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  1. #1
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    New question here. bad bottom out problems - Pace RC405

    Noticed a lot of bottom outs on my RC 405. Always put this down to my RP23 having a high-volume air can.

    So I tried DGCs excellent shim mod, which improved things, but still even a tiny jump results in a hard bottom out. Even moving to 15% sag (from ~25%) doesn't prevent it.

    Anyhow, I downloaded the demo of Linkage, and somebody had helpfully drawn an RC506 on it (very similar bike, more travel, slight geo change) - and HOLY CARP! Look at the change in rate at the bottom of the stroke!



    The regressive change in rate from 2.3 to 2.8 seems massive compared to other bikes.

    Is this as weird as it seems, or am I missing the point of what they're trying to achieve?

    Not sure where I can go from here to sort it out. Is there an extra small volume airsleeve available for the RP23 (2010 with boostvalve) ?
    Last edited by retro83; 06-03-2010 at 05:24 AM.

  2. #2
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    Why RP23 and not DT EX200?

    I have about 20-25% sag on my RC405 (105psi), and I can not make it bottom out in "normal" riding, which includes 2 ft jumps and drops.
    I surely can make it bottom out if I do a big bunny hop on flat ground and slam the bike down hard, but I don't do that very often...

    I think the idea of the of the suspension is to compensate the progression of air shocks, so you don't need a HV can to get a linear feel.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by plussa
    Why RP23 and not DT EX200?
    I bought mine discounted with a RS Monarch shock which was awful (the 'D' tuning - unbelievable amount of platform, then no damping afterwards)

    Quote Originally Posted by plussa
    I have about 20-25% sag on my RC405 (105psi), and I can not make it bottom out in "normal" riding, which includes 2 ft jumps and drops.
    I surely can make it bottom out if I do a big bunny hop on flat ground and slam the bike down hard, but I don't do that very often...
    105PSI ?! Wow, that shock must have a tiny chamber - probably explains the falling rate of the frame! I'm at 210PSI to get 20% sag on my RP23 (I do weigh 85 KG though )

    Quote Originally Posted by plussa
    I think the idea of the of the suspension is to compensate the progression of air shocks, so you don't need a HV can to get a linear feel.
    Yes, I think you're right, but the change in ratio seems too much I've emailed TF Tuned to see if they can get me an extra low volume sleeve for the RP23. In the meantime I've packed an even larger shim into the HV sleeve. Maybe it'll improve things.

  4. #4
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    I also ordered a discount frame that was supposed to come with Monarch, but it arrived with EX200 instead, so I got an additional 178.99 refund!

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by plussa
    I also ordered a discount frame that was supposed to come with Monarch, but it arrived with EX200 instead, so I got an additional 178.99 refund!
    jammy bugger! You dodged a bullet there

  6. #6
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    At first the EX200 felt a bit sticky, but after about 200km it feels so plush that I sometimes have to check if the rear tyre is leaking air...

    I weigh 85kg with riding gear, camelbak full, and I'm using 75neg/70pos pressure in my Revelation fork. It still doesn't feel as plush as the rear suspension, so I just ordered a sale DT XMC 130 from CRC...

  7. #7
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    Hmm, well I dropped in an even bigger shim last night. Initially all seemed good, set pressure to about 180 PSI to get 25-30% sag. Worked well on small to medium stuff. I got a nice big 'clunk' on the first jump I hit tho

    Still, the good news is that TF Tuned confirmed that they can get me a normal volume airsleeve to fit the 2010 RP23. No such thing as a Low Volume version though.

  8. #8
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    Also, a protip: don't ride down a rutted trail at 25mph looking down at the suspension working, you might snag the front wheel on a rock, do a front flip dismount from the bike and look a right teat in front of a group of horse riding ladies

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by retro83
    Noticed a lot of bottom outs on my RC 405. Always put this down to my RP23 having a high-volume air can.

    So I tried DGCs excellent shim mod, which improved things, but still even a tiny jump results in a hard bottom out. Even moving to 15% sag (from ~25%) doesn't prevent it.

    Anyhow, I downloaded the demo of Linkage, and somebody had helpfully drawn an RC506 on it (very similar bike, more travel, slight geo change) - and HOLY CARP! Look at the change in rate at the bottom of the stroke!



    The regressive change in rate from 2.3 to 2.8 seems massive compared to other bikes.

    Is this as weird as it seems, or am I missing the point of what they're trying to achieve?

    Not sure where I can go from here to sort it out. Is there an extra small volume airsleeve available for the RP23 (2010 with boostvalve) ?

    fyi, i also have a rc405 but with the ex200. according to pace they designed the linkage rate around the dt shock. i run around 90 psi and generally never bottom out.

  10. #10
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    I've got similar problems. Also noticed that the rockers hit the small bridge where the pivot is welded on at full travel and have chipped the paint off. Really not good on a 1200 frame.

    Do you think it is worth complaining to the shop or Pace about this? Design fault as far as I'm concerned.

    Edit: I have the monrch 3.3 rear shock not the dt Swiss one

    bad bottom out problems - Pace RC405-dscf2068small.jpg
    Last edited by BOBBYDAZZLA; 06-06-2010 at 01:36 PM.

  11. #11
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    Same here

    Could probably file a couple of mm off the rockers but shouldn't need to do so on an expensive frame like this.

  12. #12
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    Only had mine 2 months but no issues yet with bottoming out. Running a DT Swiss M210 at 180psi - I'm 190lbs fully kitted.

    I admit i haven't done any big drop offs yet bu tI have pushed it quite hard around the World Champ Loop at Dalby.

    I did have a chat with one of the guys in Kewsick Bikes about the 405 - he said that he was building it with an RP23 for a customer, but Pace designed and tweaked the geometry and free floater suspension around the M210 (for 2010 at least). It may be worth contacting Pace themselves to see what they suggest if this is the case...

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ripley_405
    Only had mine 2 months but no issues yet with bottoming out. Running a DT Swiss M210 at 180psi - I'm 190lbs fully kitted.

    I admit i haven't done any big drop offs yet bu tI have pushed it quite hard around the World Champ Loop at Dalby.

    I did have a chat with one of the guys in Kewsick Bikes about the 405 - he said that he was building it with an RP23 for a customer, but Pace designed and tweaked the geometry and free floater suspension around the M210 (for 2010 at least). It may be worth contacting Pace themselves to see what they suggest if this is the case...
    Already have.

    I've got it workable with the RP23 now, had it Push'd by TFTuned and also had the smallest air can fitted. This has made it rideable at least. Still not as good as my Meta 5.5, but okay and the geometry is pretty nice anyhow.

    Adrian from Pace said that the design was progressive, not falling rate, which I still think is incorrect. Though, perhaps I'm reading that graph wrong and that is influencing how the bike feels to me.

    I will say that everybody who likes the frame does seem to be using the DT Swiss shocks...

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