2, Turner RFX, Voodoo D-jab 650B, Voodoo Wazoo CX/commuter
    ...so far...

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    I will be getting teh shims in a few days. they will be $6 each, or if you want 2 (d-bug) $10 for both. I know that sounds like a lot for a shim but such is the law of small batches. When I get them Ill contact y'all with my paypal. i want to make sure theyre perfect and flat first.
    '14 rocky mountain altitude, rally edition
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    Quote Originally Posted by kneecap View Post
    Gotta give thanks where all can see,
    I modified my slant by removing the entire shim stack, thanks to dwyooja's great clear photos on the disassembled fork, + my added 2.5 wt oil.
    Went on a ride yesterday where the trail has rock gardens; sever breaking bumps; & steep drops as well, the fork works superbly for me compared to stock form, better than any fork I've used to date! Thanks again dwyooja for taking the time to get inside this fork & posting your findings & thoughts...
    Youre welcome. I agree teh fork feels much better with that shimstack removed. im still gonna try just oputting in the one, thinner shim, and see how that goes.
    '14 rocky mountain altitude, rally edition
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  52. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by cobym2 View Post
    Kneecap, Good to know. Whats your weight, if you dont mind?
    I'm rolling at 150 lbs. no gear, not really that fast, but not bad for my age..

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    I got the shims, If you want one paypal me $6 at jonesie29@gmail.com. These users are first in line and gauranteed to get one: grok22, d-bug (for 2), hokiebrett, ramjm_2000, and Kand. Anyone else, message or email me first just to make sure i didnt run out.
    I put one in my sweep today (to reiterate, its to replace the stock .15mm thick face shim with a .1 mm shim, and I also put one of teh pivot shims between the face shim and teh secondary shim) feels like what I wanted to do , just a little firmer than with the whole stack removed. Will test on trail this weekend.
    '14 rocky mountain altitude, rally edition
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    Edit: its $6 if youre in the us. If youre elsewhere email or pm me your address and ill se how much extra international shipping is Thanks!
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  55. #55
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    PayPal sent!

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    oh, and when you paypal me please note your mtbr username. thanks!
    '14 rocky mountain altitude, rally edition
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    Quote Originally Posted by dwyooaj View Post
    oh, and when you paypal me please note your mtbr username. thanks!
    Paid.

    Cheers


    Kand

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    Paid.

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    Paid

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    Well, i got on the trail yesterday with the thinner shim mod. I believe we have a winner, at least for my weight and the chunky trails around here. It feels about two thirds of the way between stock, and the entire midvalve removed. Absorbs the bumps a lot better, (not quite as good as entire stack removed) but still has a little support for flowy trails and steeps.
    I mailed out the shims on fri to everyone who ordered. When you do the mod post on here and let me know what you think.
    '14 rocky mountain altitude, rally edition
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  62. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by dwyooaj View Post
    at least for my weight and the chunky trails around here.
    Mind me asking your weight and location?

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    I weigh 210 geared up. laguna beach, CA
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  64. #64
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    Hello, does anyone know where I can find xfusion oil volume charts?

  65. #65
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    Just wanted to thank everyone that has posted to this thread. I made a travel adustment on my Slide today and this along with the pdf and vid's from X-Fusion was very helpful. NOT helpful is the section here on the valving. Now I want to mess with mine! -LOL!

    Notes: Mine is a late 2012/13 and the damper side had no oil at all in the lower so I did not add any. It has worked fine that way for almost 2 years so...
    Somehow one of the springs at the dust seal top fell into the fork leg while cleaning the lower out. I have never ever seen this happen and when I was sliding the lowers back on, it hung up and scraped the lower two inches of the stanchion which won't affect the working part of the fork. Be careful with this-could have been really bad if I forced the lower all the way up.

    Once again thanks and I will be doing my test on my new Vassago Verhauen (coming off a Jabberwocky) tomorrow. If I notice anything weird I will let you know.
    Vassago Cycles, Shadetree Bikes, Flat Tire Bikes, Galfer Brakes USA

  66. #66
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    I'd definitely add oil....

  67. #67
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    Ram-I thought about it, but it has never leaked. I have washed my bike once ever, and there would be a snail trail if it did. Also, on the Slant there is nothing to lube there. Looking at the pics on this thread, the damper rod is lubed by the oil in the valving area. I am going to run it as is and has been for the last couple thousand miles. Like I wrote, this thing will probably come apart again soon to do some valving work to take out the small chatter spikes.
    Vassago Cycles, Shadetree Bikes, Flat Tire Bikes, Galfer Brakes USA

  68. #68
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    Just an update after a few weeks toying with the midvalve: shim stack rearrangement v. mid valve removed.

    As a background, I first removed the shimstack and refilled with Golden Spectro cartridge fork fluid (which is supposed to be the right viscosity, I think) 5wt. Im 175lbs and the Sweep goes on my Turner Burner 650b enduro rig. I initially dove into these mods to get some small bump compliance from the Sweep, which I felt was a bit harsh new. But I quite loved the midvalve support which translated to better control for me on the steeps and braking.

    With the midvalve removed, the fork is buttery and smoother over the small bumps. Very nice and "SUV-like". Rode it a few times like that and was actually quite happy. But I had the nagging feeling to see how the fork would perform with the shim stack rearrangement.

    The shim stack rearrangement I am talking about is the same as described by dwyooaj above (switch smaller and medium shims, leave large shim in place). These are the stock shims and not the thinner shims from dwyooaj.
    Riding, it felt closer to stock, with slightly better small bump performance. It was smoother on chattery stuff, but still had good support against diving. I would say its quite closer to the firmer (stock) midvalve than it is to the fork with the midvalve completely removed.

    Between the two, I prefer the 2nd mod (shimstack rearranged). Less plush on little bumps but better control.

    Now I'm wondering how the thinner shims from dwyooaj would do. I suppose they would split the difference between 1 and 2 again. (Now where are those extra shims I saw laying around?......:P = the tinkerer's curse)

    This fork is quite an amazing performer, especially for a tinkerer like me, and for the price, it dethrones my Marz 55 RC3ti as my favorite. Durability is yet untested though.
    SCB Nomad, SCB 5010v2, Turner RFX, Voodoo D-jab 650B, Voodoo Wazoo CX/commuter
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  69. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by cstem View Post
    Ram-I thought about it, but it has never leaked. I have washed my bike once ever, and there would be a snail trail if it did. Also, on the Slant there is nothing to lube there. Looking at the pics on this thread, the damper rod is lubed by the oil in the valving area. I am going to run it as is and has been for the last couple thousand miles. Like I wrote, this thing will probably come apart again soon to do some valving work to take out the small chatter spikes.
    Not sure i follow when you say there is nothing to lube. The slide is basically a 29" Velvet no? Enix? They should all have stanchion lubrication oil in the lowers. I can't imagine a bone dry fork is very smooth not to mention killing the seals, etc...

  70. #70
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    cstem, you crazy. the fork absolutely needs bath oil in the lower to lube the bushings,stanchion, and oil seal. Just because it was bone dry when you disassembled doesnt mean you shouldnt put it in. Eitehr you have a leak or the factory forgot to put it in.
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  71. #71
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    official xfusion rl2 fork service and tuning thread

    Have a question;
    I sent my Slide 29 RL2 fork in for a leak 2x in a space of 3 weeks (was told it was a torn o-ring at the foot nut they missed the first time they fixed my damper rod), and this time when I got it back they had replaced the uppers. When I called them to find out why, I was told they upgraded the damper to the one they use in the 34mm forks. My Slide was an RL2, is there an upgraded damper in the larger forks? And how possible is it that the same one is used between the different diameter forks. I don't doubt they upgraded it because they have been absolutely wonderful throughout this process and exceeded my expectations, I just don't know how the damper is supposed to be different/better. Just curious if someone here knows. It "looks" the same from the outside, but that doesn't mean anything.

    Thanks!
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    Quote Originally Posted by dwyooaj View Post

    3. Use a 4 mm socket placed on the end of the rebound shaft where tehre are hex flats. carefully pound on this with a hammer to unseat the shaft from the lowers. Nice and straight so that rod doesnt bend.
    Click image for larger version. 

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ID:	889707 DO NOt use the footnuts to drive out the shafts like on other forks, the nuts are too soft teh threads will strip.
    does this get around needing the special damper removal tool that they show in the video on their website (X Fusion Shox - RL2 Fork Travel Adjust) or have they changed something for the 2014 forks?

    I just got off the phone with them and they don't sell the tool to end users only service centers have it, but i'm hoping that i don't actually need it. Anyone know?
    thanks

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    In a word, yes. Thats how you get around the special tool. However, I read somewhere that theyre working on an affordable tool to sell, available somrtime soon.
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    Has anyone experimented with any other shim configurations? Additionally, I am assuming the bottom out bumpers are the black rubber pieces situated in the bottom of the fork legs - are there supposed to be 2 bumpers in the air spring side, or one in each side?
    2014 Banshee Spitfire 650b
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  75. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by dwyooaj View Post
    In a word, yes. Thats how you get around the special tool. However, I read somewhere that theyre working on an affordable tool to sell, available somrtime soon.
    That unseats it, right? But he'll need a different home tool to reseat it. PVC pipe or deep socket that is bigger than the end of the damper to pound the lowers back on.
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  76. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by KRob View Post
    That unseats it, right? But he'll need a different home tool to reseat it. PVC pipe or deep socket that is bigger than the end of the damper to pound the lowers back on.
    yep, just like the pic I posted in post #4, step 17.
    '14 rocky mountain altitude, rally edition
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    I'm going to be pulling my sweep apart in a few weeks to address a few niggles I have with the fork. Like others, I find the fork a bit harsh on the small stuff but love the mid stroke support. Also I've struggled to get the spring rate to my liking. If I have the air pressure low enough to make it plush (5psi below the recommendation for my weight) it bottoms too easily, but if I increase the pressure even by 5psi, it becomes too harsh.
    Here's what I'm thinking of trying:
    - swap the shims in the midvalve to: 5mm, 10mm, 8mm, 2x 5mm.
    - add a little float fluid to the air chamber to reduce air volume a little.

    The idea of putting the 5mm shim at the face of the cup is to provide a small gap to allow some free bleed before the shims engage. My thinking is that a traditional shimmed damper has an orifice to allow some oil to flow before the flow becomes great enough to engage the shims so I'm trying to achieve something similar. Am I on the right track or way off?

  78. #78
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    Cross post from the XF Sweep thread, but it is relevant here as well:
    Quote Originally Posted by hokiebrett View Post
    Also, I had my first warranty experience with XFusion and it was favorable. It was a defect in workmanship from when they tuned my fork. Instead of having me ship it back, they were willing to have me drop it off at DirtLabs in Boulder, CO. Quite pleased.
    As I follow up, I want to give credit where credit is due. DirtLabs in Boulder did my warranty work for my custom (factory) tuned Sweep. They did a Schlube 'n Lube as well as a 'Pro-Tune' and the fork now feels wonderful.

    This time around they put in Maxima 3W oil in the damper and made sure everything was very nicely Schlube 'n Lubed up.

    If you ever want fork work done, give Luby a call at DirtLabs, great guy and great service!

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    Last edited by 06HokieMTB; 08-01-2014 at 09:07 AM.
    I like 'em long, low, slack and playful

  79. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by dwyooaj View Post
    I mailed out the shims on fri to everyone who ordered. When you do the mod post on here and let me know what you think.
    Thanks again for getting those made and sent out. I have not ridden mine yet for quite a few reasons (wheel rim failure, bike frame swap, warranty work on the Sweep... Oh yeah, also got married, took a honey moon in Costa Rica... ya know, normal stuff).

    Next time I have the fork open for service (or if I decide to try it at 160mm on the newer frame), I'll give the shim a whirl and post up my results.

    I too, love the DIY tinkerability of this Sweep!

    Quote Originally Posted by chize View Post
    does this get around needing the special damper removal tool that they show in the video on their website (X Fusion Shox - RL2 Fork Travel Adjust) or have they changed something for the 2014 forks?

    I just got off the phone with them and they don't sell the tool to end users only service centers have it, but i'm hoping that i don't actually need it. Anyone know?
    thanks
    It was me that posted up saying XF plans on making a consumer level damper removal tool (maybe not in this thread, the Sweep thread on MTBR). A few months ago, there was no ETA and pricing.

    But, it seems its not necessary... As people here are figuring out how to do it without the tool.
    I like 'em long, low, slack and playful

  80. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by hokiebrett View Post
    Cross post from the XF Sweep thread, but it is relevant here as well:


    As I follow up, I want to give credit where credit is due. DirtLabs in Boulder did my warranty work for my custom (factory) tuned Sweep. They rebuilt to stock spec's and the fork lost quite a bit of small bump and high speed chatter stability...

    Took the fork back and DirtLabs (on their dime, not XF's) opened it back up, did a Schlube 'n Lube as well as a 'Pro-Tune' and the fork now feels wonderful. Apparently the stock weight oil did not play well with whatever XF did on the original factory tune I had done (which modified the RL2 to be more like a Open/Trail instead of Open/Lock... they changed the lock to a medium compression setting).

    This time around DirtLabs put in Maxima 3W oil in the damper and made sure everything was very nicely Schlube 'n Lubed up.

    If you ever want fork work done, give Luby a call at DirtLabs, great guy and great service!

    dirtlabs.com

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    So all they did was change the oil to Maxima 3W to get your fork feeling good again? hmm maybe I should try that oil in mine.
    '12 Scott Spark 29 Team
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  81. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by zephxiii View Post
    So all they did was change the oil to Maxima 3W to get your fork feeling good again? hmm maybe I should try that oil in mine.
    Yes/No.

    My fork had been factory tuned by XF. They converted the Lockout to a Medium Compression ('Trail') setting. I do not know what XF changed to do this.

    DirtLabs was contracted to perform some warranty service on my fork (XF had a workmanship defect after the custom tune). Upon reassmembly, DirtLabs put 7wt oil back in the damper as that is what was called for, but it changed the handling characteristics of my fork. Changing to 3W seems to have brought the handling characteristics back.

    When I pull this fork apart, I'll take pics of the damper and post them up here. Maybe we can figure out what XF did to change my Lockout to a Medium Compression knob.
    I like 'em long, low, slack and playful

  82. #82
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    Well I guess I was trying to highlight the oil making the difference when Dirtlabs was working on it.

    Yeah info on your lockout setup would be interesting.
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  83. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by dwyooaj View Post
    here is a pic of the high-speed shim stack, which i didnt feel the need to mess with. It also is the blow-off for when the fork is locked out
    Click image for larger version. 

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    Can you highlight which one is the blow-off for when the fork is locked out? I'm thinking that's what XF changed on my fork. I'd like it to be a little softer, so I'm curious if it's a reconfigured shim or orifice?
    I like 'em long, low, slack and playful

  84. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by zephxiii View Post
    Well I guess I was trying to highlight the oil making the difference when Dirtlabs was working on it
    He said they also Schlube 'n Lubed the crap out of it. The small bump compliance (rocky trail chatter) was incredibly harsh and there was a tremendous amount of low speed stiction (if you pushed down on the handlebars, it would actually 'catch' and get stiff, then slowly release). Big hits seemed to be better and I was getting full travel.
    I like 'em long, low, slack and playful

  85. #85
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    Well I ordered:
    Bel-Ray High Performance Fork Oil - 2.5W - 1 Liter 99290-B1LW
    Torco RSF Medium Racing Shock Fluid Bottle
    FW-28 Wrench for the end cap

    Going to change the damper oil (which needs changed anyways) to the 2.5w just to see what difference it will make, and lowers oil.

    Then I might play around with the shims if I feel the want to.
    '12 Scott Spark 29 Team
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  86. #86
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    So I added the oil (see older post by me this thread) to the air side and all was well after going to 120mm setting. Rode bike hard for about 200 miles then things got weird. The other night, lockout started to spin (with resistance) past the lockout setting. Then unlocking, it unlocked easy then the extra spin.

    Then the travel became less and less to 80 mm, then full lock and extension, with the lockout doing nothing. I called Xfusion, got some great advice from John and tore in. I took apart air side just to be sure the travel adjust roll pin did not come out and dig into the side of the fork-all good. Took apart the damper side. First thing was the little nut under the lockout cap was loose. So I undid the top cap and noticed the top chamber was filled to the top with oil, and when removing the nut for the lower shaft (note- my fork is not like the sweep pic this thread. The top and bottom dampers are not connected with the tube and there are no threads to connect them, so I guess that is it MY2012) and the oil was less on that end. Cleaned it all up with some PJ1 Super Clean, lubed and reassembled with new oil. That fixed it and it feels better now actually. I figure I either got some debris in the lockout valving or drain back hole and caused hydro lock. Either way, thanks to all the contributors on this thread. I wish I took pics of my fork apart, but was too oily and phone was dead, and it was 105 degrees in my garage at night. Next time for sure. Tonight is a long night ride with some fast rocky chunky stuff, if I run into issues I will let you know.
    Vassago Cycles, Shadetree Bikes, Flat Tire Bikes, Galfer Brakes USA

  87. #87
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    Tagged for when my Velvet gets here.

  88. #88
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    Ok, took my Sweep for another chattery ride today. My ABP rear end with a DRCV CTD shock definitely outguns the Sweep on the small chattery stuff. Sounds like it's time to open her up and play with the new shim.

    2.5W Golden Spectro fork oil is on order. Gotta get a 6pt socket from AutoZone and grind it down.
    I like 'em long, low, slack and playful

  89. #89
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    My slide is built differently. I don't have a damper tube inside the stanchion.

    I unscrewed the bottom and it was just the damper rod and piston valve.
    I unscrewed the top and pulled out the top part which was only a few inches long.

    So the mod is really easy to do on the Slide.

    Keep in mind that it requires a different volume of damper oil, I heard it was 140ml. I didn't measure it as I set it just under where it started acting like a spring. Not enough and the lockout will not work.

    Also the custom wrenches mentioned on the 2nd page is well worth the 7 dollars + shipping. I would like to get the size for the bottom of the damper but luckily I had a closed end for it.

    I changed damper oil to 2.5w which I think helps but hard to tell as I really needed a lowers service.

    Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk
    '12 Scott Spark 29 Team
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  90. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by bkmad View Post
    I'm going to be pulling my sweep apart in a few weeks to address a few niggles I have with the fork. Like others, I find the fork a bit harsh on the small stuff but love the mid stroke support. Also I've struggled to get the spring rate to my liking. If I have the air pressure low enough to make it plush (5psi below the recommendation for my weight) it bottoms too easily, but if I increase the pressure even by 5psi, it becomes too harsh.
    Here's what I'm thinking of trying:
    - swap the shims in the midvalve to: 5mm, 10mm, 8mm, 2x 5mm.
    - add a little float fluid to the air chamber to reduce air volume a little.

    The idea of putting the 5mm shim at the face of the cup is to provide a small gap to allow some free bleed before the shims engage. My thinking is that a traditional shimmed damper has an orifice to allow some oil to flow before the flow becomes great enough to engage the shims so I'm trying to achieve something similar. Am I on the right track or way off?
    Well I made these changes last weekend and went for a ride yesterday. I'm guessing that my changes to the shim stack have opened it up to much as the fork is quite divey now. Unfortunately it doesn't seem to have helped much in improving the harshness over the smaller stuff. Medium to big hits are still fine. Next time I have it apart I'll probably go back to something close to the stock shim arrangement - maybe try a 5mm shim between the 10 and 8.

    The addition of some oil to the air chamber has improved the ramp up a little but I think I'll add some more which will let me drop my air pressure a little more for some better compliance.

  91. #91
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    What oil are u using in the damper?

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  92. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by zephxiii View Post
    What oil are u using in the damper?

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    Motul 2.5w. It was the closest I could get.

  93. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by bkmad View Post
    Motul 2.5w. It was the closest I could get.
    hmm, do you know the cSt @ 40c? Mine has been riding really good since the change to 2.5, but I based my oil selection on comparative benchmarks to the stock oil.
    '12 Scott Spark 29 Team
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  94. #94
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    Quote Originally Posted by zephxiii View Post
    hmm, do you know the cSt @ 40c? Mine has been riding really good since the change to 2.5, but I based my oil selection on comparative benchmarks to the stock oil.
    Its 15.0 mm≤/s. I think the Torco RSF Light is 14.5.

  95. #95
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    Re: official xfusion rl2 fork service and tuning thread

    Quote Originally Posted by bkmad View Post
    Its 15.0 mm≤/s. I think the Torco RSF Light is 14.5.
    Oh that's why. The Bel-Ray 2.5w I got measures 9.2, maybe try that.

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  96. #96
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    So after some testing with the lowers service and damper oil change to Bel-Ray 2.5w Fork oil on my Slide...

    The fork is moving a lot easier and soaking up more. Finally got to ride the home trail last night and it is absorbing the hits more easily. I set a bunch of PRs and landed 2nd place on my fav trail section as the fork just let me ride. I remember this one big root in a fast section that I would always feel and have to brace for. It didn't even feel like it was there as the fork soaked it up.

    There was still a couple of times where i felt a lot of chatter but it might be because i was at the top of travel where there is corrosive damage on my damper stanchion which causes it to stick. However if I roll through a root section or whatever the fork feels very well controlled at eats the rough up so I don't have to deal with it. I just need to get my crown/stanchion/steerer assembly replaced to get it working better at the top.

    Having done the lowers service which was badly needed it is hard to tell what is having the greatest effect. However I do think that the damper oil change to 2.5 is having a greater effect on how it is riding since it feels like the freshness of the lowers service has worn off just a little bit to where I can feel it to start getting hung up again at the top.
    '12 Scott Spark 29 Team
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  97. #97
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    What is the status on a more proper tool to remove the lowers? I heard that maybe they were going to release one, but haven't heard much since.

    What is the go-to method that people are using for removing the lowers?
    X-prezo Super-D, 26in style.

  98. #98
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    Removing the lowers: Undo the footnuts and bang away on the spring side with a soft blow hammer/rubber mallet. For the damper side (with the rebound knob removed), DONT hit the tiny rebound rod or it will break. find a socket or small plastic tube that fits over the rebound rod, but sits on the end of the threaded portion and hit that with a hammer. Dont use the footnut as it is soft. According to some posters, if you can find an old SRAM chainring nut (I have no idea what this is, but I have tried normal chainring nuts and they dont fit), this can take the place of the footnut: thread it in a bit and hit that with the hammer.

    I suppose you are referring to the damper side. Use a hollow tube that fits over the threads and hit the lowers with a hammer lightly until enough of the threads show to thread on the footnut and pull it out. a small PVC pipe, or even a socket can do (but it may scratch your lower). Lock out and extend the damper prior to positioning the lowers on the stanchions.

    No need for a fancy shmancy tool. But being a tool whore, yes, I would buy that dang special tool from Xfusion if it were available.

    Quote Originally Posted by y0bailey View Post
    What is the status on a more proper tool to remove the lowers? I heard that maybe they were going to release one, but haven't heard much since.

    What is the go-to method that people are using for removing the lowers?
    SCB Nomad, SCB 5010v2, Turner RFX, Voodoo D-jab 650B, Voodoo Wazoo CX/commuter
    ...so far...

  99. #99
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    Dont know if this has been posted before but it seems the damper design has changed and it needs more oil (or always was different). My 2014 Velvet RL2 contained about 120mL and it really needed this much to submerge the compression/lockout circuit.
    The top part could be removed while the rebound circuit and rod stayed in place.

    Does somebody know the official amount for the Velvet?

  100. #100
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    Great thread! Also, the service video put out by x-fusion is excellent as well.

    I have to give a shout out to the customer service at x-fusion as well. I bought my dad an rl2 fork that we wanted to bump the travel up on and a few questions came up that required a couple of phone calls into x-fusion. Those calls were answered quickly and the questions answered knowledgeably. Couldn't ask for more. The fork seems to be very nice as well.

    FYI, one question was regarding what oil is safe to use and it was a quick no on the mobile1 oil for x-fusion forks. I think this was discussed earlier in this thread.

    Another FYI, if you have an OEM fork, rather than a push pin to adjust the travel, you my have a c-clip.

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